Poll: was i out of line?

A.A.K

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Mar 7, 2009
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Pfft. I'd have put them in arm-locks and dragged them outside if they broke a couple windows and my fence. You're morally sound.
 

Magical029

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Sep 5, 2011
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Delsana, tofulove. This is not, I repeat, NOT R&P. If you want to discuss an eye for an eye, Ghandi and Jesus...move to R&P.

No, you weren't out of line, they were trespassing, and broke a fence and a window. You were merely getting them off your property. However, it was done in a sub-optimal manner. You should try next time (if there is a next time) to not cause them pain.
 

DudeistBelieve

TellEmSteveDave.com
Sep 9, 2010
4,771
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Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
You can believe that if you will, but in historical documents there is no doubt a man named jesus lived and that man died in the indicated way as well. The governor, pilate, and numerous other roman officials as well as other officials have confirmed him, though if they allowed any official information of his miracles to get out it could cause chaos. Kind of like propaganda control, you know like China and North Korea do every day. You can deny it if you like, but this is a case of historical evidence, which you can't argue against.

You can argue against his powers though.

Don't really care.

It's not really the sky so much as another realm.
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
I'm practically an atheist, your argument loses merit when you hit the part I bolded.

Is it that much of a stretch that a guy named Jesus Christ actually existed and was just a nut job that believed he was the son of God and was killed on a cross?
well if that was the case, why worship him, and still lacking in evidence. its some one saying there a flying teacup in orbit around the sun. sure there could be, but there no evidence of it so why believe it.
I don't know why people believe in it dude, but I do not think it's that much of a stretch that the guy existed and created a bit of noise and was executed and during the years that followed when the story was re-told over and over (before eventually written down) a lot of shit got exaggerated.

Really if you're going to argue religion, just stick to the easy shit to disprove. The coming back alive after 3 days of being dead, the walking on water, the parting of the red sea. The shit that's taken "on faith".
The thing that disputes your whole "he exited but he was a nut job" type thing is that people that didn't really believe in him and weren't really loyal to him.. upon his "revival", suddenly go off praising and preaching him everywhere and then get killed for it. People don't suddenly make a 180 and then go die for it unless they've got some SERIOUS reasons to believe.
It's not my thing. Like I said I can't be bothered to look it up but if my left nut was on the line, I'd bet a man named Jesus really existed.

Also you're giving the human race to much credit. You and I know as much as we do cause we've been educated and have access to wonderful technology. People back then didn't have jackshit. If I was alive back then and someone told me dragons were real I'd believe them.... why wouldn't I? There be nothing to tell me logically otherwise.

If you want proof in the modern day, how many people watch Reality TV and believe it's real? Fuck, how much money is Kim Kardashian worth despite the fact she doesn't do anything aside from exist? I'm sorry to say this dude, but the majority of the 7 Billion on this planet aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. Hell I knew a couple that was shocked that their daughter was gay.... even though her girlfriend has moved in with the family prior.... and she slept in the same bed as their daughter.... for several months. I went to my therapist and asked "They can't really be shocked, can they?" and he looked at me grimly and said "Unfortunately, yes they probably are."

I can't honestly say I believe a man named Jesus existed that could walk on water or come back from the dead. I can believe a guy named Jesus existed that earnestly believed himself to be the son of God and probably did a couple of cool things that people hyperbolized. Really dude, consider it, it makes more sense that some average guy did a couple of cool things that got blown out of per-portion then an entire religion based around an utter and complete fallacy. The simplest answer is more often the right one.
 

Simskiller

New member
Oct 13, 2010
283
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spartandude said:
You were totally in the right, ear pulling and all, as it's not bad at all, and only hurts.

It's really interesting seeing other peoples reactions, and I'm kinda interested in their ages.
 

Dags90

New member
Oct 27, 2009
4,683
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All that other crap aside, I would consider it personally irresponsible to touch someone's child without explicit (or very heavy implicit) permission. Maybe I'm just paranoid, but I like to have a neutral third party in close proximity whenever minors I'm not related to are involved.
 

xshadowscreamx

New member
Dec 21, 2011
523
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if this was the 50's, the kids would apologies or be to afraid to go over the fence,,crazy old man he might seek his dog on us, im pretty sure he said,seek balls seek that time....
 

