Persona 3 - Wait...how many floors?

CriticalGaming

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Persona 3 has been one of those highly praised but very hard to play video games in recent years namely following the success of Persona 5. The 5th entry in the series created a boom in popularity for the Persona games as a whole, being a spin off of the Shin Megumi Tensei series that is designed to be a more approachable RPG. SMT mainline games and even some spin-offs like Digital Devil Summoner are known for being pretty fucking hard as JRPG's go, this is due to the hated JRPG mechanic of "if the main dude dies it's game over, even if the rest of the party is alive" and lots of instant death attacks.

Persona games still have those mechanics (even 5) but tone it way down and tend to be more forthcoming with upcoming attacks as well as clearly marking what you need to do to block those game over attacks. However Persona for the most part, remains true to the old school dungeon crawling JRPG's of old with one big twist. Between the dungeon crawling is a slice of life sim where you will go to school, study for exams, build friendships, and maybe fall in love. All of these activities working together to build each other up binding together with a typically wonderful coming of age story revolving around a specific theme. This combination built incredible success with Persona 4 and 5, and the system originated in Persona 3. Briefly I'll mention that Persona 1 and 2 while similar in concept didn't have the slice of life part, 3 is where the formula really came into perfect shape.

But seeing as how Persona 3 is the first crack at a set formula for the series, it's also the one that does it the worst by a wide margin.

Persona 3 involves you as a high school student coming to a new school that turns into a tower of demons at midnight. Only a select few people have the power to see this tower and the creatures that escape from within, and even fewer have the ability to bring out persona's to fight back. A Persona is a demon from within, a sort of inner strength manifested with powers that allow for combat to happen. The beginning of the game is where the problems arise for me. Unlike P4 and P5, there isn't much foundation to go on with P3. There isn't really a set up for who your character is nor is there much of a set up for why demon fighting is a thing. These get explained much later in the game, but the fact that there isn't much to attach the player to the mystery it's trying to set up is a bummer.

Additionally P3's social system is extremely obtuse. Unlike in P4 and 5, where social links are practically highlighted with big neon signs that say "Make friends with this person!", P3 doesn't have that and it'll just casually suggest you talk to everybody and join some clubs to maybe make friends, or don't we don't care fuck you. While some people might enjoy figuring that shit out, when you combine the tight time schedule the game in running on (the calendar system that every entry uses) you need to manage your time wisely or risk not having enough to see everything you might want to see. The vast majority of story and social links are extremely missable in P3 and I don't really like that. I'm fine missing out on maxing everyone unless you play perfectly, but I'm not fine with missing things that you have no way to know are even there in the first place.

This issue is compounded in the recent console release of Persona 3 because you are not getting a port of the PS2 games here, instead you are getting a port of the PSP version called Persona 3 Portable. P3Portable forgoes the use of 3d graphics for exploration and all non-dungeon activities are told via visual novel style, making it harder for special characters to stand out until you talk to them.

Speaking of social links, where the later games make your party members big parts of your social circle (as it would make sense to form a bond with the people you are trying to save the world with) P3 saves these for the back half of the game where you might finally have the stats for them to respect you. For example one of your party members wont hang out with you unless you reach Genius level smarts. Which takes months of dedication to reach and keep in mind that studying also means you aren't developing other social links. It's all very frustratingly designed in that regard, and as you play through P3 you always have the feeling you are missing a shitload of stuff simply because the game isn't telling you or even providing clues that the content is there. It's like Elden Ring, and you all know my feelings on Elden Ring.

That being said the combat is fun and typical of more recent Persona games, all the basics are there including getting demons to join you, fusing them to make better demons, elemental weaknesses, all out attacks, the whole 9 yards of Persona combat.

I can definitely see where P4 and P5 grew from this entry, but know that it's very odd to have played the Persona games in a reverse order to end up with P3P.
 
