Poll: I don't like UFC | Violence in Sport | Ronda Rousey status

[stormtrooper9091]

I said 'compare', not 'connect'. Have you seen combat as extreme as UFC? Have you seen violence as extreme as ISIS? Why have these extreme things come about? Because we have been pushing the bar higher and higher and this is what it takes to be the most visible presence these days.

1. Yes, K1 gets as vicious
2. Yes, mass shootings all around Murikuh, guy in Texas recently killed 6 people, one of them being a 5 year old kid
3. People worldwide generally losing their shit

These two are in no way connected, and even though you said you "compared" them, it's still reaching to say the least

 

[Glongpre]

For people who do not like it, have you tried it?
Do you like sports? Do you enjoy competing?

Martial arts are indeed vicious, but that's because they are meant for self defence. They are made so that you will win any physical confrontation. But there is also another side to them. They teach discipline, respect, and they make you know more about your own limits.
I know many people who echo my thoughts that because they trained in a martial art, they are less likely to be violent. They honestly do not want to hurt anyone because they know what a human is capable of.

I like the UFC because I enjoy martial arts. I have done muay thai and jiu jitsu, and seriously, sparring is the funnest shit I have ever done. Like competing against another human is truly a test of your physical and mental conditioning.

Martial arts for me is more about having confidence in yourself, and trying to bring peace. Seems kind of weird right? But it goes back to what I was saying before, I don't want to fight anyone because of the risks. It would actually be terrifying to be in a real fight!!!

I am all over the place with this post it feels like. Anyway, sports are fun for people who enjoy competing against another human. Violence is just one way of showing a physical domination over an opponent. I can see how it would be hard to watch, but everyone has different likes/dislikes, and that is what this comes down to.

(I don't know if I missed the point of this post, took me a bit to write and I forget what the OP is about, haha.)

 

[spacemutant IV]

If I was King of the World, I would not prevent anyone from competing in martial arts tournaments, but I would get rid of the stupid spectacle around it. I think that's the real issue, the mindset around the sport and the events. Who's to say that someone actually interested in the sport could not enjoy it if it was treated like a chess match? I for one would actually be way more interested in it, if the people around it were quiet and serious and the whole thing wasn't marketed the way it is being marketed. I do not like loud people in general, and the noise surrounding this sport is the worst kind of noise.

*edit* Also, while I haven't criticized anything about the sport itself in the previous paragraph, the beating of opponents that are down is a real issue. This too relates to the mindset, a different way of things would be entirely possible. There are good reasons and bad reasons for competing and watching, and this sport, as probably any sport, is overrun by those who do both for the worst kinds of reasons.

 

[AgedGrunt]

Have to go with "Other".

It's a sport. It's competitive and legitimate. But though I'm not a martial artist, I respect different styles and martial arts training as disciplines. I'm not saying UFC is a bunch of people misusing or disrespecting sacred teachings, but there's so much more to martial arts than being uber badass and beating everyone on the block, and doing it for spectacle and personal gain doesn't sit well with me.

If you want to discipline and grow yourself and be competitive, great, but UFC is perverse, especially the glorification and drama injected into the competition; so many bad attitudes and images. I like pro-wrestling because there's a curtain and veneer; the people are awesome and do so much for fans and charities. UFC by comparison is more like boxing: big purses and bigger egos. I can't stand the machismo in so many fighters, but remember that's part of the draw, like the pro-wrestler "heel" (villain of the story).

TL;DR UFC is about views and money, not sport.

Also, yeah, it is too violent. Kicks to the head/neck and chokes (which a lot of times go too long) are insane.

 

[Lightknight]

So some people like to test the mettle against others and get paid while doing it. Not sure who else's business that is if that's what they prefer to do.

There are a lot of things I don't like to see. I was watching the Silva match when his leg went all rubber chicken on him. That was rough. I like to see a technically skilled match or a swift take down/knock out. Brutal breaks or lengthy poundings just aren't my cup of tea.

