Poll: You think anime should have thicker women(bigger asses and wider hips not just big boobs)

Tsun Tzu

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Thicc is all well and good, but, eh, I'm down for pretty much whatever really.

Lightspeaker said:
Smithnikov said:
Neverhoodian said:
First MLP, then Lord of the Rings and now anime. Do you view all mediums that happen to have some skinhead fans/interpretations Nazi propaganda?
If it's speaking to them on some level, clearly.

Anime's not being very damn subtle about it though.

Ballad of Evil Tonya. Need I say more?
Sage of Tanya the Evil is quite literally not the Third Reich and not WWII though. Why? Because it is pretty much literally the Imperial German Empire around the WWI-era. There are a handful of technological advances to late 1930s/early 1940s levels but geopolitically, in terms of ethos and tactically its entirely parallel to the 1910s.


Smithnikov said:
And how comically inept everyone EXCEPT the Empire is at warfare. I had to shut it off at seeing infantrymen firing on mages for the umpteenth time and having the balls to look surprised when their bullets do nothing. Again.
Sounds a bit like you're referring to the Dakia parts a little before half way through. Dakia is a parallel to 1910s Romania and is pretty explicitly supposed to be a couple of DECADES of military development behind any of the other nations.

In the anime the Empire fights only three other nations outright. And concentrates their efforts on defeating them one at a time. Dakia (as mentioned above), the Legadonia Federation (aka Legadonia Entente Alliance) which is the equivalent of a grouping of Norway, Sweden, Greenland and Finland, and the Republic which is equivalent to France. There are some skirmishes also with 'volunteers' from the Allied Kingdom (the UK) but its fairly explicit that none of the AK, the Unified States (i.e. the USA) or the Russy Federation (i.e. Russian Empire and, later in the war, Soviet Russia) are actively getting involved as yet. Both of the former are supplying the Empire's enemies and the AK is providing some military support (in the form of intelligence and volunteer troops on occasion) but that's it.

In short? The World War hasn't actually properly kicked off for most of the anime and it is individually stronger than any of the three it fights (in two cases much stronger). Instead the Empire is throwing its weight around and trying to become the biggest nation in Europe. At risk of providing spoilers: World War I DOES kick off at the very end of it. Fairly explicitly. I won't give more details for the sake of anyone else reading.



The character that's the heroine of the story, yes.
Protagonist =/= hero/heroine. Not all stories are the same, and not all stories have their focal character being a good, or even likeable, person.

Light Yagami is the protagonist of Death Note. He's a murderer with a god complex. He's a villain, but still the protagonist.

Alucard is one of the protagonists of Hellsing. He's an absolute vicious bloodthirsty monster. Given that his opponents are even worse you might charitably raise him up to be classed as an anti-hero...but he's not a hero.

Hell, Spec Ops: The Line used this as the focal point of the entire game. "Do you feel like a hero yet?" And yet, your character is still the protagonist.

Tanya is, by any measure, a violent, self-obsessed, egotistical, maniacal monster whose every move is a cynical calculation to advance her own position and she cares very little for literally anyone else. Or did you miss the part in the very first episode where she deliberately sent two subordinates to somewhere she knew they would be killed because they were guilty of insubordination in her eyes?



The (totally not German) Empire are brilliant strategists, honorable soldiers, have the cute Moe girls, and are not only possessed of technical and tactical acumen, but GOD IT'SELF blesses their prototype weapons to work beyond their expectations.

If my eyes rolled any harder, they'd have fallen out of my head.
For one: again, not Nazis. Wrong era parallel.

For two: they are fighting two relatively unsupported and objectively inferior enemies and one which comes somewhat closer to their own capabilities. And they pick them off one-by-one. The first enemy they beat is Dakia, as above it is decades out of date technologically and tactically and has no mages of its own. The second the Legadonia Entente which has somewhat more foreign support (in the form of imported supplies and small amounts of intelligence personnel and mages); they beat this nation through a surprise attack through a heavily defended area, only made possible by Tanya's unit taking out the defenses in a lightning strike. Tanya's unit consisting entirely of hand-picked mages put through absolutely brutal training by Tanya herself and thus being superior to basically any unit that could be fielded against them. The third is the Republic which they beat by drawing the Republic troops forward into a trap and then severing their lines of command by using Tanya's unit again combined with experimental rocket technology.

