Review: Final Fantasy XIII

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Review: Final Fantasy XIII

Final Fantasy XIII stumbles out of the gate, but catches up by the end once it finds its Focus.

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bartholen_v1legacy

A dyslexic man walks into a bra.
Jan 24, 2009
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Nah, good review. I played this a coupla hours at my friend's house and it seemed interesting.

When is some game here going to get some other score than four stars besides No more heroes 2? It would also be better if there were also star halves to give, I've always had trouble with the difference between 3 and 4 stars.
 

Zahri

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Dec 15, 2008
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Great.

Thank you sir, now i want to play it, despite the goofy names. o.o

Seriously, the names make me gag.

Thank you ^^
 

wooty

Vi Britannia
Aug 1, 2009
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Good review, have to say that I agree with most of it, especially the combat and graphics.
Though I also cant wait for FF15 either, playing as such future memorable characters as Hail and Percipitation
 

Danpascooch

Zombie Specialist
Apr 16, 2009
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I gotta say, overall the game is good, but it had one hell of a rocky start, about 2/5 of the way through
Before Palumpolum, after which things seem to come together
I really considered outright quitting the game.
 

BlueHighwind

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"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
 

Virgil

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Nov 17, 2020
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Good review. I haven't quite finished it yet, but I did finally get to choose my own party, hit the open-world section, and opened up the Crystarium so I have actual options. I still wish that I had hit this point about 10 hours earlier though.

Zahri said:
Thank you sir, now i want to play it, despite the goofy names.
The only thing worse than the names is Vanille's voice acting.
 

Chipperz

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Apr 27, 2009
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Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
 

Izerous

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Virgil said:
The only thing worse than the names is Vanille's voice acting.
I have not found myself fond of her voice acting either. It isn't the worst compared to some other games but it feels that it just doesn't fit.

I'm not that far along yet do to my work schedule but I'm quite enjoying it so far.
 

Onyx Oblivion

Borderlands Addict. Again.
Sep 9, 2008
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The soundtrack is great, I especially like the Chocobo Theme from Nautilus. There. That doesn't spoil a damn thing.

 

PedroSteckecilo

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Feb 7, 2008
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I know what they're TRYING to do with these early hours (thankfully I'm past them myself) but I agree with John, it's a ROUGH design choice that doesn't entirely work. Tycho of Penny Arcade puts it well, why are we given bronze characters who turn into gold instead of gold characters who turn into platinum? Why do only Sahz (and in my case Snow as well) start out as likeable?

Anyway, good review, I'm glad that The Escapist's blind prejudice against JRPG's doesn't extend to the actual staff/magazine.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
 

Tonimata

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...Why does the combat system sound A LOT like the one from Tales of Symphonia from what I understood there??

Edit: How long exactly is the game? I'm going to run out of Xbox Live soon, and I want to make sure my money is well invested.
 

Plinglebob

Team Stupid-Face
Nov 11, 2008
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A very good and very fair review. Nothing there I can really disagree with which is very annoying!
 

Onyx Oblivion

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Tonimata said:
...Why does the combat system sound A LOT like the one from Tales of Symphonia from what I understood there??
It's not...I love Tales, and FF could take a few cues from them, but its not.
 

Eagle Est1986

That One Guy
Nov 21, 2007
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Excellent, exactly what I was waiting for Mr Funk. Now I just need to complete the God Of War Collection and God Of War III, then it's FFXIII for me, I'm looking forward to it more now. And with a bit of luck I'll find it on the cheap somewhere.
 

Chipperz

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John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
Really? How did you beat...

The second Proud Clad? Even with two healers (Lightning and Vanille) in the party and spamming potions with a sentinel (Fang, also my Leader), I just can't heal enough damage when it does the "Moon Beam" or "Limiters Deactivated" abilities.

I've tried summoning Bahamut and Odin as well as bashing out Renews and not summoning, and I don't want to use Vanille as leader. Partly because I want to keep an AI healer and partly because I have a feeling that hearing Hecathanacatathaciticathier in her voice might break my brain.

Time's a factor, I've only rented it until 10 tonight (so that's, like, 7 hours...)
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Chipperz said:
John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
Really? How did you beat...

The second Proud Clad? Even with two healers (Lightning and Vanille) in the party and spamming potions with a sentinel (Fang, also my Leader), I just can't heal enough damage when it does the "Moon Beam" or "Limiters Deactivated" abilities.

I've tried summoning Bahamut and Odin as well as bashing out Renews and not summoning, and I don't want to use Vanille as leader. Partly because I want to keep an AI healer and partly because I have a feeling that hearing Hecathanacatathaciticathier in her voice might break my brain.

Time's a factor, I've only rented it until 10 tonight (so that's, like, 7 hours...)
Stick Sazh or Hope in your party somewhere (if you've leveled Sazh's SYN enough so that you have Protect and Shell, use him for his offensive buffs and higher HP, otherwise take Hope), and try to keep the buffs up at all time. I'd go with Sazh/Vanille/Lightning, make a SYN/SAB/MED or SYN/MED/MED Paradigm, just do that first.

Buffs and debuffs help a *ton* in this game. You'll need them against the final boss, too.

Also, getting Sazh to take at least one level in Medic and Lightning to take a level in Sentinel/Synergist (just to get Protect and Shell) will help you heavily in the final dungeon.
 

Chipperz

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John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
Really? How did you beat...

The second Proud Clad? Even with two healers (Lightning and Vanille) in the party and spamming potions with a sentinel (Fang, also my Leader), I just can't heal enough damage when it does the "Moon Beam" or "Limiters Deactivated" abilities.

I've tried summoning Bahamut and Odin as well as bashing out Renews and not summoning, and I don't want to use Vanille as leader. Partly because I want to keep an AI healer and partly because I have a feeling that hearing Hecathanacatathaciticathier in her voice might break my brain.

Time's a factor, I've only rented it until 10 tonight (so that's, like, 7 hours...)
Stick Sazh or Hope in your party somewhere (if you've leveled Sazh's SYN enough so that you have Protect and Shell, use him for his offensive buffs and higher HP, otherwise take Hope), and try to keep the buffs up at all time. I'd go with Sazh/Vanille/Lightning, make a SYN/SAB/MED or SYN/MED/MED Paradigm, just do that first.

Buffs and debuffs help a *ton* in this game. You'll need them against the final boss, too.

Also, getting Sazh to take at least one level in Medic and Lightning to take a level in Sentinel/Synergist (just to get Protect and Shell) will help you heavily in the final dungeon.
Ahh OK, cool, I'll try that!

I've been playing my characters pretty much as a steamroller so far - there hasn't been anything my COM/RAV/RAV can't beat with an occaional switch to COM/RAV/MED. I thought I'd broken the game at one point when one of the boss fights* took half the Target Time :p

First Barthamandalus fight. I genuinely thought he was going to trigger another event and I'd have to fight him again.
 

_Serendipity_

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Nice review. I've been on the fence about dropping the cash (not to say the time...) for this for the past week and I think you just tipped me over.

Now all I have to do is finish my dissertation, then I think I'll kill a weekend in JRPG bliss.
 

Tornik

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Mar 4, 2010
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Best review of FFXII I've seen/read yet - very nice.

'Humidity and Chance of Rain' had me cracking up also :D
 

John Funk

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Dec 20, 2005
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Chipperz said:
John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
Really? How did you beat...

The second Proud Clad? Even with two healers (Lightning and Vanille) in the party and spamming potions with a sentinel (Fang, also my Leader), I just can't heal enough damage when it does the "Moon Beam" or "Limiters Deactivated" abilities.

I've tried summoning Bahamut and Odin as well as bashing out Renews and not summoning, and I don't want to use Vanille as leader. Partly because I want to keep an AI healer and partly because I have a feeling that hearing Hecathanacatathaciticathier in her voice might break my brain.

Time's a factor, I've only rented it until 10 tonight (so that's, like, 7 hours...)
Stick Sazh or Hope in your party somewhere (if you've leveled Sazh's SYN enough so that you have Protect and Shell, use him for his offensive buffs and higher HP, otherwise take Hope), and try to keep the buffs up at all time. I'd go with Sazh/Vanille/Lightning, make a SYN/SAB/MED or SYN/MED/MED Paradigm, just do that first.

Buffs and debuffs help a *ton* in this game. You'll need them against the final boss, too.

Also, getting Sazh to take at least one level in Medic and Lightning to take a level in Sentinel/Synergist (just to get Protect and Shell) will help you heavily in the final dungeon.
Ahh OK, cool, I'll try that!

I've been playing my characters pretty much as a steamroller so far - there hasn't been anything my COM/RAV/RAV can't beat with an occaional switch to COM/RAV/MED. I thought I'd broken the game at one point when one of the boss fights* took half the Target Time :p

First Barthamandalus fight. I genuinely thought he was going to trigger another event and I'd have to fight him again.
Yeah, fights take longer but they're also safer.

Buffs and debuffs can actually REALLY boost your damage output/survivability. On the final bosses, stick DeProtect and DeShell on them, with Faith/Bravery/Haste/Protect/Shell/Vigilance on your guys? RAV/RAV/RAV gets them staggered in no time, then COM/RAV/COM (that was my setup with Light/Vanille/Sazh, respectively) once they're staggered to dish out the pain? It does a *ton* of damage. Then SEN/MED/MED if there's anything big incoming, MED/MED/MED to heal up, and MED/SAB/SYN or RAV/SAB/SYN to rebuff anything that's fallen off. That was pretty much my entire battle plan for the last few bosses.
 

Onyx Oblivion

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PedroSteckecilo said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Susan Arendt said:
"Humidity and Chance of Rain"

*giggle*
I can't wait for Overcast and Light Flurries.
Don't joke about that, Flurry seems like a legitimate possibility and Square might be watching!
What about Solar Flare?

Actually, I LIKE that name...
 

PedroSteckecilo

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Feb 7, 2008
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Onyx Oblivion said:
PedroSteckecilo said:
Onyx Oblivion said:
Susan Arendt said:
"Humidity and Chance of Rain"

*giggle*
I can't wait for Overcast and Light Flurries.
Don't joke about that, Flurry seems like a legitimate possibility and Square might be watching!
What about Solar Flare?

Actually, I LIKE that name...
Knowing Square's record it would probably be Flare Solar or something slightly less obvious than Solar Flare.
 

Tarrker

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Zahri said:
Seriously, the names make me gag.
Yeah, I half suspect that this is the result of some international translator going "Hmmmm? Lightning? How will that sound in english? Thunder maybe? No. He's a character in Fable. Lightning it is!". This is a complete guess, though. I do, however, know things that sound tough and awesome in one language rarely sound as cool in another.

Great review, tho. Never disappointed by Escapist reviews. Even Yahtzee seems to notice the same flaws in games that I do.
 

