Review: Demon's Souls

Gigaguy64

Special Zero Unit
Apr 22, 2009
5,481
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nice, great review.
i like the fact that while the game is tough, its fair.
though i dont like most games where you haft to buy your next lv, DS makes it work.
Hopefully ill get to play it.
Im looking forward to your next game announcment and review.
 

L.B. Jeffries

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Nov 29, 2007
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It's always comforting to know that Atlus maintains a strong tradition of actually making difficult games to go with good stories.

I will never forget the moment in Persona 4 when, after grinding and gaining 5 levels, I went one floor too high in the dungeon and got curb stomped. Game over, would you like to load your last save? It had literally been years since a game slapped me that hard.
 

Eagle Est1986

That One Guy
Nov 21, 2007
1,976
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How did I go so long without hearing about this game? I didn't know it existed until I saw an advert for it yesterday.
It sounds like the sort of game I'd like, though it also sounds like I'd need to devote a lot of time to it, maybe I'll mark it down for my summer games next year.
 

Lord_Gremlin

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Apr 10, 2009
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Actually it's not that extremely hard. Just be cautious, keep your shield up and raise your vitality as high as possible.
 

Curtmiester

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Jan 13, 2009
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That hint system is awesome. I might see if I can rent this game, course I'd probably still break the disk in angry and swear words.
 

ila

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Jul 29, 2008
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I've been waiting on this one for awhile. While I've had the temptation to just import one of the version in English, I figured Atlus would pick this one up eventually. I love a good dungeon crawl (or roguelike... I hate that word) so this seems like something that will keep my PS3 occupied for awhile.

...when October arrives. Sigh.
 

Susan Arendt

Nerd Queen
Jan 9, 2007
7,222
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Something I neglected to mention in the review is that, unlike in Oblivion, your stamina (the green bar) actually matters. Run out of stamina, and you're staggered until you get a bit back. Swinging your weapon, blocking, running, getting hit, all of these use up stamina. So it's quite easy to find yourself in the middle of a knot of enemies, suddenly unable to do anything but watch in horror as you're shredded because you ran out of stamina. So it's not quite as simple as just blocking. :)
 

Pendragon9

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Apr 26, 2009
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Finally a game to make those young whipper snappers learn their place. I think I'll be picking this game up.
 

Eric the Orange

Gone Gonzo
Apr 29, 2008
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Maybe I'm just jaded but when I think of interactions with others online my thoughts are more of them being dicks then them being helpful.
 

Kenjitsuka

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Sep 10, 2009
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Great review as always.
As for the game itself.... eh, very hard to choose wheter I would love or hate it.
I'm really bad with dealing with failure, especially if it's unfair, but then again I also managed to beat Ninja Gaiden on xbox on all dificulty levels because I refused to let a game beat me. And yes, when you manage to get as good as to breeze through a level or boss fight without getting hit, it does make you feel really godlike. :)

My question; if you get really good at the game (like with Ninja Gaiden where you needed to get into the flow of the game) does the unfairness factor go down? I.e. does it keep you crying bitter tears through to the end, or does it eventually let up a tad?

Also, how many hours of gameplay are we looking at?
 

Dody16

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Jan 24, 2008
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Good Review.
I've played the game as well and I agree.
Awesome game, but don't play it if you have a tendency to destroy things every time you lose in a game. you will probably end up destroying everything you own.
 

Pipotchi

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Jan 17, 2008
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Lord_Gremlin said:
ssgt splatter said:
Hi!......and "hi" to you too. HA! That was funny.
The most frequent message is, as far as I noticed, "it's harsh. Evacuate me.")
I usually find the message "white sticky stuff", usually clustered around the female NPCs

I have been playing this game for a good few months now and I still love it
 

Monocle Man

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Apr 14, 2009
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Still no European publisher, I presume?

Import it is.
Better figure out whether I can use paypal through bank transactions since I have this special credit card that isn't supported by any site.
EDIT/ Quite amusing, Amazon is not willing to ship that particular game to an address outside the US. As if the gods are mocking me.
 

Susan Arendt

Nerd Queen
Jan 9, 2007
7,222
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Kenjitsuka said:
Great review as always.
As for the game itself.... eh, very hard to choose wheter I would love or hate it.
I'm really bad with dealing with failure, especially if it's unfair, but then again I also managed to beat Ninja Gaiden on xbox on all dificulty levels because I refused to let a game beat me. And yes, when you manage to get as good as to breeze through a level or boss fight without getting hit, it does make you feel really godlike. :)

My question; if you get really good at the game (like with Ninja Gaiden where you needed to get into the flow of the game) does the unfairness factor go down? I.e. does it keep you crying bitter tears through to the end, or does it eventually let up a tad?

Also, how many hours of gameplay are we looking at?
Ok, let me stress this -- while the game is very hard, it is never unfair. Yes, there are sneak attacks and traps, but when you die, it's not because the game is being cheap. I will say that at times the camera works against you, making it hard to see what you're fighting, but I don't personally count that as unfair.

If do very well in the game, the game gets easier and the loot becomes crappier. Conversely, if you fare poorly, the game gets harder, but the loot gets better. This is known as the world's "tendency" (light is easy, dark is hard). So the difficulty can adjust, yes, but let me be clear: Demon's Souls does not let up. You will never be able to relax. You will find, though, as you begin to understand the game, that areas you once found impossible become child's play. Not so much because you've leveled up, but because you're in the proper mindset. It's kind of difficult to explain.

Oh, and as for interactions with other players -- yeah, I assume people are going to be jerks, too, which is why it makes me glad to say that the messages I found were, in almost every case, quite helpful and well-meant.
 

messy

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Dec 3, 2008
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I was quite curious about this game. I figured the combat (since I heard the words; very hard) would be like DMC or ninja gaiden whereas this seems kind of wooden similar to baldurs gate so I may give it a miss.
 

sunpop

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Oct 23, 2008
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Well when I get this I suppose I will be the last one to make it to the boss for I will make base camp at each level and grind out for awhile. If I find one room that's better for grinding I will drop a note.
 

hazabaza1

Want Skyrim. Want. Do want.
Nov 26, 2008
9,612
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Now, this, along with LBP, Uncharted, and inFamous are reasons I want to get a PS3. Thanks for the review, I might have to pick this up if I ever do get a PS3.
 

Gruchul

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Aug 30, 2009
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The looks very much like Severence: Blade of Darkness to me, fairly frustrating at times but hugely satisfying when you get even with that horde later on
 

Casual Shinji

Should've gone before we left.
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I usually try to steer clear of games that kick my ass. Though, that hint system sounds pretty freaking neat.
 

Kenjitsuka

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Sep 10, 2009
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Susan Arendt said:
Kenjitsuka said:
Great review as always.
As for the game itself.... eh, very hard to choose wheter I would love or hate it.
I'm really bad with dealing with failure, especially if it's unfair, but then again I also managed to beat Ninja Gaiden on xbox on all dificulty levels because I refused to let a game beat me. And yes, when you manage to get as good as to breeze through a level or boss fight without getting hit, it does make you feel really godlike. :)

My question; if you get really good at the game (like with Ninja Gaiden where you needed to get into the flow of the game) does the unfairness factor go down? I.e. does it keep you crying bitter tears through to the end, or does it eventually let up a tad?

Also, how many hours of gameplay are we looking at?
Ok, let me stress this -- while the game is very hard, it is never unfair. Yes, there are sneak attacks and traps, but when you die, it's not because the game is being cheap. I will say that at times the camera works against you, making it hard to see what you're fighting, but I don't personally count that as unfair.

If do very well in the game, the game gets easier and the loot becomes crappier. Conversely, if you fare poorly, the game gets harder, but the loot gets better. This is known as the world's "tendency" (light is easy, dark is hard). So the difficulty can adjust, yes, but let me be clear: Demon's Souls does not let up. You will never be able to relax. You will find, though, as you begin to understand the game, that areas you once found impossible become child's play. Not so much because you've leveled up, but because you're in the proper mindset. It's kind of difficult to explain.

Oh, and as for interactions with other players -- yeah, I assume people are going to be jerks, too, which is why it makes me glad to say that the messages I found were, in almost every case, quite helpful and well-meant.
Thank you so much for the extra information, it made it even clearer that this is an amazing game! And a game for me :)

Can't wait to get it, maybe I'll even see you invading my game :p
(And then I'd be dead for the billionth time, lol )
 

The_Echo

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Mar 18, 2009
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Looks really cool, and I haven't actually had a real challenge in a long while. Totally checking it out! :D
 

BlackDodongo

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Apr 15, 2009
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Monocle Man said:
Still no European publisher, I presume?

Import it is.
Better figure out whether I can use paypal through bank transactions since I have this special credit card that isn't supported by any site.
EDIT/ Quite amusing, Amazon is not willing to ship that particular game to an address outside the US. As if the gods are mocking me.
http://www.renchi.com/renchi/PS3_Games_Asia_Demon_s_Souls_AS.htm

Thats were me and my friend got our copy. Works perfectly :)

As for the game, definitely one of my favourites. I love the feeling you get after you get past that room you've been trying to do for hours. Although I had the benefit of watching my friend play through the game while I waited for my delayed copy so I knew about alot of the early traps :p

Also, brilliant review. Really did the game justice.
 

Monocle Man

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Apr 14, 2009
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BlackDodongo said:
Monocle Man said:
Still no European publisher, I presume?