Kikyoo

New member
Apr 16, 2008
124
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Dunno about over there, but trespassing around here can, and will get you shot. So honestly twisting ears seems like a pretty minor thing. That's just me.
 

Jonluw

New member
May 23, 2010
7,245
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BeeGeenie said:
Jonluw said:
Dishing out corporeal punishment, or any punishment really, to other people's kids is out of line, yes.
Carrying them out of your yard and getting their parents to pay damages is perfectly reasonable.

Twisting ears is very painful, but their mother overreacted.
I want you to try an experiment: Grip your ear lobe firmly between your thumb and index finger. Give it a tug. Was that "very painful" NO. No it wasn't. Unless that 12 year old boy was wearing earrings and tore the skin, it was not painful, it was mildly uncomfortable. So he can suck it up.
I've had people do that to me many times as a child.
I'd rather not do it again just because you don't think I can appropriately gauge the pain involved in a form of corporeal punishment.
Children don't have the same tolerance for pain as an adult, and there are few things more frightening to a child than an adult being violent with them. Such an ear-twisting, particularly from a stranger, can be quite a horrifying experience.
A spanking, if done right, can also be mildly uncomfortable. You don't tell your kids to suck it up if your neighbour spanks them, do you?
 

tofulove

New member
Sep 6, 2009
676
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0
SaneAmongInsane said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
You can believe that if you will, but in historical documents there is no doubt a man named jesus lived and that man died in the indicated way as well. The governor, pilate, and numerous other roman officials as well as other officials have confirmed him, though if they allowed any official information of his miracles to get out it could cause chaos. Kind of like propaganda control, you know like China and North Korea do every day. You can deny it if you like, but this is a case of historical evidence, which you can't argue against.

You can argue against his powers though.

Don't really care.

It's not really the sky so much as another realm.
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
I'm practically an atheist, your argument loses merit when you hit the part I bolded.

Is it that much of a stretch that a guy named Jesus Christ actually existed and was just a nut job that believed he was the son of God and was killed on a cross?
well if that was the case, why worship him, and still lacking in evidence. its some one saying there a flying teacup in orbit around the sun. sure there could be, but there no evidence of it so why believe it.
I don't know why people believe in it dude, but I do not think it's that much of a stretch that the guy existed and created a bit of noise and was executed and during the years that followed when the story was re-told over and over (before eventually written down) a lot of shit got exaggerated.

Really if you're going to argue religion, just stick to the easy shit to disprove. The coming back alive after 3 days of being dead, the walking on water, the parting of the red sea. The shit that's taken "on faith".
The thing that disputes your whole "he exited but he was a nut job" type thing is that people that didn't really believe in him and weren't really loyal to him.. upon his "revival", suddenly go off praising and preaching him everywhere and then get killed for it. People don't suddenly make a 180 and then go die for it unless they've got some SERIOUS reasons to believe.
It's not my thing. Like I said I can't be bothered to look it up but if my left nut was on the line, I'd bet a man named Jesus really existed.

Also you're giving the human race to much credit. You and I know as much as we do cause we've been educated and have access to wonderful technology. People back then didn't have jackshit. If I was alive back then and someone told me dragons were real I'd believe them.... why wouldn't I? There be nothing to tell me logically otherwise.

If you want proof in the modern day, how many people watch Reality TV and believe it's real? Fuck, how much money is Kim Kardashian worth despite the fact she doesn't do anything aside from exist? I'm sorry to say this dude, but the majority of the 7 Billion on this planet aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. Hell I knew a couple that was shocked that their daughter was gay.... even though her girlfriend has moved in with the family prior.... and she slept in the same bed as their daughter.... for several months. I went to my therapist and asked "They can't really be shocked, can they?" and he looked at me grimly and said "Unfortunately, yes they probably are."

I can't honestly say I believe a man named Jesus existed that could walk on water or come back from the dead. I can believe a guy named Jesus existed that earnestly believed himself to be the son of God and probably did a couple of cool things that people hyperbolized. Really dude, consider it, it makes more sense that some average guy did a couple of cool things that got blown out of per-portion then an entire religion based around an utter and complete fallacy. The simplest answer is more often the right one.
the story of jesus borrows heavily from other origin stories like horus. so ya its more likely its complete bull shit. your making alot of conclusions with out evidence. jesus might of bin some crazy guy that convice some desert people hes god. or some desert people just made him up. ill take the latter considering there isn't any evidence that says the former.

im just saying there is no evidence at all, why believe in it. there a lot of folk lore we laugh at, like hercules. was there a guy name hercules who fought lions and multi headed lizard monsters and was the son of a god, sure its possible, maybe he was just a rather strong regular guy who kicked some ass, sure possible to, or maybe he was just a made up character to tell around a camp fire. first one is clearly not true, so leaves the last 2 possibilitys, and it really doesn't matter ether way. cause the legend of him is not real, be it pure fiction or fiction based on some obscure guy who was pretty strong that kept getting stronger after ever retelling. its all fiction regardless at this point.
 

