[Politics] Doctor allowed Patient to Walk Outside, wrongly arrested for Stealing Medical Equipment

Sep 24, 2008
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A black man says he was racially profiled by white police officers while he was being treated at an Illinois hospital and went for a walk hooked up to an IV drip.

Police arrested Shaquille Dukes, 24, of misdemeanor disorderly conduct after a security guard called them, saying that Dukes was trying to steal medical equipment.

The Freeport Police Department confirmed Sunday in a statement that Dukes filed a complaint "alleging unfair and biased conduct by responding officers." The department said it has retained an outside, third-party investigator to "gather the facts, interview all parties involved, and determine whether officers conducted themselves in adherence to department policies and guidelines."

Dukes wrote on Facebook that he was on vacation in Freeport, about 100 miles west of Chicago, when he came down with double pneumonia and went to the hospital. He told CNN he was admitted to FHN Memorial Hospital for two days.

On the morning of the second day, June 9, he said he was feeling better and asked doctors if he could go for a walk. He went outside with his boyfriend and his brother, still wearing his hospital gown and pushing a steroid and antibiotic IV drip.

As they went outside, Dukes said a security guard called them over to his car and asked if they were trying to "leave the hospital and sell the IV equipment on eBay."

"I was livid, I was irate," Dukes said. "The first thing he said to me wasn't, 'What's your name? Can I help you?' but 'Are you stealing this?'" Dukes said his boyfriend began recording the encounter, as Dukes was trying to explain to the security guard that they were on a walk.

That's when the security guard called for police backup, Dukes told CNN. He said the guard told police, "I have three black males attempting to steal medical equipment from the hospital."

Police arrested all three men, charging them with misdemeanor disorderly conduct. Two of the men were also charged with misdemeanor resisting arrest, according to a Freeport police press release issued June 17.

Dukes told CNN that before his arrest, police officers took his emergency inhaler and his IV was removed, though not by a doctor. Police said in a June 18 statement that the IV was removed by FHN medical personnel.
(Source [https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/01/us/illinois-man-with-iv-arrested/index.html])

First off... yup, another day in America. If I wasn't so devoid of hope for this country that I'm actively filling out papers to move to Canada, I would be heartbroken even more

Now, I'm of two minds.


One, I think Dukes was wrong for saying he was 'racially profiled by white police officers'. I'm not putting any stock into their motivations (as of yet), but I'm not going to say they racially profiled him.

The Security Guard did. The Security Guard called in three black men trying to steal Hospital property. The Police were following up on a call. At this moment, was it the right call (it wasn't) isn't up for debate. But they were responding to the complaint. At that whit, their hands were tied.

Now. Moving forward to Two, there did seem to be some malice. In a post Eric Garner world, you need to take the care of those you have in custody seriously. None of them are medically trained, but they removed an IV? Something that goes into your blood vessels? Really? That seemed like a good idea?

And he had an asthma attack and they wouldn't let him have an inhaler? I just spoke about Eric Garner. Breathing is a very important thing to humans. I had a few asthma attacks when I was younger. Do you know what it feels like? Drowning. It is a frightening feeling, and all you want is relief. And they denied him that until they got to a police station. I will definitely put this squarely on police because that's cruel and unusual treatment that has no basis in the world.

I'm really done with this country. If we have any Canadian women who would like to date and marry me, I'm reasonably fit, I can cook very well, and I'll soon have a Trading Securities License in America and Canada. Take me, please.
 

Baffle

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ObsidianJones said:
None of them are medically trained, but they removed an IV? Something that goes into your blood vessels?
You'd think the fact the IV was currently IVing would be a clue that he wasn't stealing it. I mean, that's going the extra mile to steal what is basically a bag on a pole.
 
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He was black and gay? Well shit, thats two kinds of prejudice he's got stacked against him, I wonder if the security guard was against just one or both...
 

Baffle

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Palindromemordnilap said:
He was black and gay? Well shit, thats two kinds of prejudice he's got stacked against him, I wonder if the security guard was against just one or both...
And he was temporarily disabled.
 