Most of these strategic plans involved Tanya or her ideas. Which are a direct result of her retained knowledge about the parallel WWI from her previous life in another world. Which is something of an advantage strategically, hence why they tended to do fairly well.

As far as God "blessing" their weapons...if you really think that then you have entirely missed the point of that entire aspect of the series. So its probably best that you stopped watching honestly, because without understanding this its a waste of time to watch.

The core point of the series is the antagonistic relationship between Tanya and "Being X"/God. She has only been reborn in an attempt to make her bow down to X's power. To do this, X is manipulating everything around her in order to put her into a situation where she has no other option but to truly put her absolute faith in God; which she refuses to do so.

I'm assuming that what you're specifically referring to is the prototype computation jewel that she was ordered to test. In that case she was unhappy with it in the extreme after repeated tests and refused to do more as it was dangerous to push it any further. As a result X manipulated the lead engineer on the project to make him FORCE her to go up one more time and then push to the jewel to overload. Then he came to her and basically offered that she could either die (and subsequently have her soul go to hell) or to have faith and pray for help and it would be "graciously" granted by X and she would be saved.

She ended up giving in on this point, and praying for help, and lo-and-behold X stabilised the jewel for her. But from now on if she ever wants to use it to its full capacity she must pray to God to allow her to do so (or it'll explode and kill her).

Its got absolutely nothing to do with God/X helping the Empire and EVERYTHING to do with X's obsession to get Tanya to bow to its will. For the same reason X later inspires and empowers other people in an attempt to either kill Tanya or get her to pray for help and put more faith in it.
Quoted in its entirety, because reasons.

Thank you.

Saved me the time and effort of addressing all of that ridiculousness.
 

Smithnikov_v1legacy

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As far as God "blessing" their weapons...if you really think that then you have entirely missed the point of that entire aspect of the series. So its probably best that you stopped watching honestly, because without understanding this its a waste of time to watch.
Way ahead of ya, buddy. I obviously don't, nor do I care to understand it. Don't need to get in proximity of the /pol/ splooge.
 

Paragon Fury

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I'm all for more pretty women in anime.

I do wish we'd see more styles and women in the vain of Outlaw Star, Cowboy Bebop, Golden Boy, Witchblade, Ghost in the Shell etc. to have some variety, as most anime these days seems content to copy the style of Sekirei, Bikini Warriors, Dragon Maid, High School DxD, Naruto etc.
 

Neverhoodian

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Smithnikov said:
Neverhoodian said:
First MLP, then Lord of the Rings and now anime. Do you view all mediums that happen to have some skinhead fans/interpretations Nazi propaganda?
If it's speaking to them on some level, clearly.

Anime's not being very damn subtle about it though.

Ballad of Evil Tonya. Need I say more?


Because you're going to have to swear off the vast majority of art and entertainment if you do.
Que sera sera. If it turns out the vast majority of art and entertainment is out there to push a right wing authoritarian message, I'll be glad to be rid of it.
...Well, it's up to you, or course. As for me, I prefer not to have my personal tastes dictated by whether or not a skinhead somewhere happens to share one or two of them. <a href=http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/HitlerAteSugar>Hitler ate sugar, after all. That doesn't mean you have to swear off sweets for the rest of your life.

I will agree with you on one aspect; Japan as a nation needs to properly address and atone for the myriad of atrocities they committed during the invasion of China and World War II instead of trying to brush it under the rug.
 

Smithnikov_v1legacy

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Neverhoodian said:
That doesn't mean you have to swear off sweets for the rest of your life.
Only if the sweets industry is pushing a message about how awesome and righteous Hitler and the Riech's reign was.