Proteus214

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Jul 31, 2009
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Very accurate review. Pretty much matches what my friends and I are experiencing as we're playing through it.
 

Jared

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Jul 14, 2009
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Seems fairly accurate.

I really enjoyed it, awesome game even if it did take some time to get to its point.
 

Jaranja

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BlueHighwind said:
"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
 

Slycne

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Feb 19, 2006
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Jaranja said:
BlueHighwind said:
"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
Because linearity isn't a binary yes or no, there is no denying that Final Fantasy XIII level of linearity(at least for the first half) might turn off some fans of previous Final Fantasy games. Yes you are always playing the same story with the same characters, but in previous iterations you had the freedom to wander around and explore the world to various degrees.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Well I like the game but it certainly gives a WHOLE new meaning to the term linear... I mean the only way the game could be any more linear were if it were a line... (they cant all be winners) But in all seriousness the loss of an explorable world is kinda a game killer in a RPG...

I mean sure once you get to the open part it does make the game about 1 million times more enjoyable but the open part is still pretty damn small and short.. especially given its the only open world part of the entire game...

Oh and i agree with earlier posters Vanille's voice acting is pretty bad, its like she can't decide what accent she is supposed to be doing, at times she sounds English at others Australian and at some points she sounds sorta American...

The combat system... well yeah...

i personally hate it, not because its difficult (quite the opposite) but because its so restrictive. Even at the end of the game your characters only have about 3 abilities for each role, so its spam city. Oh and it IS spam city because the monsters have ridiculously high healths... the only purpose i can see of this is to make the game longer by dragging battles out... I mean yeah i want strong monsters to fight but whats the point of fighting a 1.5 million health monster around every corner... making every battle like 2 or 3 minutes (or according to the time thingie in the game 5 or 6). ON the note of the time thing has anyone ever actually gone OVER the time suggested, the time seems to be ridiculously over the top for each battle. and probably most importantly wth happened to the WHOLE team has to be wiped out to die.... I mean I remember times in RPG youth where the death of your main character in a battle would lose the battle but i thought we were past this... In all seriousness though what is a feasible reason for this (not game mechanics wise because its kinda obvious that if your main character dies you would have to control someone else and heaven forbid you could control more than one character in battle) do your ai characters store their brains in the main character in battle so when s/he dies they suddenly lose the ability to heal them..

I personally feel like the entire game has been dumbed down for whatever reason... I mean a 3 yr old could probably navigate the story by holding down the forwards arrow for long enough..

Okay i feel i may have gotten carried away so i'll summarise for those who DONT want to read blocks of text

Pluses

+story (well sort of anyway its not super but its not terrible)

+the open world part (what little there is)

Minuses

-LINEAR

-restrictive *auto* battle combat system (why not make ALL the battles automatic and determined by your skills/ attributes, that will make it even better!! {ps if you cant sense sarcasm the previous sentence is dripping it})

-the battle AI is SLIGHTLY retarded especially the medic "oh your hurt like 1% into yellow so i'll heal you once and ignore the fact that you have about 4 debuffs on you that will mean instant death from a single hit" Yes removing debuffs should be the lowest priority but not lower than healing my hangnail...

-LINEAR (i really wish i could post that bigger)

-Pointlessly long battles with normal common creatures... (spend half your battles sitting there watching your guys spam your most powerful attacks for like 40 seconds to take off 1% of the health of the baby duckling. No need to change paradigms or anything in most battles just sit there and hit x every 5 or 6 seconds

-Main character KO kills entire party, who are too retarded (apparently) to cast the raise spell when your not around to coddle them

-LINEAR

-Vanille's voice acting

-Names of the characters... Lightning, Snow, Vanille, Fang, Hope, Sahz... sorry but 2 'elemental names', a virtue, a flavour of ice cream (yeah i know its not but close enough), a terrible sickness and a tooth arent quite the best names you could have used... (and if anyone points our squall and cloud ill kick you, it seems that sky and cloud related names sound cool)
 

NamesAreHardToPick

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In terms of initial characters I found Sazh and Snow likeable right from the start for their sense of humor... hated Hope, Vanille, and especially Lightning. The thing about Snow, Hope, and Vanille is that they're clearly and seriously flawed and in need of change. It a bitter pill at first but the whole point is how awesome it is when they turn from negative characters to positive ones, having "good" characters become "more good" just isn't the same kind of uplifting experience as seeing the guys who get off to a false start in FF13 get their crap together. Also it might just be me but even though Vanille's cheer is annoying at first she can be cool in the more melodramatic moments as the story starts moving.

Personally I don't mind the straight-line approach to the game design... you're clearly playing a tactics/fighting game to get from cutscene to cutscene, but it's intense and fun and challenging and every story chapter is nice payoff for all the fun you had getting there. It's like carrot-and-stick, only with another carrot instead of the stick.
 

Jaranja

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Slycne said:
Jaranja said:
BlueHighwind said:
"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
Because linearity isn't a binary yes or no, there is no denying that Final Fantasy XIII level of linearity(at least for the first half) might turn off some fans of previous Final Fantasy games. Yes you are always playing the same story with the same characters, but in previous iterations you had the freedom to wander around and explore the world to various degrees.
I haven't yet finished it but, doesn't it have the part near the end of the game where you can do various side missions, get ultimate weapons or anything like that?
 

John Funk

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Dec 20, 2005
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Hurricane and Sleet will be in 15. Alongside Choco, Molar, and Despair.
 

Zombie Nixon

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I was with you until you called the Leona Lewis song stellar.

Terrible, horrible, awful review. How do you sleep at night?
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Zombie Nixon said:
I was with you until you called the Leona Lewis song stellar.

Terrible, horrible, awful review. How do you sleep at night?
I didn't say the Leona Lewis song was stellar. The soundtrack was stellar overall, even taking into account the Leona Lewis song :p
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Ghostwise said:
Hurricane and Sleet will be in 15. Alongside Choco, Molar, and Despair.
Oh and watch out for Tropical Storm!! (This is a reference to Nuklearpower.com's 8-bit theatre)

I wouldnt call the soundtrack stellar.. it's okay but very annoying after your been in the area for more than about 5 minutes
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Dakeyras-Way said:
Ghostwise said:
Hurricane and Sleet will be in 15. Alongside Choco, Molar, and Despair.
Oh and watch out for Tropical Storm!! (This is a reference to Nuklearpower.com's 8-bit theatre)

I wouldnt call the soundtrack stellar.. it's okay but very annoying after your been in the area for more than about 5 minutes
Yeah....to be honest not a single tune in the game is memorable whatsoever. I couldn't hum a single tune off the entire soundtrack which is a little odd for a FF title if you ask me. It just all seems so generic.
 

Slycne

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Feb 19, 2006
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Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
And if linearity was a black and white issue your statement might have merit. This might come as a surprising reveal, but a grey scale exists between total freedom and walking down a a single hallway. XIII leans towards the single hallway, where as in the past Final Fantasy games have existed somewhere in the center leaning towards linear. If you can't see that then I would recommend examining the thickness of the your own skull first.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
This game is extremely linear even by Final Fantasy standards. Get that through yours. :p

Even in FFX, arguably the most linear other than this, you could still explore; there were still towns, there were still different pathways to go down.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Well yeah they are linear story wise but most of them at least have explorable areas and the option to follow the story or do something else like explore that creepy building over there... the first 15-20 hours of the game there is literally a path ahead of you with the occasional fork which in most cases joins back on in about 30 meters allowing you to ambush a powerful group of enemies...

In FF7,8,9,10,12 well actually in pretty much all FF games you explore towns and go through different rooms and find secret areas all over the place... in this game there are about 3 or 4 optional areas total... the rest of the areas are straight line linear pathways to the next cutscene. I actually don't remember ever exploring anywhere except the open area part... which is as mentioned previously about 15-20 hours in and not very large anyway..
 

Furrama

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Besides Cloud and Lightning, I don't remember anyone else being named after weather effects... Snow doesn't count, because he licky boom boom down and all of that. And then you take into account that Lighting was designed by the staff to be a female Cloud then it makes sense.
 

Sephychu

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Meh, if pacing's the only massive issue, I'm down with that. FF VII had a similar 20 hour startup sequence, but if that's the only issue, then I'm gonna love this game.

Great review.
 

Furrama

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John Funk said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
This game is extremely linear even by Final Fantasy standards. Get that through yours. :p

Even in FFX, arguably the most linear other than this, you could still explore; there were still towns, there were still different pathways to go down.
And then there was X-2.

Oh GAWD that was horrible, and I chalk a pretty hefty hunk of it up to it being not linear enough. So far I'm liking X more, but I'm not through the halfway point with XIII yet, so we'll see.

I'm also waiting for them to turn off the real time battle system on these games again. I like having more control in that regard- the story can be a strait as a board for all I care.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Furrama said:
Besides Cloud and Lightning, I don't remember anyone else being named after weather effects... Snow doesn't count, because he licky boom boom down and all of that. And then you take into account that Lighting was designed by the staff to be a female Cloud then it makes sense.
Squall for one
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Furrama said:
I'm also waiting for them to turn off the real time battle system on these games again. I like having more control in that regard- the story can be a strait as a board for all I care.
It's not the Real-timeness that needs to be turned off its allowing you to actually do more than spam attack... I mean the RTB in FF VII-X were pretty good for control... (ie you could actually choose more than auto-attack)
 

sivlin

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I'm about 30 hours in and I've actually enjoyed almost every bit of the game so far. The linear portion doesn't hurt the game in the least IMO seeing as how Final Fantasy is played for its story first and foremost (Or so I would assume as thats what I always loved about the series). Not too far into the non-linear section but it seems pretty awesome as well, and I'm quite excited that some of the regular mobs actually require some thought to kill (i.e, Com/Rav/Rav the entire fight will get you killed). So far my only real gripe about the game is that if your main character dies you have to retry :/. It should wait till all of your characters are dead.
 

Warachia

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Slycne said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
And if linearity was a black and white issue your statement might have merit. This might come as a surprising reveal, but a grey scale exists between total freedom and walking down a a single hallway. XIII leans towards the single hallway, where as in the past Final Fantasy games have existed somewhere in the center leaning towards linear. If you can't see that then I would recommend examining the thickness of the your own skull first.
I find it extremely sad that many cannot examine the old to understand the new. If you look at older FF games, (the ones I'm using are 1,2,4,5,7, and 9) they are just as linear, you can wander off the path to a hidden treasure chest, but that is all that is waiting for you. you cannot influence anything, aside from names, equipment and combat, and all of these ff games have mainly only 1 corridor you follow through to make it to the end of the stage. Those are past FF games, and I would like to know what you werwe expecting if not more of the same.