 

[omega 616]

Here I thought people would understand it, here of all places (outside of MMA forums).

All those anime's you like, all these cool fights are played out in real life and what do you do? "oh this is savage" ... then complain the combat in the Elder scrolls games isn't realistic enough.

I mean, there are some insanely cool moments, just look at the showtime kick.... (only need to watch about 10 seconds)


Anyway, MMA is MUUUUCH safer than boxing, which is so widely accepted that it has been going on since the AD's. The great thing about MMA is it's looks a lot worse but it actually a lot safer.

You can still end up as a mumbling mess due to repeated wars, in which you take an absolute beating but death is so much more rare ... in the UFC they are yet to have a death.

MMA shows off most of the most effective fighting styles and sees who is the better man or woman. You can complain about "he gets on top of the other guy and just smashes his face in and it's too much" sure, if the ref is crap, that happens but a lot of the time it's not as bad as you think AND there is no standing count, which is what is really dangerous.

If you get hit so hard you can't stand up, why are you then allowed 10 seconds to stand back up and carry on fighting? Your brain has swollen from being hit so much and so hard, then you are able to stand up and carry on ... that is a road to a brain damage or death, which is shown by in ring deaths. In MMA you get rocked and chances are the fight is over soon after, which is why it's so much safer.

What could be better? Very highly skilled practitioners, doing incredible things AND more safely than other combat sports that are accepted without question.

Wiki (I know, I know) says there have been 12 deaths in MMA upto 2014, 4 of those are from sanctioned fights. I can't find numbers of how many boxers have died since 1993 (when the UFC started and MMA started to get big) but I did read on average 10 boxers die per year ... so very roughly 220 dead boxers? I'd also be willing to bet that retired MMA fighters are a lot more healthy than retired boxers.

All I am saying is, stop being fox news and jumping to your own conclusions, think about it, read about it (as Chris rock says about voting) swirl it around in your head for a bit and then make a decision.

Also, yeah, it is too violent. Kicks to the head/neck and chokes (which a lot of times go too long) are insane.

Head kicks have been barred since pride, which was only in Japan. As for chockes the fighter can stop them any time and the second they go limp (which is very rare) the fight stops. Unless you fight 1 certain fighter has was fired for holding chokes and continues to do so.

 

[Lightknight]

So some people like to test the mettle against others and get paid while doing it. Not sure who else's business that is if that's what they prefer to do.

There are a lot of things I don't like to see. I was watching the Silva match when his leg went all rubber chicken on him. That was rough. I like to see a technically skilled match or a swift take down/knock out. Brutal breaks or lengthy poundings just aren't my cup of tea.

I prefer contests that are more designed for those technical skills, and which prevent the brutality. In my mind, it's like a preference for fencing and kendo vs. wanting to see gladiators fight with blades. The whole point of modern sporting is to retain the essential contest without requiring needless sacrifice of the participant's health.

Lets also be realistic that as the average person lives a lot longer, and with a better quality of life, there is more to lose. If you were going to be crippled in your 30's and 40's from backbreaking labor anyway, and dead shortly thereafter or in your 50's, these debates probably seemed weird. With the exception of boxing, few sports take their toll in a time that previous social structures ever needed to take notice of. The ones that did, were controlled.

Now frankly, we have to consider that someone who would otherwise be spry in their 60's may be making ill-informed choices which lead to them being an aching, hobbling, and in the worst case demented wreck by their 50's.

Any sport can ruin your body with repetition. Basketball ruins knees, football does a variety of things and even Tennis and fencing are going to have long-term damage thanks to repetitive movements. Even dancers can have severe hip and knee injuries that can rival UFC fighters.

So I'm not sure the "you'll be sore when you're old" is exclusive to UFC fighting. At least in UFC you'll likely be out before you become punch drunk like boxers because of all the other ways you can lose other than getting knocked out.

