PSN Downtime Costing Capcom Big Bucks

hermes

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erbkaiser said:
hermes200 said:
You Two are missing the point here. Even when Capcom is one of the first in saying it explicitly, the outage is affecting every developer/publisher out there. If a company as big as Capcom is feeling a dent in its revenue because of this, imagine what is going to happen with smaller ones (or those that are counting on Sony's infrastructure, like Pixel Junk).
Nope, I get the point, but Capcom really is the last party that should complain here.
I feel for the developers that are now suffering because PSN is dead, but not for a company that punishes its own customers just out of greed (the only reason they are doing their own DRM is that they want every user of a PS3 to buy another copy of their games, something nobody else does).

To give a PC example, it's like Ubisoft complaining that Steam is down so nobody can buy AC:B for the PC there (fictitious example), when they themselves demand a constant online internet connection just to play the damn game.
I think I don't follow you there... It is unfortunate (specially now) and even a bad design choice that Capcom includes a DRM system into PS3 games that require an active PSN account, but I don't understand why that comes from greed and how that is deliberately used to boost sales on PSN games.
 

subtlefuge

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May 21, 2010
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I would laugh at the "new games" comment, but that's tasteless and I like Capcom.

I'm really just not seeing a way for Sony to recover from this one. Ever.
 

erbkaiser

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hermes200 said:
I think I don't follow you there... It is unfortunate (specially now) and even a bad design choice that Capcom includes a DRM system into PS3 games that require an active PSN account, but I don't understand why that comes from greed and how that is deliberately used to boost sales on PSN games.
Okay, this is how it works for all PSN bought games except capcom's: you buy them, then you have the right to download them on all your activated PS3s. On all those PS3s, any user can play these games as long as the original purchaser still exists as a user on that PS3 and the system has not been deactivated for that user. Nobody but the purchaser needs to have an active PSN account to their user account, the game will work for anyone and store save data individually for every user.

So if I make another account on my PS3 for my girlfriend or a friend, they can play all the games I have bought but get their progress saved for their own profiles and, if they have created a PSN account, multiplayer stats and/or trophies. These accounts need not have PSN Store wallets or credit cards tied to them, and they are completely separate from my own PSN account so they won't be changing my online stats or earning trophies I haven't gotten to yet.

With Capcom games on the other hand, only the original purchaser can play the game, and he must prove that he is this original purchaser by logging into PSN every time. So essentially Capcom games cannot be played by others, since anyone playing them is forced to use the same PSN account. If my girlfriend or a mate wants to play Bionic Commando Rearmed 2 on my PS3, I must let them earn my trophies etc. since they cannot use their own PSN account without buying another copy.

Ergo, greed.
 

DocMcCray

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Oct 14, 2010
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Enrathi said:
I'm having trouble seeing the hundreds of thousands, let alone millions of dollars Capcom is supposedly losing. Can anyone explain to me how they make these numbers up?

Edit: I do understand it's affecting developers/publishers, especially the small ones. I just don't really believe these huge numbers that Capcom is throwing around.
Most of the money they are losing is from their price gouging DLC (such as the stuff for MvC3). You know, stuff that is/should have already been on the disc but they are charging the customer double for anyway. Also their download only games such as Megaman 9 & 10 and Bionic Commando series.

Their costs for these type of items are minimal since they don't have to pay for storage, shipping and all sorts of middlemen. Basically their only costs are server access and Sony/Microsoft/Nintendo which means a much higher profit.
 

Fappy

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I thought the whole point of the attacks was to punish Sony for its philosophies... so... let me get this straight. If you are trying to spread your ideology (people own their consoles, etc.), how does compromising the private information of millions of people, screwing the consumers out of their purchased content and forcing unrelated companies to lose millions support your cause? Yeah, you may prove that Sony is incompetent to some degree, but when you make someone's wallet lighter chances are they aren't going to side with you.
 

Atmos Duality

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Farewall Megaman Legends 3.
Oh well. It was built on a flimsy premise anyway ("We hold the game hostage unless you buy the beta").
 

Shadie777

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subtlefuge said:
I would laugh at the "new games" comment, but that's tasteless and I like Capcom.

I'm really just not seeing a way for Sony to recover from this one. Ever.
That comment is sarcasm, right?

I find it hard to believe that a huge company won't recover from this. It will make a huge negative effect but I think they will recover in time.
 

Arfreid

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Well CAPCOM, it really sucks that you can't sell any games or DLC on the PS3.

But do you really know really, REALLY sucks for your customers? is that they can't play games they have already PAID for because you decided to implement online DRM for the CONSOLES.

So CAPCOM, take it easy, if customers really want to buy your games, they will after the service is back online. If not then you lost nothing.

Well, I guess many angry players but that's not the point, right?
 

Just_A_Glitch

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So Capcom is losing money it could be putting towards MvC3 DLC characters... Like Gambit...

Shit just got personal.
 

icaritos

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Apr 15, 2009
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God fucking damn it how long till people get this right.

