Orson Scott Card and gays

[dantheman931]

http://www.cracked.com/blog/orson-scott-card-wants-you-to-rise-up-against-the-government-but-in-the-worst-way-possible/

I've never read anything by Orson Scott Card before. And now that I know he's against gay marriage, I've vowed never to read anything of his in the future either. I don't care how he tries to dress it up as logical and totally not based on his religious beliefs (even though he's a Mormon--go figure), in my mind, it's still intolerance of the worst kind. But every time I mention this to people, they say I should read his stuff and just ignore the whole gay thing. I can't do that though. I can't bring myself to support someone whose beliefs I find that offensive, because if nothing else, I feel like his beliefs probably inform his writing to some degree; plus, I doubt people would be saying the same thing if they found out he was anti-Semitic or racist. Am I being childish? (I'm not gay, by the way, so that has nothing to do with it.)

 

[NeutralDrow]

Kind of old news, since he first came out against gay marriage in 2005.

Not that I disagree with you, though.

 

[Pseudonym2]

It gets worse. in one of his books a character goes on a two page rant about how Islam is a "riot with a scripture."

 

[dantheman931]

Kind of old news, since he first came out against gay marriage in 2005.

Not that I disagree with you, though.

Probably best not to say he "came out" against it. *snort*

It probably is old news, but I just learned about it, so I'm pissed. lol

 

[Odude]

He's Mormon... it's kinda to be expected that he doesn't like homosexuals. I really don't mean to be bias against a single religious group, but Mormons are known for their stanch "disapproval" of homosexual relationships/marriage/sex. I've studied the Mormon religion extensively, going as far as interviewing their "bishops." They're about polygamous relationships between a man and women (they believe polygamy is the way of heaven, even if they are not allowed to practice it in the US. This is ALL Mormons, not just the fundamentalists who actually practice it), and anything else is a mortal sin. They also have a history of disliking the US government (for convicting Joseph Smith of being a con-man), which is still prevalent in the older generations of Mormons, but not so much in the younger ones (Mormon teachings changed dramatically in the 80's).

I've also seen it in my home, Orange County, California. The local Mormon Temples organized large picket brigades that stalked the streets for a month. I'm sure it was Mormon organized because I knew most of the people picketing, and asked them myself. Sadly it was so enforced that even a closet gay Mormon I know was out with a "Yes on Prop 8" sign (for those non-Californians, proposition 8 banned gay marriage, putting the state constitution in conflict with itself).

What I'm trying to say is that his religion is a large influence in his stance, but in no means am I saying that all Mormons think like this. Orson Scott Card is one messed up individual. I really thought we were a progressing society, but once again I'm proven wrong with unfounded hate off anyone different. People really need to let person belief be just that, personal. What's with people always pushing their way on everyone else?

I just don't get people at all...

 

[yeah_so_no]

No, you're not being childish--if the man's beliefs are abhorrent to you, there's no reason why you should read his books. I don't see how that's any different from not buying things from a company because you don't like their business practices or stances.

 

[vxicepickxv]

Well, if you want to read his books without supporting him, you could always go to a library.

 

[kjrubberducky]

Well, I'm Christian, not Mormon, but I still read his books and think he is a very gifted author. Some people abstain from reading him because his beliefs differ from their own, but I kind of think that is a little ridiculous. Should I not read any scientific publication if it mentions the Big Bang, just because I think the universe came about differently? I rather enjoy my physics class, so that would be a little remiss of me.

I guess I can understand if you choose not to support him by buying his books, but, as someone mentioned, that's what the library is for. A difference of opinion is not a good reason to disregard other people's ideas.

 

[vxicepickxv]

A difference of opinion is not a good reason to disregard other people's ideas.

You sir, have displayed wisdom. I'd give you a cookie for it, but I can't.

 

[kitsuna]

http://www.cracked.com/blog/orson-scott-card-wants-you-to-rise-up-against-the-government-but-in-the-worst-way-possible/

I've never read anything by Orson Scott Card before. And now that I know he's against gay marriage, I've vowed never to read anything of his in the future either. I don't care how he tries to dress it up as logical and totally not based on his religious beliefs (even though he's a Mormon--go figure), in my mind, it's still intolerance of the worst kind. But every time I mention this to people, they say I should read his stuff and just ignore the whole gay thing. I can't do that though. I can't bring myself to support someone whose beliefs I find that offensive, because if nothing else, I feel like his beliefs probably inform his writing to some degree; plus, I doubt people would be saying the same thing if they found out he was anti-Semitic or racist. Am I being childish? (I'm not gay, by the way, so that has nothing to do with it.)

