[Politics] Trump, LBGT+ Ally

Silentpony_v1legacy

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Smithnikov said:
Just because White has pointed out some creepers does not erase that she's a bigot and still an overall shit person. It just means she's a shit person who has done a couple of commendable things.
But that's the thing- even if she is a bigot, which sure she IS, I have no idea but ill go for it for crowd approval sake(meaing i have scene only a few of her videos and don't know enough to judge), that doesn't mean she is wrong. Meaning "I dont like trans people" and "This person is using the Trans identity to molest children" are not connected. We're adults here, we can have two thoughts in our brain and understand the difference. "I hate trans" fuck off, "I hate Pedos using trans as a shield, IE trans = pedo" yeah lets look into this. The politics should be regardless. I couldn't care less about Blair White hunting Pedos as I do Rachel Maddow -both are known political entities. And both are agreed that raping children is wrong. Know one should care about the political agenda behind stopping child rape.
 

Saelune

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Silentpony said:
Smithnikov said:
Just because White has pointed out some creepers does not erase that she's a bigot and still an overall shit person. It just means she's a shit person who has done a couple of commendable things.
But that's the thing- even if she is a bigot, which sure she IS, I have no idea but ill go for it for crowd approval sake(meaing i have scene only a few of her videos and don't know enough to judge), that doesn't mean she is wrong. Meaning "I dont like trans people" and "This person is using the Trans identity to molest children" are not connected. We're adults here, we can have two thoughts in our brain and understand the difference. "I hate trans" fuck off, "I hate Pedos using trans as a shield, IE trans = pedo" yeah lets look into this. The politics should be regardless. I couldn't care less about Blair White hunting Pedos as I do Rachel Maddow -both are known political entities. And both are agreed that raping children is wrong. Know one should care about the political agenda behind stopping child rape.
When Christians who hate LGBT people condemn Muslims for hating LGBT people, that is some bullshit. Sure, Islam IS anti-LGBT, but when anti-LGBT Christians use that to excuse abuse against Muslims, that is not ok.

That is what this is.
 

Shadowstar38

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https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCDmCBKaKOtOrEqgsL4-3C8Q/videos

I've been going through the chick's channel on and off inbetween shifts and looking up her interviews with Shapiro and Crowder. If someone could actually point to something that's legitimately bigoted against LGBT people, I'd coincide she may not be entirely credible. But that still wouldn't distract from Yavin being an alleged predator.

Like, what, do we need only approved left wing media to shame people for deplorable actions?
 

Drathnoxis

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Going off topic because a thought has occurred to me recently. I remember a lot of anti-LGBT arguments that hinged on the fact that gay relationships are non-procreational. That because a gay couple does not produce offspring it is morally inferior to a straight couple. Well I was thinking: there are OVER 7 BILLION PEOPLE now and counting, all taking up land, resources, and producing waste and pollution. That is over 7 times as many people as existed 200 years ago! This is not sustainable growth.

Surely then, gay relationships as well as any couple that does not produce offspring is, at this time, morally superior to those who continue to irresponsibly pop out more and more spawn to clutter up the planet and eventually lead to famine, war, pollution, and mass extinction through over population.
 

Terminal Blue

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Shadowstar38 said:
I've been going through the chick's channel on and off inbetween shifts and looking up her interviews with Shapiro and Crowder. If someone could actually point to something that's legitimately bigoted against LGBT people, I'd coincide she may not be entirely credible. But that still wouldn't distract from Yavin being an alleged predator.
You know, I started writing a really long list with youtube references, and then I realised.. you can find records of all this stuff with a 5 second google search.

The fact that you haven't made that search and are instead coming to us to provide you with receipts that are openly available, suggests that you're not actually particularly interested in those receipts.

My guess is that you correctly recognize that it would be emotionally exhausting to us to have to trawl through a lot of openly transphobic shit, and you're just trying to create a situation where it is too much effort to argue with you. Sorry, not playing along, do the google search like everyone else.
 

