Problems that men have to deal with

redlemon

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ObserverStatus said:
Leonardo Huizar said:
Woman acts shallow-Society says ok
Man acts shallow-Chauvinist CIS-scum Pig rapest
If you weren't kidding and you actually think being cyberbullied by SJWs qualifies as an actual problem with being a man, your chromosomes can't be treating you all that badly
And then this attitude causes men to lose most child custody cases, and virtually every harassment/rape accusation against women regardless of whether or not they're true.
 

Thaluikhain

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redlemon said:
And then this attitude causes men to lose most child custody cases, and virtually every harassment/rape accusation against women regardless of whether or not they're true.
Yeah, the latter isn't remotely true. The conviction rate for rape is very small, even for the ones that get reported. For one reason or another, the rates at which that happens has been blown out of all proportion.
 

seris

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Casual Shinji said:
Women? :p

Seriously though, living at home with your parents. Even if my situation is not as clear cut, I'm still living at home with my parents.

...

Yeah, that sensation just now was your inner you instinctively scoffing at the idea of a nearly 32-year old man still living with his mommy and daddy.
in a lot of other cultures thats really common. unfortunitely in america that is not the case
 

Casual Shinji

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seris said:
Casual Shinji said:
Women? :p

Seriously though, living at home with your parents. Even if my situation is not as clear cut, I'm still living at home with my parents.

...

Yeah, that sensation just now was your inner you instinctively scoffing at the idea of a nearly 32-year old man still living with his mommy and daddy.
in a lot of other cultures thats really common. unfortunitely in america that is not the case
Neither is it in Europe, except for maybe the Mediterranean countries.
 

Halla Burrica

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After what I've read on this thread is, now more than ever does it seem like we men really don't have that many gender specific problems, if at all.
There are certainly a few tragic sob stories here and there, but mostly it seems to be "Since I'm a guy it is expected of me to be strong and manly". So? Everybody have expectations for others, old and young, fat or skinny, male or female, they all are met with one expectation or another. And that's completetely fine, that's a natural occurence in society. The problem isn't that we are met with expectations, it's that we are so terrible at dealing with them.
 

Riot3000

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This thread turned out better than I thought no offense to you OP its just usually threads like turn south really quick.

My thing that annoys me as a man is the the whole catch twenty douche in place that is set up that the only way to handle it is to say fuck all of it.

It is either you are too "masculine" and it becomes dudebro nonsense and sexist crap about men's place as leader and overbearing nonsense if you swing in the other way you are "weak", need to get in touch with you manliness and stuff about the "death of men".

And don't get me started on relationships and the whole stud thing with men. At this point it might be better to be a horn dog than to be a virgin as a male because for all the talk virgin men get a heap ton of crap and condenscending judgment and remarks but is my opinion.

I grew up in African American community the pinnacle hyper masculinity where ideas of men and women are traditional as hell with no sense of budging. The very idea of the man not being the bread winner or not taking charge and being in control is just not happening. I honestly for a while and at times want to avoid relationships because this idea of god tier pinnacle confident leader sounds like more trouble than its worth.

I even see it else where in american society traditional values of men are still entrenched that's not to knock you thread even when this is brought up in a good discussion these values will be unconsciously or consciously reinforced in some way shape or form.
 

Riot3000

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Rebel_Raven said:
Zen Bard said:
As a man, I am sworn to protect my family from any ferocious beasts. So it's my job to deal with them when they wander into our home and threaten my wife by simply existing.

Problem is I'm a Buddhist. So rolled up newspapers, flyswatters and sandals are not a viable solution for me.

This means I must find a way to non-violently evict the intruders from our home so we can establish peace. And spiders can sometimes be...stubborn.
Would getting them in a cup, and taking them outside be too much? It's what I used to do. Now I just kinda accept them as they get rid of more pests than not. Especially if they'r smaller than a dime.


OT:
Not sure if it's been mentioned, but one problem I know of for guys is that they're generally expected to be the instigator of a relationship. Asking the girl out, and getting the ball rolling. No idea how much this is leaving gender culture, but it's still pretty there.
Sucks for the shy guys, this expectation.


Captcha Propane Accessories
I sell'em, and propane!
That is not leaving the culture anytime soon in fact it is not even really budging or going anywhere. I mean I can of many articles all over the web about "Why men don't approach" compared to "How to approach a guy". I know on some sites guys saying they would like a women to approach are told by women and men that "no you really don't" "it goes against your nature" and "you just want things to come easy for you stop being self entitled" met with lots of upvotes and agreeing with no sense of the irony in that.