Import it is.
Better figure out whether I can use paypal through bank transactions since I have this special credit card that isn't supported by any site.
EDIT/ Quite amusing, Amazon is not willing to ship that particular game to an address outside the US. As if the gods are mocking me.
http://www.renchi.com/renchi/PS3_Games_Asia_Demon_s_Souls_AS.htm

Thats were me and my friend got our copy. Works perfectly :)

As for the game, definitely one of my favourites. I love the feeling you get after you get past that room you've been trying to do for hours. Although I had the benefit of watching my friend play through the game while I waited for my delayed copy so I knew about alot of the early traps :p

Also, brilliant review. Really did the game justice.
Would I be correct if I'd assume that version is completely in English and has no subtitles written in strange characters?
And does the game still have an active playerbase in those servers since those servers are supposedly separate and a lack of players to co-op or murder/be murdered by would probably detract from the overall experience.
 

rmx687

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Mar 3, 2009
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I've had this game (imported) for a few months now and I have to say it's one of the most unique games out. To me it brings those challenging dungeon crawlers of the NES day to full HD life with great graphics and physics. The atmosphere it builds is haunting and it translates into the gameplay wonderfully.

I think the challenging nature is a bit, well, misunderstood. Don't get me wrong, the game is hard and it's 100% based on how skilled you are at playing. But I'm no where near a hardcore, challenge-oriented RPG player and I still have a lot of fun. That's because the game itself is built around the trial and error of the adventure, getting a little farther in a dungeon each time, banking on your skill in new areas, and of course, memorizing where the ambushes are.

One of the most rewarding aspects is that a big part of all of this is interacting with the community. You're constantly reading messages to know what's ahead of you, and leaving your own when you figure something out others before you might've missed.

Again, it's a very unique game and I absolutely recommend it to RPG enthusiasts or anyone who just got a PS3.
 

CBPodge

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Mar 15, 2009
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I imported this game a while back as it seemed that there's no hope of a EU release, and I absolutely love it. Great game. Its hard, but its hard in a really fair way - when you die its not because the game did something unfair, its because its better than you.

And when you complete it it basically restarts the game with you having the same skills but the enemies being a lot harder, so there's a good amount of replay value in it.

Definitely would recommend this, its a great game.
 

Avatar Roku

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Jul 9, 2008
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Looks interesting. I've never been too much of a fan of insanely difficult games, but that's because most of the ones I've played were only difficult because they were unfair about it (Resident Evil 5 on Professional mode unfair, I mean). If this is truly fair about it, I might get it. Besides, I think I have enough patience for this; I certainly have a high tolerance for repetition, if that helps.
 

Susan Arendt

Nerd Queen
Jan 9, 2007
7,222
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orannis62 said:
Looks interesting. I've never been too much of a fan of insanely difficult games, but that's because most of the ones I've played were only difficult because they were unfair about it (Resident Evil 5 on Professional mode unfair, I mean). If this is truly fair about it, I might get it. Besides, I think I have enough patience for this; I certainly have a high tolerance for repetition, if that helps.
Yep, that'll help. Success in the game comes from learning its vagaries, which comes only from playing it over and over and over again. It's also fun to try different character builds -- an armor-heavy Temple Knight won't be as quick as Royal, for example.
 

Venatio

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Sep 6, 2009
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Nice review, but like always made me kinda sleepy. Maybe I'm just too used to Yahtzee?
 

Omni-Bot

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Jul 5, 2009
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Yahtzee totally should have reviewed this. I mean, think about it, Demon's Souls is a JRPG that he might like, a lot.

No offense to you Susan, it was still a good review even if you did exaggerate the difficulty.
 

Souplex

Souplex Killsplosion Awesomegasm
Jul 29, 2008
10,313
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Looks like there is a new worthwhile PS3 exclusive! As of now worthwhile PS3 exclusives: Little Big planet, Valkyria Chronicles, InFamous, the Ratchet and Clank future episodes and introducing... Demon Souls!
 

dududf

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Aug 31, 2009
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Oh my god that template system is genius :)

Good review, it got the points stressed the good things, and ended with a chuckle.

Hi! Hi to you too!
 

Aptspire

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Mar 13, 2008
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I get the feeling that no matter how many Warriors or orcs there are, there'll still be WAY more trolls :(
 

HyenaThePirate

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I have no shame in admitting that this game probably will not appeal to me due to that niggling little factor of the incredibly high difficulty.
Not that I don't enjoy a good challenge, but I find that games that are TOO difficult soon cease to be "Fun" as most of the time I just want to play a game and have a few hours of kicking back and passing time between school and work.
When a game is killing me every 5 minutes, that breaks the fun factor. For example, Ninja Gaiden Black could be crazy tough, and so could God of War, but neither crossed that line between "Hard but fun" and "Too hard it's NO fun".

As for the message system, I'm extremely interested in how it works and wonder if the author can go into more detail... When you play the game, are you ALWAYS online with the thousands of other gamers who are also playing it? Or do you have to go online somehow by selecting an option? How do the messages keep from bleeding over each other...
From the description I can imagine coming up to a trap and finding 4,000 messages littered all over the passage way all warning me of the same thing... which in it's own way could potentially bring down the game because if everyone is telling you how to get past something, then where is the fun of figuring it out yourself?

It's like getting a strategy guide walkthrough for an RPG or looking up one of the walkthrough's online... i always felt they rob me of the fun of experiencing things for myself.

So how does the message system work? Will I be tripping over them all the way through every inch of the game?

I think I'll just pass on this one and continue waiting for White Knight Chronicles.
 

Antzon

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Sep 9, 2009
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Pipotchi said:
Lord_Gremlin said:
ssgt splatter said:
Hi!......and "hi" to you too. HA! That was funny.
The most frequent message is, as far as I noticed, "it's harsh. Evacuate me.")
I usually find the message "white sticky stuff", usually clustered around the female NPCs

I have been playing this game for a good few months now and I still love it

LOL.... what are you hinting.., Yea, but the Hi portion was epic
 

theultimateend

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Eric the Orange said:
Maybe I'm just jaded but when I think of interactions with others online my thoughts are more of them being dicks then them being helpful.
I expect many bloody spots that say "You are a fag" when I get on the game.

At least when folks get banned from this they'll hopefully need to make a whole new account to be a douchebag.

As always enjoyed the reviews Susan :).

HyenaThePirate said:
I have no shame in admitting that this game probably will not appeal to me due to that niggling little factor of the incredibly high difficulty.
Not that I don't enjoy a good challenge, but I find that games that are TOO difficult soon cease to be "Fun" as most of the time I just want to play a game and have a few hours of kicking back and passing time between school and work.
When a game is killing me every 5 minutes, that breaks the fun factor. For example, Ninja Gaiden Black could be crazy tough, and so could God of War, but neither crossed that line between "Hard but fun" and "Too hard it's NO fun".

As for the message system, I'm extremely interested in how it works and wonder if the author can go into more detail... When you play the game, are you ALWAYS online with the thousands of other gamers who are also playing it? Or do you have to go online somehow by selecting an option? How do the messages keep from bleeding over each other...
From the description I can imagine coming up to a trap and finding 4,000 messages littered all over the passage way all warning me of the same thing... which in it's own way could potentially bring down the game because if everyone is telling you how to get past something, then where is the fun of figuring it out yourself?

It's like getting a strategy guide walkthrough for an RPG or looking up one of the walkthrough's online... i always felt they rob me of the fun of experiencing things for myself.

So how does the message system work? Will I be tripping over them all the way through every inch of the game?

I think I'll just pass on this one and continue waiting for White Knight Chronicles.
Want to play a game that is so hard it is entirely unfun?

Holy Invasion of Privacy Badman! is the title for you.
 

FROGGEman2

Queen of France
Mar 14, 2009
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You like to coat your Halberd with sticky white stuff?

What?

Ehrm. I'll definitely rent it.
 

KoudelkaMorgan

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Jul 31, 2009
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I imported it a few months back, and played it 5 or 6 times through. Already preordered the CE out next month in NA.

Too often I hear this game as (insert superlative) difficult. In reality its only as difficult as you make it. I the video review for example, she is using a halberd to fight a pack of wolves in a tight space. You wouldn't be able to swing fast enough or likely at all in that scenario to keep your cream filling on the inside.

She is also wearing pretty heavy armour in the second part of the first level. Assuming she didn't go back to it after a bit of grinding she would be too encumbered by her armour weight to actually be able to dodge roll.

I had no experience or foreknowledge before I began the game, and my manual was in chinese, but I would now consider myself to be an expert on it. If anyone wants to know anything about it you can just message me.

Biggest tip is that you want to stay dead as much as possible. When you beat a boss you get your body back. You should dive off the ledge in the nexus to get rid of that smelly thing asap. This keeps away unwanted PKers if you like, but more importantly you do way more damage as a spirit. You lose half your HP though, unless you equip the cling ring which lets you keep about 33% more of your max HP while dead.

The new NA servers are gonna be intersting for PK/Co-op. Currently you rarely find anyone around your level to actually be able to do either, and in my experience people will literally cut there internet connection rather than lose gracefully. I rarely invade games, I only help people in theirs against invaders/bosses.

While its true you can build your character any way you want, you really want to focus on stamina early and often. Armor is barely useful, so just wear whatever looks good/has most defense but weighs < 1/2 your max equip cap. Because rolling is good. Falling over like a bowling pin when you try to dodge is bad mkay?