DudeistBelieve

TellEmSteveDave.com
Sep 9, 2010
4,771
1
0
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
You can believe that if you will, but in historical documents there is no doubt a man named jesus lived and that man died in the indicated way as well. The governor, pilate, and numerous other roman officials as well as other officials have confirmed him, though if they allowed any official information of his miracles to get out it could cause chaos. Kind of like propaganda control, you know like China and North Korea do every day. You can deny it if you like, but this is a case of historical evidence, which you can't argue against.

You can argue against his powers though.

Don't really care.

It's not really the sky so much as another realm.
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
I'm practically an atheist, your argument loses merit when you hit the part I bolded.

Is it that much of a stretch that a guy named Jesus Christ actually existed and was just a nut job that believed he was the son of God and was killed on a cross?
well if that was the case, why worship him, and still lacking in evidence. its some one saying there a flying teacup in orbit around the sun. sure there could be, but there no evidence of it so why believe it.
I don't know why people believe in it dude, but I do not think it's that much of a stretch that the guy existed and created a bit of noise and was executed and during the years that followed when the story was re-told over and over (before eventually written down) a lot of shit got exaggerated.

Really if you're going to argue religion, just stick to the easy shit to disprove. The coming back alive after 3 days of being dead, the walking on water, the parting of the red sea. The shit that's taken "on faith".
The thing that disputes your whole "he exited but he was a nut job" type thing is that people that didn't really believe in him and weren't really loyal to him.. upon his "revival", suddenly go off praising and preaching him everywhere and then get killed for it. People don't suddenly make a 180 and then go die for it unless they've got some SERIOUS reasons to believe.
It's not my thing. Like I said I can't be bothered to look it up but if my left nut was on the line, I'd bet a man named Jesus really existed.

Also you're giving the human race to much credit. You and I know as much as we do cause we've been educated and have access to wonderful technology. People back then didn't have jackshit. If I was alive back then and someone told me dragons were real I'd believe them.... why wouldn't I? There be nothing to tell me logically otherwise.

If you want proof in the modern day, how many people watch Reality TV and believe it's real? Fuck, how much money is Kim Kardashian worth despite the fact she doesn't do anything aside from exist? I'm sorry to say this dude, but the majority of the 7 Billion on this planet aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. Hell I knew a couple that was shocked that their daughter was gay.... even though her girlfriend has moved in with the family prior.... and she slept in the same bed as their daughter.... for several months. I went to my therapist and asked "They can't really be shocked, can they?" and he looked at me grimly and said "Unfortunately, yes they probably are."

I can't honestly say I believe a man named Jesus existed that could walk on water or come back from the dead. I can believe a guy named Jesus existed that earnestly believed himself to be the son of God and probably did a couple of cool things that people hyperbolized. Really dude, consider it, it makes more sense that some average guy did a couple of cool things that got blown out of per-portion then an entire religion based around an utter and complete fallacy. The simplest answer is more often the right one.
the story of jesus borrows heavily from other origin stories like horus. so ya its more likely its complete bull shit. your making alot of conclusions with out evidence. jesus might of bin some crazy guy that convice some desert people hes god. or some desert people just made him up. ill take the latter considering there isn't any evidence that says the former.

im just saying there is no evidence at all, why believe in it. there a lot of folk lore we laugh at, like hercules. was there a guy name hercules who fought lions and multi headed lizard monsters and was the son of a god, sure its possible, maybe he was just a rather strong regular guy who kicked some ass, sure possible to, or maybe he was just a made up character to tell around a camp fire. first one is clearly not true, so leaves the last 2 possibilitys, and it really doesn't matter ether way. cause the legend of him is not real, be it pure fiction or fiction based on some obscure guy who was pretty strong that kept getting stronger after ever retelling. its all fiction regardless at this point.
The funny thing is that we are both on the same page... I'm just saying if you're going to argue against the christians stick the stuff they take on faith not something that could reasonably happen in our reality. Guy name Jesus believes he's the king of the jews? Plausible. Homeboy comes back from the dead 3 days later? Bullshit.