By the way, I do like FF games, but mainly for their storytelling and enviroments.
 

sivlin

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Dakeyras-Way said:
Furrama said:
Besides Cloud and Lightning, I don't remember anyone else being named after weather effects... Snow doesn't count, because he licky boom boom down and all of that. And then you take into account that Lighting was designed by the staff to be a female Cloud then it makes sense.
Squall for one
Tidus for another kinda... ya know.. tide, water.
 

Furrama

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Dakeyras-Way said:
Furrama said:
Besides Cloud and Lightning, I don't remember anyone else being named after weather effects... Snow doesn't count, because he licky boom boom down and all of that. And then you take into account that Lighting was designed by the staff to be a female Cloud then it makes sense.
Squall for one
Oh yeah, Squall. For some reason I keep thinking that's a ground bird :D
 

PedroSteckecilo

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John Funk said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
This game is extremely linear even by Final Fantasy standards. Get that through yours. :p

Even in FFX, arguably the most linear other than this, you could still explore; there were still towns, there were still different pathways to go down.
When most of the dungeons are quite literally LINES I think calling the game "Agressively Linear" is fair.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Warachia said:
Slycne said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
And if linearity was a black and white issue your statement might have merit. This might come as a surprising reveal, but a grey scale exists between total freedom and walking down a a single hallway. XIII leans towards the single hallway, where as in the past Final Fantasy games have existed somewhere in the center leaning towards linear. If you can't see that then I would recommend examining the thickness of the your own skull first.
I find it extremely sad that many cannot examine the old to understand the new. If you look at older FF games, (the ones I'm using are 1,2,4,5,7, and 9) they are just as linear, you can wander off the path to a hidden treasure chest, but that is all that is waiting for you. you cannot influence anything, aside from names, equipment and combat, and all of these ff games have mainly only 1 corridor you follow through to make it to the end of the stage. Those are past FF games, and I would like to know what you werwe expecting if not more of the same.

By the way, I do like FF games, but mainly for their storytelling and enviroments.
*Jaw drops* BUH???

FFVII actually had a free world which you could run around and go into any kind of building that you could see (well just about) i mean you could go into towns and wander around for quite a while..

And as for your other examples they too had free worlds (ie the world map) where you could wander to your hearts desire.. If you wanted to walk all the way back to the first town for whatever reason you could!
 

Warachia

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John Funk said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
This game is extremely linear even by Final Fantasy standards. Get that through yours. :p

Even in FFX, arguably the most linear other than this, you could still explore; there were still towns, there were still different pathways to go down.
but exploration was all you could do, even in past games you finished a crypt/level/dungeon/palace by following one corridor down one path, with only extra monster encounters and chests for you if you left the path. Sort of like the game The Path. You could not influence the story, change characters, or find alternate routes around game scenarios (other than there is a boulder in the way). This is why I do not understand why people expect FF13 to be anything BUT linear, and i do apologize if all you meant was that you wanted some form of exploration and I misheard.
 

Chipperz

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John Funk said:
Yeah, fights take longer but they're also safer.

Buffs and debuffs can actually REALLY boost your damage output/survivability. On the final bosses, stick DeProtect and DeShell on them, with Faith/Bravery/Haste/Protect/Shell/Vigilance on your guys? RAV/RAV/RAV gets them staggered in no time, then COM/RAV/COM (that was my setup with Light/Vanille/Sazh, respectively) once they're staggered to dish out the pain? It does a *ton* of damage. Then SEN/MED/MED if there's anything big incoming, MED/MED/MED to heal up, and MED/SAB/SYN or RAV/SAB/SYN to rebuff anything that's fallen off. That was pretty much my entire battle plan for the last few bosses.
Thing is, they're not that much longer. I've got a new set up of Sazh/Vanille/Lightning and my two main Paradigms now are my all-time favourite RAV/RAV/COM and SYN/MED/MED. I also have a SYN/SAB/COM and SYN/SAB/MED for bosses, but against the basic minions, I find the Saboteur a little pointless - if I get most enemies to their Stagger point, Lightning uses Launch and I can juggle them by staggering Sazh and Vanille's attacks to keep them in the air so they can't do any damage to me.

Of course, this also works on most bosses, but it's nice to have the debuffs in case they can fly :p
 

Warachia

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Dakeyras-Way said:
Warachia said:
Slycne said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
And if linearity was a black and white issue your statement might have merit. This might come as a surprising reveal, but a grey scale exists between total freedom and walking down a a single hallway. XIII leans towards the single hallway, where as in the past Final Fantasy games have existed somewhere in the center leaning towards linear. If you can't see that then I would recommend examining the thickness of the your own skull first.
I find it extremely sad that many cannot examine the old to understand the new. If you look at older FF games, (the ones I'm using are 1,2,4,5,7, and 9) they are just as linear, you can wander off the path to a hidden treasure chest, but that is all that is waiting for you. you cannot influence anything, aside from names, equipment and combat, and all of these ff games have mainly only 1 corridor you follow through to make it to the end of the stage. Those are past FF games, and I would like to know what you werwe expecting if not more of the same.

By the way, I do like FF games, but mainly for their storytelling and enviroments.
*Jaw drops* BUH???

FFVII actually had a free world which you could run around and go into any kind of building that you could see (well just about) i mean you could go into towns and wander around for quite a while..

And as for your other examples they too had free worlds (ie the world map) where you could wander to your hearts desire.. If you wanted to walk all the way back to the first town for whatever reason you could!
Did running back to the first town affect story, characters, plot, or anything else? Did the extra exploration change any of the events that happened or were going to happen? If you can explore in a game, it doesn't mean that it doesn't have any linearity, it just means you press a fictional pause button while you run around doing things that have no effect on anything else. Every single event that could happen will happen regardless of what you do to try and stop it.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Warachia said:
John Funk said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
This game is extremely linear even by Final Fantasy standards. Get that through yours. :p

Even in FFX, arguably the most linear other than this, you could still explore; there were still towns, there were still different pathways to go down.
but exploration was all you could do, even in past games you finished a crypt/level/dungeon/palace by following one corridor down one path, with only extra monster encounters and chests for you if you left the path. Sort of like the game The Path. You could not influence the story, change characters, or find alternate routes around game scenarios (other than there is a boulder in the way). This is why I do not understand why people expect FF13 to be anything BUT linear, and i do apologize if all you meant was that you wanted some form of exploration and I misheard.
Okay now i understand what you mean... yes you are right most of the dungeons/crypt/levels or whatever were linear but they were linear events in a explorable world.. you could go here or there... in this game its basically linear event after linear event with no choice as to whether you want to continue the storyline and explore for a while... (except quite late in the game and the area to explore is rather small in comparison to some other FF games)
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
Warachia said:
Slycne said:
Warachia said:
ALL FF GAMES ARE LINEAR. Get that through your thick skulls.
And if linearity was a black and white issue your statement might have merit. This might come as a surprising reveal, but a grey scale exists between total freedom and walking down a a single hallway. XIII leans towards the single hallway, where as in the past Final Fantasy games have existed somewhere in the center leaning towards linear. If you can't see that then I would recommend examining the thickness of the your own skull first.
I find it extremely sad that many cannot examine the old to understand the new. If you look at older FF games, (the ones I'm using are 1,2,4,5,7, and 9) they are just as linear, you can wander off the path to a hidden treasure chest, but that is all that is waiting for you. you cannot influence anything, aside from names, equipment and combat, and all of these ff games have mainly only 1 corridor you follow through to make it to the end of the stage. Those are past FF games, and I would like to know what you werwe expecting if not more of the same.

By the way, I do like FF games, but mainly for their storytelling and enviroments.
*Jaw drops* BUH???

FFVII actually had a free world which you could run around and go into any kind of building that you could see (well just about) i mean you could go into towns and wander around for quite a while..

And as for your other examples they too had free worlds (ie the world map) where you could wander to your hearts desire.. If you wanted to walk all the way back to the first town for whatever reason you could!
Did running back to the first town affect story, characters, plot, or anything else? Did the extra exploration change any of the events that happened or were going to happen? If you can explore in a game, it doesn't mean that it doesn't have any linearity, it just means you press a fictional pause button while you run around doing things that have no effect on anything else. Every single event that could happen will happen regardless of what you do to try and stop it.
Well to put it simply Yes... In VII for example quite a few of the side quests gave you more information about your characters, gave them new abilities or spells. While yes you had little choice that would affect later events there were some... such as the date scene in FF VII where depending upon which characters you talked to throughout the game you could end up going on a date with someone other than Aeris
 

era81

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danpascooch said:
I gotta say, overall the game is good, but it had one hell of a rocky start, about 2/5 of the way through
Before Palumpolum, after which things seem to come together
I really considered outright quitting the game.
Everyone I talk to back home has been saying the same thing they also say they are glad they stuck with it.
 

Warachia

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Dakeyras-Way said:
Okay now i understand what you mean... yes you are right most of the dungeons/crypt/levels or whatever were linear but they were linear events in a explorable world.. you could go here or there... in this game its basically linear event after linear event with no choice as to whether you want to continue the storyline and explore for a while... (except quite late in the game and the area to explore is rather small in comparison to some other FF games)
funny, I never put in a final fantasy game, because I wanted exploration, I put in FF games for their storytelling, and enviroments (and in very rare cases, characters). I never considered not bieng able to explore a killer, even if it does suck a lot, and if you arrived for anything other than story then it's time to reevaluate what you want in an experience, because I can flat out garuntee that there is better combat and exploration on this console genaration (including but not limited to: Star ocean: the last hope, Enchanted Arms, Infinite Undiscovery, and Tales of Vesparia).
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Bland contrived game with poor implementations...at least FF12 had something in the level layouts.. and FFX had the sphere grid...this has nothing...its a Frankenstein of a a game.... its no wonder its done poorly in japan....

edit
If I played a game for stories I'd watch a movie instead.....
/curmudgeon
 

Tonimata

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Onyx Oblivion said:
Tonimata said:
...Why does the combat system sound A LOT like the one from Tales of Symphonia from what I understood there??
It's not...I love Tales, and FF could take a few cues from them, but its not.
Well now I'm interested... and poor...
Guess I'm going to have to stick to replaying Eternal Sonata for the umpteenth time :(
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
Okay now i understand what you mean... yes you are right most of the dungeons/crypt/levels or whatever were linear but they were linear events in a explorable world.. you could go here or there... in this game its basically linear event after linear event with no choice as to whether you want to continue the storyline and explore for a while... (except quite late in the game and the area to explore is rather small in comparison to some other FF games)
funny, I never put in a final fantasy game, because I wanted exploration, I put in FF games for their storytelling, and enviroments (and in very rare cases, characters). I never considered not bieng able to explore a killer, even if it does suck a lot, and if you arrived for anything other than story then it's time to reevaluate what you want in an experience, because I can flat out garuntee that there is better combat and exploration on this console genaration (including but not limited to: Star ocean: the last hope, Enchanted Arms, Infinite Undiscovery, and Tales of Vesparia).
... I'm not saying that I necessarily dislike the storytelling or even the game I'm just saying you could finish the entire game by holding forwards and tapping x...
 