Strength is not too useful, even if you want to be pure melee (and you are handicapping yourself if you are). Just get it high enough to equip a purple flame shield, as its one of the two shields you will ever need, and if you plan on doing more than one play though its all but mandatory.

Dexterity is where its at. My starting class was the wanderer, which is kinda a cross between a soldier and a thief. Plus is that you begin with a Falchion (curved sword) and all curved swords are faster an duse less stamina to wield. They also use Dex and Str as modifiers, but mostly Dex. Dex also is the main modifier of your crossbow/bow. You won't be using a crossbow, as they have poor range, poor reload, and poor power. They use only one hand though.

If you like, you can snipe almost every enemy and a lot of the bosses. However its only end game when you have the right equips that enable 4x damage (at a hefty and reasonable price).

Two kinds of spells. Magic (i.e. useful) and Miracles (i.e. uneeded healing/curing spells). You will consume moongrass to heal pretty much exlusively as its quicker and you can full heal with most of them. The only miracles you need are Anti-Magic field (so you don't get one shotted by the octopus guys or have ot defend against ANY magic) and evacuate so you can warp for free back to the nexus.

As for Magic you will proably use Soul light and firestorm like the cool people, because your other options suck and you only have so many spell/miracle slots.

Bosses are awesome, but the only really difficult ones are Maneater (you will know why and you will QQ), Flamlurker (this is why you have that purple flame shield), and the False King (unless you use the ubercheap method of poisoning him and walking away).

Unlike most reviewers, I strongly reccomend NOT playing it online. At least not at first. You really don't want to deal with the PKers when you don't even know the level yet. The NA servers will be starting fresh though so you won't have any douchebags that deleveled themselves with an old glitch so that they could fight newbs with end game stuff.

Also, there is a glitch/design choice that randomly resets your world tendancy to neutral in a world when you play online. This will seriously impact how easy/hard enemies are and which side areas/equip is available to you. If its your first time through this can mess you up to the point where you need to help others/kill yourself repeatedly to fix it. Assuming it doesn't happen while fixing it.

Best advice is to find a type of weapon early on that fits your playstyle, but be especially aware of its short comings. Daggers are great for critical backstabs and ripostes, which require you parrying with a light shield or certain weapons in your off hand. While novel, you would be a fool to have anything but a heavy shield in your off hand unless you are using your bow at the time. You can still back stab, and you can't parry a lot of attacks. Using a dagger on a boss is not going to work as you can't backstab them (unless they are black phantoms).

Halberds have the longest reach, but indoors they are hindered by this. Only a few of the attacks you can do with them will have room.

Most new players use spears since they are relatively quick, there are plenty of mobs that are weak to piercing damage, and you can attack from behind your shield.

Once you are more advanced you may have your own distinct playstyle, but I used a Moon Kilij +5 almost exclusively. It combines the speed of a curved sword with added magical damage on top of the regular physical damage. I use my bow and my spells often as the situation calls for, and this weapon is modified heavily by MAG, with minor STR and DEX.

The Meat Cleaver is another good choice, as is the Blueblood Sword. The former get mods from STR DEX MAG and Faith (on top of the ability to pound your enemies into the ground where they are set up for more abuse). The latter is like a longsword that's Mod includes Luck which makes it unique. You won't find a rapier that doesn't suck. Sorry.

Lastly if the idea of making a warrior priest sounds like fun, there is the Moonlight Sword. It has a purely magical damage modded by Faith. The blade is made of light, and as such it is the fasted of the huge swords and only weighs 2 pounds. Plus it being basically a lightsaber, it IGNORES SHIELDS. Goes right through them like tinsel. Useful indeed.

As long as you are flexable you will do fine. Since in the end (after way more time than most sane people would spend) you can level up to 786ish and max all your stats you should just have fun playing around with different stuff. Rerolling isn't needed.

Each time you beat it the game gets about 20% harder, with the exception of the second playthough which is a bigger jump in difficulty.

Devil may cry games, Shinobi, and Ninja Gaiden are way more difficult than anything this game has in store for you.
 

Susan Arendt

Nerd Queen
Jan 9, 2007
7,222
0
0
HyenaThePirate said:
I have no shame in admitting that this game probably will not appeal to me due to that niggling little factor of the incredibly high difficulty.
Not that I don't enjoy a good challenge, but I find that games that are TOO difficult soon cease to be "Fun" as most of the time I just want to play a game and have a few hours of kicking back and passing time between school and work.
When a game is killing me every 5 minutes, that breaks the fun factor. For example, Ninja Gaiden Black could be crazy tough, and so could God of War, but neither crossed that line between "Hard but fun" and "Too hard it's NO fun".

As for the message system, I'm extremely interested in how it works and wonder if the author can go into more detail... When you play the game, are you ALWAYS online with the thousands of other gamers who are also playing it? Or do you have to go online somehow by selecting an option? How do the messages keep from bleeding over each other...
From the description I can imagine coming up to a trap and finding 4,000 messages littered all over the passage way all warning me of the same thing... which in it's own way could potentially bring down the game because if everyone is telling you how to get past something, then where is the fun of figuring it out yourself?

It's like getting a strategy guide walkthrough for an RPG or looking up one of the walkthrough's online... i always felt they rob me of the fun of experiencing things for myself.

So how does the message system work? Will I be tripping over them all the way through every inch of the game?

I think I'll just pass on this one and continue waiting for White Knight Chronicles.
Happy to provide a bit more detail on the messaging. First off, don't worry about messages saying "FAG" or anything like that, because you have to build your message from a selection of pre-selected words and phrases. You can't type anything on your own. So everything you see, whether actually helpful or not, will at least be fit for public consumption.

If you are signed into the PSN, you are playing with others. The game signs you in to the servers automatically. Each area can only hold a certain number of messages, however. As it fills up with new messages, older ones drop off. Ones that are popular (by which I mean they have been recommended many times) float to the top despite their age. So, unhelpful, old messages will eventually dropped off, to be replaced by new messages.

In case it's not clear in the video, messages show up as glowing red letters on the floor. You're free to ignore them if you wish, you have to actively ask to read them.

Hope that helps!
 

JonnoStrife

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Sep 5, 2009
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So the only way to win is to lose constantly? Can anyone tell me if this game out in Australia yet, because I can't find anything on it and I'm a glutton for punishment. Also it's a bit of a shame that there isn't an easier mode that allows the player to really get into the the hack-and-slash swing of things. PS. Can you slay a dragon either online or solo?
 

BlackDodongo

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Apr 15, 2009
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Monocle Man said:
BlackDodongo said:
Monocle Man said:
Still no European publisher, I presume?

Import it is.
Better figure out whether I can use paypal through bank transactions since I have this special credit card that isn't supported by any site.
EDIT/ Quite amusing, Amazon is not willing to ship that particular game to an address outside the US. As if the gods are mocking me.
http://www.renchi.com/renchi/PS3_Games_Asia_Demon_s_Souls_AS.htm

Thats were me and my friend got our copy. Works perfectly :)

As for the game, definitely one of my favourites. I love the feeling you get after you get past that room you've been trying to do for hours. Although I had the benefit of watching my friend play through the game while I waited for my delayed copy so I knew about alot of the early traps :p

Also, brilliant review. Really did the game justice.
Would I be correct if I'd assume that version is completely in English and has no subtitles written in strange characters?
And does the game still have an active playerbase in those servers since those servers are supposedly separate and a lack of players to co-op or murder/be murdered by would probably detract from the overall experience.
The game is completely english. I didn't even have to change languages or anything. There is full English voice acting and the option to have English subtitles, or none at all. Only think is that the box is in foriegn and so is the instruction manual. But you do get an english booklet and the box art, in my opinion, looks better. It really captures the essernce of the game, in bieng that your characters already dead on the cover! As for the playerbase, still very, very active. And ofcourse there are always the players that, like me, couldnt wait to import the American release, so we got the Asian one instead :p And because the messages are pre-set, they are all translated online. So no problemn there. The only thing i can think of is that, if there is any future DLC, you will need a japanese account.
 

Biek

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I guess the multiplayer message system will remind me that the cake is a lie many, many times.
 

Monocle Man

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BlackDodongo said:
The game is completely english. I didn't even have to change languages or anything. There is full English voice acting and the option to have English subtitles, or none at all. Only think is that the box is in foriegn and so is the instruction manual. But you do get an english booklet and the box art, in my opinion, looks better. It really captures the essernce of the game, in bieng that your characters already dead on the cover! As for the playerbase, still very, very active. And ofcourse there are always the players that, like me, couldnt wait to import the American release, so we got the Asian one instead :p And because the messages are pre-set, they are all translated online. So no problemn there. The only thing i can think of is that, if there is any future DLC, you will need a japanese account.
Ah, thank you very much. I will look into ordering it sometime soon.
 

Biek

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Susan Arendt said:
Biek said:
I guess the multiplayer message system will remind me that the cake is a lie many, many times.
You didn't read the rest of this thread, did you?
Whats your problem? Im just saying that if theres gonna be bloody messages scribbled by players throughout this game, I predict alot of people will put in the "cake is a lie" or something like that because the same thing happens in portal. This is actually the first thing that ocurred to me after watching the review video.
 