Nielas

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Did that security guard wake up in the morning and decide to find the best way to get himself fired and the hospital sued?
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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Baffle2 said:
ObsidianJones said:
None of them are medically trained, but they removed an IV? Something that goes into your blood vessels?
You'd think the fact the IV was currently IVing would be a clue that he wasn't stealing it. I mean, that's going the extra mile to steal what is basically a bag on a pole.
I mean not even Cosplayers actually insert the needle. That's next level dedication.
 

CaitSeith

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So do Freeport's hospitals have a high rate of medical supplies thievery or something? Otherwise, how did the guard jump to that conclusion?
 

Drathnoxis

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How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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Drathnoxis said:
How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
As far as the article says he was arrested at his car, so I guess the parking lot? Which if its the size of most hospitals is either right next to the front door, or only a few hundred feet away.
Also hospital security aren't usually stationed at the front door. There's a reception desk a few feet inside, but at the door itself are the vallet drivers. Its kinda' weird to have a security station at the front door, and have guards that wouldn't go a few feet back to reception to double-check.
 

Lil devils x_v1legacy

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Silentpony said:
Drathnoxis said:
How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
As far as the article says he was arrested at his car, so I guess the parking lot? Which if its the size of most hospitals is either right next to the front door, or only a few hundred feet away.
Also hospital security aren't usually stationed at the front door. There's a reception desk a few feet inside, but at the door itself are the vallet drivers. Its kinda' weird to have a security station at the front door, and have guards that wouldn't go a few feet back to reception to double-check.
I think you may have misread that. It read to me as the security guard called him over to the security guard's car, not the car of the man who was arrested.
OP:
The man was in the hospital for Pneumonia and hooked up to an IV at the time there is no excuse for the security guard and the officer's behavior. The officers had no way of knowing the current state of the patient and a person who is not getting enough oxygen, as was the case with this man who later passed out due to the officer's ignorant behavior, can often be confused, disoriented, and non compliant as this is expected for a person in his medical condition so a charge of " disorderly conduct" at all is asinine to begin with. A person who is not getting enough oxygen can become irritable, irrational and not even understand what you are saying to them at the time. It has even been known to trigger their fight or flight response because they may feel as though they are fighting for their life as they are suffocating.

The fact the man was a patient was blatant and undergoing medical care at the time they attempted to berate him should have made it obvious they should have offered assistance to the man if needed rather than accost him. It is extremely expected for patients to be walking around outdoors at Hospitals, in fact they are encouraged to do so as being in bed too long is damaging to one's health. Patients are expected to go for walks indoors and out, to their cars, to the cafeteria ect and cannot fathom why a security guard or an officers would treat them the way that happened here. Hell, even when you have patients who wake up extremely violent they are sedated and strapped down, not arrested. There is no excuse for them reacting that way at all. Ever.
 

Trunkage

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Drathnoxis said:
How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
Surely the gown was the clue. Also, is this the hospital security guard?

I've heard of older people getting disoriented and lost when just stepping outside. It could happen to any patient. Why was the first thought: he must be stealing
 

Lil devils x_v1legacy

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trunkage said:
Drathnoxis said:
How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
Surely the gown was the clue. Also, is this the hospital security guard?

I've heard of older people getting disoriented and lost when just stepping outside. It could happen to any patient. Why was the first thought: he must be stealing
Sadly that is the first thing some racist people tend to think when they see a black person whether it is in the store, walking in their own neighborhood or in the Hospital. It is seriously that screwed up.
 
Oct 22, 2011
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Baffle2 said:
ObsidianJones said:
None of them are medically trained, but they removed an IV? Something that goes into your blood vessels?
You'd think the fact the IV was currently IVing would be a clue that he wasn't stealing it. I mean, that's going the extra mile to steal what is basically a bag on a pole.
Bet they'll count it as driving under influence(those IV strollers have wheels after all).
 