This wasn't done by Anon, or some undisclosed criminal organization. This was most likely accomplished by a tiny number of people (if not solo) looking towards turning a profit. Newsflash idiotic fans, there are criminals and people willing to do crimes, it is why there are security guards in malls and other public establishments.

Yes they are criminals who stole valuable data, and yes they should be punished by the law. But to say Sony is not to blame only applies in a perfect world where crime is unprecedented and this is the first murder done in the history of ever.

Sony didn't give half a shit about my data as they did about putting DRM in every piece of shitware that they own, and so this whole thing happened. Next console race I know who won't get my money and support.
 

Digikid

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Suck it up Capcom. Never depend on ANYONE but yourself. You cannot blame Sony or the hackers for this.
 

geizr

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Fronzel said:
I don't think this "collateral damage" shines a particularly bad light on the hackers, if it's true the hacking was an act of protest. This was "direct action" of wrecking shit, and you can't do that without hurting someone. I don't think that means it's inherently wrong. The real question is the argument for attacking in the first place.
I'm actually getting tired, now, of seeing silly apologetic statements like this to defend hackers when they commit illegal, criminal acts such as what has transpired. While I will not defend Sony for its complete negligence of security(and I do consider Sony 100% accountable for the current affairs due to their negligence), the hackers are 100% culpable for the current situation as it is a direct result of THEIR actions, not Sony's. Sony did not hack into its own servers, the hackers did. Sony did not steal information from the servers, the hackers did. Sony did not attempt to sell this information on the Internet, the hackers did. At every point, there was a direct action on the part of the hackers that had an identifiably negative consequence. Any grieves or issues the hackers may have had with Sony, there are legal and legitimate methods to address them. These actions are simply the action of thugs, thieves, and unrepentant criminals.

Another thing, there has been constant undertone in the media that the hackers' actions are as a form of protest against Sony's refusal to allow the OtherOS option anymore. Well, grow up, kids! Sony is perfectly in right to include or not include a particular feature in a device it sells, and it has right to protect its interests if such a feature could cause damage or losses to its business. You don't always get to do what you want, when you want, how you want, where you want to whomever you want, because, like it or not, your actions have an effect and consequence on others outside yourself(remember the Golden Rule? This is the reason behind it). This is why we have laws to arbitrate in order to avoid or mitigate the conflicts that can arise within our society from our collective actions. Vigilantism and vegeance are not proper and stable means of addressing conflict and grievences; they only beget social unrest, instability, and mutual destruction.

But even more so, as one poster mentioned, in this world, there do exist actual criminals, people without scruples who are willing to commit extreme harm to others for purposes of their own personal gain. This is easily what we are dealing with. The coincidence with the GeoHot case and the Anonymous DDoS is circumstantial until a direct link can be made. It is very likely that the hackers saw an opportunity and took advantage of it purely with an intent to profit from it, not make any statement or protest against Sony(and certainly, any merits their position of protest may have had, if this were such, have long since been lost in light of the consequences of their actions; the same thing happens to terrorists). Sony did indeed fail to take sufficient account of this reality to protect its servers from intrusion, and I will agree that they are 100% accountable to everyone affected for their negligence. But, these criminals were not necessarily trying to do anything noble(even if misguided); they were simply committing theft with the intent of personal gain, caring not one wit the effect their actions beyond such ends.

Regardless of how lax Sony's security may have been, the fact still exists that entry onto the servers was restricted to only authorized personnel, which the hackers were not, and that information on those servers was not meant to be extracted for any reasons other than legitimate business commerce by authorized entities, a fact which the hackers also violated. By no means are these hackers' actions legal or justified on either moral, legal, or civil grounds. They committed an act of trepass by gaining unauthorized access to a restricted area, the servers, and compounded that with an act of theft, unauthorized extraction of restricted information. These are criminal acts punishable by law. However weak the lock may have been, the fact is the door was still locked, and one is not allowed in without the correct key; breaking past the lock and taking what's inside still constitutes criminal acts.

No matter how people try to spin it, the actions of these hackers were unnecessary, unwarranted, and criminal in nature, regardless if it is a protest or not. Stop apologizing for them. Yes, Sony is at fault for their negligence and should be held 100% accountable by law, but the hackers are also 100% accountable for actually committing the act and, by law, should be criminally punished accordingly.

EDIT: Spelling errors and minor rewrites.
 

Just_A_Glitch

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Digikid said:
Suck it up Capcom. Never depend on ANYONE but yourself. You cannot blame Sony or the hackers for this.
Except if it wasn't for the hackers, or Sony's pitiful security, none of this would have happened to them...

No, I'm fairly certain that, in this instance, Capcom can fully blame Sony and the hackers for their loss.
 

VanityGirl

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Apr 29, 2009
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Andy Chalk said:
Capcon Senior Vice President Christian Svensson
Is he really a con? ;)

I guess Capcom can suffer just as much as anyone, but they have stuff on other consoles too, so they should be too bad off.