Silvanus

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Shadowstar38 said:
Like, what, do we need only approved left wing media to shame people for deplorable actions?
No, and nobody has argued such. But she's not just shaming an individual for their actions, is she? She's smearing entire demographics of people.

So, no, we don't need just "approved left wing" media... but we damn well do need media that won't abuse the incident in question to further some other prejudicial agenda.
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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Saelune said:
Silentpony said:
Smithnikov said:
Just because White has pointed out some creepers does not erase that she's a bigot and still an overall shit person. It just means she's a shit person who has done a couple of commendable things.
But that's the thing- even if she is a bigot, which sure she IS, I have no idea but ill go for it for crowd approval sake(meaing i have scene only a few of her videos and don't know enough to judge), that doesn't mean she is wrong. Meaning "I dont like trans people" and "This person is using the Trans identity to molest children" are not connected. We're adults here, we can have two thoughts in our brain and understand the difference. "I hate trans" fuck off, "I hate Pedos using trans as a shield, IE trans = pedo" yeah lets look into this. The politics should be regardless. I couldn't care less about Blair White hunting Pedos as I do Rachel Maddow -both are known political entities. And both are agreed that raping children is wrong. Know one should care about the political agenda behind stopping child rape.
When Christians who hate LGBT people condemn Muslims for hating LGBT people, that is some bullshit. Sure, Islam IS anti-LGBT, but when anti-LGBT Christians use that to excuse abuse against Muslims, that is not ok.

That is what this is.
That has nothing to do with anything. who cares about anyone's political leaning if the topic is 'We hate child rape' Who cares if Blair White is going after Jessica Yaniv for being an alleged pedophile just because Yaniv is Trans? Doing the right thing, ie going after a pedo, for the wrong reason, being trans, is still a good action even done for bad reasons.
You analogy only works if Blair White is herself a pedo, and is just going after Yaniv for being trans, not the whole topless children swim parties thing.

Voting against Donald Trump because you think his daughter is ugly is still a vote against Trump.
Calling the police when your neighbor's home is being invaded because you really don't want to risk a black family moving in after the neighbor is dead is still saving a life.
Letting a woman go on the life raft ahead of you because you don't think women can swim is still saving her life.
Calling the police on a pedophile and reporting her, 'cause you just hate those trans people, is still saving children.

As long as someone is doing the right thing, why should we care why? There are plenty of people doing wrong, and those people need to be called out. So long as Blair White spends her time stopping pedos using the trans identity as justification for their crimes, I'm prepared to over-look the fact she likes Trump, or might be bigoted(still haven't seen that, but that is besides the point)
 

Trunkage

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Silvanus said:
Shadowstar38 said:
Like, what, do we need only approved left wing media to shame people for deplorable actions?
No, and nobody has argued such. But she's not just shaming an individual for their actions, is she? She's smearing entire demographics of people.

So, no, we don't need just "approved left wing" media... but we damn well do need media that won't abuse the incident in question to further some other prejudicial agenda.
I also love how it's 'just the Left Wing Media' who does this. Usually by the same Right pundits who try to shame back.

If you have Free Speech, the ONLY recourse to it to generate a society is shame. If you want something else, get the government involved
 

Saelune

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Silentpony said:
Saelune said:
Silentpony said:
Smithnikov said:
Just because White has pointed out some creepers does not erase that she's a bigot and still an overall shit person. It just means she's a shit person who has done a couple of commendable things.
But that's the thing- even if she is a bigot, which sure she IS, I have no idea but ill go for it for crowd approval sake(meaing i have scene only a few of her videos and don't know enough to judge), that doesn't mean she is wrong. Meaning "I dont like trans people" and "This person is using the Trans identity to molest children" are not connected. We're adults here, we can have two thoughts in our brain and understand the difference. "I hate trans" fuck off, "I hate Pedos using trans as a shield, IE trans = pedo" yeah lets look into this. The politics should be regardless. I couldn't care less about Blair White hunting Pedos as I do Rachel Maddow -both are known political entities. And both are agreed that raping children is wrong. Know one should care about the political agenda behind stopping child rape.
When Christians who hate LGBT people condemn Muslims for hating LGBT people, that is some bullshit. Sure, Islam IS anti-LGBT, but when anti-LGBT Christians use that to excuse abuse against Muslims, that is not ok.