 

[omega 616]

snip

Missed my point entirely. Also, why so rude? Don't you think I understand the difference between fantasy and reality? Really?

... except I do have a point, if boxing is accepted and not called savage/barbaric, despite being more harmful, why is MMA called savage/barbaric when it is safer. Again, you missed my point.

Not that many broken bones, not that many dislocations or hyper extensions and most muscle tears happen in training, like anybody taking MMA (or any subset of MMA, such as BJJ) would get. The vast majority of fighters tap in the vast majority of cases before any damage is done 'cos they know their career could be over if they don't tap. If you watch UFC and judging by your responses you don't, you'd see that in a number of occasions they barely fight the hold. Collective hours spent unconscious? Hours? How long do you think people are knocked unconscious for? It's rare for it to be 10 seconds, let alone longer. Oh, I bet you have a doctorate with that last line of that paragraph.

Now you're just being pedantic, clearly "see who the better man is" is an expression, break a leg doesn't actually mean break a leg during a performance.

Considering the gloves barely cover the hands, they are mainly to protect the knuckles from breaking ... like you went on about in paragraph 2. It is also against the rules to hold the opponents gloves. The rule set does prohibit some weird shit, like no 12-6 elbows 'cos the commission saw demonstrations and thought a 12-6 elbow would break skulls and head kicks/knees to downed opponents despite Pride allowing such kicks and no serious injuries occurred (that I know of).

I don't HAVE to read anything. Though by reading what you just wrote, I'd research MMA before getting back to me.

 

[Lightknight]

So some people like to test the mettle against others and get paid while doing it. Not sure who else's business that is if that's what they prefer to do.

There are a lot of things I don't like to see. I was watching the Silva match when his leg went all rubber chicken on him. That was rough. I like to see a technically skilled match or a swift take down/knock out. Brutal breaks or lengthy poundings just aren't my cup of tea.

I prefer contests that are more designed for those technical skills, and which prevent the brutality. In my mind, it's like a preference for fencing and kendo vs. wanting to see gladiators fight with blades. The whole point of modern sporting is to retain the essential contest without requiring needless sacrifice of the participant's health.

Lets also be realistic that as the average person lives a lot longer, and with a better quality of life, there is more to lose. If you were going to be crippled in your 30's and 40's from backbreaking labor anyway, and dead shortly thereafter or in your 50's, these debates probably seemed weird. With the exception of boxing, few sports take their toll in a time that previous social structures ever needed to take notice of. The ones that did, were controlled.

Now frankly, we have to consider that someone who would otherwise be spry in their 60's may be making ill-informed choices which lead to them being an aching, hobbling, and in the worst case demented wreck by their 50's.

Any sport can ruin your body with repetition. Basketball ruins knees, football does a variety of things and even Tennis and fencing are going to have long-term damage thanks to repetitive movements. Even dancers can have severe hip and knee injuries that can rival UFC fighters.

So I'm not sure the "you'll be sore when you're old" is exclusive to UFC fighting. At least in UFC you'll likely be out before you become punch drunk like boxers because of all the other ways you can lose other than getting knocked out.

Knees can be replaced, brains can't be. Football if we're being honest is an insane thing to play for your entire body, and hobbling older players (with the exception of QB's and kickers) tell that sorry story. At some point we're going to have to ask ourselves if paying people to ruin their health is right. It's allowed obviously, and I don't think it should be legislated away, but I would love it if people were empathetic and smart enough to not enjoy watching it happen.

Basketball though, really doesn't do much more to people than any vigorous activity would to 7' tall men. You're not talking about a population that was ever going to have an easy time of it; that kind of size comes with consequences to a number of organ systems and the joints, almost inevitably. As with tennis though, playing too much and too often is going to be a problem.