Susan Arendt

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Jan 9, 2007
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Biek said:
Susan Arendt said:
Biek said:
I guess the multiplayer message system will remind me that the cake is a lie many, many times.
You didn't read the rest of this thread, did you?
Whats your problem? Im just saying that if theres gonna be bloody messages scribbled by players throughout this game, I predict alot of people will put in the "cake is a lie" or something like that because the same thing happens in portal. This is actually the first thing that ocurred to me after watching the review video.
As has been addressed both in the written review and in this thread, that's simply not possible. The messages are created by selecting words and phrases from a list. You can't actually type anything in.
 

Korten12

Now I want ma...!
Aug 26, 2009
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cant wait to buy this on my ps3 on october 6th. I have been waiting for this game since before atlus said they would be releasing the NA version. I was going to import the game but then I checked up on wiki and saw the NA release date and I decided to wait.
 

wlad777

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I imported this game about a month ago (I live in South Africa and since we share releases with Europe we won't be seeing it here any time soon) and I have to say it is one of the best purchases I have ever made. I managed to finish the game, with a little help from other players here and there, and I have to say it is the most difficult yet rewarding game I ever played. I highly recommend this game to anyone who has a PS3 and loves RPG's. I would even go so far as to say this is the best game I have played in my life. It took me about 60 + hours to finish the first playthrough, although I did rush it at the end, but immediately after you finish it the game restarts again (you keep all your items, weapons, souls, etc.) but only this time it's a LOT more difficult.

There is definitely a lot of replay value as every time you finish the game it just restarts with an increased difficulty level and the max level you can become is 712! (I was only level 91 after the first playthrough)

The online play is awesome when your in soul form and extremely frustrating when your in body form. When in soul form you can be summoned to help other players with their levels, but any bosses you help them defeat are not defeated in your world and you do not get the PSN trophies for them. In body form you can summon other players to help you, but it also makes you open to attack from black phantoms, i.e. other players invading your world with the intent of killing you and taking your souls (which happens a lot). The message system is also pretty awesome and I've come accross a lot of very helpful messages pointing me in the direction of valuable loot. The closest thing you'll get to people calling you a "fag" or whataver is fake messages, i.e. messages telling you to jump down for treasure but when you do jump you just die and lose all your souls.

Again, if you have a PS3 and love RPG's get this game. I cannot stand difficult games, but this is definitely the best game I have ever played. It is very, very difficult, yes, but it is also very, very rewarding. A definite must-buy!
 

jboking

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Demon's Souls looks good and difficult. I could likely spend a large amount of time with this if the difficulty isn't exaggerated. Will definitely buy on October 6th.
 

Raykuza

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KoudelkaMorgan said:
I imported it a few months back, and played it 5 or 6 times through. Already preordered the CE out next month in NA.

...

She is also wearing pretty heavy armour in the second part of the first level. Assuming she didn't go back to it after a bit of grinding she would be too encumbered by her armour weight to actually be able to dodge roll.

I had no experience or foreknowledge before I began the game, and my manual was in chinese, but I would now consider myself to be an expert on it. If anyone wants to know anything about it you can just message me.

Biggest tip is that you want to stay dead as much as possible. When you beat a boss you get your body back. You should dive off the ledge in the nexus to get rid of that smelly thing asap. This keeps away unwanted PKers if you like, but more importantly you do way more damage as a spirit. You lose half your HP though, unless you equip the cling ring which lets you keep about 33% more of your max HP while dead.

...
I also imported the game a while ago, and I'll have to disagree with your advice. Don't chuck your body off a cliff as soon as you get it; that thing is totally awesome. When your HP is at full, you don't have to wear the Cling Ring, thus freeing up a ring slot (you only have 2 slots). This is important because there are only 2 rings you'll want to wear most of the time (by most of the time, I mean when you are dead): the Cling Ring to boost your HP from 50%, and either the Fragrant Ring for MP recovery if you're a Royal or the Thief Ring which makes it easier for you to see enemies before they see you (super helpful). Freeing up a ring slot opens up a wealth of other possibilities for rings with very helpful effects.

Also, when you have your body, you can summon up to two other players to help you get through the level. This not only means that you will have extra man-power when fighting the boss, but also when fighting invading players.

PvP Protip: Scraping Spear. That is all.
 

Susan Arendt

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It's a shame this is getting 8s and 9s rather than 10s simply because of the difficulty issue. Nobody complained about the difficulty of games like Thief, System Shock 2 and Deus Ex when they were originally released. Even the original Half-Life was a quickload extravaganza. It seems like console games must adhere to a certain (universally accessible) standard of difficulty these days in order to get top marks. Susan, would you give this a maximum if you had to provide a number score? Or is that a forbidden question? :D

Oh and two more questions:

1) Did you play on Japanese servers?
2) Did you encounter any PvP competitions?

I found the Japanese players to be extremely chivalrous & helpful, which made the online experience way better than I expected it to be. I fear that playing with Americans might be... umm... slightly less enjoyable on occasion. The PvP competitions are basically where everyone stands around in a circle and guys fight each other one-one-one, then when someone dies another contender steps in. They just happen randomly sometimes, and they're as awesome as they sound.
 

HyenaThePirate

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Susan Arendt said:
HyenaThePirate said:
I have no shame in admitting that this game probably will not appeal to me due to that niggling little factor of the incredibly high difficulty.
Not that I don't enjoy a good challenge, but I find that games that are TOO difficult soon cease to be "Fun" as most of the time I just want to play a game and have a few hours of kicking back and passing time between school and work.
When a game is killing me every 5 minutes, that breaks the fun factor. For example, Ninja Gaiden Black could be crazy tough, and so could God of War, but neither crossed that line between "Hard but fun" and "Too hard it's NO fun".

As for the message system, I'm extremely interested in how it works and wonder if the author can go into more detail... When you play the game, are you ALWAYS online with the thousands of other gamers who are also playing it? Or do you have to go online somehow by selecting an option? How do the messages keep from bleeding over each other...
From the description I can imagine coming up to a trap and finding 4,000 messages littered all over the passage way all warning me of the same thing... which in it's own way could potentially bring down the game because if everyone is telling you how to get past something, then where is the fun of figuring it out yourself?

It's like getting a strategy guide walkthrough for an RPG or looking up one of the walkthrough's online... i always felt they rob me of the fun of experiencing things for myself.

So how does the message system work? Will I be tripping over them all the way through every inch of the game?

I think I'll just pass on this one and continue waiting for White Knight Chronicles.
Happy to provide a bit more detail on the messaging. First off, don't worry about messages saying "FAG" or anything like that, because you have to build your message from a selection of pre-selected words and phrases. You can't type anything on your own. So everything you see, whether actually helpful or not, will at least be fit for public consumption.

If you are signed into the PSN, you are playing with others. The game signs you in to the servers automatically. Each area can only hold a certain number of messages, however. As it fills up with new messages, older ones drop off. Ones that are popular (by which I mean they have been recommended many times) float to the top despite their age. So, unhelpful, old messages will eventually dropped off, to be replaced by new messages.

In case it's not clear in the video, messages show up as glowing red letters on the floor. You're free to ignore them if you wish, you have to actively ask to read them.

Hope that helps!
That explains everything... awesome..
The game sounds a bit more appealing now, especially thanks to the another long post up above where someone sheds a little more light on the intricacies of the combat depth.
Still it does sound a bit too daunting for my more casual/hardcore style.
I think I'll be wait and gamefly it first just to see if I can handle the "die, you DIE! DIE!" over and over again... the whole black phantoms thing smacks of PKing, bringing up FEARS from the old UO days.. which is perfectly fine in my MMO's... not so fine on my console.
Thank you tho for taking the time to clear things up!
 

wlad777

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Raykuza said:
PvP Protip: Scraping Spear. That is all.
I forgot about the scraping spear, it is indeed the perfect detterent for black phantoms (it damages both the weapon and armour of whoever you attack with it). I always carry mine around with me and as soon as a black phantom invades, I switch to it and attack him a few times. They usually run away after about the third of fourth hit, then you can take them out real quick :D
 

KoudelkaMorgan

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I'll grant that having all your hit points and calling on others to fight for you is nice, but I prefer hitting harder. The fact that having a body lets enemies hear you clanking around, while you are silent and draw much less aggro as a ghost is nice too.

I usually wear the Eternal Warrior ring and the ring of magical sharpness. Going 2 handed with my kilij against the dredglings in 1-1 never gets old. One hit one kill, or two kills if its rolling attack. Its like a dance of death, a non stop chain of attacks, after which you can loot them for herbs. Same with the rampart after the dragon leaves later in the level, and thats just the first stage. You will be farming 1-1 for healing items until you get to 1-4. You won't need to buy them very often. Boletaria is my favorite world by far. I actually hate the Valley of Defilement. It excels at what it is trying to accompolish though, doesn't mean its any more fun. Charge attacking knights just when they raise their swords and landing 2 or 3 hits before they can land their blow is fun. Espesially when you know that if you mistime it they will block or get a free hit which will probably kill you.

Once you level up some of the rare weapons you can have a lot more fun. Makoto is a katana that has massive attack power and massive bleed damage. The baby's nail is a wicked dagger which can crit and plague. You can hit an enemy a few times and walk away. They will follow you for a bit and then they stop attacking you, stand there and die a bit later.