That is what this is.
That has nothing to do with anything. who cares about anyone's political leaning if the topic is 'We hate child rape' Who cares if Blair White is going after Jessica Yaniv for being an alleged pedophile just because Yaniv is Trans? Doing the right thing, ie going after a pedo, for the wrong reason, being trans, is still a good action even done for bad reasons.
You analogy only works if Blair White is herself a pedo, and is just going after Yaniv for being trans, not the whole topless children swim parties thing.

Voting against Donald Trump because you think his daughter is ugly is still a vote against Trump.
Calling the police when your neighbor's home is being invaded because you really don't want to risk a black family moving in after the neighbor is dead is still saving a life.
Letting a woman go on the life raft ahead of you because you don't think women can swim is still saving her life.
Calling the police on a pedophile and reporting her, 'cause you just hate those trans people, is still saving children.

As long as someone is doing the right thing, why should we care why? There are plenty of people doing wrong, and those people need to be called out. So long as Blair White spends her time stopping pedos using the trans identity as justification for their crimes, I'm prepared to over-look the fact she likes Trump, or might be bigoted(still haven't seen that, but that is besides the point)
So if a racist person murders a black person just for being black, but it turns out they raped someone, the killer should not be considered to have committed a hate crime? Like, the killer had no idea, they just happened to murder a rapist, its ok?

Like, you are literally saying 'The ends always justify the means', context be damned.

Like, do you really realize what you have posted here? Cause its pretty bad.
 

Shadowstar38

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evilthecat said:
You know, I started writing a really long list with youtube references, and then I realised.. you can find records of all this stuff with a 5 second google search.

The fact that you haven't made that search and are instead coming to us to provide you with receipts that are openly available, suggests that you're not actually particularly interested in those receipts.

My guess is that you correctly recognize that it would be emotionally exhausting to us to have to trawl through a lot of openly transphobic shit, and you're just trying to create a situation where it is too much effort to argue with you. Sorry, not playing along, do the google search like everyone else.
When people accuse someone of being a bigot, and their whole argument rests on me agreeing with that premise, I don't expect the act of proving it to me emotionally exhausting. But okay, fair enough. Just don't blame me if I don't buy it.

Silvanus said:
No, and nobody has argued such. But she's not just shaming an individual for their actions, is she?
To be determined.

So, no, we don't need just "approved left wing" media... but we damn well do need media that won't abuse the incident in question to further some other prejudicial agenda.
Accept only the facts and don't be swayed but whatever narrative is being pushed.
 

Kwak

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Shadowstar38 said:
Accept only the facts and don't be swayed but whatever narrative is being pushed.
If she's interviewing/being interviewed by Shapiro and 'socialism is for fags' Crowder there is absolutely a narrative being pushed. A fucking doozy of a narrative.
And if you only were exposed to the issue because you frequent that sort of media, then you're obviously all for it.
 

Saelune

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Shadowstar38 said:
evilthecat said:
You know, I started writing a really long list with youtube references, and then I realised.. you can find records of all this stuff with a 5 second google search.

The fact that you haven't made that search and are instead coming to us to provide you with receipts that are openly available, suggests that you're not actually particularly interested in those receipts.

My guess is that you correctly recognize that it would be emotionally exhausting to us to have to trawl through a lot of openly transphobic shit, and you're just trying to create a situation where it is too much effort to argue with you. Sorry, not playing along, do the google search like everyone else.
When people accuse someone of being a bigot, and their whole argument rests on me agreeing with that premise, I don't expect the act of proving it to me emotionally exhausting. But okay, fair enough. Just don't blame me if I don't buy it.

Silvanus said:
No, and nobody has argued such. But she's not just shaming an individual for their actions, is she?
To be determined.

So, no, we don't need just "approved left wing" media... but we damn well do need media that won't abuse the incident in question to further some other prejudicial agenda.
Accept only the facts and don't be swayed but whatever narrative is being pushed.
Don't blame us for thinking the people who side with bigots are bigots.
 