John Funk

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blipblop said:
i might be wrong, but did you steal GT review line by line at some places???
Uh, you're very wrong. I didn't even know GT *did* reviews. Hell, I've avoided most reviews of the game altogether since I didn't want my opinion to be shaped by them.

Plagiarism is a very serious charge, so I'd appreciate if you didn't insult me by suggesting that :/
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Slycne said:
Ya but with 4(and ,5,7,8,9) you get a ever expanding world then a bit of the moon with X,anything bioware,XIII and even 12(to a small degree) you get a static on the rails world that should be far to simplistic for today's supposedly higher standards...

John Funk said:
blipblop said:
i might be wrong, but did you steal GT review line by line at some places???
Uh, you're very wrong. I didn't even know GT *did* reviews. Hell, I've avoided most reviews of the game altogether since I didn't want my opinion to be shaped by them.

Plagiarism is a very serious charge, so I'd appreciate if you didn't insult me by suggesting that :/
Plagiarism = "There, I went and stole your words, too. Now you no longer have those words because I have stolen them from you. If I had infringed the copyright of your words you'd still have them, I'd just be benefiting from them as well, but because I stole them you can no longer have them."

:p
 

John Funk

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ZippyDSMlee said:
Slycne said:
Ya but with 4(and ,5,7,8,9) you get a ever expanding world then a bit of the moon with X,anything bioware,XIII and even 12(to a small degree) you get a static on the rails world that should be far to simplistic for today's supposedly higher standards...
But here's the thing; linearity isn't inherently a bad choice. Today's "higher standards" has nothing to do with an "on-rails" world. Not every game has to be open-ended; execution can make all the difference in the world.
 

Warachia

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Dakeyras-Way said:
Well to put it simply Yes... In VII for example quite a few of the side quests gave you more information about your characters, gave them new abilities or spells. While yes you had little choice that would affect later events there were some... such as the date scene in FF VII where depending upon which characters you talked to throughout the game you could end up going on a date with someone other than Aeris
Yes, you can get extra abilities and items, but they had no effect on the game (aside from making it easier), unless you were a romantic or a completionist there was no point in the date scene, as all characters seemed to forget about it about 30 seconds after it was over, and aside from getting extra weapons/items to hopefully use against the final boss making the fight too easy (20+ megalixers) everybody THOUGHT it would be nice to return to this area later, did you? Maybe, maybe not. I know I didn't. If you did, you did only to get the aforementioned items before leaving the place behind forever. In a really special scenario, you treasure a city, leave, thinking how nice it would be to come back, and then have the city destroyed, while you remember fond memories of being there. In my opinion it degrades the experience when you return and the city is now boring and insipid with no interesting events.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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John Funk said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
Slycne said:
Ya but with 4(and ,5,7,8,9) you get a ever expanding world then a bit of the moon with X,anything bioware,XIII and even 12(to a small degree) you get a static on the rails world that should be far to simplistic for today's supposedly higher standards...
But here's the thing; linearity isn't inherently a bad choice. Today's "higher standards" has nothing to do with an "on-rails" world. Not every game has to be open-ended; execution can make all the difference in the world.
Open ended < expanding crawl(for lack of a better word on my end) don't confuse the pathing emphasis of Oblivion/FO3 or House of the dead with a more progressively polished and designed approach to pathing. One eases you into a fake open ended world while the other forces you on the rails at gun point. (oh god my grammar is failing me).

On the rails is simple,effective from a design standpoint and cheaper to produce thus why we get shorter and shorter hallway games from the majority of the mainstream producers...........

Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
Well to put it simply Yes... In VII for example quite a few of the side quests gave you more information about your characters, gave them new abilities or spells. While yes you had little choice that would affect later events there were some... such as the date scene in FF VII where depending upon which characters you talked to throughout the game you could end up going on a date with someone other than Aeris
Yes, you can get extra abilities and items, but they had no effect on the game (aside from making it easier), unless you were a romantic or a completionist there was no point in the date scene, as all characters seemed to forget about it about 30 seconds after it was over, and aside from getting extra weapons/items to hopefully use against the final boss making the fight too easy (20+ megalixers) everybody THOUGHT it would be nice to return to this area later, did you? Maybe, maybe not. I know I didn't. If you did, you did only to get the aforementioned items before leaving the place behind forever. In a really special scenario, you treasure a city, leave, thinking how nice it would be to come back, and then have the city destroyed, while you remember fond memories of being there. In my opinion it degrades the experience when you return and the city is now boring and insipid with no interesting events.
I'd rather have the choice to go there........ more options people...not less...... get it right already.....
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
Well to put it simply Yes... In VII for example quite a few of the side quests gave you more information about your characters, gave them new abilities or spells. While yes you had little choice that would affect later events there were some... such as the date scene in FF VII where depending upon which characters you talked to throughout the game you could end up going on a date with someone other than Aeris
Yes, you can get extra abilities and items, but they had no effect on the game (aside from making it easier), unless you were a romantic or a completionist there was no point in the date scene, as all characters seemed to forget about it about 30 seconds after it was over, and aside from getting extra weapons/items to hopefully use against the final boss making the fight too easy (20+ megalixers) everybody THOUGHT it would be nice to return to this area later, did you? Maybe, maybe not. I know I didn't. If you did, you did only to get the aforementioned items before leaving the place behind forever. In a really special scenario, you treasure a city, leave, thinking how nice it would be to come back, and then have the city destroyed, while you remember fond memories of being there. In my opinion it degrades the experience when you return and the city is now boring and insipid with no interesting events.
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Dakeyras-Way said:
Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
Well to put it simply Yes... In VII for example quite a few of the side quests gave you more information about your characters, gave them new abilities or spells. While yes you had little choice that would affect later events there were some... such as the date scene in FF VII where depending upon which characters you talked to throughout the game you could end up going on a date with someone other than Aeris
Yes, you can get extra abilities and items, but they had no effect on the game (aside from making it easier), unless you were a romantic or a completionist there was no point in the date scene, as all characters seemed to forget about it about 30 seconds after it was over, and aside from getting extra weapons/items to hopefully use against the final boss making the fight too easy (20+ megalixers) everybody THOUGHT it would be nice to return to this area later, did you? Maybe, maybe not. I know I didn't. If you did, you did only to get the aforementioned items before leaving the place behind forever. In a really special scenario, you treasure a city, leave, thinking how nice it would be to come back, and then have the city destroyed, while you remember fond memories of being there. In my opinion it degrades the experience when you return and the city is now boring and insipid with no interesting events.
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
Ya to many devs are making games HIGHLY linear when they do not need to be.......... games are not film you do not have to marginalize everything in directing.....
 

blipblop

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John Funk said:
blipblop said:
i might be wrong, but did you steal GT review line by line at some places???
Uh, you're very wrong. I didn't even know GT *did* reviews. Hell, I've avoided most reviews of the game altogether since I didn't want my opinion to be shaped by them.

Plagiarism is a very serious charge, so I'd appreciate if you didn't insult me by suggesting that :/
yeah didn´t mean to insult you funk. I did just ask a question.
 

NamesAreHardToPick

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You know, I was thinking "I've seen this sort of game before".

I just put my finger on it... FF13 has old-school brawler level design instead of dungeon-crawl. Think about Double Dragon or River City Ransom. Now add Final Fantasy menu-based combat and cutscenes. Voila. I always thought there was something about it that came from arcade games.

The only point in having characters explore a dungeon is if you're going to make a repetitive resource-management game out of it. Like "how much can I explore before we run low on potions and have to run back?" and "how many times do we have to walk back into this damned dungeon before we find the boss fight and the MacGuffin and/or exit." That's fun on its own, but it waters down the moment-to-moment challenges in favor of making you decide if you can or can't afford to have a look around one more corner before running back to town. Also, it's the last thing you want in a cinematic game like FF13 because you don't want the story going cold for hours between cutscenes.
 

Casual Shinji

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John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
How the hell were you able to get by on Pulse without grinding? I grinded a certain amount before I left Cocoon, but when I got to Pulse got my ass handed to me.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Casual Shinji said:
John Funk said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.

It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
I never really "grinded" in the game, I just defeated every enemy that was in front of me. Hell, I managed to avoid most of the enemies in the entire last two sequences abusing Deceptisols, and I still managed to beat the game.
How the hell were you able to get by on Pulse without grinding? I grinded a cetain amount before I left Cocoon, but when I got to Pulse got my ass handed to me.
If you actually fight every enemy along the way (including going both paths where it diverges) you get to pulse strong enough to beat most enemies.. the only things to avoid are the giant 4 legged stomping things.. I mean I didnt grind at all.. in fact i find grinding quite annoying.. but i got to pulse and even though i didnt slaughter everything in my path when i got there i could still beat pretty much anything first try.. including the marks.. Maybe its your party or paradigms or something...

A lot of people like Lightning, Hope and Fang but personally I use Lightning, Sahz and Vanille.. the paradigms bully (COM,SAB,SYN), diversity (COM,RAV,MED) and Relentless assault (COM,RAV,RAV) are enough to get through pretty much any confrontation.. And yes i play without a SEN
 

Florion

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Oh, help me. You're going to make my head explode: do I buy Heavy Rain first, or FFXIII? T_T
 

Diddy_King

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Onyx Oblivion said:
The soundtrack is great, I especially like the Chocobo Theme from Nautilus. There. That doesn't spoil a damn thing.

Yeah the music is great, I loved that song. It's a shame that they let go of most of their music staff.
 

MasterSplinter

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Excellent review, I´ve never played a FF game and am kinda ill biased about it. But this review made me want to give it a chance and did not seem like a fan boy tounge bath. I think Funk is one of the best reviewers (<- Is that a real word?) in this site, always is pretty objective and you can tell when he actually enjoyed something.
Not that the others are particularly bad, it´s just that sometimes it seams you have to reed/hear what they say taking into account the personality of the reviewer.(btw: not just talking about Yahtzee).
 

Warachia

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Dakeyras-Way said:
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
It seems weird that in a series based around a linear story with linear dungeons you would claim it is not linear.

I never claimed that the date scene was part of the story, it was an add on, as many were, As I've said before stopping to do add on SIDEQUESTS. As part of the earlier points, everything people talk about before are sidequests, little missions you do assideto the main story that are given by in game person A to accomplish objective A and get reward A.

If the sidequests don't need to be finished in order to progress in the game and are for rewards that you don't absolutely need, then the game is still linear with no alternate progression, and no amount of optional quests can change that, as FF 12 proved, it only puts a hold on the main storyline While you run around doing things that don't matter, not that there is anything wrong with that, I'm only explaining that not having these doesn't downgrade the game as much as people claim and that the FF series has hardly had squat to do with them, except as an afterthought (except possibly FF 10 and FF 12 if you're willing to count it).

