Piracy Numbers

Wicky_42

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Sep 15, 2008
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Just about what I thought. Pirates pirate, no matter the protection. Simple enough.

More DRM = fewer sales? Likely.

More DRM costs more to implement? Likely.

Bother with DRM? I wouldn't - offer continued support with additional content (over TIME, not at release) to encourage people to buy.
 

Starke

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Mar 6, 2008
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llafnwod said:
How many pirates are jerks?

100%
How accurate of you to make that claim. You have peered into my very soul.
Fixed.

Honestly, llaf, you respond to that by taking a potshot at him, and it's a no win. You post like a jerk and you're reinforcing that statistic. You post opposition to that statistic and you're reinforcing that you're in that demographic. The only way you can come across as something other than a jerk is to post either a) articulatly, or b) not at all.
 

Valiance

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Jan 14, 2009
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That's some ridiculous numbers.

And to think, I love Stardock and actually paid for Entrepreneur and The Corporate Machine...

How can we tell them that the PC is still worth developing for? Buying more games? Thanks to steam, I just play a lot of demos and I hardly find something that screams to me "This is incredible, pre-purchase now."

Even indie games are great, but I bought Trine on sale - does this really help the developers? I'm not pirating it, but buying it at 75% off, how can they profit from me being a thrifty shopper? As a gamer, I don't like to spend a shit ton of money. A friend of mine bought Zombie Driver, and he and I had great fun with it - we went over to his house, and we played through it, alternating turns when we died and whatnot...And we loved it - but it was done in like 3 hours.

He felt ripped off that he spent 20 bucks on 3 hours of gameplay, and I wouldn't pay more than 5 dollars for that game, because I can get a movie ticket for 5 bucks around here for almost the same amount of time done.

It's a great game, I had fun, I enjoyed it, but no free-roam, only one city, no map editor, no DLC, etc...Why wouldn't someone pirate it?

A lot of demos I play (Eufloria, Metal Drift, Zombie Driver) give away a large portion of the gameplay, and I would like it to be significantly improved when I purchase the real thing - else I'll just wait for it to go on sale and that probably won't really help any developers, publishers, or the industry in general, even though I want to make an impact.

Should I just mail Stardock a 50 dollar check?
 

CommyGingerbreadMan

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Dec 22, 2009
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llafnwod said:
Starke said:
llafnwod said:
How many pirates are jerks?

100%
How accurate of you to make that claim. (Case in point)
Fixed.
Uh, case in point? I'm a jerk for being opposed to sweeping statements about people whose single universally common trait is an arguably immoral act?
Nothing arguable about it. People in the revolutions never claim their actions aren't radical. Pirates cannot claim their actions aren't STEALING.

Still we have a vicious circle, more DRM = more Pirates, more Pirates = More DRM
 
Apr 28, 2008
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I bought spore, and also downloaded the pirated copy. Mainly because of all the shit the securom did to my system.

Sadly, publisher's just can't get their heads around the fact that their games will always get pirated. No matter what.

Movies and music get pirated all the damn time, arguably more than games. And yet they don't impliment mandatory online activation or whathaveyou.
 

Woodsey

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Aug 9, 2009
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llafnwod said:
Starke said:
llafnwod said:
How many pirates are jerks?

100%
How accurate of you to make that claim. (Case in point)
Fixed.
Uh, case in point? I'm a jerk for being opposed to sweeping statements about people whose single universally common trait is an arguably immoral act?
What's arguable about it?

They steal.

OT: Some interesting points. The whole thing is doing my head in, because no-one will relent. Publishers won't with the DRM (well, some have) and the pirates just don't give a shit.

If you can't get rid of piracy (you can't), then you need to make things more appealing to get legit buyers more interested in buying your games. Then make the service you provide better (i.e. not DRM).
 
Feb 13, 2008
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You know, I find these numbers very hard to take seriously.

For one, I know a number of people who have gone from pirated to proper copy. And a number who played pirated to get past the DRM (especially the constant disc/net checks).

But let's take the bookies favourite, Mewtwo.

Now, given our 90% piracy rate, (And in Mewtwo - it's almost likely to be higher) that means that of the figures they have

wiki said:
4.7 million sales - and allegedly pirated 4.1 million times(PC) and nearly a million times (Xbox)
Hold on....that looks suspiciously like 50/50.

Never mind, let's look at the comeback. RRP was £55, but we know damn well that almost no-one bought it at that...best figure I can come up with was an average price of around £40.

So Infinity Ward should have made £220 million, made £170 odd million, and claim they should have made (90% piracy) £2.2 billion.

Now, figures don't really add up here, because it's fair to assume that 90% of the people who bought/pirated MewTwo (And remember it has a wonderful anti-piracy DRM that was cracked within days) were able to get online.

That means (90% Piracy) 40 million different players joined in. Which is basically the population of England, Ireland and Scotland. (UK is 62 mil)

Now if all of these games have roughly 90% piracy at all times...that means that for every new person who wants to play it, 9 pirates will also want to play it.