Saelune

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Shadowstar38 said:
Saelune said:
Don't blame us for thinking the people who side with bigots are bigots.
You as an individual are free to make any hasty conclusions you wish to make.
You call others condescending, then act condescending, you accuse others of gaslighting while you gaslight, you jump to conclusions while accusing others of doing the same, you say 'listen to facts' while ignoring the facts inconvenient for your narrative. There is a word for that.
 

Shadowstar38

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Saelune said:
Shadowstar38 said:
Saelune said:
Don't blame us for thinking the people who side with bigots are bigots.
You as an individual are free to make any hasty conclusions you wish to make.
You call others condescending, then act condescending, you accuse others of gaslighting while you gaslight, you jump to conclusions while accusing others of doing the same, you say 'listen to facts' while ignoring the facts inconvenient for your narrative. There is a word for that.
I haven't been given any concrete facts with which too ignore. Telling me someone is a bigot because they "side with bigots" doesn't tell me anything other than you really don't like republicans, which I already knew and doesn't really add anything.

Kwak said:
Shadowstar38 said:
Accept only the facts and don't be swayed but whatever narrative is being pushed.
If she's interviewing/being interviewed by Shapiro and 'socialism is for fags' Crowder there is absolutely a narrative being pushed. A fucking doozy of a narrative.
And if you only were exposed to the issue because you frequent that sort of media, then you're obviously all for it.
If you search youtube for her name, those interviews either come up by themselves, or are referenced by other youtubers talking about her which leads you to go find the original content.

So...you're assuming people who are interviewed by people you don't like are by extension terrible? That doesn't add up.

Making assumptions about people based on the media you think they consume? Again, that doesn't make sense either. I watch the TYT to see what stupid thing they've said this week. Does that make me a liberal all of a sudden? The fuck kind of logic is this?
 

Saelune

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Shadowstar38 said:
Saelune said:
Shadowstar38 said:
Saelune said:
Don't blame us for thinking the people who side with bigots are bigots.
You as an individual are free to make any hasty conclusions you wish to make.
You call others condescending, then act condescending, you accuse others of gaslighting while you gaslight, you jump to conclusions while accusing others of doing the same, you say 'listen to facts' while ignoring the facts inconvenient for your narrative. There is a word for that.
I haven't been given any concrete facts with which too ignore. Telling me someone is a bigot because they "side with bigots" doesn't tell me anything other than you really don't like republicans, which I already knew and doesn't really add anything.
Who said anything about Republicans?
 

Shadowstar38

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Saelune said:
Who said anything about Republicans?
You said she's "siding" with bigots. The only thing that you could possibly be referring to is her being politically conservative. Of course, this is me googling information and throwing out my best guess cause no one wants to actually tell me what makes her a bigot.
 

Kwak

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Shadowstar38 said:
If you search youtube for her name, those interviews either come up by themselves, or are referenced by other youtubers talking about her which leads you to go find the original content.

So...you're assuming people who are interviewed by people you don't like are by extension terrible? That doesn't add up.

Making assumptions about people based on the media you think they consume? Again, that doesn't make sense either. I watch the TYT to see what stupid thing they've said this week. Does that make me a liberal all of a sudden? The fuck kind of logic is this?
People regularly interviewed by those are legitimately neo-nazis. They choose their guests on how much it's going to 'stick to the liberal narrative'. Yes, they are terrible people.
If you were a fan of that media, an eager consumer of that crap, then yes, so would you be. In my opinion, of course.
 