I put this to you, as a global commentary on sport:

If the average person can live to be 200 in some hypothetical future, with 100 being the equivalent of a very healthy ~40 now, how would that change things? Would it still be seen as sane to sacrifice the quality of 150 of those years for the sake of fame and money for maybe 10-20 years? Granted (hopefully) regenerative medicine is going to make all of this a non-issue, but it's an interesting thought experiment. Would we want teens to play competitive gymnastics or tennis if they might spend so much of their potentially healthy years in pain as a result, for example?

Do you believe that marijuana should be legal? May not sound relevant but it is. How about alcohol or cigarettes? What about rubber cement and aerosol products?

 

[Synigma]

I wrote out an eloquent response but lost it before hitting send... so here is a rushed version:

I don't like the savagery. I don't like the way young children are being shown it. I don't like the glorification of the kind of people who would end your life upon meeting them in a dark alley. I don't like the glorification of the kind of person who thinks degree of blood- and tooth-loss equates to sporting prowess. I don't see how a mother can be proud of a son or daughter who raises their blood-soaked fists in triumph after dismantling a stranger's face. I don't like what it says about contemporary society that this kind of sport can garner such a sincere and fervored following - frankly, and I know this is rather a long bow, I draw comparisons between the surge in popularity for UFC in recent years to the growth of ISIS, who have also relied on a hitherto unheard of appreciation for shock and savagery among our desensitized younger populations.

I'm glad you specified that this was just an opinion before you went into it, because I found some of implications you made to be rather insulting. Personally i'm not really a fan but I have friends who are and most of them also happen to be martial artists themselves. And actually to that point when I started taking Judo I also gained a new appreciation for UFC as well... though to be fair the 'ground and pound' strategy you seem most against is also my least favourite part.

You do make some good points, ie children shouldn't be watching it unsupervised, but frankly I disagree that it's 'savage' or somehow regressive. It's violent without a doubt but the word savage implies a level of wildness or lack of control that just isn't there. These are professionals trying to win at a sport and unlike most sports where you can get a lucky goal, here you can get a lucky hit and end the fight. So they can't afford to be reckless and they have to follow up when they get an opportunity. When one fighter gets the other down and starts feeding them punches and the crowd goes wild... it's not because they are excited at the blood it's like a break away in hockey; they are cheering because this might be the end of the fight.

And frankly your comparison with ISIS is completely misplaced. ISIS is a terrorist group, if the UFC was really desensitizing us then it would only result in people being LESS afraid of ISIS and therefore it would be failing not growing. ISIS's growth is entirely reliant on a warped religious indoctrination and preying on youth's desire to rebel. If you're looking to draw a link between ISIS and other violence then I'd like to direct you to statistics on drone strikes.

 

[sageoftruth]

I basically think it's something that I would have found entertaining if I hadn't been spoiled by the spectacle of fighting games.
As a result, I'm neither drawn in nor pushed away, just bored whenever I watch it.

 

[MeatMachine]

I don't watch UFC myself, but that's not saying much, given that I'm not fond of playing or spectating ANY sports. In spite of its violent (sometimes gruesome) nature that surpasses older combat sports like boxing and wrestling, I don't have a problem with the conflict. People enjoy participating, people enjoy watching, and the only harm that comes to anyone are those who understand and accept the inevitability of minor injury and the decent risk of serious injury when competing.

Honestly, the only thing about the UFC I find truly distasteful is the demeanor of the fighters. It's rather unsportsmanlike to scowl and intimidate your competitor immediately before the match, and pound your chest and scream like a triumphant ape when you win. I totally understand that psychological tactics are an inseparable element of combat and combat sports alike, but if behaving like an asshole gives you an indisputable advantage in a sport... well, I'm not going to enjoy watching it very much if I hate everyone involved.

Yeah, I know - I have no problem seeing people kick each other into comas, but it bothers me immensely to watch them sneer at each other before the bell rings. Call me a pussy, but I'd rather watch a long, boring game of golf if it began with a handshake and ended in a round of cold beer between the competitors.