This seems less like hard data, and more like mass exaggeration.
 

ZZoMBiE13

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Oct 10, 2007
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I've bought and paid for every game I've ever played. When I worked at a popular retail computer outlet and saw rampant piracy on a daily basis, I would still proudly buy the game and say "no thank you" as the tech guys offered to give (steal) me a copy.

What did the DRM that came along do for me? Well I stopped playing PC games at all. The hassles of being pestered by something even though I've always gone the prim and proper route soured me on the whole experience.

Point of this story? Well obviously I'm just offering a self-righteous rant to make myself feel superior. But maybe next time you make a column like this, you can have one category for me.
 

triorph

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Aug 5, 2008
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This is a good article. It points out the failings of DRM, and says you have to ignore pirates rather than fight them.
 

llafnwod

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Nov 9, 2007
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CommyGingerbreadMan said:
llafnwod said:
Starke said:
llafnwod said:
How many pirates are jerks?

100%
How accurate of you to make that claim. (Case in point)
Fixed.
Uh, case in point? I'm a jerk for being opposed to sweeping statements about people whose single universally common trait is an arguably immoral act?
Nothing arguable about it. People in the revolutions never claim their actions aren't radical. Pirates cannot claim their actions aren't STEALING.
In a lot of cases, yeah, they can. I torrented Psychonauts, The Longest Journey, and The Witcher, games I would not have bought had they not been "freely" available, and have since purchased all three of them. I got ICO for the PS2 since acquiring it "legitimately" through eBay would have cost at least one hundred USD more than retail price, precisely 0% of which would have gone to the developers.
 

Shamus Young

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Jul 7, 2008
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How many people use the pirated version as an extended demo?

Actually, back when I pirated things (I don't anymore) that's pretty much exactly what I did. I pirated games, and if I liked them enough to keep playing them, I almost always (I'd say 94% of the time, depended on how easy the game is to acquire) I bought them, usually digitally.

I wasn't using that as an weak excuse either, I'd say of all the games I downloaded, roughly 150 or so, about 75% of them ended up getting liked by me and bought at a later time.

And I never seeded.

Just another anecdote to counter yours, it isn't data as you said, just making sure both sides of the argument are represented. I'm not condoning piracy either.

And I'd still be termed a pirate by the industry, although I gave up on it last year.

Am I a jerk?

*weeps*
 

Suskie

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Nov 9, 2009
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I'm starting to wonder if publishers like Ubisoft even understand how piracy works. All it takes is ONE GUY to crack the DRM, and then it's available to anyone; the DRM is useless after that. Like you said, how can DRM do anything if pirates aren't even affected by it?

Great article, and in fact I find this whole topic fascinating, if only for how dumb it is. Publishers really don't seem to understand what they're up against.
 

Shamus Young

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Jul 7, 2008
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You guys(pirates) just got slapped in this article just pointing this out.

Better get some first aid for all that butthurt.
 

fenrizz

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Feb 7, 2009
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Woodsey said:
OT: Some interesting points. The whole thing is doing my head in, because no-one will relent. Publishers won't with the DRM (well, some have) and the pirates just don't give a shit.

If you can't get rid of piracy (you can't), then you need to make things more appealing to get legit buyers more interested in buying your games. Then make the service you provide better (i.e. not DRM).
What bothers me the most is that DRM is only affecting the paying customers, and not pirates.

Why should I suffer because my neighbor pirate?
In all honesty, it makes me more likely to pirate [insert random game publisher here]'s next release, or boycott the game and company altogether.

I mean, why should i pay for an inferior product when my pirating neighbor get's the "good" version for free?

DRM has only on purpose, and that is to (hopefully) slow down the crackers so much that more people buy the game before it is available on torrent sites.
And this does not seem to be working, as new releases by [insert random game publisher here] are often on torrent sites before the game is even in stores!

In short, DRM is meaingless and pisses of your paying customers.
Please stop it.
 

Shamus Young

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Jul 7, 2008
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Okay...

Demigod: DOTA players were angry/curious someone was trying to sell a dumbed down version of a free warcraft 3 map. The rest likely wouldn't have known it existed if not for sites like rlslog.net
World of goo: None of the people that pirated it would've known it even existed if not for sites like rlslog.net publishing the fact it was "cracked." Quotes, as it game didn't use any drm.
Ricochet infinity: same as world of goo...
That iphone app: Its a goddamn iphone app. They're charging for flash games. Most the time it isn't even an original product, but a port of a free game.

To attempt to offer some "converse" to this... now, please god don't shoot me for posting this, I know the source could be called, at best, biased, but... http://www.rlslog.net/piracy-isnt-that-bad-and-they-know-it/ God, the fucking url is even misleading. Its an email from the makers of a movie called "man from earth." They slapped it together from almost nothing and it didn't even get that much attention on the indie-film circuit. Due to "piracy," the film received pretty massive attention. They've re-released the film on bluray, they're doing well thanks to something demonized by massive corporations.

I am not in any way affiliated with any website mentioned.