keep in mind thats what makes religious folk so frightening to people like us, they're willing to make HUUUUUUGGGGEEEEEE leaps of faith. People like me and you need some form of ground rules.
 

dementis

New member
Aug 28, 2009
357
0
0
Delsana said:
dementis said:
If there were more people like you maybe kids wouldn't be such disgusting little cretins.
If people didn't call other people disgusting little cretins and take a shine towards aggressive response such as you do, perhaps the world would be a better place.
I live in an area where 12 year old kids drink, smoke, and swear at adults passing by right in front of their parents who do nothing about it. I've had these kids threaten me with violence when I used to do a paper round minding my own business, they stoned my house and broke a window because I refused to give them a paper that people pay to have delivered. I'm justified in calling kids like that disgusting little cretins.
 

Delsana

New member
Aug 16, 2011
866
0
0
dementis said:
Delsana said:
dementis said:
If there were more people like you maybe kids wouldn't be such disgusting little cretins.
If people didn't call other people disgusting little cretins and take a shine towards aggressive response such as you do, perhaps the world would be a better place.
I live in an area where 12 year old kids drink, smoke, and swear at adults passing by right in front of their parents who do nothing about it. I've had these kids threaten me with violence when I used to do a paper round minding my own business, they stoned my house and broke a window because I refused to give them a paper that people pay to have delivered. I'm justified in calling kids like that disgusting little cretins.
We will take your response into advisement and respond within a 7-day period. Thank you for calling DefendMart.
 

Delsana

New member
Aug 16, 2011
866
0
0
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
You can believe that if you will, but in historical documents there is no doubt a man named jesus lived and that man died in the indicated way as well. The governor, pilate, and numerous other roman officials as well as other officials have confirmed him, though if they allowed any official information of his miracles to get out it could cause chaos. Kind of like propaganda control, you know like China and North Korea do every day. You can deny it if you like, but this is a case of historical evidence, which you can't argue against.

You can argue against his powers though.

Don't really care.

It's not really the sky so much as another realm.
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
I'm practically an atheist, your argument loses merit when you hit the part I bolded.

Is it that much of a stretch that a guy named Jesus Christ actually existed and was just a nut job that believed he was the son of God and was killed on a cross?
well if that was the case, why worship him, and still lacking in evidence. its some one saying there a flying teacup in orbit around the sun. sure there could be, but there no evidence of it so why believe it.
I don't know why people believe in it dude, but I do not think it's that much of a stretch that the guy existed and created a bit of noise and was executed and during the years that followed when the story was re-told over and over (before eventually written down) a lot of shit got exaggerated.

Really if you're going to argue religion, just stick to the easy shit to disprove. The coming back alive after 3 days of being dead, the walking on water, the parting of the red sea. The shit that's taken "on faith".
The thing that disputes your whole "he exited but he was a nut job" type thing is that people that didn't really believe in him and weren't really loyal to him.. upon his "revival", suddenly go off praising and preaching him everywhere and then get killed for it. People don't suddenly make a 180 and then go die for it unless they've got some SERIOUS reasons to believe.
It's not my thing. Like I said I can't be bothered to look it up but if my left nut was on the line, I'd bet a man named Jesus really existed.

Also you're giving the human race to much credit. You and I know as much as we do cause we've been educated and have access to wonderful technology. People back then didn't have jackshit. If I was alive back then and someone told me dragons were real I'd believe them.... why wouldn't I? There be nothing to tell me logically otherwise.

If you want proof in the modern day, how many people watch Reality TV and believe it's real? Fuck, how much money is Kim Kardashian worth despite the fact she doesn't do anything aside from exist? I'm sorry to say this dude, but the majority of the 7 Billion on this planet aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. Hell I knew a couple that was shocked that their daughter was gay.... even though her girlfriend has moved in with the family prior.... and she slept in the same bed as their daughter.... for several months. I went to my therapist and asked "They can't really be shocked, can they?" and he looked at me grimly and said "Unfortunately, yes they probably are."