I remember one site about the topic of shy guys. Lord they were ripped into by posters who were in like there 30s and up for "having no balls" "self centered" and just dehumanized and flat called losers who fail at their biological purpose. I wish I was making this up but I am not.

So that relationship instigator of relationship thing from my view even when other aspects offer some flexible that one is like the constant that probably won't shake any time soon.
 

Vendor-Lazarus

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Riot3000 said:
I remember one site about the topic of shy guys. Lord they were ripped into by posters who were in like there 30s and up for "having no balls" "self centered" and just dehumanized and flat called losers who fail at their biological purpose. I wish I was making this up but I am not.

So that relationship instigator of relationship thing from my view even when other aspects offer some flexible that one is like the constant that probably won't shake any time soon.
This is a really good point to bring up, and continue to bring up.
(Me, being a shy 30 year old virgin with little interest in most "manly" past-times and hobbies would also have been shredded on that other site.)

If men are supposed to initiate contact it confirms the view that men should be dominant and women submissive.
If men are the protectors, women are supposed to be protected.
It isn't always so of course, and I'm not trying to make this about men vs women, but they do sometimes overlap.

A man having to be "man enough" to approach women is applauded, but only if successful.
If he is rejected it signals that he is not a man.
Women who feel that they can sit back and enjoy having power and not deal with rejection need to take a close look on how they continue to re-affirm gender stereotypes.

That last sentence might have hit some nerves. In no way do I think that all women do this.
My statement is only directed at those who know this consciously and continue practice such a shady tactic.

I'm not saying that men shouldn't approach women, those who are able to muster up the courage to do so,
just that not all men can overcome their shyness and should not be made to feel less of a man for it.

(I wonder why my hands are shaking right now...)
 

bartholen_v1legacy

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Westaway said:
Threads like these are the symptoms of a dying society
You're right, things like emotional or mental stability, or the stress and pressure caused by either are hoaxes anyway. Let's keep ignoring the suicide rates, depressions, school shootings, PTSD, shorter life expectancies and all that, those are just stuff of pussies.
 

Suhi89

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I thought I'd bring some stats into this.

[a href="http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/crime-stats/crime-statistics/focus-on-violent-crime/stb-focus-on--violent-crime-and-sexual-offences-2011-12.html#tab-Overall-violence-%E2%80%93-victim-profile"] Men are more likely to be the victim of violent crime [/a] and are also [a href="http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/crime-stats/crime-statistics/focus-on-violent-crime/stb-focus-on--violent-crime-and-sexual-offences-2011-12.html#tab-Victims"]more likely to be victims of murder [/a].

Even though [a href="http://www.ons.gov.uk/ons/rel/crime-stats/crime-statistics/focus-on-violent-crime/stb-focus-on--violent-crime-and-sexual-offences-2011-12.html#tab-Prevalence-of-intimate-violence"]35-40% of domestic violence victims are men [/a] only [a href="http://www.esteemmen.co.uk/"] 72 beds available to male survivors of DV, compared to around 7,500 for female survivors[/a] 44 of those spaces available to men are also available to women leaving only 28 dedicated to men (18 of those exclusively for gay men). Incidentally, when I did a Google search for "Number of Men's DV shelters in the UK, Google asked me "Did you mean 'Number of Women's DV shelters in the UK.'" Much of domestic violence policy is based on the [a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Duluth_model"]Duluth Model[/a] which frames domestic violence as " the result of patriarchal ideology in which men are encouraged and expected to control their partners," which assumes female victims and male perpetrators.

[a href="http://www.crisis.org.uk/data/files/publications/factfile_Full.pdf"] Anywhere from 70% to 90% of the homeless are male [/a]. (Page 36 of the document).

[a href="http://www.universitiesuk.ac.uk/highereducation/Documents/2012/PatternsAndTrendsinUKHigherEducation2012.pdf"] Around 55% of undergrads are women[/a] with a bigger majority in subjects such as medicine, law and biological sciences. (page 13). As far as I'm aware, there are no male only scholarships to try to redress the balance, but there are still female only scholarships in subjects where they are underrepresented (or there were 6 years ago when I started university). The trend appears to be that this gap is growing. Girls are also doing better at school.