You are never lacking in options
 

Susan Arendt

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harhol said:
It's a shame this is getting 8s and 9s rather than 10s simply because of the difficulty issue. Nobody complained about the difficulty of games like Thief, System Shock 2 and Deus Ex when they were originally released. Even the original Half-Life was a quickload extravaganza. It seems like console games must adhere to a certain (universally accessible) standard of difficulty these days in order to get top marks. Susan, would you give this a maximum if you had to provide a number score? Or is that a forbidden question? :D

Oh and two more questions:

1) Did you play on Japanese servers?
2) Did you encounter any PvP competitions?

I found the Japanese players to be extremely chivalrous & helpful, which made the online experience way better than I expected it to be. I fear that playing with Americans might be... umm... slightly less enjoyable on occasion. The PvP competitions are basically where everyone stands around in a circle and guys fight each other one-one-one, then when someone dies another contender steps in. They just happen randomly sometimes, and they're as awesome as they sound.
I don't do review scores. Period. I do think knocking the game for its difficulty is unfair, though. Yes, it's hard, perhaps harder than the average person might enjoy, but that hardly makes the game bad. It just makes it different, which I personally find to be in its favor.

I was playing on the Japanese servers, yes -- the American servers won't open up until the game releases. It's fair to be concerned about the differences in...what shall we call it, manners? -- but I do think that the game has enough built-in safeguards to prevent it becoming too unpleasant.
 

BlackDodongo

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KoudelkaMorgan said:
I'll grant that having all your hit points and calling on others to fight for you is nice, but I prefer hitting harder. The fact that having a body lets enemies hear you clanking around, while you are silent and draw much less aggro as a ghost is nice too.

I usually wear the Eternal Warrior ring and the ring of magical sharpness. Going 2 handed with my kilij against the dredglings in 1-1 never gets old. One hit one kill, or two kills if its rolling attack. Its like a dance of death, a non stop chain of attacks, after which you can loot them for herbs. Same with the rampart after the dragon leaves later in the level, and thats just the first stage. You will be farming 1-1 for healing items until you get to 1-4. You won't need to buy them very often. Boletaria is my favorite world by far. I actually hate the Valley of Defilement. It excels at what it is trying to accompolish though, doesn't mean its any more fun. Charge attacking knights just when they raise their swords and landing 2 or 3 hits before they can land their blow is fun. Espesially when you know that if you mistime it they will block or get a free hit which will probably kill you.

Once you level up some of the rare weapons you can have a lot more fun. Makoto is a katana that has massive attack power and massive bleed damage. The baby's nail is a wicked dagger which can crit and plague. You can hit an enemy a few times and walk away. They will follow you for a bit and then they stop attacking you, stand there and die a bit later.

You are never lacking in options
Backstabs and ripostes are always a favourite of mine.
 

Fearzone

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KoudelkaMorgan said:
Biggest tip is that you want to stay dead as much as possible. When you beat a boss you get your body back. You should dive off the ledge in the nexus to get rid of that smelly thing asap. This keeps away unwanted PKers if you like, but more importantly you do way more damage as a spirit.
Yeah, that is the subtle message I've been getting from descriptions of the game--that your body is nothing but a temporary health buff and, from what you are saying, it is a damage nerf as well, so thinking-outside-the-box maybe you can just do without.

I though the animations at the end while fighting the wolves were unimpressive.
 

pantsoffdanceoff

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Ugh... I love Atlas they (IMO) have made some of the best games to come out. Unfortunately, I really suck at normal difficulty videogames, let alone ones made to put your balls in a vice.
 

Susan Arendt

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Dang I thought this game was for Xbox360 too a while back ago, well another reason to buy a PS3 i suppose.
 

Demiath

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HyenaThePirate said:
When a game is killing me every 5 minutes, that breaks the fun factor. For example, Ninja Gaiden Black could be crazy tough, and so could God of War, but neither crossed that line between "Hard but fun" and "Too hard it's NO fun".
Not that Demon's Souls plays anything like Ninja Gaiden Black, but if you weren't too frustrated by the difficulty level in NGB I'd say you probably won't mind being repeatedly crushed in this game either (assuming you're not a vastly superior NGB player compared to me and coasted through Tecmo's classic without dying much at all). One thing worth emphasizing is that Demon's Souls is a fairly slow-paced game compared to most action RPGs, which means that more often than not you'll have just enough time to start running if things get tough. Better part of valor and all that...
 

KoudelkaMorgan

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I enjoyed the game a lot more once I learned you can sprint. It made 1-2's dragon areas make a hell of a lot more sense. As I said my manuel is in chinese, and I glossed over it in the english insert...

Demiath is right that its not as frantic as NG or DMC. Methodical would be a good word to describe it.

There is a spell called demon's prank that I never use, but has limitless potential. It creates a noise at the location you aim it that attracts and even aggros mobs. I assume it makes for easy backstabs, but definately good for defusing ambushes.

Until you get to most bosses, then its pretty crazy. Bear in mind there is usually a easy way and a hard way to beat a boss. You can one shot the first boss (on second playthough) with firestorm. You can melee Tower Knight (like I did the first time) or snipe from the ramparts with magic (like most people do).

The three bosses I mentioned before being an exception. Strategy kinda breaks down with bosses that are relentless, can chain near infinite combos, and don't react to being hit in any way.
 

HyenaThePirate

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Well that sounds much better then.
LOL and NGB had a tough learning curve, but it was manageable and I became pretty good at it through dedication, so if Demon Souls is like that, you just might have convinced me to give this a game a second look.

I think what needs to be conveyed is that I'm not afraid of "difficulty" as much as I have an aversion to "cheap". There is a difference between a game being difficult to master but fun to play, and difficult because the game cheapshots you at every convenience. A good example was SPartan: Total Warrior. Where the enemies were ridiculously cheap, breaking your combos with EASE and then unleashing their own devastating 'counters' while your "block" button seemed to have a constant 2 second delay where you can hit the button and by the time the screen registers and your character starts through the animations, you were already getting pwned. Or like Street FIghter II back in the day on the SNES... where Bison could bring shame-filled tears to my eyes like a wuss because it wasn't FAIR how fast and easily he could pull off his moves which seemed unavoidable, unblockable, and always incinerated half your health with the slightest flutter of his cape in your general direction... in fact that seems to be a consistency in Capcom games.... easy game play, compensated for by ridiculously over-powered or just plain CHEAP bosses with moves that borderline more on game GLITCHES than God-like.

Anyway, it sounds like this game is less "frenetic" hack and slash, twitch reflexes, like in NGB where your main strategy was to hold down the block button ALWAYS and wait for that .2 microsecond opening to take a quick strike at the enemy, and if your finger slipped for even a second, the A.I. registered that the "block" button was 'released' and commenced to handing you your ass with all the trimmings.

I'm not quite sure I like the PK aspect of a game that is already raising eyebrows with it's difficulty level, but you also mentioned something about it being a "Slow paced" game and that made me curious.
Do you mean it's slow as in not as many enemies because you are exploring an environment trying to solve puzzles and figure out how to survive traps? Or is it that the combat is slow and methodical, like the combat in Conan could sometimes be where you and the enemy circled each other feinting and striking, hoping to gain an advantage in some sort of deadly duel?

Also, (sorry I know i'm being a pain lol), could someone explain how the online portion works a bit better? Are you always online, like in Little Big Planet? Do you NEED to be connected to PSonline to play? If so, is there a way to restrict who can enter your world (removing black phantoms basically), and also, on the coop team-ups, I see alot of people talk about strangers helping out, but is there a method that friends on your friend's list can also jump in to help (assuming they also have the game?) I think it would suck if complete strangers could jump into my game at any time, but a friend who lives down the road on my friend's list can't.

Thanks in Advance!
 

BaldursBananaSoap

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Is the game only hard because it's cheap? Like Ninja Gaiden 2s rocket spammers, or is it hard to master and rewarding, because I might pick it up?
 

KoudelkaMorgan

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Its not cheap. The button reading ai in NG is cheap, and proven to be there. Demon's souls levels are almost totally linear. Not big and sprawling, except for the two swamp areas. A few levels are extremely claustrophobic like the mines and the beginning of the Valley. Some have shortcuts that you unlock/make on the other side that stay open ever after.

There are 5 areas. Boletaria Castle is the first and my favorite. You fight knights and soldiers mostly. Levels are made of rooms and ramparts. Fairly roomy, the envoriment won't kill you. The second is a mining town. You will be suprised by a more varied group of mobs. You will trigger bombs and fall to your death if you take the huge shortcut most likely until you figure it out.

The third is the most creepy. Its a dungeon patrolled by those mindflayer guys. Later in the same level you will get out of the dungeon, but face the coolest and one of the more diffuclt parts of the game ending with Maneater.

World 4 is kinda a crumbling ruin, populated by all manner of undead. Not as scary as you might think. More of an open air ruin at the edge of an abyss.

World 5 is a suprise. You won't like it. Any part of it. Its sadistic from start to finish.

The game is fast paced at bosses, but usually the first time through a level you will be walking around with your shield up. That is the first and last thing you need to remember. Shield up.

Once you know the layout you only use your shield to block arrows and go on a two handed killing spree. Suprise is the main source of the difficulty. You won't be ambused at every turn...but you aren't supposed to believe that.

Slow weapons aren't your friend. A kilij will attack 3 to 4 times before a large axe will get 2 in.
 