I also never claimed that a city being boring and insipid makes it linear, I only said it destroyed my enjoyment of a good place, but that's just me.
 

jabu354

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I mostly agree with this review, the only place I differ on is that I only felt the first 2 chapters to be too boring, before the combat started opening up and before you could even level up. The rest of the game leading up to chapter 10 on when it starts opening up even more, I found to be very fun, and it was a good way to let you get to know the characters and combat system.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
It seems weird that in a series based around a linear story with linear dungeons you would claim it is not linear.

I never claimed that the date scene was part of the story, it was an add on, as many were, As I've said before stopping to do add on SIDEQUESTS. As part of the earlier points, everything people talk about before are sidequests, little missions you do assideto the main story that are given by in game person A to accomplish objective A and get reward A.

If the sidequests don't need to be finished in order to progress in the game and are for rewards that you don't absolutely need, then the game is still linear with no alternate progression, and no amount of optional quests can change that, as FF 12 proved, it only puts a hold on the main storyline While you run around doing things that don't matter, not that there is anything wrong with that, I'm only explaining that not having these doesn't downgrade the game as much as people claim and that the FF series has hardly had squat to do with them, except as an afterthought (except possibly FF 10 and FF 12 if you're willing to count it).

I also never claimed that a city being boring and insipid makes it linear, I only said it destroyed my enjoyment of a good place, but that's just me.
So you would rather have a tightly directed linear game than one thats not so rigidly linear?
What killed FF12 for me was the horrible skill system,bland MMO equipment and no redeeming factor to the limit breaks. At least FFX managed to use quasi classes very well FF12 mostly felt like a soulless MMO knock off due to lack of focus on skills/equipment.

What I would like to see for FF or any qussai TB/RT RPG is combat from FFX/FF12(IE situational based turns based on location/ground/character/equipment) level layout from FF12(only with a proper overworld world travel would work on a cell to cell transit system like Oblivion/FO3 but the closer you get to a area the more of it opens up in real time), the gambit system with the ability to save multi preset lists and don't have to gather most gambits, a party system like dragon age(where you can split up the party) only you can do the FF6 thing and have 2 or 3 partys in different areas at once, oh the puzzle fun to be had!

Nothing I loath more than "cinemagic" game design where they try and treat a game as something as linear as film, FFX was mostly horrible, Doom 3 was a frigg'in joke of a game ....games are just not meant to be so highly linear IMO.
 

AlternatePFG

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I agree with this review. As bad as the early hours get, the game definitely becomes great further in. I never was a big FF fan, I didn't have any expectations, but this game definitely surpassed them.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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ZippyDSMlee said:
Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
It seems weird that in a series based around a linear story with linear dungeons you would claim it is not linear.

I never claimed that the date scene was part of the story, it was an add on, as many were, As I've said before stopping to do add on SIDEQUESTS. As part of the earlier points, everything people talk about before are sidequests, little missions you do assideto the main story that are given by in game person A to accomplish objective A and get reward A.

If the sidequests don't need to be finished in order to progress in the game and are for rewards that you don't absolutely need, then the game is still linear with no alternate progression, and no amount of optional quests can change that, as FF 12 proved, it only puts a hold on the main storyline While you run around doing things that don't matter, not that there is anything wrong with that, I'm only explaining that not having these doesn't downgrade the game as much as people claim and that the FF series has hardly had squat to do with them, except as an afterthought (except possibly FF 10 and FF 12 if you're willing to count it).

I also never claimed that a city being boring and insipid makes it linear, I only said it destroyed my enjoyment of a good place, but that's just me.
So you would rather have a tightly directed linear game than one thats not so rigidly linear?
What killed FF12 for me was the horrible skill system,bland MMO equipment and no redeeming factor to the limit breaks. At least FFX managed to use quasi classes very well FF12 mostly felt like a soulless MMO knock off due to lack of focus on skills/equipment.

What I would like to see for FF or any qussai TB/RT RPG is combat from FFX/FF12(IE situational based turns based on location/ground/character/equipment) level layout from FF12(only with a proper overworld world travel would work on a cell to cell transit system like Oblivion/FO3 but the closer you get to a area the more of it opens up in real time), the gambit system with the ability to save multi preset lists and don't have to gather most gambits, a party system like dragon age(where you can split up the party) only you can do the FF6 thing and have 2 or 3 partys in different areas at once, oh the puzzle fun to be had!

Nothing I loath more than "cinemagic" game design where they try and treat a game as something as linear as film, FFX was mostly horrible, Doom 3 was a frigg'in joke of a game ....games are just not meant to be so highly linear IMO.
Not every game is meant to be the same. Linearity is not a bad thing. What you *prefer* is not what is necessarily best for gaming as a whole.

Gaming is best served by having *diversity* in its design. Linearity has a place alongside more free-form things.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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John Funk said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
It seems weird that in a series based around a linear story with linear dungeons you would claim it is not linear.

I never claimed that the date scene was part of the story, it was an add on, as many were, As I've said before stopping to do add on SIDEQUESTS. As part of the earlier points, everything people talk about before are sidequests, little missions you do assideto the main story that are given by in game person A to accomplish objective A and get reward A.

If the sidequests don't need to be finished in order to progress in the game and are for rewards that you don't absolutely need, then the game is still linear with no alternate progression, and no amount of optional quests can change that, as FF 12 proved, it only puts a hold on the main storyline While you run around doing things that don't matter, not that there is anything wrong with that, I'm only explaining that not having these doesn't downgrade the game as much as people claim and that the FF series has hardly had squat to do with them, except as an afterthought (except possibly FF 10 and FF 12 if you're willing to count it).

I also never claimed that a city being boring and insipid makes it linear, I only said it destroyed my enjoyment of a good place, but that's just me.
So you would rather have a tightly directed linear game than one thats not so rigidly linear?
What killed FF12 for me was the horrible skill system,bland MMO equipment and no redeeming factor to the limit breaks. At least FFX managed to use quasi classes very well FF12 mostly felt like a soulless MMO knock off due to lack of focus on skills/equipment.

What I would like to see for FF or any qussai TB/RT RPG is combat from FFX/FF12(IE situational based turns based on location/ground/character/equipment) level layout from FF12(only with a proper overworld world travel would work on a cell to cell transit system like Oblivion/FO3 but the closer you get to a area the more of it opens up in real time), the gambit system with the ability to save multi preset lists and don't have to gather most gambits, a party system like dragon age(where you can split up the party) only you can do the FF6 thing and have 2 or 3 partys in different areas at once, oh the puzzle fun to be had!

Nothing I loath more than "cinemagic" game design where they try and treat a game as something as linear as film, FFX was mostly horrible, Doom 3 was a frigg'in joke of a game ....games are just not meant to be so highly linear IMO.
Not every game is meant to be the same. Linearity is not a bad thing. What you *prefer* is not what is necessarily best for gaming as a whole.

Gaming is best served by having *diversity* in its design. Linearity has a place alongside more free-form things.
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
 

John Funk

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Dec 20, 2005
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ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
Yes, because Super Mario Bros. 3 is clearly the most non-linear game ever made.

Your opinion is not law. Your preference does not indicate overall objective quality. A linear game is simply trying to do something with a different approach than a more free-form one. It is trying to offer a much more controlled experience.

Just because you personally do not like this, does not mean your word is law and the be-all-end-all of game quality.
 

addeB

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Meh, I'm not really a fan of JRPG's, i just don't like the style...
 

edgeofblade

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I've said it before. I'll keep saying it until something proves me wrong:

A game that leans heavily on a story causes the gameplay to suffer. In this case, to the point where there is next to no gameplay at all. I've played my share of the classic JRPGs. Chrono Trigger wipes the floor with FF13. It was non-linear in FOUR FRACKING DIMENSIONS!

Running down a pretty tunnel, stopping to mash "Auto-Battle" every few seconds... IS... NOT... A... GAME.
 

FFKonoko

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Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.
It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
Yes, they have. It was in Final Fantasy 8. For some reason, many didn't like it.

edgeofblade said:
Running down a pretty tunnel, stopping to mash "Auto-Battle" every few seconds... IS... NOT... A... GAME.
Chrono Trigger had a damn good story and damn good graphics. I loved the game. But its combat...was not its strong point. Double-techs became useless, and when revisting areas in Epoch, the weaker areas? ...mashing 'Auto-Battle', and enjoying the pretty scenery.

Honestly, I think the Gambit system of FFXII was good. Figuring it out for myself, first discovering the use of the indigo amulet, or late in the game where rather than leveling up to defeat a boss, I used a Reflect Mote and some 'IF Reflect Status THEN Fira SELF' gambits.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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John Funk said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
Yes, because Super Mario Bros. 3 is clearly the most non-linear game ever made.

Your opinion is not law. Your preference does not indicate overall objective quality. A linear game is simply trying to do something with a different approach than a more free-form one. It is trying to offer a much more controlled experience.

Just because you personally do not like this, does not mean your word is law and the be-all-end-all of game quality.
So less is more?
No matter how you shake it you can not get more from less.

edgeofblade said:
I've said it before. I'll keep saying it until something proves me wrong:

A game that leans heavily on a story causes the gameplay to suffer. In this case, to the point where there is next to no gameplay at all. I've played my share of the classic JRPGs. Chrono Trigger wipes the floor with FF13. It was non-linear in FOUR FRACKING DIMENSIONS!

Running down a pretty tunnel, stopping to mash "Auto-Battle" every few seconds... IS... NOT... A... GAME.
I would not say it's non-linear its just more expansive, its not quite open ended but you can do alot of back tracking and moving forward from different spots.

But otherwise I agree with you.

FFKonoko said:
Chipperz said:
Nice review. I loved it for all the reasons most people hate it, and I don't know if it's any consolation for Final Fantasy fans who can't imagine playing something with a linear story, but after the first twenty or so hours, the game becomes a massive open-world grindfest. Sadly, my love of the storyline has put me into the trap most people I know have fallen into playing ANY Final Fantasy game - didn't grind enough, can't beat a boss, fucked over in sight of the ending.
It's really, really soured me on the Final Fantasy series, even more than before. Have Japanese people heard of scaling enemies!?
Yes, they have. It was in Final Fantasy 8. For some reason, many didn't like it.

edgeofblade said:
Running down a pretty tunnel, stopping to mash "Auto-Battle" every few seconds... IS... NOT... A... GAME.
Chrono Trigger had a damn good story and damn good graphics. I loved the game. But its combat...was not its strong point. Double-techs became useless, and when revisting areas in Epoch, the weaker areas? ...mashing 'Auto-Battle', and enjoying the pretty scenery.