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meiam

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Additionally P3's social system is extremely obtuse. Unlike in P4 and 5, where social links are practically highlighted with big neon signs that say "Make friends with this person!", P3 doesn't have that and it'll just casually suggest you talk to everybody and join some clubs to maybe make friends, or don't we don't care fuck you. While some people might enjoy figuring that shit out, when you combine the tight time schedule the game in running on (the calendar system that every entry uses) you need to manage your time wisely or risk not having enough to see everything you might want to see. The vast majority of story and social links are extremely missable in P3 and I don't really like that. I'm fine missing out on maxing everyone unless you play perfectly, but I'm not fine with missing things that you have no way to know are even there in the first place.
? I haven't played the PSP version, but I can't recall missing anyone. This was actually one of my main complain with P5, one of the most important social link in it is hidden behind doing part time work at a very specific job for multiple days and if you don't do that you'll miss it with no indication.

Also, P3 link were far less important since they were just use for fusion and not much else, compared to P5 where they're extremely important since they link to so many system. Missing someone in P3 was not a problem. But in P5 missing fortune, temperance or sun (all of which are easily missable) is going to really hamper your ability.
 

immortalfrieza

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Persona 3 has been one of those highly praised but very hard to play video games in recent years namely following the success of Persona 5. The 5th entry in the series created a boom in popularity for the Persona games as a whole, being a spin off of the Shin Megumi Tensei series that is designed to be a more approachable RPG. SMT mainline games and even some spin-offs like Digital Devil Summoner are known for being pretty fucking hard as JRPG's go, this is due to the hated JRPG mechanic of "if the main dude dies it's game over, even if the rest of the party is alive" and lots of instant death attacks.

Persona games still have those mechanics (even 5) but tone it way down and tend to be more forthcoming with upcoming attacks as well as clearly marking what you need to do to block those game over attacks. However Persona for the most part, remains true to the old school dungeon crawling JRPG's of old with one big twist. Between the dungeon crawling is a slice of life sim where you will go to school, study for exams, build friendships, and maybe fall in love. All of these activities working together to build each other up binding together with a typically wonderful coming of age story revolving around a specific theme. This combination built incredible success with Persona 4 and 5, and the system originated in Persona 3. Briefly I'll mention that Persona 1 and 2 while similar in concept didn't have the slice of life part, 3 is where the formula really came into perfect shape.

But seeing as how Persona 3 is the first crack at a set formula for the series, it's also the one that does it the worst by a wide margin.

Persona 3 involves you as a high school student coming to a new school that turns into a tower of demons at midnight. Only a select few people have the power to see this tower and the creatures that escape from within, and even fewer have the ability to bring out persona's to fight back. A Persona is a demon from within, a sort of inner strength manifested with powers that allow for combat to happen. The beginning of the game is where the problems arise for me. Unlike P4 and P5, there isn't much foundation to go on with P3. There isn't really a set up for who your character is nor is there much of a set up for why demon fighting is a thing. These get explained much later in the game, but the fact that there isn't much to attach the player to the mystery it's trying to set up is a bummer.

Additionally P3's social system is extremely obtuse. Unlike in P4 and 5, where social links are practically highlighted with big neon signs that say "Make friends with this person!", P3 doesn't have that and it'll just casually suggest you talk to everybody and join some clubs to maybe make friends, or don't we don't care fuck you. While some people might enjoy figuring that shit out, when you combine the tight time schedule the game in running on (the calendar system that every entry uses) you need to manage your time wisely or risk not having enough to see everything you might want to see. The vast majority of story and social links are extremely missable in P3 and I don't really like that. I'm fine missing out on maxing everyone unless you play perfectly, but I'm not fine with missing things that you have no way to know are even there in the first place.

This issue is compounded in the recent console release of Persona 3 because you are not getting a port of the PS2 games here, instead you are getting a port of the PSP version called Persona 3 Portable. P3Portable forgoes the use of 3d graphics for exploration and all non-dungeon activities are told via visual novel style, making it harder for special characters to stand out until you talk to them.

Speaking of social links, where the later games make your party members big parts of your social circle (as it would make sense to form a bond with the people you are trying to save the world with) P3 saves these for the back half of the game where you might finally have the stats for them to respect you. For example one of your party members wont hang out with you unless you reach Genius level smarts. Which takes months of dedication to reach and keep in mind that studying also means you aren't developing other social links. It's all very frustratingly designed in that regard, and as you play through P3 you always have the feeling you are missing a shitload of stuff simply because the game isn't telling you or even providing clues that the content is there. It's like Elden Ring, and you all know my feelings on Elden Ring.