[a href="http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/health/7699457.stm"]Women live about 4 years longer than men. [/a]

I could go on talking about how men are more likely to be in jail (they commit more crime, but you can make arguments that this is because of societal expectations. There is also a sentencing bias against men), are discriminated against in the family courts, how men's health problems aren't given as much attention as women's health problems and the portrayal of men in the media, but this post is long enough already.

Personally, I've found been a guy pretty great, but that doesn't change the stats above.

Disclaimer, all sources relate to the UK, where I live.
 

Aramis Night

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I have been giving this some thought and this is how I see it. Men on some level of course want to be seen as attractive which is something that very few of us manage to achieve on purely physical characteristics alone. So a lot of what men do tends to on some level be influenced by this desire, while at the same time not giving the impression that we genuinely care one way or the other. This is the best most men can think of to attract women since women seem to be attracted to self-assured men from what we can observe. Now women will often claim that they are attracted to other qualities. Some of us have tried to be what women claim to want and some have not. The fact is that trying to be what women want does not really produce any substantial difference in results from the men who do not cater to women's desires. In fact one could be forgiven for having the impression that women in fact seem to prefer men who do not really consider their desires in the first place. That women respond more favorably to selfish behavior then they do to consideration. This is just given romantic considerations from a man's perspective.

A few people have brought up gender expectations on men being unfair and I would not disagree. However, there are many men who do not have an issue with being stoic. Some men are just genuinely that way and I do not understand why there is such a move to demonize men for it or to try to convince such men that they are wrong for being so. I totally agree that people should not be forced into that position if it does not suit them, but what about those whom it does suit? I would also say that being a stoic man should not be a license to have others treat you badly. A stoic man is as worthy of compassion as anyone else and we should not encourage life to be harder on them for it. I would just like to see society not taking advantage of them to such a degree while demonizing them.
 

redlemon

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thaluikhain said:
redlemon said:
And then this attitude causes men to lose most child custody cases, and virtually every harassment/rape accusation against women regardless of whether or not they're true.
Yeah, the latter isn't remotely true. The conviction rate for rape is very small, even for the ones that get reported. For one reason or another, the rates at which that happens has been blown out of all proportion.
Maybe, but simply being accused of rape is often enough to destroy your reputation.

(Yes I know I'm backpedaling)
 

mecegirl

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redlemon said:
thaluikhain said:
redlemon said:
And then this attitude causes men to lose most child custody cases, and virtually every harassment/rape accusation against women regardless of whether or not they're true.
Yeah, the latter isn't remotely true. The conviction rate for rape is very small, even for the ones that get reported. For one reason or another, the rates at which that happens has been blown out of all proportion.
Maybe, but simply being accused of rape is often enough to destroy your reputation.

(Yes I know I'm backpedaling)
Depends on the community. Some will just ignore the accusation and close ranks around the alleged rapist(s) like in Stubenville. That sort of attitude is exactally why some people don't report their rape. The individual doesn't even have to be a football player or some highly influential figure. Since there is a warped perception in our culture how rapists behave, if the person seems nice enough(and outside of the crime they committed they could actually be nice people), that is enough for some to not take a claim seriously and start an investigation.

I've heard too many horror stories from men and women who still have to associate with their assaulter because no one believes them.
 

Malpraxis

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I was never good at sports, and they didn't interest me. That alone made me a pariah at school. I only see cars as a medium of transport, not as my girlfriend.
In my teens I took an interest in portrait photography, fashion, and modelling. So naturally, all my friends were girls. And also naturally everyone thought I was obviously gay. I was also kind of spineless, so I was friendzoned by all, reinforcing that belief.

That didn't change until college, when I moved into my first apartment and set up an improvised studio in the living room. I realised that my personality made girls feel comfortable around me, and after one took the initiative and shagged me senseless, I embraced my interests, and made it my MO. Started grooming more, going to spas, dressing better. And if someone thought I was gay, heck, maybe I offered her girlfriend a 'photoshoot'.

After that I got into Med school, finished it, and with the influx of more disposable income, I embraced being a dandy.
People are still suspect that a 27yo well groomed, fashionable Doctor is so adamantly single, and some even asked me about my homosexuality. I find that a small price to pay for being an average looking guy that shags models on a regular basis.

TL;DR: I do the fruitiests things possible, and get laid. Screw the rest. Deal with it *shades*.
 

jethroe498

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Also, there's the huge shame culture surrounding penis size. I broke up with a girl and she immediately spread that I had a small penis and
A) She really has no clue about its size
B) It's impossible to defend yourself for being made fun of
It's something you're just born with that really doesnt even matter all that much whatsoever but for so many people its the arbitrary scale of manliness and personal value. Its an absolutely stupid thing and no matter how much you explain it, people will continue to laugh at you and sometimes it really gets to me, even though I try not to let it.