Honestly, I think the Gambit system of FFXII was good. Figuring it out for myself, first discovering the use of the indigo amulet, or late in the game where rather than leveling up to defeat a boss, I used a Reflect Mote and some 'IF Reflect Status THEN Fira SELF' gambits.
Whats really neat is it works better than the scripts on DA :p
But other than that I found FF12 deadthly boring due to lack of fun equipment it felt like a bland MMO clone.

I enjoyed FF12 combat some it let me easily switch between control and auto and that I like but other than that its not worth playing all the way through.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
Yes, because Super Mario Bros. 3 is clearly the most non-linear game ever made.

Your opinion is not law. Your preference does not indicate overall objective quality. A linear game is simply trying to do something with a different approach than a more free-form one. It is trying to offer a much more controlled experience.

Just because you personally do not like this, does not mean your word is law and the be-all-end-all of game quality.
So less is more?
No matter how you shake it you can not get more from less.
I'm not trying to say less is more.

I'm trying to say that more is not always better.
 

Mythrignoc

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FF2 Characters- Firion, Leon, Maria, Guy
FF3 Characters- Luneth, Ingus, Arc, Refia
FF4 Characters- Cecil, Rydia, Tellah, Edward, Yang, Palom, Porom, Edge, FuSoYa
FF5 Characters- Bartz, Faris, Reina, Galuf, Krile
FF6 Characters- Terra, Locke, Celes, Edgar, Cyan, Sabin, Setzer, Shadow, Mog
FF7 Characters- Cloud, Tifa, Barret, Red XIII, Yuffie, Cait Sith, Cid
FF8 Characters- Squall, Quistis, Rinoa, Selphie, Irvine, Laguna
FF9 Characters- Zidane, Dagger (Garnet), Steiner, Vivi, Amarant, Eiko, Quina, Freya
FF10 Characters- Tidus, Wakka, Yuna, Lulu, Rikku, Auron, Kimhari
FF12 Characters- Vaan, Balthier, Ashe, Basch, Penelo, Fran
FF13 Characters- Lighning, Snow, Vanille, Sazh, Yun Fang, Hope

Well, if you count Cloud, that is a total of 3 out of 71 names involving the weather. 4 if you count Terra which is just a latin name for land and a fairly common american name.

Your point about meteorological names is moot.

No offense but I believe I'm done with your reviews as this is the second instance where I've found you complaining about something that doesn't warrant frustration of any kind.


Oh, and final fantasy has ALWAYS been linear. Always.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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John Funk said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
Yes, because Super Mario Bros. 3 is clearly the most non-linear game ever made.

Your opinion is not law. Your preference does not indicate overall objective quality. A linear game is simply trying to do something with a different approach than a more free-form one. It is trying to offer a much more controlled experience.

Just because you personally do not like this, does not mean your word is law and the be-all-end-all of game quality.
So less is more?
No matter how you shake it you can not get more from less.
I'm not trying to say less is more.

I'm trying to say that more is not always better.
Considering how..er....."limited" today's games are you can say that with a straight face?
Just look at the options menu and lack of control configuration and bipolar sound/video/gamplay option standards.....and thats even before you get into mechanics and implementations.

Sure you can have to much FO3 and Bioshock have to much but when you do a double take and focus on what they have to much on it generally falls to bad pacing or poorly making a generalized path through a game.


Mythrignoc said:
FF2 Characters- Firion, Leon, Maria, Guy
FF3 Characters- Luneth, Ingus, Arc, Refia
FF4 Characters- Cecil, Rydia, Tellah, Edward, Yang, Palom, Porom, Edge, FuSoYa
FF5 Characters- Bartz, Faris, Reina, Galuf, Krile
FF6 Characters- Terra, Locke, Celes, Edgar, Cyan, Sabin, Setzer, Shadow, Mog
FF7 Characters- Cloud, Tifa, Barret, Red XIII, Yuffie, Cait Sith, Cid
FF8 Characters- Squall, Quistis, Rinoa, Selphie, Irvine, Laguna
FF9 Characters- Zidane, Dagger (Garnet), Steiner, Vivi, Amarant, Eiko, Quina, Freya
FF10 Characters- Tidus, Wakka, Yuna, Lulu, Rikku, Auron, Kimhari
FF12 Characters- Vaan, Balthier, Ashe, Basch, Penelo, Fran
FF13 Characters- Lighning, Snow, Vanille, Sazh, Yun Fang, Hope

Well, if you count Cloud, that is a total of 3 out of 71 names involving the weather. 4 if you count Terra which is just a latin name for land and a fairly common american name.

Your point about meteorological names is moot.

No offense but I believe I'm done with your reviews as this is the second instance where I've found you complaining about something that doesn't warrant frustration of any kind.


Oh, and final fantasy has ALWAYS been linear. Always.
Focus man focus, FFX(and FF7 town layouts) linear and FF4,6,9(even 8 is not "that" linear no worse than FF7 really) linear are 2 completely different worlds.
 

FinalHeart95

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I like that you mention that linearity isn't inherently bad, something a majority of reviewers tend to forget.

To be quite honest, I enjoyed the first half of the game... once I got my paradigm shifts anyway. It's probably be really boring if I went back and played chapter 1/2 now.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
20,364
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Mythrignoc said:
FF2 Characters- Firion, Leon, Maria, Guy
FF3 Characters- Luneth, Ingus, Arc, Refia
FF4 Characters- Cecil, Rydia, Tellah, Edward, Yang, Palom, Porom, Edge, FuSoYa
FF5 Characters- Bartz, Faris, Reina, Galuf, Krile
FF6 Characters- Terra, Locke, Celes, Edgar, Cyan, Sabin, Setzer, Shadow, Mog
FF7 Characters- Cloud, Tifa, Barret, Red XIII, Yuffie, Cait Sith, Cid
FF8 Characters- Squall, Quistis, Rinoa, Selphie, Irvine, Laguna
FF9 Characters- Zidane, Dagger (Garnet), Steiner, Vivi, Amarant, Eiko, Quina, Freya
FF10 Characters- Tidus, Wakka, Yuna, Lulu, Rikku, Auron, Kimhari
FF12 Characters- Vaan, Balthier, Ashe, Basch, Penelo, Fran
FF13 Characters- Lighning, Snow, Vanille, Sazh, Yun Fang, Hope

Well, if you count Cloud, that is a total of 3 out of 71 names involving the weather. 4 if you count Terra which is just a latin name for land and a fairly common american name.

Your point about meteorological names is moot.

No offense but I believe I'm done with your reviews as this is the second instance where I've found you complaining about something that doesn't warrant frustration of any kind.


Oh, and final fantasy has ALWAYS been linear. Always.
Dude.

We always end our reviews on a joke of some sort. Take a joke :p

ZippyDSMlee said:
Considering how..er....."limited" today's games are you can say that with a straight face?
Just look at the options menu and lack of control configuration and bipolar sound/video/gamplay option standards.....and thats even before you get into mechanics and implementations.

Sure you can have to much FO3 and Bioshock have to much but when you do a double take and focus on what they have to much on it generally falls to bad pacing/making a generalized path through a game.
Because I don't see them as limited. I don't care about control configuration or sound options or options menus.

That's like saying that Naruto is automatically the best anime series ever because it's one of the longest. Short and sweet is just fine.
 

Mythrignoc

New member
Oct 17, 2009
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@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
 

ZippyDSMlee

New member
Sep 1, 2007
3,959
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John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
FF2 Characters- Firion, Leon, Maria, Guy
FF3 Characters- Luneth, Ingus, Arc, Refia
FF4 Characters- Cecil, Rydia, Tellah, Edward, Yang, Palom, Porom, Edge, FuSoYa
FF5 Characters- Bartz, Faris, Reina, Galuf, Krile
FF6 Characters- Terra, Locke, Celes, Edgar, Cyan, Sabin, Setzer, Shadow, Mog
FF7 Characters- Cloud, Tifa, Barret, Red XIII, Yuffie, Cait Sith, Cid
FF8 Characters- Squall, Quistis, Rinoa, Selphie, Irvine, Laguna
FF9 Characters- Zidane, Dagger (Garnet), Steiner, Vivi, Amarant, Eiko, Quina, Freya
FF10 Characters- Tidus, Wakka, Yuna, Lulu, Rikku, Auron, Kimhari
FF12 Characters- Vaan, Balthier, Ashe, Basch, Penelo, Fran
FF13 Characters- Lighning, Snow, Vanille, Sazh, Yun Fang, Hope

Well, if you count Cloud, that is a total of 3 out of 71 names involving the weather. 4 if you count Terra which is just a latin name for land and a fairly common american name.

Your point about meteorological names is moot.

No offense but I believe I'm done with your reviews as this is the second instance where I've found you complaining about something that doesn't warrant frustration of any kind.


Oh, and final fantasy has ALWAYS been linear. Always.
Dude.

We always end our reviews on a joke of some sort. Take a joke :p

ZippyDSMlee said:
Considering how..er....."limited" today's games are you can say that with a straight face?
Just look at the options menu and lack of control configuration and bipolar sound/video/gamplay option standards.....and thats even before you get into mechanics and implementations.

Sure you can have to much FO3 and Bioshock have to much but when you do a double take and focus on what they have to much on it generally falls to bad pacing/making a generalized path through a game.
Because I don't see them as limited. I don't care about control configuration or sound options or options menus.

That's like saying that Naruto is automatically the best anime series ever because it's one of the longest. Short and sweet is just fine.


Just like dev cycles to poo out more unpolished crap, its not so much the lack of content that crawled up my neither regions and dies but lack of polishing and working on the frakk'in mechanics...FO3 and BS both are horribly balanced and paced yet loved and worshiped like frigging twilight(uhg the dead horse of my rotting argument >< FAIl I R).

PS:One piece is longer :p

Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....
 

FFKonoko

New member
Nov 26, 2009
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The appeal is not always in just doing what you want to do, but sometimes in simply enjoying a well crafted set of gameplay mechanics, characters, story, graphics and music. You can do that in games regardless of if they are linear or not.
Personally, I see no greater illusion of being open ended in the older games than the newer ones. I still loved those older games.
 

ZippyDSMlee

New member
Sep 1, 2007
3,959
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FFKonoko said:
The appeal is not always in just doing what you want to do, but sometimes in simply enjoying a well crafted set of gameplay mechanics, characters, story, graphics and music. You can do that in games regardless of if they are linear or not.
Personally, I see no greater illusion of being open ended in the older games than the newer ones. I still loved those older games.
I dunno the more constricted and contrived it feels the more I just turn off and hate it, Loved FF4,FF6 FF5 was k for what it was same for FF7,FF8 was messy but had neat sub plots, FF9 was pure fun,FFX was messy I enjoyed blitz ball more than the game itself, FF12 is very messy and FF13 is very very messy on the rails hell Dragon age is as messy as FF12 but with problems in other areas...... blah I over analyze games(and movies) because I want them to be the best they can be not cheap thrill fodder........*sigh*
 

crazyjay321

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Feb 22, 2009
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Tonimata said:
...Why does the combat system sound A LOT like the one from Tales of Symphonia from what I understood there??