I can't honestly say I believe a man named Jesus existed that could walk on water or come back from the dead. I can believe a guy named Jesus existed that earnestly believed himself to be the son of God and probably did a couple of cool things that people hyperbolized. Really dude, consider it, it makes more sense that some average guy did a couple of cool things that got blown out of per-portion then an entire religion based around an utter and complete fallacy. The simplest answer is more often the right one.
the story of jesus borrows heavily from other origin stories like horus. so ya its more likely its complete bull shit. your making alot of conclusions with out evidence. jesus might of bin some crazy guy that convice some desert people hes god. or some desert people just made him up. ill take the latter considering there isn't any evidence that says the former.

im just saying there is no evidence at all, why believe in it. there a lot of folk lore we laugh at, like hercules. was there a guy name hercules who fought lions and multi headed lizard monsters and was the son of a god, sure its possible, maybe he was just a rather strong regular guy who kicked some ass, sure possible to, or maybe he was just a made up character to tell around a camp fire. first one is clearly not true, so leaves the last 2 possibilitys, and it really doesn't matter ether way. cause the legend of him is not real, be it pure fiction or fiction based on some obscure guy who was pretty strong that kept getting stronger after ever retelling. its all fiction regardless at this point.
The funny thing is that we are both on the same page... I'm just saying if you're going to argue against the christians stick the stuff they take on faith not something that could reasonably happen in our reality. Guy name Jesus believes he's the king of the jews? Plausible. Homeboy comes back from the dead 3 days later? Bullshit.

keep in mind thats what makes religious folk so frightening to people like us, they're willing to make HUUUUUUGGGGEEEEEE leaps of faith. People like me and you need some form of ground rules.
Out of curiosity, what would you do if undeniable proof of his powers did exist? Would you take back everything you said? Or.. would you argue about it more?
 

DudeistBelieve

TellEmSteveDave.com
Sep 9, 2010
4,771
1
0
Delsana said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
You can believe that if you will, but in historical documents there is no doubt a man named jesus lived and that man died in the indicated way as well. The governor, pilate, and numerous other roman officials as well as other officials have confirmed him, though if they allowed any official information of his miracles to get out it could cause chaos. Kind of like propaganda control, you know like China and North Korea do every day. You can deny it if you like, but this is a case of historical evidence, which you can't argue against.

You can argue against his powers though.

Don't really care.

It's not really the sky so much as another realm.
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
SaneAmongInsane said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
tofulove said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
Delsana said:
stonethered said:
I don't think you were, not even for the ear twisting (which frankly sounds totally situationally appropriate, and is exactly how it would have happened if it had been a movie). Kids should have known better than to trespass, assuming they knew it was someone's property. Lady shouldn't have yelled at you for it, but her reaction is quite understandable. She was angry, and probably a bit scared about what you were doing; odds are nobody has ever actually laid hands on her kids before (and I'd say that after trespassing and vandalizing your private property, somebody probably ought to).

Could you have handled it better? Yeah, you could have just tracked down their parents and courteously requested compensation. But at the same time, your actions will have a rather more lasting impact on all of them. And you didn't try to kill anyone, or cause permanent harm. Nobody was threatened. And everything was paid for. As long as there's no legal problems, I'd say you did fine.
Legally, it was child abuse.

There's a very big legal problem here.

Again, I sense hypocrisy for everyone forgetting what happened when they were young kid...
Depends on the region.
And by legal problems, I mean depending on whether anyone wanted to press charges. Generally, the police don't fuss with things unless people take issue with them.

And what exactly is it that we're all forgetting here?
You guys all broke things when you were really young, or your parents did, and you didn't want to take responsibility and you fled... and now look at you all taking issue with it and acting as if it's the worst thing ever and punishment ever made you stop.. bahaha such hypocrisy.
Right, but we got caught, we got punished, and we were forced to take responsibility for ourselves. What they did is not the worst thing ever, its not good, but nobody's dead or psychologically scarred. But I'm glad to hear that they got caught, they got punished, and someone took responsibility for it. Maybe one of these days they'll shape up to be decent, responsible adults like many of the other kids who did stupid things and got punished. But one thing's for sure, if they don't get punished then they probably won't learn to behave themselves.