Silentpony_v1legacy

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Saelune said:
Silentpony said:
Saelune said:
Silentpony said:
Smithnikov said:
Just because White has pointed out some creepers does not erase that she's a bigot and still an overall shit person. It just means she's a shit person who has done a couple of commendable things.
But that's the thing- even if she is a bigot, which sure she IS, I have no idea but ill go for it for crowd approval sake(meaing i have scene only a few of her videos and don't know enough to judge), that doesn't mean she is wrong. Meaning "I dont like trans people" and "This person is using the Trans identity to molest children" are not connected. We're adults here, we can have two thoughts in our brain and understand the difference. "I hate trans" fuck off, "I hate Pedos using trans as a shield, IE trans = pedo" yeah lets look into this. The politics should be regardless. I couldn't care less about Blair White hunting Pedos as I do Rachel Maddow -both are known political entities. And both are agreed that raping children is wrong. Know one should care about the political agenda behind stopping child rape.
When Christians who hate LGBT people condemn Muslims for hating LGBT people, that is some bullshit. Sure, Islam IS anti-LGBT, but when anti-LGBT Christians use that to excuse abuse against Muslims, that is not ok.

That is what this is.
That has nothing to do with anything. who cares about anyone's political leaning if the topic is 'We hate child rape' Who cares if Blair White is going after Jessica Yaniv for being an alleged pedophile just because Yaniv is Trans? Doing the right thing, ie going after a pedo, for the wrong reason, being trans, is still a good action even done for bad reasons.
You analogy only works if Blair White is herself a pedo, and is just going after Yaniv for being trans, not the whole topless children swim parties thing.

Voting against Donald Trump because you think his daughter is ugly is still a vote against Trump.
Calling the police when your neighbor's home is being invaded because you really don't want to risk a black family moving in after the neighbor is dead is still saving a life.
Letting a woman go on the life raft ahead of you because you don't think women can swim is still saving her life.
Calling the police on a pedophile and reporting her, 'cause you just hate those trans people, is still saving children.

As long as someone is doing the right thing, why should we care why? There are plenty of people doing wrong, and those people need to be called out. So long as Blair White spends her time stopping pedos using the trans identity as justification for their crimes, I'm prepared to over-look the fact she likes Trump, or might be bigoted(still haven't seen that, but that is besides the point)
So if a racist person murders a black person just for being black, but it turns out they raped someone, the killer should not be considered to have committed a hate crime? Like, the killer had no idea, they just happened to murder a rapist, its ok?

Like, you are literally saying 'The ends always justify the means', context be damned.

Like, do you really realize what you have posted here? Cause its pretty bad.
No, you've missed the point so hard its embarrassing. My point was doing the RIGHT thing, not the wrong thing. Murdering a black man is not the right thing. Of course doing the wrong thing is bad. What's bad is you thinking that someone political views prevent them from calling out non-political crimes. Blair white supports Trump, therefore she has no right to stop a predator from harming children.

Also FYI you're on record saying ends justify means all the time, just with people you disagree with.

Also just so you know, Ends justify the means means that the action you take is fine, so long as the outcome is a positive. In that context doing anything is fine, so long as something good happens. My point was, specifically, doing the right thing, even for the wrong reason. That is not ends justify the means, because the action has to be the right one, in my example trying to stop child rape, for the wrong reason, the rapist is trans.
So no, that's not ends justify the means. Ends justify the means would be allowing Jessica Yaniv to rape children, a bad action, if it ends up making her, a trans person, happy. That is a bad action, so long as a postie outcome. My point was that so long as the action is good, the initial reason for the action is moot. I never mentioned outcome.

So yeah...

EDIT: Here I'll show you a great example.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l8JoQ2MWwoM
This is a video by the Quartering. He is a well known conservative anti-SJW commentator on YouTube. This video is about him trying to stop a YouTube channel whose content is animal abuse, specifically cat torture videos.
Are you okay with the Quartering being against cat torture even though you and he disagree politically, or because he's conservative you have to take the opposite point of view regardless, and either defend cat torture or say he has no right to make such videos.
 

Shadowstar38

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Kwak said:
People regularly interviewed by those are legitimately neo-nazis. They choose their guests on how much it's going to 'stick to the liberal narrative'. Yes, they are terrible people.
If you were a fan of that media, an eager consumer of that crap, then yes, so would you be. In my opinion, of course.
That would make Sam Harris a neo-nazi according to this logic.

If you're judging people based on what they watch, not by their beliefs, words,actions, then...I mean wow. I've got nothing. The discussion is kind of pointless at that point.