Edit: How long exactly is the game? I'm going to run out of Xbox Live soon, and I want to make sure my money is well invested.
Dude the combat is no way near as good as the tales series. All you have to do to win(also there is no penalty for losing a fight at all) is change the paradigm's and press auto battle.

I'm hooked on the game but do not know why I am, I think it's the story and character's.
 

feeqmatic

New member
Jun 19, 2009
125
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The game is disappointing in my opinion. I put it down and will probably not pick it up until i have more time on my hands and have played everything else i want to play. The idea of playing in a straight line for 30 hours to get to the rpg part of the game just seems retarded. If it were 10 hours, maybe. Basically they expect the combat and story to carry the game for 30 hours, and not even God of war, Ninja Gaiden, or any other action orriented game could carry a game for 30 hours by itself. I got to chapter 6 realized what the game was asking of me then put bayonetta in cause if im going to play a flashy linear game it might as well have exciting combat.

I feel slightly betrayed as a fan. They did the same thing Mass Effect did and took the RPG out of the game except they did it waaaaay worse with far worse results.
 

A Weary Exile

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Aug 24, 2009
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I never noticed the "Weather-named" characters before. Cloud, Squall, Lightning...strange.

I'm still on the fence about whether I'm going to buy FFXIII, I'm going to borrow it from my friend first and see if I like it.
 

Nickymonkey

New member
Mar 27, 2009
5
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I have the game, its like having eddie murphy as a character so fun!
Plus its 10X more fun because you can make fun of the characters
and its like playing a MOVIE!!!
 

rickthetrick

New member
Jun 19, 2009
533
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This game fails due to it having zero replay value. I can not see myself having an urge to plow through 30 hours of "training wheels" just to get to semblance of a game for the second time. If you need me I'll be over here playing Dragon Age again.
 

Wounded Melody

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Jan 19, 2009
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FFVI is pretty non linear in the World of Ruin IMO, you can pick up or choose to leave behind several characters and it affects the ending.
I watched the FF13 playthrough (Japanese) on Youtube and now will be watching the English version. Snow gets on my nerves, but I like the rest of the cast. I like that you can avoid battles but the loss of towns makes me sad. It was always cool to look around and see if something was hidden or if you'd meet dancing girls or get turned into a pig XD
One thing--what's the point of getting turned into crystal if you succeed at your focus? That's a pretty crappy reward...
 

demouse

New member
Nov 23, 2009
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lol, only game that has ever made me seriously wish i had a console... just for the last bit

RUN!!

...

I MEANT AWAY!!!
 

kawaiiamethist

New member
Nov 21, 2009
779
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I finished the 'story' last night.

The final bosses were a total joke, and I found Barthandulus got progressively easier if you compare the three battles (the first was an absolute nightmare and the hardest thing I did in the game).

Story is so important to me, so it was frustrating to see them cutting corners on side characters and villains. They were there, the they were gone. They only had walk on scenes. I didn't give a rats about Cid, so when the two you-know-what events happened with him, it didn't faze me in any way.

I also really disliked the use of datalogues to give the audience important information. So lazy and unimaginative. They didn't even try to offer context, they just gave you notes to read.

Wounded Melody said:
I watched the FF13 playthrough (Japanese) on Youtube and now will be watching the English version. Snow gets on my nerves, but I like the rest of the cast. I like that you can avoid battles but the loss of towns makes me sad. It was always cool to look around and see if something was hidden or if you'd meet dancing girls or get turned into a pig XD
One thing--what's the point of getting turned into crystal if you succeed at your focus? That's a pretty crappy reward...
I hated Snow too, right to the bitter end.

Turning to crystal beats the alternative. Would you rather become a crystal or a brainless beast?

Please put important events under a spoiler tag.

-Mod
 

MisterColeman

New member
Mar 19, 2009
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This is the best FFXIII review I have ever read, but that mostly just means that we both think the same thing, so this might actually be bad for you, I'm not usually the person you want to think the same as, or so I've been told.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Aug 12, 2008
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Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
I would like to point out that the date scene was just an example i don't particularly care one way or another whether the characters remember it or not the fact remains you did influence the events and that's not the only place it happens... Plus quite a few of the towns that you do go back to DO have events that occur outside of the actual story..

But most importantly just because you found that returning was boring and insipid that doesnt actually make it linear... the fact you can choose to return and do something new or whatever you wanted (by your own admission with the megalixer thing) makes it non linear... The STORY is linear but the actual game isnt..

Oh and saying there is no point in getting a different part of the story after claiming there were no other parts kinda proves my point
It seems weird that in a series based around a linear story with linear dungeons you would claim it is not linear.

I never claimed that the date scene was part of the story, it was an add on, as many were, As I've said before stopping to do add on SIDEQUESTS. As part of the earlier points, everything people talk about before are sidequests, little missions you do assideto the main story that are given by in game person A to accomplish objective A and get reward A.

If the sidequests don't need to be finished in order to progress in the game and are for rewards that you don't absolutely need, then the game is still linear with no alternate progression, and no amount of optional quests can change that, as FF 12 proved, it only puts a hold on the main storyline While you run around doing things that don't matter, not that there is anything wrong with that, I'm only explaining that not having these doesn't downgrade the game as much as people claim and that the FF series has hardly had squat to do with them, except as an afterthought (except possibly FF 10 and FF 12 if you're willing to count it).

I also never claimed that a city being boring and insipid makes it linear, I only said it destroyed my enjoyment of a good place, but that's just me.
First of all the date scene IS part of the main story.. you can't continue in the game without doing it...

Second of all when i say that not all are linear i agree that they are partially linear but NOWHERE near as linear as this... And yeah putting the 'linear story' on pause to do something else for a few hours may not in actual fact change the story (and lets face it ALL stories are linear) but the choice to do something other than the story is there, and in many FF games the Side quests are long and just as much fun as the main quest. By forcing the player to follow a single path through the ENTIRE game counts as linear whereas when you have the opportunity to say "hey i don't really feel like going there right now i'd rather go wander in that forest or in the cave" it not only gives you other paths (making it LESS linear) but also makes the game feel less like it is simply a single path straight from start to boss...

Oh and not having side-quests or optional quests DOES downgrade the game.. You personally might not like exploring the world or doing side quests finding them 'boring and insipid' but a lot of people (myself included obviously) quite enjoy finding out all the secret cool stuff that the developers put in for you to find if you work hard enough.. I mean i spent hours fighting in the Golden Saucer to get Cloud's Limit Break "Omnislash" which was definitely a side quest worth the work as was racing the chocobo's and breeding them to get a Golden one with which you could (guess what) EXPLORE the WORLD. Most of my fondest memories of the game were of completing these sidequests. (along with killing Ruby and Emerald Weapons')

And yes you didnt say that the towns being boring and insipid made them linear you said that you never wanted to go back to them because it would degrade the experience without events... MY point was that the towns (for some) were still fun to explore and had heaps of secrets to find.. For example in VII there were a lot of secret events in Nibelheim (i think that's how its spelt) such as in the basement of the Shinra mansion there were about 3 from memory..
 

lumenadducere

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May 19, 2008
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Thanks for the review. I've been on the fence about this one, but I've heard good things from people I know who have it and with this review I think I've finally been convinced. I think I'll pick it up when I get through Dragon Age: Awakening...which should give me a few weeks to beat it before Splinter Cell: Conviction comes out.

*sigh*

This year is absolutely nuts in terms of games that I want. There was so little comparatively for me the last few years, and now it's all coming in a massive rush. Ah well, at least Spring Break is coming up.
 

Rayansaki

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May 5, 2009
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Apparently I'm having the opposite reaction to the game as other people. It was my first Final Fantasy game, and I really like the first part (Except for the first 5 chapters that could basically be passed with 1 hand on controller), but I liked every bit until Gran Pulse more than I liked it after. Its just that I was so used to knowing exactly what to do and every objective, that getting to a large openworld with questgivers scattered all around and being able to pick only one quest at a time overwhelmed me a bit. For me, the chapters 7, 8, 9, and 10, specially the
Cid Raines
fight, were my favorite bits.

Also, I really liked Vanille, Hope and Lightning, and hated Snow, Fang and Sazh, which is pretty much the opposite of what everyone else thinks, with the exception of maybe Lightning.
 

Wounded Melody

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kawaiiamethist said:
I hated Snow too, right to the bitter end.

Turning to crystal beats the alternative. Would you rather become a crystal or a brainless beast?
Sad part is I thought I was going to like him ><;

Good point on the two choices, but still it's pretty much lose-lose.
 

Typhron

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Dec 17, 2008
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Jaranja said:
BlueHighwind said:
"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
I hate you so much right now.
 

BlackndEclipse

New member
Mar 17, 2010
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Just finished FFXIII tonight, was epic, final boss fight got me shifting paradigms like every 20 seconds lol. Lightning, Fang and Hope are the greatest
 

Crimsoneyelion

New member
Oct 18, 2008
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Flurry's too close to furry...speaking of which, aren't we overdue for another Mog/Red XIII/Kimarhi-esque character?
 

Crimsoneyelion

New member
Oct 18, 2008
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Crimsoneyelion said:
Flurry's too close to furry...speaking of which, aren't we overdue for another Mog/Red XIII/Kimarhi-esque character?
Heh, sorry, forgot to quote someone earlier about the possible names of FF15, but this is in reference to that joke line, I'm sure you'll figure it out.
 

Super Toast

Supreme Overlord of the Basement
Dec 10, 2009
2,476
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I've only rented it, but in the short time I played I found it cripplingly boring. It gets better the more you play it, but MAN! Worst. Opening. Sequence. EVER
 

BlackndEclipse

New member
Mar 17, 2010
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Crimsoneyelion said:
Flurry's too close to furry...speaking of which, aren't we overdue for another Mog/Red XIII/Kimarhi-esque character?
Kimarhi was just pro
best scene in FFX, "Summoner may pass, Guardians may pass, KIMAHRI may not pass"
 

Mythrignoc

New member
Oct 17, 2009
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ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
20,364
0
0
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
 

AgentNein

New member
Jun 14, 2008
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blipblop said:
John Funk said:
blipblop said:
i might be wrong, but did you steal GT review line by line at some places???
Uh, you're very wrong. I didn't even know GT *did* reviews. Hell, I've avoided most reviews of the game altogether since I didn't want my opinion to be shaped by them.