BlackDodongo

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KoudelkaMorgan said:
Its not cheap. The button reading ai in NG is cheap, and proven to be there. Demon's souls levels are almost totally linear. Not big and sprawling, except for the two swamp areas. A few levels are extremely claustrophobic like the mines and the beginning of the Valley. Some have shortcuts that you unlock/make on the other side that stay open ever after.

There are 5 areas. Boletaria Castle is the first and my favorite. You fight knights and soldiers mostly. Levels are made of rooms and ramparts. Fairly roomy, the envoriment won't kill you. The second is a mining town. You will be suprised by a more varied group of mobs. You will trigger bombs and fall to your death if you take the huge shortcut most likely until you figure it out.

The third is the most creepy. Its a dungeon patrolled by those mindflayer guys. Later in the same level you will get out of the dungeon, but face the coolest and one of the more diffuclt parts of the game ending with Maneater.

World 4 is kinda a crumbling ruin, populated by all manner of undead. Not as scary as you might think. More of an open air ruin at the edge of an abyss.

World 5 is a suprise. You won't like it. Any part of it. Its sadistic from start to finish.

The game is fast paced at bosses, but usually the first time through a level you will be walking around with your shield up. That is the first and last thing you need to remember. Shield up.

Once you know the layout you only use your shield to block arrows and go on a two handed killing spree. Suprise is the main source of the difficulty. You won't be ambused at every turn...but you aren't supposed to believe that.

Slow weapons aren't your friend. A kilij will attack 3 to 4 times before a large axe will get 2 in.
Boletaria Palace is also my favourite because of its layout mostly. Also, just because KoudelkaMorgan says there aren't many traps, I would still be on your guard because they are there.

The second area is probably one of my leat favourites. Although the enemies are nicely varied, they can be a pain in the arse.

The first part of the third level is one of my favourites because it has a nice atmosphere to it. The rest of the third level kind of loses this a little bit in place of roaming outside of the tower.

I hate the fourth level simply because my wireless is not working so I have not been able to update the game with the patch and this makes the game alot harder.

As for the fifth level. This is the only part of the game you can really consider cheap. It uses a poison swamp that you will have to navigate and makes it very hard to manouver in. You will die many times in this part and most likely, hate it like everyone else. However, the "cheapness" can be overcome and really only requires a little thinking.

Also, slow weapons can be affective, although I wouldn't recommend them untill you know what you are doing.


HyenaThePirate said:
I'm not quite sure I like the PK aspect of a game that is already raising eyebrows with it's difficulty level, but you also mentioned something about it being a "Slow paced" game and that made me curious.
Do you mean it's slow as in not as many enemies because you are exploring an environment trying to solve puzzles and figure out how to survive traps? Or is it that the combat is slow and methodical, like the combat in Conan could sometimes be where you and the enemy circled each other feinting and striking, hoping to gain an advantage in some sort of deadly duel?

Also, (sorry I know i'm being a pain lol), could someone explain how the online portion works a bit better? Are you always online, like in Little Big Planet? Do you NEED to be connected to PSonline to play? If so, is there a way to restrict who can enter your world (removing black phantoms basically), and also, on the coop team-ups, I see alot of people talk about strangers helping out, but is there a method that friends on your friend's list can also jump in to help (assuming they also have the game?) I think it would suck if complete strangers could jump into my game at any time, but a friend who lives down the road on my friend's list can't.
The combat is kinda a mix of both your examples. You will not be fighting masses of enemies at once, but most opponents require more than a quick flash of your blade (untill you level up a bit atleast). This does slow the pace of combat down. However, there will be tougher enemies that require a bit of strategy to combat, rather than charging in brandishing your Dragon Long Sword +3. The Blue Eyed/Red Eyed Knights in the Boletarian Palace are a perfect example. A few will keep their sheilds high, requiring you to waste your stamina on a powerful blow to break their shield, or to wait for an opening in their own attacks.

As for online. Yes, you are constantly online (unless you actively choose not to) and you carry on as normal. From time to time you will see white, ghostly figures, wandering the passages. These are the other players. At this time you cannot interact with them. As Im sure you've picked up by now, you have two forms. Human and Soul. Near the beggining of the game you gain an item called the Blueye Stone. As a Soul you may place this at certain area's in the game. If a human player spots your Stone they may summon you to their world. You are playing in their world so all of the bosses they have killed will be there and any you may have killed will not affect their game. As a Human you collect all of the items in a game but none of the souls (currency) and as the Soul you gain all of the souls but cannot pick up items. Any Bosses you kill in another players world, will not be killed in yours. As a Human, other players Blueye Stones will appear in your world and you can look at the ratings other players have given them before you choose to summon them into your own world.

Now Im not quite sure how Black Phantoms work because, as I said, I don't have online for my PS3 (I hate virgin media).

I hope that helped.
 

KoudelkaMorgan

New member
Jul 31, 2009
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Yes there are a few boulder down the stairs traps in boletaria. I was meaning that there aren't any poison swamps, gratuitous pits, or flying bombs like in the other levels when I said the enviroment wouldn't kill you.
 

MDSnowman

New member
Apr 8, 2004
373
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Wow, I was going to pass on this but Koudelka is really selling this game well. Gets my inner table top RPer riled up. Once I finally give Valkyria Chronicles the brutal beatdown that it deserves I'll need to buy this.
 

KoudelkaMorgan

New member
Jul 31, 2009
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Its all part of my diabolical plan to encourage them to make dlc or a sequel.

I need to finish VC too. Played like 5 missions then stopped for another game. I got the DLC, wanted to start from scratch, and never touched it again.

If you want to spoil yourself with foreknowledge go here http://demonssouls.wikidot.com/

The maps are terrible last time I checked though so you will still be suprised.
 

Snooters

New member
Mar 19, 2004
3
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I registered on this site a while ago. I never even heard of the escapist until last year. I think I'm losing my mind.

Demon's Souls deluxe preordered BTW.
 

Perversion

New member
Oct 8, 2009
2
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I'm surprised nobody else has commented here in the past few days, as this just released domestically on Tuesday. I picked this game up on import a while back, played for about an hour, died, and set it down. Picked it up again about a month ago, and have been obsessed with it ever since. Just picked up my Deluxe Edition today. I also wrote a few critiques on the game that question the difficulty of the game itself in relation to the difficulty of breaking bad habits and going against human nature. Excerpts and links below.


Is Demon's Souls really THAT difficult? The answer is yes and no. The game itself is challenging, without a doubt. But what's garnering the game its seemingly reveled-in status as "the most difficult game this generation," is not so much the challenge of overcoming the deviously-placed obstacles that it places in your path, but instead overcoming probably the most difficult obstacle to surmount, the obstacle of habit, routine, and human nature.


So in order to succeed at Demon's Souls, you need to confront another deeply ingrained part of your humanity, the fear and panic centers of your brain, and overcome them. You need to overcome them to the point that your logical and tactical brain is in full control, and you begin imprinting new instincts, new habits, through repetition.
And again, we come back to the sheer genius of Demon's Souls, and the brilliance of its developers. Taken on a literal level, this is, as many other reviews mention, a brooding dark fantasy game. But beneath the surface is a game that profoundly taps into areas of the brain and the psyche that no other game has ever touched.

http://stupididioticramblings.wordpress.com/2009/10/05/demons-souls-critique-1-is-it-really-all-that-difficult/
http://stupididioticramblings.wordpress.com/2009/10/05/demons-souls-critique-2-primal-fear-and-isolation/
 

BlackDodongo

New member
Apr 15, 2009
104
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Perversion said:
I'm surprised nobody else has commented here in the past few days, as this just released domestically on Tuesday. I picked this game up on import a while back, played for about an hour, died, and set it down. Picked it up again about a month ago, and have been obsessed with it ever since. Just picked up my Deluxe Edition today. I also wrote a few critiques on the game that question the difficulty of the game itself in relation to the difficulty of breaking bad habits and going against human nature. Excerpts and links below.


Is Demon's Souls really THAT difficult? The answer is yes and no. The game itself is challenging, without a doubt. But what's garnering the game its seemingly reveled-in status as "the most difficult game this generation," is not so much the challenge of overcoming the deviously-placed obstacles that it places in your path, but instead overcoming probably the most difficult obstacle to surmount, the obstacle of habit, routine, and human nature.


So in order to succeed at Demon's Souls, you need to confront another deeply ingrained part of your humanity, the fear and panic centers of your brain, and overcome them. You need to overcome them to the point that your logical and tactical brain is in full control, and you begin imprinting new instincts, new habits, through repetition.
And again, we come back to the sheer genius of Demon's Souls, and the brilliance of its developers. Taken on a literal level, this is, as many other reviews mention, a brooding dark fantasy game. But beneath the surface is a game that profoundly taps into areas of the brain and the psyche that no other game has ever touched.

http://stupididioticramblings.wordpress.com/2009/10/05/demons-souls-critique-1-is-it-really-all-that-difficult/
http://stupididioticramblings.wordpress.com/2009/10/05/demons-souls-critique-2-primal-fear-and-isolation/
Read through both your "reviews and I have to say that I generally agree. I hat difficulty in games where they just add more enemies or just make them do more damage, with more health. Its just uncreative and because they are practically the same enemy. I recently purchased Ninja Gaiden Sigma 2 for PS3. I went through the game on the hardest game difficulty available at the beggining. Every time I died I felt that it wasn't because I wasn't skilled enough, I felt that I just got unlucky. The reason I felt this was because I would retry the same part and then succeed, even though I hadn't really changed my strategy in any way. Demons Souls difficulty lies in the way your required to think.
 

infinisynth

The man
Jul 31, 2009
206
0
0
This was the game that got me to buy a ps3. It's a creepy rpg with a good story and character development, it's hardcore as hell and the online works great. Just wish there was more gear. Hopefully they will come out with DLC for this.
 

