Poll: The line between piracy and copying.

dragontiers

The Temporally Displaced
Feb 26, 2009
497
0
0
Ok, I will admit this is inspired by the "Don't Copy That part 2" video that was just put up. One thing I noticed throughout was the fact they us the word "copy" as if it was synonymous with "pirate" or "steal". Then it occured to me that part of the endless debating on piracy could stem from a simple misunderstanding of what other people mean when they use the term.

If I want to copy a disk (game, program, etc.) that I have purchased, I am within my legal rights to do so. That is all a back-up is, after all. I can't count the number of programs I have that I no longer have the original disks for because the were somehow damaged or lost, but I still retain a copy of so that I can continue to use the program. I'm sure many other responsible people make multiple back-ups of software for emergency use, both on-line and off-line.

Similarly, who among us hasn't bought a video game/cd/movie, played it, and then loaned it to a friend we thought would also love said item, or vice versa. This, as well, is perfectly within one's legal rights.

I also believe we can all (for the most part) agree that what the guy at the end of the video did (stealing bank account information, making fake ebay/paypal accounts, and then selling illegal copies of games on-line for money) is blatant piracy, as well as a few other serious crimes. From this I believe we can all also agree that if I sell a game/program that I have a back-up of, the responsible thing to do would be to either give the person who is buying from me all copies that I have made, or to destroy them after the sale.

In my opinion, the line starts getting hazy when the two are mixed. If I buy (let's say for argument's sake) Fallout 3, make a back-up disk, play it, enjoy it, then loan it to a friend, am I suddenly guilty of piracy? How much leeway do I have? This is the grey area, and I think where most people get confused/argumentative. So, to help get a reading on this, I have decided to put up a poll.

Where, in your opinion, is the line crossed? What is your right as a consumer, and at what point have you overstepped your bounds. If you have any sort of outside information, legal or otherwise, please link it. Well developed arguments are desired here.

Disclaimer 1: I apologize if this has been done before, but I was unable to find anything relevant with the search bar. Granted, there was a lot of other topics to wade through, but I did my best.

Disclaimer 2: This is not meant to be a discussion on the legality of piracy, whether we should use the term piracy or some other term, companies attempts to prevent piracy, whether or not piracy is ever justified, etc, nor is it intended to condone piracy in any form. This is just meant to get a gage on what the average gamer thinks piracy actually is. All statements made in my post are reflective only of my opinion and possible limited knowledge on the subject, and should not be taken as statements of cold hard facts unless otherwise stated. I have been known to be wrong. Please read the post in full detail before commenting.
 

Radeonx

New member
Apr 26, 2009
7,013
0
0
If you are making a back up disc, it is legal, but selling the back up disc is not. Piracy is piracy if you don't have the game, but you download it. It isn't backing up, it is theft.
 

thiosk

New member
Sep 18, 2008
5,410
0
0
I dont think the ENTIRE piracy debate is due to a simple misunderstanding of the word copy.
 

dragontiers

The Temporally Displaced
Feb 26, 2009
497
0
0
thiosk said:
I dont think the ENTIRE piracy debate is due to a simple misunderstanding of the word copy.
If you notice in my first paragraph, I say that I think that PART of the debate could be due to misunderstanding. Nowhere do I claim it is the entirety of the issue. This post is just an attempt to try and guage where people think the dividing line is, and possibly try to clear up any confusion people have about what is and isn't legal.
 

Schnippshly

New member
Mar 6, 2009
199
0
0
Piracy is not a matter of opinion to be voted on, piracy is when you copy games and give/sell them to people who don't own the original, or you obtain games that you're supposed to pay for by downloading them without paying for them, as opposed to being given the actual physical retail copy of a game for free.
 

Cargando

New member
Apr 8, 2009
2,092
0
0
Does EA let you mod their games? I'm not sure.

But anyway, I think making a back up itself isn't piracy, more... insurance. Back up with intent to give it away I reckon is piracy.
 

dragontiers

The Temporally Displaced
Feb 26, 2009
497
0
0
Schnippshly said:
Piracy is not a matter of opinion to be voted on, piracy is when you copy games and give/sell them to people who don't own the original, or you obtain games that you're supposed to pay for by downloading them without paying for them, as opposed to being given the actual physical retail copy of a game for free.
Yes, both of those examples are obvious forms of piracy. My intent with this topic was to clear up some of the less cut and dry examples. If I make a back-up of something, then let you borrow either my original copy or the back-up without giving you both, is that piracy? If I sell off a cd I own, and six months later while doing routine maintenance on my computer find I still have the cd saved to memory, have I been guilty of pirating the cd for the past six months, albiet unknowingly? Should I have to go out and spend another x dollars on a retail copy of a game I already purchased, even I have the back-up, just because someone stole my retail copy? If I have a back-up server and someone hacks in and downloads my back-ups, am I responsible for their piracy? These are all examples of some of the grey areas most people without law degrees wouldn't neccessarily know for sure and, the law being what it is, might have mistaken impressions on.
Also, as I pointed out, quite often the language we use to describe piracy is muddy, as per the video I mention where they use the word copy as if the very act of making a copy, even a back-up copy, is piracy and therefore a crime. I'm not taking a vote on what piracy is or isn't, I'm trying to guage what people THINK it means, especially in corner cases like some I've mentioned.
 
Mar 9, 2009
893
0
0
It's doesn't matter, because especially with completely online services such as iTunes, as soon as you change computers all the stuff on your iPod gets deleted and if you try and get it back for free (since you already paid for it) you become a criminal. In my opinion, you might as well cut out the middle man and pirate things to begin with, cause you're a criminal anyway.
 

scotth266

Wait when did I get a sub
Jan 10, 2009
5,202
0
0
When you're giving things away, that's when you stroll into piracy. Lending people things is fine (I buy stuff I borrow from people), but giving them away/selling them is not.
 

Teh_Doomage

New member
Jan 11, 2009
936
0
0
I think it's a combination of alot of the above. Giving your original away while keeping the backup or giving a copy of the backup away, either way.

The backups are what, I feel started the piracy.
 

Sixties Spidey

Elite Member
Jan 24, 2008
3,299
0
41
There's a difference.

Almost every single game in my catalogue of Wii games are all torrent copies. They are discs with an ISO I got from a torrent burnt on it. It's not only to save money, but it's also to save hassle dealing with asshole retailers.

And here's the insult in this. I modded my Wii along with a hard disk so that it can actually PLAY games from the HDD. I just launch the channel, go underneath my games, install whatever game I want to install on it, and then play it from there. AND IT LOADS FASTER.

My point is that backing up a game is different from actively pirating. What I described above, is actively pirating it. It's a deliberate act and what you decide to do is all in your morals and motives.

Also, a person who buys a disc has the right to distribute it to whoever the fuck he wants. Likewise, the consumer has the right to choose if what he is buying is actually worth the money or not.