Also, someone cut my foreskin off for no rational reason. That ain't cool.
 

BEE-BOT

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I ;personally lack a definition for what it means to be 'MALE', et alone a sense of self identity.
My upbringing was lonely and horrific (still the former and incredulously bleak) and part of that was directly as a result of my gender, among other things.

I'm an odd sort if traditionally inspected, id rather write then do a cars for example. But Ive never been slave to what ive been told is manly
, even when it was in my better interest to conform. As a result i seem to be in something of a state of flux when i engage with peers.
this may not have been explained too well, but in the rare social encounter, i can generally, within some margin tell who a person is, i.e a girly girl or manly man, but iv never quite had that, which was good and bad for me.
Also the various neurosis and whatnot.
Sounded clearer in my head >_>

Anyway, im a heavy set, pan sexual, nerd/geek, with a few disorders and character defects, many hobbies, no job/living at home, and deeply suicidal, and all i know is a Traditional male role i do not fit in anyway.

Totally fine with that these days.
 

snowfi6916

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erttheking said:
*Sigh* You know there's kind of a generally "accepted" mindset of what a man should be in society, at least in the united states. We're supposed to be tough, we're supposed to be crude, we're not supposed to get upset at anything, we're supposed to play sports and we don't do "girly" shit, because obviously we're gay if we do. Every single fucking day people ask me "do you play basketball" because I'm tall. And then I tell them I prefer to write and they act like I just told them the sky was purple. And I have to bite back telling them to go fuck themselves because I am tired of being asked that. No I don't play basketball, in fact I hate basketball with a burning passion. I find writing stories to be a much more productive way to spend my time. But I'm tall and a guy, so therefore I must want to play basketball because it's hardwired into my DNA, at least according to the cunts I talk to. It's very telling that I can look at another tall man, say "So how often do you get asked it?" and he knows exactly what I'm talking about.

But it doesn't stop there. Gym in high school was a bit of a miserable experience for me. Because there was a non-competitive side and a competitive side. All of the guys were on the competitive side, with the exception of me and about three others who were with all of the girls on the non-competitive side. I hated sports but I didn't want people to think I was a wimp so I stuck with the competitive side, until the teacher saw how underpinning I was (I was pathetic) and told me to go to the non-competitive side. I never exactly got made fun of for it, but I always did feel insecure about it. Something about the way society saw men made me feel ashamed for not being on the tough manly side of things, and it made gym a miserable experience. There's also how I thought 90% of the guys at school were all douche bags and had been conditioned to think that acting that way was acceptable, but that's a whole other can of worms.

That's not even getting into the fact that I suffer from bouts of depression at times and how society deals with men who feel sad a lot. They get called pussies. Thankfully I lucked out on that end with a pharmacist for a mother and an understanding family. We live in MA too, which is a bit more progressive than the rest of the states, so I wasn't just told to take it like a man in suck it up. If I had been born somewhere else though...I don't want to think about it.

So. Other guys out there, what bullshit have you had to put up with because of your gender? And ladies, any that you have noticed?
All of your examples are right on target OP. They are problems that men directly have to deal with because of the patriarchal society that we live in that reinforces the idea that men have to be "in charge, never be weak, and never show emotion".

What many people don't realize (and what pisses me off when these discussions happen) is that this "men's problems" topic is DIRECTLY related to feminism, as feminism is fighting the same patriarchal society and rules that we currently have in place. But instead, people will point to this and go "you feminists see this... see how we have problems too?", instead of realizing that BOTH groups are being oppressed by a patriarchy that expects men to be tough and never be weak, and women to "know their place and serve her man".

Not saying that you said anything to make me think that OP... it's just something that happens in threads like these.

P.S. - Fist bump for a fellow MA resident. =)
 

BEE-BOT

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manic_depressive13 said:
When we were little kids my dad would hit my brother, but not me, because he was a boy and I was a girl. I mean really? You're going to hit a little kid because he's a boy? You, a grown ass ****, hands the size of a fucking frying pan, thinks hitting a tiny fucking child is okay because he happens to have a dick? How can I even express how fucked up that is?
This made me chortle somewhat. Well put. except my sister was punished then by the stepmother.
My sister acted out once when the step mother was absent, and the acting out was trying to protect me bit, and that was the ony time he layed a hand on her.