AgentNein

New member
Jun 14, 2008
1,476
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HyenaThePirate said:
I'm not quite sure I like the PK aspect of a game that is already raising eyebrows with it's difficulty level, but you also mentioned something about it being a "Slow paced" game and that made me curious.
Do you mean it's slow as in not as many enemies because you are exploring an environment trying to solve puzzles and figure out how to survive traps? Or is it that the combat is slow and methodical, like the combat in Conan could sometimes be where you and the enemy circled each other feinting and striking, hoping to gain an advantage in some sort of deadly duel?
Hey Hyena, doesn't look like anyone fielded your question about the PK aspect yet, so I thought I'd help. The only time another player can enter your game is when you're alive. So if you're a soul, no worries! And believe me, you'll be running around as a soul quite abit (it's not that bad, your at half health at first but then you find an item that increases it to 3/4ths health, and you're actually abit stronger). Worst case scenario, someone kills you and you'll just be a soul again. Hell, the predatory ghost has more to lose from entering your game to kill you than you do, because if you kill them, then they will lose a point off their highest stat! You don't lose anything save for your body, and hey no big deal there. Also, the game does let you know when your area has been 'invaded', so you can prepare accordingly.

Honestly dude, I recommend giving this a shot. I can't play this Ninja Gaiden without breaking a controller, but I love this game. The pace is definitely slow, in a very methodical sense. And you wondered before if other player's messages might break the game, well the game is built around this. It's not an after thought, there are traps around, and these traps may kill you without much warning! Luckily, you'll have messages to read (they're not so in depth that they spoil things, but they'll definitely give you a heads up), and bloodstains can't be disregarded either. Most of the time they'll show you a ghostly image of someone getting their ass kicked, but every once in awhile they'll help telegraph a nasty trap. The game is made fully aware of these things. thus nothing is every too unfair or too gamebreaking. Hope this all helps.

Also, forgot to mention that if a 'black phantom' (other player trying to kill) invades your game, you can summon two white phantoms (other players to help you out) to back you up. Games not quite as ball busting as it's made out to be.
 

HyenaThePirate

New member
Jan 8, 2009
1,412
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AgentNein said:
HyenaThePirate said:
I'm not quite sure I like the PK aspect of a game that is already raising eyebrows with it's difficulty level, but you also mentioned something about it being a "Slow paced" game and that made me curious.
Do you mean it's slow as in not as many enemies because you are exploring an environment trying to solve puzzles and figure out how to survive traps? Or is it that the combat is slow and methodical, like the combat in Conan could sometimes be where you and the enemy circled each other feinting and striking, hoping to gain an advantage in some sort of deadly duel?
Hey Hyena, doesn't look like anyone fielded your question about the PK aspect yet, so I thought I'd help. The only time another player can enter your game is when you're alive. So if you're a soul, no worries! And believe me, you'll be running around as a soul quite abit (it's not that bad, your at half health at first but then you find an item that increases it to 3/4ths health, and you're actually abit stronger). Worst case scenario, someone kills you and you'll just be a soul again. Hell, the predatory ghost has more to lose from entering your game to kill you than you do, because if you kill them, then they will lose a point off their highest stat! You don't lose anything save for your body, and hey no big deal there. Also, the game does let you know when your area has been 'invaded', so you can prepare accordingly.

Honestly dude, I recommend giving this a shot. I can't play this Ninja Gaiden without breaking a controller, but I love this game. The pace is definitely slow, in a very methodical sense. And you wondered before if other player's messages might break the game, well the game is built around this. It's not an after thought, there are traps around, and these traps may kill you without much warning! Luckily, you'll have messages to read (they're not so in depth that they spoil things, but they'll definitely give you a heads up), and bloodstains can't be disregarded either. Most of the time they'll show you a ghostly image of someone getting their ass kicked, but every once in awhile they'll help telegraph a nasty trap. The game is made fully aware of these things. thus nothing is every too unfair or too gamebreaking. Hope this all helps.

Also, forgot to mention that if a 'black phantom' (other player trying to kill) invades your game, you can summon two white phantoms (other players to help you out) to back you up. Games not quite as ball busting as it's made out to be.
Thanks for clearing that up! That SOUNDS more awesome! I do have some other questions..
If a phantom invades my game, can they be killed by accidentally setting off the same traps?
Do they enter as Souls? Or ALive? Is there ever really even a REASON to stay "alive"? It sounds like you are better off just playing through DEAD the whole time. When black phantoms enter the world, can you hide from them or do they essentially spawn right on top of you? do they have to seek you out?

Otherwise, I think all of you may have convinced me to give this game a go, although I'm wondering if it is out in North America because I havent seen many people playing it and I havent seen it at the local game stores. Thanks!
 

AgentNein

New member
Jun 14, 2008
1,476
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HyenaThePirate said:
AgentNein said:
HyenaThePirate said:
I'm not quite sure I like the PK aspect of a game that is already raising eyebrows with it's difficulty level, but you also mentioned something about it being a "Slow paced" game and that made me curious.
Do you mean it's slow as in not as many enemies because you are exploring an environment trying to solve puzzles and figure out how to survive traps? Or is it that the combat is slow and methodical, like the combat in Conan could sometimes be where you and the enemy circled each other feinting and striking, hoping to gain an advantage in some sort of deadly duel?
Hey Hyena, doesn't look like anyone fielded your question about the PK aspect yet, so I thought I'd help. The only time another player can enter your game is when you're alive. So if you're a soul, no worries! And believe me, you'll be running around as a soul quite abit (it's not that bad, your at half health at first but then you find an item that increases it to 3/4ths health, and you're actually abit stronger). Worst case scenario, someone kills you and you'll just be a soul again. Hell, the predatory ghost has more to lose from entering your game to kill you than you do, because if you kill them, then they will lose a point off their highest stat! You don't lose anything save for your body, and hey no big deal there. Also, the game does let you know when your area has been 'invaded', so you can prepare accordingly.

Honestly dude, I recommend giving this a shot. I can't play this Ninja Gaiden without breaking a controller, but I love this game. The pace is definitely slow, in a very methodical sense. And you wondered before if other player's messages might break the game, well the game is built around this. It's not an after thought, there are traps around, and these traps may kill you without much warning! Luckily, you'll have messages to read (they're not so in depth that they spoil things, but they'll definitely give you a heads up), and bloodstains can't be disregarded either. Most of the time they'll show you a ghostly image of someone getting their ass kicked, but every once in awhile they'll help telegraph a nasty trap. The game is made fully aware of these things. thus nothing is every too unfair or too gamebreaking. Hope this all helps.

Also, forgot to mention that if a 'black phantom' (other player trying to kill) invades your game, you can summon two white phantoms (other players to help you out) to back you up. Games not quite as ball busting as it's made out to be.
Thanks for clearing that up! That SOUNDS more awesome! I do have some other questions..
If a phantom invades my game, can they be killed by accidentally setting off the same traps?
Do they enter as Souls? Or ALive? Is there ever really even a REASON to stay "alive"? It sounds like you are better off just playing through DEAD the whole time. When black phantoms enter the world, can you hide from them or do they essentially spawn right on top of you? do they have to seek you out?

Otherwise, I think all of you may have convinced me to give this game a go, although I'm wondering if it is out in North America because I havent seen many people playing it and I havent seen it at the local game stores. Thanks!

Okay, to your first question: I'm honestly not sure. I've never had the nerve to invade somebody elses game and possibly lose one of my hard earned stat points. What I do know is that enemies will ignore them, I'm ASSUMING traps can still kill them (as they kill me all the time when I'm a spirit).

Yes, they enter as a spirit. There whole objective to entering in to your game to kill you is to get back their body. They don't start on top of you, they start I believe at the beginning of the stage, and there's a good chance that you'll be through with the area (or a better chance you'll be dead because of an enemy) before they find you.

The one thing is, when you're alive you make a lot of clicking and clacking noises what with your armor and all while spirits stay silent, thus giving them a bit of a jump on you.

As for the upside to being alive, like I mentioned before you can summon other players as spirits to help you in the game (which you can't do when you're a spirit yourself, and believe me this is helpful when trying to tackle some of these worlds), and if you kill a boss demon with them, they get their bodies back. Also you might enjoy PvP! I know I do from time to time.
 

Dharlas

New member
Nov 15, 2009
1
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0
AgentNein said:
HyenaThePirate said:
AgentNein said:
HyenaThePirate said:
I'm not quite sure I like the PK aspect of a game that is already raising eyebrows with it's difficulty level, but you also mentioned something about it being a "Slow paced" game and that made me curious.
Do you mean it's slow as in not as many enemies because you are exploring an environment trying to solve puzzles and figure out how to survive traps? Or is it that the combat is slow and methodical, like the combat in Conan could sometimes be where you and the enemy circled each other feinting and striking, hoping to gain an advantage in some sort of deadly duel?
Hey Hyena, doesn't look like anyone fielded your question about the PK aspect yet, so I thought I'd help. The only time another player can enter your game is when you're alive. So if you're a soul, no worries! And believe me, you'll be running around as a soul quite abit (it's not that bad, your at half health at first but then you find an item that increases it to 3/4ths health, and you're actually abit stronger). Worst case scenario, someone kills you and you'll just be a soul again. Hell, the predatory ghost has more to lose from entering your game to kill you than you do, because if you kill them, then they will lose a point off their highest stat! You don't lose anything save for your body, and hey no big deal there. Also, the game does let you know when your area has been 'invaded', so you can prepare accordingly.