RobertEHouse

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The fact is that it is illegal to have a IV drip attached outside of a hospital in the US. Or the fact that is illegally for a hospital anywhere in the US to allow a patient to walk outside with one. Or the fact that a patient not discharge cannot leave the premise under any circumstances unless discharged agreed by a doctor is signed. Or to discharge patient with a steroid antibiotic IV drip as it's consider by law to be administer under supervision.As that drug is considered a controlled substance which cannot legally be in the position of an non-healthcare personal. This is protocol in all hospitals in the US.

I can also tell you that hospitals do place security personal in the entrance way. They place a security desks right near when you walk in the ER .Just before you run into the main reception desk or right after you enter thought the ambiance drop off. Simply because LEGAL 2,000 happen A LOT (they try to harm self or others). I also know of this hospital, it's huge and if he was in the parking lot that is one large parking lot. They also used to have a third party contracted in charge of the security cameras on the hospital grounds. Lastly this is not a very safe area of Chicago and like all hospitals people try to steal anything all the time.

Beyond this I personally want to wait for the independent investigation report to find out what their findings are.
 

RobertEHouse

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trunkage said:
Drathnoxis said:
How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
Surely the gown was the clue. Also, is this the hospital security guard?

I've heard of older people getting disoriented and lost when just stepping outside. It could happen to any patient. Why was the first thought: he must be stealing
First he is not an old patient and Pneumonia does not have the side effect of confusion. Pneumonia in the hospital if it's bad enough your hooked up to a machine to breathe you will not suffer confusion. If anything Pneumonia will cause temps over 105 and vomiting with shortness of breath. His condition though was not bad enough if he was give just an inhaler.

Second you cannot walk out of hospital in the US with an IV drip attached to you at all. That is both illegal and a health risk as if his IV drip dries out; air accumulates and can go into the blood stream. Air in the blood stream will lead to a very painful death as the air pocket reaches the heart in seconds. Also removing an IV drip with no experience will lead to permanent harm and infection. That is one reason of many, why you don't walk out with IV drips. Second the Steroid in the IV outside of the hospital is illegal in the possession of non healthcare personnel. He was also not discharged as clearly indicated by the hospital and thus he walked outside.

Medical equipment is also very valuable worth tens of thousands of dollars because of insurance and red tape.Security handles both legal 2000 codes (those trying to harm self and others) etc as well as property theft. Freeport Chicago on the other hand has sections where crime is high; the hospital sits in the old section of town not a very nice place. Because of that it would not be out of the scope of security to be looking for theft. Still we will have to wait for the independent investigation to go public.
 

twistedmic

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RobertEHouse said:
trunkage said:
Drathnoxis said:
How far away from the hospital was this guy walking? Surely the police could have just inquired at the hospital and verified his story unless he was out on a hike in his gown and IV.
Surely the gown was the clue. Also, is this the hospital security guard?

I've heard of older people getting disoriented and lost when just stepping outside. It could happen to any patient. Why was the first thought: he must be stealing
First he is not an old patient and Pneumonia does not have the side effect of confusion. Pneumonia in the hospital if it's bad enough your hooked up to a machine to breathe you will not suffer confusion. If anything Pneumonia will cause temps over 105 and vomiting with shortness of breath. His condition though was not bad enough if he was give just an inhaler.
I think the point was that some patients can become disoriented and confused, not that pneumonia can cause confusion. A young(er) patient could have suffered head trauma, could have neurological problems or diminished mental capacity. The apparent age of a patient is not enough to assume whether or not they are aware of where (or who) they are. And outside of highly visible diseases (mumps, measles, chicken pox, etc.) and injuries it's almost impossible to tell what a patient is suffering from just by looking at them.
Also, a high fever can effect a person's mental acuity, as can a lack of sleep or even a reaction to medications.
 
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RobertEHouse said:
The fact is that it is illegal to have a IV drip attached outside of a hospital in the US. Or the fact that is illegally for a hospital anywhere in the US to allow a patient to walk outside with one. Or the fact that a patient not discharge cannot leave the premise under any circumstances unless discharged agreed by a doctor is signed. Or to discharge patient with a steroid antibiotic IV drip as it's consider by law to be administer under supervision.As that drug is considered a controlled substance which cannot legally be in the position of an non-healthcare personal. This is protocol in all hospitals in the US.

