Poll: Dubstep. Music or not music?

[sethisjimmy]

Yes, dubstep is clearly music.

The argument that music must take skill is fucking retarded, because making electronic music actually does take some level of skill, and almost every type of music is going to be less skill involved than another.
Let me ask you this. Is rock music not really music because it takes less skill than classical music?
No.

Unless you can come up with a better argument than "one thing takes more skill than another so therefore it isn't music", yes dubstep is music.

What pisses me off is how entirely unfounded this debate is. The only reason people like to put forth the opinion that it isn't music is because they don't like it.
It's like if I don't like racing games, then they aren't video games anymore, it's like, grow the fuck up idiots.

 

[snekadid]

This is too much, Escapist, far too much. I had faith in you, for some reason that I cannot recall, but it was there! Now it lays on the floor like a spent condom: used up, tossed on the floor, and filled with the squishy refuse of a drunken minuteman.

I'd make my case, but I'm sure someone else here has tossed the 'Dubstep lacks talent because it's almost entirely automated' argument somewhere. Guitars, pianos, drums, flutes, cymbals, cellos, violins, violas, basses, tubas, trombones, bongos, xylophones and the human voice each require, talent, precision and finesse to be used to the best of their ability. Next, everyone's gonna cay loading a CD into a player and starting it makes you a musician.

This is it. Tonight, I am giving one more post to finish things off proper, and the Escapist forums and I are done.

I'd like to refute this with a video of the most awesome thing i've ever seen.


This is entirely automated, involves none of the very narrow list of instruments you posted, infact all notes are played by the variety of sounds a floppy drive can make at certain speeds. This is not only music, i think its great, its takes talent and a certain amount of specific skills to be able to do things like in the video or dubstep. The main difference is dubstep takes away spontaneity and alot of the risk that comes from live performances.

I like most music with the exception of gangsta rap and country. This doesn't mean their not music, with the exception of the the country songs where they play music while some one talks, thats just some one having a one sided conversation in a elevator and only shatner is allowed to do that and call it music because he is that great.

 

[Baron_Rouge]

Of course it's music...even if it's not good music (which is a debate for another time) it's pretty elitist to think you can just deem something "not music".

 

[Random Argument Man]

It's music.

Although, what I think of it is pretty much how Jeff Winger of the show Community sees Paul Rudd and religion.

"To me, Religion is like Paul Rudd. I see the appeal and I would never take it away from anyone, but I would also never stand in line for it."

Replace "religion" with "dubstep" and Paul Rudd with...let's see....Friendship is magic.

 

[Toy Yota]

It is music, but it's not very popular because some people don't enjoy it. In contrast with the other forms of music, Dubstep appears to be the type best for remixes.

 

[LunaSpark]

http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/SturgeonsLaw

90% of EVERYTHING is crap, dubstep is no exception, but that still leaves roughly 10% that can range anywhere from reasonably good to downright awesome.

Just because someone might not have found anything they liked during their first experiences with a new genre, that doesn't mean that there isn't something out there that they might like, if only they would give the genre a chance long enough for them to find it.

 

[razer17]

"Music is an art form whose medium is sound and silence"

You could have just described anything from the chatter of a waiting room to the cars passing on a motorway to the sound of typing in an office ...

On topic. When I was at school we were taught about musical instruments, among which was not the decks or the computer! It takes absolutely fuck all skill to make dubstep, all it requires is money for the equipment and a taste similar to everybody else's (or a majority at least).

You could spend 1,000 hours perfecting the "song" then all you have to do at a live performance is press play.

I define anything as art (or in this case music) as something which takes skill to do, such as playing a guitar in time with everybody else in the band. Take art for example, I wouldn't consider a white canvass with different coloured horizontal stripes art 'cos any fucker can do that! I would call the Mona Lisa art 'cos that is a skillful thing.

The only exception I have to dubstep not being music is beardyman, who does something called live looping. He makes a sound, records it, loops it makes another sound, records it, loops it, layers it over the first sound, then repeats till he has a full song going.

That takes skill to do! This isn't live looping but it is harder to do.

Firstly, you are wrong. You still have to be creative and know how to use various pieces of software and harware to make a good song. I've tried, and it's not as easy as people who don't like it make it out to be. And it isn't just a computer. You need all sorts of kit to make a good song. Learning to use them is not all that different to learning guitar or drums. I could pick up a guitar right now, doesn't mean I could make a song. You could pick up Fruity Loops right now, and you couldn't make a dubstep song.

The only difference between Beardyman and other dubstep artists is that he uses his mouth. all music is essentially layering certain sounds over the top of each other.

Not too mention that this entire argument falls down when you have bands that use real instruments to make their dubstep. Pendulum, Chase and Status, Modestep and many other use live bands with guitars, drums, keyboards etc. to play dubstep.

 

[MisterGobbles]

I can't believe no one has brought this abomination up yet.

OT: Yes, of course there's some good dubstep. A lot of it is boring, but a lot of electro in general is boring. The stuff that is good is quite amazing, and there's been a lot of inventive stuff made using the tropes of the genre.

 

[razer17]

This is too much, Escapist, far too much. I had faith in you, for some reason that I cannot recall, but it was there! Now it lays on the floor like a spent condom: used up, tossed on the floor, and filled with the squishy refuse of a drunken minuteman.

I'd make my case, but I'm sure someone else here has tossed the 'Dubstep lacks talent because it's almost entirely automated' argument somewhere. Guitars, pianos, drums, flutes, cymbals, cellos, violins, violas, basses, tubas, trombones, bongos, xylophones and the human voice each require, talent, precision and finesse to be used to the best of their ability. Next, everyone's gonna cay loading a CD into a player and starting it makes you a musician.