I've read some of his stuff. Ender's Game series for example, and it's actually pretty interesting. I subscribe to the opinion that you don't have to agree with somebody's ideals to enjoy their fictional work.

I've yet to see his anti-gay marriage opinion in any of his books, so I have no problem reading it. Even if there was, I'm sure I would endeavour to approach it in the way an Old World explorer would observe a tribal native... With a sneer at their backward ideas.

 

[sonidraw]

How is reading somebody's books "supporting" them? Heck, I had one of them assigned to me in high school for cryin' out loud. Totally free and fun.

You don't have to agree with a person's personal beliefs to enjoy reading some of their fictional work. Or even nonfiction for that matter.

I have a copy of Mein Kampf with me. Does that make me a Nazi?

 

[vxicepickxv]

How is reading somebody's books "supporting" them? Heck, I had one of them assigned to me in high school for cryin' out loud. Totally free and fun.

You don't have to agree with a person's personal beliefs to enjoy reading some of their fictional work. Or even nonfiction for that matter.

I have a copy of Mein Kampf with me. Does that make me a Nazi?

No, just like my copy of the communist manifesto doesn't really make me a communist.

 

[edinflames]

His books are garbage. The same applies to all these pseudo-academic religious bigots. Even the fiction, just go read a better novel imo, there's plenty to choose from.

Religion poisons everything, it gives men like this a shield to hide their small minded hatred behind.

 

[ix_tab]

No, there are plenty of musicians, actors and writers who, sometimes I wish I didn't like reading up on, because there's nothing like finding out someone you admire is a horrid bigot.

It's up to you whether you let it colour your enjoyment of their work. I tried to not let it get to me, but in the end I was much happier to stop supporting the work of people who realistically hate me and the majority of my friends and members of my family.

 

[Gamine]

There are people i like (Musicians, Actors)who i then realise are gay, that cannot affect the way i feel about their work,

So. .Leave the personal alone.

 

[Biek]

I think you should try to see an artists work and personal beliefs as different things. Lovecraft was a racist, but that doesnt stop me from reading his work.

 

[dantheman931]

So you point at an anti-gay lunatic to suggest gay marriage is the only sane option.
I'm not buying it.

Huh?

How is reading somebody's books "supporting" them? Heck, I had one of them assigned to me in high school for cryin' out loud. Totally free and fun.

You don't have to agree with a person's personal beliefs to enjoy reading some of their fictional work. Or even nonfiction for that matter.

I have a copy of Mein Kampf with me. Does that make me a Nazi?

No, just like my copy of the communist manifesto doesn't really make me a communist.

I suppose you have a point. But I want to say for the record, and for the benefit of latecomers, that I'm not trying to say he *shouldn't* say what's on his mind; I don't believe in abridging anyone's freedom of speech, no matter how ignorant that speech may be. I'm just not entirely sure I could shove that thought out of my mind long enough to just enjoy the story. Perhaps that's just my hang-up to deal with. It's the same reason I can't take Tom Cruise and John Travolta seriously as actors anymore now that I know what kind of freaks they are. (Battlefield Earth didn't help matters either. Can somoene pass me the brain bleach please?)

 

[scotth266]

I take the easy route and try to avoid learning ANYTHING about people who make stuff I enjoy. When I learn stuff, it doesn't change my opinions though.

You know what? I still love Braveheart and Mel Gibson movies, and I'll buy them as long as they continue to be good. I don't have to give two shits whether or not he's anti-Semitic, because as long as he doesn't stick in the movie the words FUCK JEWS in on the credits then it doesn't affect the quality of the movie. I once had someone try to convince me that 20,000 BC is anti-Semitic propoganda. Sorry, but no dice. Mel Gibson may be a jerk for hating Jews, but that doesn't make his movies not worth watching.

Also: the guy that plays Magneto is gay. The navigator dude from the first Star Trek is gay. Does that make them, or their portrayals of their characters, any less awesome? NO. And if you dare disagree...

Spoiler: The consequences of disagreeing

I just force-choked your sorry butt with a iron bar.
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