That being said the combat is fun and typical of more recent Persona games, all the basics are there including getting demons to join you, fusing them to make better demons, elemental weaknesses, all out attacks, the whole 9 yards of Persona combat.

I can definitely see where P4 and P5 grew from this entry, but know that it's very odd to have played the Persona games in a reverse order to end up with P3P.
This is pretty much a list of all the reasons I stopped being able to even play Persona 3 after Persona 4 came out. I mean, I used guides to do all the social links and stuff and continue to do so with future entries since it's near impossible to see everything otherwise so I don't mind the obtrusive social links and time management. What annoys me the most is the combat system with it's tiredness mechanic, but far far worse is the inability to control party members in combat. I don't understand why that was ever a thing in the first place but the party has the extremely unfortunate combination of being AI controlled and dumb as a box of rocks even after more tactics to direct them open up. And this is in a turned based RPG where there's zero reason there should be AI controlled party members. Would it have really been so difficult to just have them controllable from the outset?

That, and the entire story is downright depressing. The game starts with the protagonists fighting by shooting themselves in the head and... yeah, it gets worse from there. Without spoilers it has the most depressing ending in the entire series. P4 and P5 have significantly more enjoyable stories, and it really feels like they were feeling things out with P3 with the various systems and story.

On that note, I only ever play P3:FES whenever I do manage to work up the desire to play P3, despite the irritation of the combat. The PSP version has fixed combat and has a female scenario but... no 2D cutscenes, turning it into a visual novel, etc. it just feels half baked. I was really hoping the PC release would add back in the cutscenes and turn it back to 3D outside the dungeons but nope, and the PC doesn't have the excuse of hardware limitations.

I really hope that eventually ATLUS will get off it's butt and make a full remake with the gameplay changes, cutscenes, 3D world to run around in, etc. and... maybe a new more optimistic ending but I'm not holding my breath. Maybe trickle down some P5 stuff while I'm dreaming.

I loved P5 completely and am looking forward to when I eventually get Royal. P4 was great on the PS2 but the Golden rerelease... I find myself struggling to get through that and it's almost entirely due to Chie's new voice actor. God I feel like my ear is being raped every time she speaks. The old VA for her was significantly better both as an voice actor and just to listen to, as opposed to the new one who sounds like she's an overly hyperactive 5 year old screaming every line at the top of her lungs.

What might be worse is they did replace Teddie's voice actor... and he actually sounds like the old VA for the most part. It's not like they couldn't have found a VA for Chie that sounded just like the old one if they really needed to. It's a shame too because Chie was originally one of my favorites in the game both as a character and in battle, but in Golden I ditch her from my party the moment I'm able to and turn off the sound while doing her social links just so I can keep how much I have to listen to her to a minimum.
 

Drathnoxis

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Two hundred and sixty four palette swapped floors (not counting the oops, I got hit with and instadeath after 20 floors and need to redo them now because I'm trying to be efficient with my days here)! It is exactly as tedious as it sounds. At least you were able to control your party members directly. No! Mitsuru, don't charm the stupid enemy, HEAL ME I'M DYING! I did not like P3 having played it after P4. It was way too long and the downer ending seemed like it came out of nowhere.
 

wings012

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I played P3 way back on the PS2. And it was pretty silly that regular ass P3 was localized when P3FES already existed in Japan, then they released the localized P3FES later.... needless to say I didn't get to that.

P3P on the PC is also a bit weird since it's missing FES content. It does have the female protagonist and other social links but I can't help but wonder if they could've made an even more complete P3 P + FES version or something.

I was pretty eh initially at how you couldn't control your party members in P3, but I got pretty used to it in the end.

I recently beat P5R and man, they sure made it a lot more friendly than before. I remember back on vanilla P3, social links were a harsh mistress. They could invert if you neglected them, needing to waste extra time to fix them. I had very few completed links at the end of P3, and there were some I didn't even manage to discover at all. In P5R I just winged it(though I did use a guide for the correct answers, none for schedule though) and managed to max out all my links in the end with time to spare.

I don't think I'll bother with P3P at this point. A long time ago I was pondering playing the Episode Aigis part of P3 FES, but you don't have access to the Persona Compendium there and having to manually catch/fuse everything just sounds like a pain in the arse so I never did it.

I think I still like a lot of the tracks in the P3 OST better than P4/5.
 
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