I will agree with you on one aspect; Japan as a nation needs to properly address and atone for the myriad of atrocities they committed during the invasion of China and World War II instead of trying to brush it under the rug.
Ain't holding my breath.
 
Apr 11, 2020
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Smithnikov said:
I want anime to just stop sucking the Nazi party's proverbial cock. The "Germany did nothing wrong" circlejerk has already gotten me to swear off the medium entirely.
*Scratches head*

What kind of anime do you watch? Better yet, what website did you learn this from?

I mean, let's take Mobile Suit Gundam as a standard. I think it's fair, considering it's considered one of the most known anime franchises of all time, most Japanese people have at least heard of it, kind of like Pokemon.

Who were the bad guys again? You know the guys with this flag?

[/spoiler]
You know, those guys that yelled "Sieg Zeon". Those guys that gassed millions of civilians in space, and then colony dropped/nuked the earth, killing of half humanity in one year? Hmmm... who could these guys be based off of?
[spoiler]
[MEDIA=youtube]tlJ5j-hSUmQ[/MEDIA]
[/spoiler]
Or what about Spaceship Yamato, who were the evil genocidal guys trying to exterminate humanity?
[spoiler]
[img src="http://www.pageofreviews.com/wp-content/uploads/Desler-and-Domel.jpg"]
[/spoiler]
 
Apr 11, 2020
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Smithnikov said:
My main three pieces of evidence were Evil Tanya, Legend of Galactic Heroes, and Code Geass.

Also Girl Und Panzer to a lesser extent.
I never watched Evil Tanya or LotGH, but from what I have heard Code Geass is a ripoff of LotGH. Both are about trying to conquer the world and overthrow an backwards aristocratic system along with some other things that were most likely "inspired".

So anyways, In Code Geass, the Holy Britannian Empire are the bad guys. The entirety of the anime is trying to destroy the Holy Britannian Empire and to create a peaceful world. There is nothing possibly remotely likeable about the Britanians. They conquered Japan and treat their citizens like subhumans, calling them 'eleven' as a racial slur. In the first couple of episodes they start massacring civilians. The Japan-Nazi loving-angle is beyond absurd. The guy in the Hitler-esque speech you mentioned is the guy the MC is trying to kill.

I suspect that the evil Galactic Empire in LotGH is the same.

Honestly GuP is one million times more Nazi loving than Code Geass, because there is a girl who that dresses like and calls herself Erwin, and when you see the Afrika Korps insignia with the swastika removed, you think "mhmm nice try". Oh and this

Other than that, the main cast drives a Panzer IV because if they drove a Type 97, they would get completely rekted. The other teammeates drive a a StuG, M3 Lee, and Type 89, so their school has diversity in tanking hoho. Also the main character is related to the Nazi school sensei, and they fight the Nazi team later on so, eh...
 

Fox12

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Smithnikov said:
I want anime to just stop sucking the Nazi party's proverbial cock. The "Germany did nothing wrong" circlejerk has already gotten me to swear off the medium entirely.
...

Umm... I know I'm gonna regret asking, but what does this have to do with THICC anime girls?
 

Fox12

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erttheking said:
Where's the option for anime girls that look like actual fucking people? Where do I sign up for that?
Or you could replace all these boring women with THICC big bootied Amazonian goddesses
 

crimson5pheonix

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Smithnikov said:
A Fork said:
What kind of anime do you watch?
My main three pieces of evidence were Evil Tanya, Legend of Galactic Heroes, and Code Geass.

Also Girl Und Panzer to a lesser extent.
I'm going to back Ezekial on this, do you just see black uniforms and think Nazis? Not to mention that a frequent criticism of Reinhard's empire that even Reinhard acknowledges is that his very efficient autocracy is wholly reliant on the autocrat being good and the long standing war was started because a previous autocrat was a really shit nationalist/supremacist populist and nobody in universe wants that.
 

NPC009

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I'm also siding with Ezekiel on this. As much as I dislike Japan's weird fascination with military uniforms, it's not series like the classic space operas or even Saga of Tanya the Evil that make me question their knowledge of world history. Those series draw parallels to old Germanies (not always the one with the Nazis!), but they don't glorify those eras. If anything, they're critical.