Honestly dude, I recommend giving this a shot. I can't play this Ninja Gaiden without breaking a controller, but I love this game. The pace is definitely slow, in a very methodical sense. And you wondered before if other player's messages might break the game, well the game is built around this. It's not an after thought, there are traps around, and these traps may kill you without much warning! Luckily, you'll have messages to read (they're not so in depth that they spoil things, but they'll definitely give you a heads up), and bloodstains can't be disregarded either. Most of the time they'll show you a ghostly image of someone getting their ass kicked, but every once in awhile they'll help telegraph a nasty trap. The game is made fully aware of these things. thus nothing is every too unfair or too gamebreaking. Hope this all helps.

Also, forgot to mention that if a 'black phantom' (other player trying to kill) invades your game, you can summon two white phantoms (other players to help you out) to back you up. Games not quite as ball busting as it's made out to be.
Thanks for clearing that up! That SOUNDS more awesome! I do have some other questions..
If a phantom invades my game, can they be killed by accidentally setting off the same traps?
Do they enter as Souls? Or ALive? Is there ever really even a REASON to stay "alive"? It sounds like you are better off just playing through DEAD the whole time. When black phantoms enter the world, can you hide from them or do they essentially spawn right on top of you? do they have to seek you out?

Otherwise, I think all of you may have convinced me to give this game a go, although I'm wondering if it is out in North America because I havent seen many people playing it and I havent seen it at the local game stores. Thanks!

Okay, to your first question: I'm honestly not sure. I've never had the nerve to invade somebody elses game and possibly lose one of my hard earned stat points. What I do know is that enemies will ignore them, I'm ASSUMING traps can still kill them (as they kill me all the time when I'm a spirit).

Yes, they enter as a spirit. There whole objective to entering in to your game to kill you is to get back their body. They don't start on top of you, they start I believe at the beginning of the stage, and there's a good chance that you'll be through with the area (or a better chance you'll be dead because of an enemy) before they find you.

The one thing is, when you're alive you make a lot of clicking and clacking noises what with your armor and all while spirits stay silent, thus giving them a bit of a jump on you.

As for the upside to being alive, like I mentioned before you can summon other players as spirits to help you in the game (which you can't do when you're a spirit yourself, and believe me this is helpful when trying to tackle some of these worlds), and if you kill a boss demon with them, they get their bodies back. Also you might enjoy PvP! I know I do from time to time.
Ok Guys lemme clear some gray area for ya, as well a few of my misconceptions.
First some Blue Phantom info:
1. The way the multiplayer works is that as a Human when you enter a level you see blue marking allowing you to summon another player to come out and help you, so you can pick and choose
2.I never noticed that when summoning Blue Phantoms that you don't get souls, but i never really summon any so i cannot say forsure, but i DO know for a fact that no matter what happens if you are a blue phantom all of the souls you collect are still there, to my knowledge that even counts death by enviroment (falling, traps, etc.) so don't fear death, embrace it....then start again
3.There is currently no proof or disproof that your friends in your friends list have a better chance of thier stone being noticed which is a crying shame i might add, for a game meant for online play they should have a function to warp to a buddies world to help him out.
4.Blue Phantoms still only have half HP unless you use a cling ring which its then 75% HP, but as previously stated as long as you kill things and do your best you still come out on top, and rating only affects how people THINK of how good you are, you could destroy a boss and some ass will still only give you a C so ranks mean nothing.

WARNING!!! Potential Secret Spoiler!!!!

5.Some areas have what i like to call a "Special Event" where if you offer yourself as a Blue Phantom something special will happen, Take area 3-1 for example, on an off chance you offer yourself as a Blue Phantom, you will become a Black one instead, being summoned by some old guy in a stack of chairs, it nets you a new headgear that increases Magic attack but lowers resistance to magic, and is WAY too big, like you can't see over it, and then your trapped in a room waiting for the human to open up the fog so you'll both fight, by the way your health is filled to the max like if your still human and then DOUBLED, yes doubled. Unfortunatly i don't know any other Special Events yet

Now for Black Phantoms:
1.You can ONLY become a black phantom from one way (excluding special events) and that's by killing a black phantom, now it doesn't neccesarily mean another player, it can be an NPC Phantom as well, yes they exist but only in black soul tendancy, and there are 2 kinds, 1 Generic more often than not there WILL be more than one so becareful, not much of a problem, block/parry strike back up fling magic, whatever might kill you in one to 4 hits but thats what a shield is for. 2 I call them "Mimic Phantoms" because they simply mimic a friendly NPC that you might find in that area or entire level (ex. 1-1 to 1-4) so far they only appear in events where you save thier mimic, Saint Urbain is one, but more often than not they only appear during black soul tendancy, but if you are not in -3 soul tendancy (black) then watch out because they WILL kill you without good strategy, AKA RUN LIKE HELL, then pick them off like a sissy school girl. So remember, Generic means that another is around the corner, Mimics are usually around an area for saving a friendly, Ostrava of Boletaria seems to be an exception.
2. When becoming a Black Phantom, i personally have not proven or disproven that you always start in the beginning area of the archstone area you went to, because when i become a black phantom, i always just start invading from the beginning spot, also the armor jingling as a human, gives you as much of an edge as having heavy armor in this game, so unless you like taking damage from not being able to dodge, then none at all, its barely noticable, and if it is then they are either really dense, or congrats, you MAY win, potentially.
3.Black Phantoms are most certantly dead, they are not alive, so either half or 3/4 of thier health, you will have a slight advantage over them, unless they devoted all of thier souls to HP, which seems like a good idea, nearly all the time.
4.Yes they invade to kill you, to become re-born in thier own world, thus making them available for invasion, nothing says revenge like dying then coming back to haunt them, trust me its ALOT of fun when yo get revenge within like 10 min? Oh little helpful hint, you WILL know when they are appearing in your world, you will get a nice little info bar saying "You are being invaded by " in nice black and red border and letters
5.Invading is fun, they will never always see you, and same goes for them, so use your camera to look around suspicious corners or overhangs, because they KNOW your there, just not where and they will kick the crap out of you, just as you are trying to do the same to them, but they can summon thier buddies.
6.Lastly i believe too, to my current knowledge traps do NOTHING, but this has only been tested with level 4-1's arrow traps, you can set them off but they just go through you, BUT falling off a ledge WILL CAUSE YOU TO LOSE A SOUL LEVEL AT RANDOM, so be VERY CAREFUL about that,the requirement goes down to what it was 1 soul level ago, but if you have a weapon that you JUST meed the requirments to use, and then you lose said requirement stat point, congrats, and this strengths Law #3 always have backup equipment, ok i made that last part up. OH! and i have not noticed gaining any souls from killing a human, but rumor is you get one equal to thier soul level, but then again that also may just be with the Red Eye Stone, only one way to obtain but its a spoiler so request for me to put it up or search for yourself.
Thats all i think, but all my characters are either Dharla (for female chars) or Dharlas (for male chars) so if i kill you, come complain on here, cause its like a trophy case to me :D
 

Fearzone

Boyz! Boyz! Boyz!
Dec 3, 2008
1,241
0
0
I live in an alternate dimension of reality where Leonard Nemoy had a goatee and the human race is enslaved by evil aliens forcing us to buy houses with no-down interest-only loans. We have Demon's Souls just like you do, exactly like yours, except for one difference: we can save the game at any point.

I'd like to comment on our version of Demon's Souls.

Graphics: if you like creepy, bleak, and ugly images, then there is plenty to like about Demon's Souls. But for a PS3 exclusive the graphics are sub-par even by 360 port standards. Textures are fair but polygon count is low. Visuals outside our immediate linear pathway are blurry. Animations are leaden, and the rag doll dead bodies are laughable.

Sound: Contributes to the creepy, bleak feeling.

UI: Is taken straight out of the mid-90's, and feels very 16-bit.

Controls: Movements and responsiveness are good. But targeting is clunky, camera positioning can be problematic, and zooming out in open spaces would be nice.

AI: rock bottom. You enter an enemies threat radius and they charge you, and that's it. All enemies spawn in the exact same place every time and do nothing but stand there until you arrive.

Multiplayer: While the "ghosts" contribute to the creepy atmosphere, it doesn't help you much other than maybe alert you to a monster closet ahead. Similarly, all messages boil down to: "Heads up!" or "Please recommend this message so I can get a heal." The text generator approximates but never quite precisely expresses what you mean to say.

I see that in your reality, most game reviewers focus on the difficulty and rarely get past that, not really ever critiquing the games other elements, including its shortcomings. Indeed if there were no save function I imagine it must be frustrating. With a save function, its challenge is moderate but not particularly noteworthy.

In our world, Demon's Souls is an okay-but-outdated RPG, commendable only for its strong sense of style. The absence of a save feature I imagine would make it stand out among videogames, but I'm not convinced that should be regarded as a positive.