I can also tell you that hospitals do place security personal in the entrance way. They place a security desks right near when you walk in the ER .Just before you run into the main reception desk or right after you enter thought the ambiance drop off. Simply because LEGAL 2,000 happen A LOT (they try to harm self or others). I also know of this hospital, it's huge and if he was in the parking lot that is one large parking lot. They also used to have a third party contracted in charge of the security cameras on the hospital grounds. Lastly this is not a very safe area of Chicago and like all hospitals people try to steal anything all the time.

Beyond this I personally want to wait for the independent investigation report to find out what their findings are.
Which would mean that, logically, the security guard's job is to prevent you from walking out the door with in IV in the first place. Or to turn you around and tell you your doctor shouldn't have told you you could go out. Not to just automatically call the police
 

Gethsemani_v1legacy

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RobertEHouse said:
Second you cannot walk out of hospital in the US with an IV drip attached to you at all. That is both illegal and a health risk as if his IV drip dries out; air accumulates and can go into the blood stream. Air in the blood stream will lead to a very painful death as the air pocket reaches the heart in seconds. Also removing an IV drip with no experience will lead to permanent harm and infection.
I've no doubt it might be illegal to leave a hospital with an IV infusion running in the US. The rest of what you write is hogwash though. An IV drip will never truly "dry out", as there will always be some fluid left in the bag and the tube and if the pressure drops low enough in the tube blood will flow up into the tube due to the pressure difference. So walking around with an empty IV bag for a while isn't a big deal, it poses no imminent health risk. Especially not from air getting into the bloodstream, because of the fact that the IV is a sealed environment and the pressure difference between the tube and the blood stream which ensures that the tiny amount of air in the drip chamber (not enough air to kill a person) remains in the drip chamber, the administering nurse or doctor also ensures there are no air bubbles in the tube before connecting the IV (even though they'd be too small to pose a health risk, generally).

Secondly, removing an IV catheter without training is as simple as pulling a plastic catheter out of your vein. This requires no special training and you'll have to really try if you want to hurt yourself doing it, as a PVC (peripheral venous catheter) is a small plastic tube attached to a plastic infusion valve. You'll bleed, but due to the flexibility of the catheter it will never cause any harm going out. If the adhesive keeping it in place remains, you might suffer from skin irritation or friction burn if you pull really hard and fast. You might suffer an infection if you leave the wound from the PVC exposed after you've removed it, but generally speaking all it takes is to stem the bleeding and keep it covered to avoid the worst risks. Putting a band-aid on it is literally all that healthcare personnel does to prevent infection (barring special cases with high infection risks).

Source: Am a Registered Nurse. Has inserted and removed hundreds of PVCs in the last decade.
 

Kwak

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RobertEHouse said:
The fact is that it is illegal to have a IV drip attached outside of a hospital in the US. Or the fact that is illegally for a hospital anywhere in the US to allow a patient to walk outside with one. Or the fact that a patient not discharge cannot leave the premise under any circumstances unless discharged agreed by a doctor is signed. Or to discharge patient with a steroid antibiotic IV drip as it's consider by law to be administer under supervision.As that drug is considered a controlled substance which cannot legally be in the position of an non-healthcare personal. This is protocol in all hospitals in the US.

I can also tell you that hospitals do place security personal in the entrance way. They place a security desks right near when you walk in the ER .Just before you run into the main reception desk or right after you enter thought the ambiance drop off. Simply because LEGAL 2,000 happen A LOT (they try to harm self or others). I also know of this hospital, it's huge and if he was in the parking lot that is one large parking lot. They also used to have a third party contracted in charge of the security cameras on the hospital grounds. Lastly this is not a very safe area of Chicago and like all hospitals people try to steal anything all the time.

Beyond this I personally want to wait for the independent investigation report to find out what their findings are.
Are you... fucking DEFENDING this?! What the fuck?