And hey, it makes sense for them to take inspiration from these eras. Their own culture was heavily influenced by that part of Europe back during the Meiji Restauration. And going with Germany instead of Japan has two advantages for the people writing fiction: it's both recognisable and exotic to the readers.

In any case, I'm more worried about series that take bits of military history and strip them of real-world context. For instance, there are otaku who are really into weapons, uniforms, vehicles and so on, and admire them regardless of who used them and their role in history, turning everything into porn for military otaku. That's where shit gets weird.

BTW speaking of Germany, it wouldn't hurt Japan to be more like current Germany. Germany school spend a good amount of time teaching students about the darkest pages of German history, whereas Japanese school books tend to gloss over the human tragedies of the Second World War, instead focusing on dates and statistics.
 

Scarim Coral

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Honestly I don't get the appeal of wider hip women. I can get big boob or butt but the hip? Just to be clear, I got nothing against women with big hip, I just don't understand the attraction toward that part of the body.
 

EMWISE94

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OP: Do you think Japanese animation could benefit from larger body types for women?
Thread: Lets discuss how Japan seems to glorify Nazi germany... also T H I C C women i guess.

Oh Escapist people, never change.

On the topic of body types and Japan, its pretty much the same way that you get western media constantly having the ideal woman be someone that's thin with a large bust and shapely butt, it's what the general viewing pubic see as ideal or what marketing departments want to push as ideal. Whenever it comes to discussions of Japan's lack of diversity in representation, whether it be in body types, skin tones etc, I always see two camps of arguments pop up that I'm somewhat curious about.

The first is that: Japan shouldn't change cause it's their Culture. An argument that pretty much boils down to "its their media, they can do whatever they want with it, 'we' as an outside demographic have no say or influence on what gets made there.", let Japan do Japan and all that; which is an argument that holds ground if you think about it in a 'its unique to them' kind of way. The key thing that makes other cultures appealing is their difference from one's own culture and if said culture doesn't offer thin, fair skinned girls on display en masse in animated media like Japan does, then there's reason there to say let Japan keep doing things their way, because as far as I know a lot of anime/manga is made for Japanese audiences with no thought of what outsiders would find more appealing, since a lot of sales for those mediums is domestic.

This is usually counter argued by the flip side of the argument: Japan should get with the times. Despite the modern technological age essentially bringing the world closer in terms of ideas through media, Japan still operates mostly as an isolated nation to some extent, meaning that the stuff they make is mostly for them with little thought of a worldwide audience, and this sometimes leads to their influences being mostly local. As such there's a lot of times when the media they make is very similar to one another, whether it be in story settings, or even character body types. Which leads to western/overseas audiences seeking some diversity because in a lot of western media, diversity is what's the talk of the town, some people are tired of seeing the same type of characters over and over again and are looking for some variety but would Japanese media provide such variety for an outsider audience? and audience who, unless I'm mistaken, aren't really considered much of an influence on sales (haven't looked up any recent figures that would prove that an international market supports japanese animation/manga as much as they do in game sales.)

Then again this is just outsider speculations and stuff, rarely do you get people from the actual anime/manga industry talking about this stuff (unless I'm not looking in the right places) to shed some proper light on how it is.

NPC009 said:
And then there's the sad case of Akira Hiramoto. In his early career, he wrote and drew the acclaimed manga Me and the Devil Blues [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Me_and_the_Devil_Blues_(manga)]. It was a commercial failure. As the story goes (and I have no idea if this is true), Hiramoto was so fed up with good manga failing, he set out to create the trashiest thing he could image as an act of rebellion. Prison School was a worldwide hit.
That's gotta suck, try to do something different and it bombs, but conform to the norm/niche and it sticks. I can kinda believe that Kangoku Gakeun (Prison School) was an extreme counter act to appealing to the niche because in the earlier chapters the absurdity of its titillation seemed like it was poking fun at just how absurd normal titillation in other works is.