And Punishment did, usually, make me stop.
Punishment doesn't stop things, it makes you get better at hiding it. Your "usually" indicates this. It's not punishment that gives you self-introspection, it's maturity and development of self through experiences based on your own capacity and capabilities and drives. Not the forced drives of others.
sure it does, if some one murders some one else, and you kill them for there crime. they wont be doing any more murdering. for major crimes make examples out of people, for minor crimes focus on teaching them a better way. rapist, murders, people with multiple assaults and so on deserve the harsh punishments as a warning to others, more petty crimes focus on the rehabilitation to make them a functioning member of society.
An eye for an eye makes the whole world blind.
for some people, if you don't take there eye out, they will keep ripping other peoples eyes out. more importantly your showing every one else what happens when you do some thing that stupid. for people who do horrible deeds against there fellow human, horrible deads befall them as a reminder. lesser evils should be treated as mental illness and focus on healing instead of crucifying.

an eye for an eye doesn't apply to every thing. when Gandhi said it, he new he couldn't beet the English with force, and new with mass media could win the war with the hearts and minds of the English populace. but a guy who murdered his wife for insurance pay out cant be compared to what gandhi faced. a person who casually took some one else life for personal gain is some thing society needs to remove. you cant fix every one, when some one is at the point of making money with murder, or murdering for fun. you remove them and let every one else who might take that path know what happens when you do.

now a 19 year old kid who is poor and steels a car for personal gain can be saved, with some therapy and skill training, you can send that kid back into the world able to support him self and be a functioning member of society. Leniency on those who can be saved. make an example of those who cant.
The eye for an eye statement is actually an interpretation of something in the bible said by Jesus.
eye for an eye makes the world blind was said by gandhi in the movie, but no evidence that he actually came up with it.

eye for a an eye, tooth for a tooth was in the bible, and that was telling you to literally take a tooth if they take one from you.
Except then Jesus countered it, because it was the time of forgiveness.
what i remember was turn the other cheek, if i remember correctly never said eye for an eye makes the hole world blind. plus gandhi was a real person. i don't care what your story book has to say about a fictional character. don't get me wrong emulating jesus is a noble feet, but impractical for society as a hole.
Actually Jesus was proven to exist historically, by both the king, the governor, numerous tax representatives and many things, he was also confirmed to die the way it was said. It was the mystical things never proven, but of course, that's hard to prove.
you gave me a good giggle, one there is no secular evidence of him being real, the few pieces they have 'found' was proven to be fake. 2 only paul was able to be alive during the time of jesus, and never said he was a living being on earth, every one else in the new testament for the most part happen 100 years + after his death. so no real evidence is there. pluss if you have a guy walking around one of the most wealthy provinces in rome. curing the sick and blind, raising the dead, walking on water and so on, you think there be some secular evidence. this was the height of the roman empire. had a functioning news system, and apparently important enough to the roman army to be killed by them, but yet not one piece of secular evidence.

or are you on of those its my faith god told them to write it goof balls. if so have fun in your make belief world, where magic people live in the sky.
I'm practically an atheist, your argument loses merit when you hit the part I bolded.

Is it that much of a stretch that a guy named Jesus Christ actually existed and was just a nut job that believed he was the son of God and was killed on a cross?
well if that was the case, why worship him, and still lacking in evidence. its some one saying there a flying teacup in orbit around the sun. sure there could be, but there no evidence of it so why believe it.
I don't know why people believe in it dude, but I do not think it's that much of a stretch that the guy existed and created a bit of noise and was executed and during the years that followed when the story was re-told over and over (before eventually written down) a lot of shit got exaggerated.

Really if you're going to argue religion, just stick to the easy shit to disprove. The coming back alive after 3 days of being dead, the walking on water, the parting of the red sea. The shit that's taken "on faith".
The thing that disputes your whole "he exited but he was a nut job" type thing is that people that didn't really believe in him and weren't really loyal to him.. upon his "revival", suddenly go off praising and preaching him everywhere and then get killed for it. People don't suddenly make a 180 and then go die for it unless they've got some SERIOUS reasons to believe.
It's not my thing. Like I said I can't be bothered to look it up but if my left nut was on the line, I'd bet a man named Jesus really existed.

Also you're giving the human race to much credit. You and I know as much as we do cause we've been educated and have access to wonderful technology. People back then didn't have jackshit. If I was alive back then and someone told me dragons were real I'd believe them.... why wouldn't I? There be nothing to tell me logically otherwise.