This is it. Tonight, I am giving one more post to finish things off proper, and the Escapist forums and I are done.

Are you saying you're quitting this forum because some of us think that dubstep is music? If so:
Good. See you later. You're a close minded idiot, and you're insulting. There's too many of you're type around these parts anywhere. Go find a place where you can be with your close minded equals.

 

[Joey Bolzenius]

Dubstep is like hip hop and rap where samples from other music is used. The genre is very much a patchwork of sounds put together with new meaning and context. Hell Andy Warhol is world famous for painting brand name soup cans and a bunch of pictures of Marylin Monroe. In my view, Dubstep is a major upgrade to the boring ass overly repetitive techno music of the 90s.

Funny, had the internet been around in the 50s there'd be plenty of people saying rock and roll is garbage and just a fad. To those folks rock just did not compare to jazz or swing or whatever was established as an accepted music genre at the time.

Black Sabbath was far from accepted in the late 60s by contemporary music critics but look how many bands they influenced.

The music snobs will always get left in their own little corner where they cling to their music as the "best" while most people will look for new sounds, new compositions, new music paths.

 

[Kizi]

While I'm definitely not a fan of dubstep, it's still music.

 

[frizzlebyte]

Of course it is. Aside from some really short, explosive samples, though (like the one used in the Borderlands trailer), I don't find it to be very enjoyable.

 

[khaimera]

Since the answer to this question is an obvious yes, I'll contribute by helping others find amazing dubstep tunes in one easy to use place. Simply go to [link]www.soundcloud.com[/link] and look up my username, khaimera. Click on my name and then on the people I follow tab. I follow over 250 amazing producers of bass heavy music. Tons of music is available for free download or purchase. Enjoy.

 

[Vanilla_Druid]

I guess it can be, but I feel like I am being a bit too generous. I mean, I do have an appreciation for electronica, but I believe that it is better make new stuff rather than remix existing tracks.

 

[klaynexas3]

You are a terrible person. You are bad and you should feel bad.
My actual reaction to this video: this isn't so bad *hits the drop* god dammit. Wait, the music is somewhat coming back, and even with the robot voice, maybe they could salvage it *hits last drop* I'm done. Screw you Muse, you were once good.

OT: Of all my posts on this thread, I have yet to actually reply to the OP. Yes, it is music, and can be done well, but it is easy to put out garbage, so we see more of that. Also, most see it as a joke, case in point

 

[Crowbar_Abortion]

I have never understood why people enjoyed listening to the dubstep genre until I saw this:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gEJHrmliVQw

Do I like the song at all? well yes strangely enough, but only when paired with the video. If I close my eyes then it becomes just like nails on a chalkboard.
But having it displayed satirically or ironically whichever is right or closest, makes this one of the funniest most enjoyable things ive ever seen. And since I can appreciate it in this manner alone, I must at least call it music or art.

 

[Lunar Templar]

its a way for people to make money in the music industry with out actually making music, like hiphop

 

[Keltrick]

"Music is an art form whose medium is sound and silence"

You could have just described anything from the chatter of a waiting room to the cars passing on a motorway to the sound of typing in an office ...

On topic. When I was at school we were taught about musical instruments, among which was not the decks or the computer! It takes absolutely fuck all skill to make dubstep, all it requires is money for the equipment and a taste similar to everybody else's (or a majority at least).

You could spend 1,000 hours perfecting the "song" then all you have to do at a live performance is press play.

What about a visual medium? A film is recorded, then all you do is go to a theater and press play. You can edit, tweak, and reshoot what ever parts you don't like, just like with digital music. Once its done, you let it play. No one's arguing "Stage Acting is REAL art. The rest is fake." What about a painting? You Make it, then present it. Don't even have to hit a play button.

Skill is subjective. A taste to similar to everybody else? You mean like all music that floods my radio when I make the mistake of turning it on. I'm sorry, but I don't feel comfortable assigning the label of "art" to things and refusing it to others just because "you didn't deviate from the norm enough." A better microphone also makes singers sound better, but I'm not going to say Shakira sings well just because of her equipment. It takes that, sure, but it also takes talent and knowing how to use it.

I go back to editing film. You take what the camera man shoots, and what the actors did/said, and you make art out of that. No ones has seen Requiem for a Dream's editing and said there wasn't an artistic mind behind that.

 

[Songblade]

just a bunch of noise mashed together by people with too much time on their hands.

That IS music.

As for dubsteb? It's technically music, but it's starting to get a little old.

 

[Keltrick]

This is too much, Escapist, far too much. I had faith in you, for some reason that I cannot recall, but it was there! Now it lays on the floor like a spent condom: used up, tossed on the floor, and filled with the squishy refuse of a drunken minuteman.

I'd make my case, but I'm sure someone else here has tossed the 'Dubstep lacks talent because it's almost entirely automated' argument somewhere. Guitars, pianos, drums, flutes, cymbals, cellos, violins, violas, basses, tubas, trombones, bongos, xylophones and the human voice each require, talent, precision and finesse to be used to the best of their ability. Next, everyone's gonna cay loading a CD into a player and starting it makes you a musician.

This is it. Tonight, I am giving one more post to finish things off proper, and the Escapist forums and I are done.

Are you saying you're quitting this forum because some of us think that dubstep is music? If so:
Good. See you later. You're a close minded idiot, and you're insulting. There's too many of you're type around these parts anywhere. Go find a place where you can be with your close minded equals.

Seconded. I don't cry when I pull weeds from my garden to let the more beautiful plants have more room to grow. There is a big difference between copy/pasting an image, and then using a digital medium like photoshop to create and edit images. If you're equating dubstep to loading a CD, I think you're past help. I don't like dubstep in the least, and I understand it more than that.