If you want proof in the modern day, how many people watch Reality TV and believe it's real? Fuck, how much money is Kim Kardashian worth despite the fact she doesn't do anything aside from exist? I'm sorry to say this dude, but the majority of the 7 Billion on this planet aren't the sharpest knives in the draw. Hell I knew a couple that was shocked that their daughter was gay.... even though her girlfriend has moved in with the family prior.... and she slept in the same bed as their daughter.... for several months. I went to my therapist and asked "They can't really be shocked, can they?" and he looked at me grimly and said "Unfortunately, yes they probably are."

I can't honestly say I believe a man named Jesus existed that could walk on water or come back from the dead. I can believe a guy named Jesus existed that earnestly believed himself to be the son of God and probably did a couple of cool things that people hyperbolized. Really dude, consider it, it makes more sense that some average guy did a couple of cool things that got blown out of per-portion then an entire religion based around an utter and complete fallacy. The simplest answer is more often the right one.
the story of jesus borrows heavily from other origin stories like horus. so ya its more likely its complete bull shit. your making alot of conclusions with out evidence. jesus might of bin some crazy guy that convice some desert people hes god. or some desert people just made him up. ill take the latter considering there isn't any evidence that says the former.

im just saying there is no evidence at all, why believe in it. there a lot of folk lore we laugh at, like hercules. was there a guy name hercules who fought lions and multi headed lizard monsters and was the son of a god, sure its possible, maybe he was just a rather strong regular guy who kicked some ass, sure possible to, or maybe he was just a made up character to tell around a camp fire. first one is clearly not true, so leaves the last 2 possibilitys, and it really doesn't matter ether way. cause the legend of him is not real, be it pure fiction or fiction based on some obscure guy who was pretty strong that kept getting stronger after ever retelling. its all fiction regardless at this point.
The funny thing is that we are both on the same page... I'm just saying if you're going to argue against the christians stick the stuff they take on faith not something that could reasonably happen in our reality. Guy name Jesus believes he's the king of the jews? Plausible. Homeboy comes back from the dead 3 days later? Bullshit.

keep in mind thats what makes religious folk so frightening to people like us, they're willing to make HUUUUUUGGGGEEEEEE leaps of faith. People like me and you need some form of ground rules.
Out of curiosity, what would you do if undeniable proof of his powers did exist? Would you take back everything you said? Or.. would you argue about it more?
If I had legit concrete proof that the miracles actually happened, something that completely eliminated the notion of taking it "on faith"... yes obviously. That's my whole thing, the only thing I know for sure is that no one knows.
 

TheTurtleMan

New member
Mar 2, 2010
467
0
0
Those kids can go fuck themselves. Of anything I'm more distressed that you were on the fence (metaphorically) if you were out of line. I understand why the mom might be mad, but that's her job to be pissed when her babies learn a lesson that she didn't teach. Those kids are fine and they know not to go on your goddamn lawn, so mission accomplished.
 

Rastien

Pro Misinformationalist
Jun 22, 2011
1,221
0
0
Kinda disagree with the ear twisting part...

I got kids that play in the car park out the front of my flat, couldn't give a bollacks kids will be kids.

The one time the ball seemed to be bouncing off my car alot i just went down and had a chat with them, basically said i don't mind them playing ball here at all just take it easy as i don't want my car damaged. I did start the conversation with "OI!" mind you, but they seemed keen to listen and stopped belting the ball towards the cars x)

But yeah i can see how you got pissed in that situation, perhaps just dragging them out by the scruff of their shirts might have been the way to go rather than causing pain to them ^^.
 

Dogstile

New member
Jan 17, 2009
5,093
0
0
Eh, depends. Did you twist the ears on purpose or did you drag them out by the ears? If it was the latter, perfectly fine. Hurts a little and they can't exactly struggle like they do if you grab clothes. On purpose? Well if you did that makes you a bit of a dick, but I still don't blame you.
 

UsefulPlayer 1

New member
Feb 22, 2008
1,776
0
0
Not in the least bit.

You weren't punishing them, you were making sure the buggers didn't get away. I understand the Mom not wanting a stranger to punish her kids, but all you were doing was making sure they were gonna accept responsibility for what they had done.

My mom would have yelled a me for being a dumbfuck, not the person who caught me being a dumbfuck.
 

JWAN

New member
Dec 27, 2008
2,725
0
0
If my kids were pulling crap like that and I saw someone twisting their ears I'd say thank you and then pick up where they dropped off.