Plagiarism is a very serious charge, so I'd appreciate if you didn't insult me by suggesting that :/
yeah didn´t mean to insult you funk. I did just ask a question.
Great quote from Adam Sessler when it comes to junk like accusing reviewers of plagiarizing or taking bribes from companies:

"Do you fuck your mom? Why are you upset? It's just a question."
 

Archemetis

Is Probably Awesome.
Aug 13, 2008
2,089
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0
I personally am enjoying FFXIII to no end, I've hit the Gran Pulse section after about 25-30 hours of play.

I was a bit confused and annoyed by how long it actually took me to get my entire team.
I guess I'm just a little more used to newer FF titles where the team is generally established early on and pretty much is just waiting for the great evil to present itself in some form.

XIII just seems to be more like:

"Here's all the characters you'll get, have fun playing between them all for the next 15-20 hours."

Don't get me wrong, even during the sections where I was playing in two character groups I was having fun.
Although the section in Nautilus Park with Sazh and Vanille really got on my nerves when Brynhildr was being a stubborn fuck with what exactly constitutes a satisfactory action... And again in the Palamecia with Barthandilus I grinded on the soldiers outside his room for two days to build my Crystariums to as high level as they could before finally kicking the shit out of him.
Despite these annoying little moments, the fun I've had so far has been in massive amounts and I was genuinely overcome with awe over the battle system, the new ATB system is brilliant, the way items work is great and well suited to the single character control style and the stagger system--

(I have to cut this short because something is about to happen to my internet, I'll be back to finish this.)

(edit: back again)

That was annoying, anyway the Stagger system I really liked, seeing as the game has no (noticeable at this time) limit break system in place it's handy to have another means of dealing above average damage and I really prefer it, it makes the already quite strategic nature of the combat become (Only slightly mind) deeper, I've quite often found myself talking in a newly developed mental language much like:

"Ok, I go in Diversity until his stagger is reached then unleash with Relentless and then bust out Combat Clinic in case the others damage me..."

It's all confusing at first but ultimately like most veterans of the series it becomes second-nature, which I suppose is what the games are good for.

I just hope that now I've hit Gran Pulse I'll have less of the "This is your team, you must deal with it, because we're not letting you have anyone else..." stuff.
 

Jaranja

New member
Jul 16, 2009
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Typhron said:
Jaranja said:
BlueHighwind said:
"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
I hate you so much right now.
Isn't that cute.
 

Warachia

New member
Aug 11, 2009
1,116
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ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.

As for personal opinion, just don't bring it into these arguments, because it is an instant lose argument for both sides, to help you out though, you just aren't looking in the right places, try way of the samurai 3 for massive non-linearity, or try the Star Ocean series if you like Jrpg's.
By the way, I find it funny that you complain about quality when your spelling is horrible.
 

Warachia

New member
Aug 11, 2009
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Dakeyras-Way said:
First of all the date scene IS part of the main story.. you can't continue in the game without doing it...

Second of all when i say that not all are linear i agree that they are partially linear but NOWHERE near as linear as this... And yeah putting the 'linear story' on pause to do something else for a few hours may not in actual fact change the story (and lets face it ALL stories are linear) but the choice to do something other than the story is there, and in many FF games the Side quests are long and just as much fun as the main quest. By forcing the player to follow a single path through the ENTIRE game counts as linear whereas when you have the opportunity to say "hey i don't really feel like going there right now i'd rather go wander in that forest or in the cave" it not only gives you other paths (making it LESS linear) but also makes the game feel less like it is simply a single path straight from start to boss...

Oh and not having side-quests or optional quests DOES downgrade the game.. You personally might not like exploring the world or doing side quests finding them 'boring and insipid' but a lot of people (myself included obviously) quite enjoy finding out all the secret cool stuff that the developers put in for you to find if you work hard enough.. I mean i spent hours fighting in the Golden Saucer to get Cloud's Limit Break "Omnislash" which was definitely a side quest worth the work as was racing the chocobo's and breeding them to get a Golden one with which you could (guess what) EXPLORE the WORLD. Most of my fondest memories of the game were of completing these sidequests. (along with killing Ruby and Emerald Weapons')

And yes you didnt say that the towns being boring and insipid made them linear you said that you never wanted to go back to them because it would degrade the experience without events... MY point was that the towns (for some) were still fun to explore and had heaps of secrets to find.. For example in VII there were a lot of secret events in Nibelheim (i think that's how its spelt) such as in the basement of the Shinra mansion there were about 3 from memory..
First, whereas you could change the character Cloud went out with it changed absolutely nothing, as well as getting Vincent, it might unlock slightly more dialogue but has no effect on the story at all.

Second, I'm not going to argue about how you felt about the sidequests or cities or about how we choose to remember them, because that is personal opinion and an instant lose for both sides, you might think that the game is for the worse without sidequests, I might think that sidequests have little to no effect on certain games, and FF games definantly fall into that section.
Personally, what I would like in a city is what the games Enchanted arms or Tales of Symphonia did, where the cities are there, changed/destroyed, and you help rebuild and watch as the city changes due to your efforts, but that's just me. Also, I never said I didn't want to go back to any city, I just said going back ruins the shock and awe value (if there is any).
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
Ok let me try and explain it like this, there is a higher level of fun for me in a game that has a high illusion level of non-linearity but has not lost qaulity and polish to making an open world lulz fest. So Quake 1-2,RTCW,Dark Messiah is "deeper" than Bioshocck, FF4,FF6,ff9 are more fun and interesting to me than any other RPG I have played because newer games do not have much depth in the illusion of non-linearity they are more boxed and constricted concepts.

I apologize for my grammar and the way I communicate I tend to stick on easy trains of thought I can easily roll, its difficult for me to find the right words or line of thought sometimes.
Warachia said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.

As for personal opinion, just don't bring it into these arguments, because it is an instant lose argument for both sides, to help you out though, you just aren't looking in the right places, try way of the samurai 3 for massive non-linearity, or try the Star Ocean series if you like Jrpg's.
By the way, I find it funny that you complain about quality when your spelling is horrible.
Ok let me try and explain it like this, there is a higher level of fun for me in a game that has a high illusion level of non-linearity but has not lost qaulity and polish to making an open world lulz fest. So Quake 1-2,RTCW,Dark Messiah is "deeper" than Bioshocck, FF4,FF6,ff9 are more fun and interesting to me than any other RPG I have played because newer games do not have much depth in the illusion of non-linearity they are more boxed and constricted concepts.

I apologize for my grammar and the way I communicate I tend to stick on easy trains of thought I can easily roll, its difficult for me to find the right words or line of thought sometimes.
 

Sylveria

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I really really wish Square would stop experimenting with their flagship series, like they have with the two most recent installments.

FF12's combat was abysmal, truly the worst single player combat experience ever. If it was an MMO it might have flown but it would still be dull. FF13 made some improvements but its still just "press X 2-4 times to attack." The paradigm shifting is an unnecessary extra step especially when FF has proven it knows how to make a "Job" system (FFV, X-2, 11) which would do the exact same thing and not leave you fumbling to shift to a medic when the screen starts glowing red. Its like they took the dress change system from X-2 and shoved it down our throats with a big stick. At least the imagery of combat in 13 is a bit more flashy than 12 to keep you interested, but it could be so much better if they actually gave some interaction.
Honestly a less dynamic system like 1 through X2 where you control all 3 characters or a completely dynamic system like Star Ocean, Tales, .hack//GU, etc would have been so much better than this. Instead it feels like they're trying to please both types of people and end up with a mediocre system that very few people really enjoy.

The second huge flaw, which was commented on in the review, is this ultralinear world. It kills any sense of immersion at all. You don't feel like you're exploring a world. As much as I hated 12, the world felt large and epic; one of its few redeeming qualities. FF13 feels like a drag-race strip. 10 seemed to start this trend of point A to point B road maps but even there it had some secret dungeon offshoots and some expansive areas like the Calm Lands and desert.

As far as the game exploding with awesome at hour 20.. I'm waiting to see it. I am about 20hrs in but I spent a good 5+hrs farming CP and chips to sell for money because the encounters don't just drop gil which is incredibly retarded.
Remember how in 8 you got a salary but it was a pittance at best because you really didn't have much to buy? Well this is like that only 10x worse cause there's tons of shit to buy to upgrade your weapons.

After 12 I had lost a lot of faith in Square-Enix.. that was compounded by the new Star Ocean having some really stupid ideas (material farming) and mediocre combat. FF13 isn't the last nail in the coffin but it added a few to the box. I hope that FF Versus XIII gives me something I can really sink my teeth into because as it is, my PS2 RPGs from NIS are proving to be more entertaining.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Sylveria said:
I really really wish Square would stop experimenting with their flagship series, like they have with the two most recent installments.

FF12's combat was abysmal, truly the worst single player combat experience ever. If it was an MMO it might have flown but it would still be dull. FF13 made some improvements but its still just "press X 2-4 times to attack." The paradigm shifting is an unnecessary extra step especially when FF has proven it knows how to make a "Job" system (FFV, X-2, 11) which would do the exact same thing and not leave you fumbling to shift to a medic when the screen starts glowing red. Its like they took the dress change system from X-2 and shoved it down our throats with a big stick. At least the imagery of combat in 13 is a bit more flashy than 12 to keep you interested, but it could be so much better if they actually gave some interaction.
Honestly a less dynamic system like 1 through X2 where you control all 3 characters or a completely dynamic system like Star Ocean, Tales, .hack//GU, etc would have been so much better than this. Instead it feels like they're trying to please both types of people and end up with a mediocre system that very few people really enjoy.

The second huge flaw, which was commented on in the review, is this ultralinear world. It kills any sense of immersion at all. You don't feel like you're exploring a world. As much as I hated 12, the world felt large and epic; one of its few redeeming qualities. FF13 feels like a drag-race strip. 10 seemed to start this trend of point A to point B road maps but even there it had some secret dungeon offshoots and some expansive areas like the Calm Lands and desert.

As far as the game exploding with awesome at hour 20.. I'm waiting to see it. I am about 20hrs in but I spent a good 5+hrs farming CP and chips to sell for money because the encounters don't just drop gil which is incredibly retarded.
Remember how in 8 you got a salary but it was a pittance at best because you really didn't have much to buy? Well this is like that only 10x worse cause there's tons of shit to buy to upgrade your weapons.

After 12 I had lost a lot of faith in Square-Enix.. that was compounded by the new Star Ocean having some really stupid ideas (material farming) and mediocre combat. FF13 isn't the last nail in the coffin but it added a few to the box. I hope that FF Versus XIII gives me something I can really sink my teeth into because as it is, my PS2 RPGs from NIS are proving to be more entertaining.
Did you try and play FF12 manually? I used the gambits for health and enjoyed it for awhile but the bland equipment system and broken skill system turned me off the game after 10 hours. I need to dig out my code breaker and go at it again.
 

feeqmatic

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Im sorry, but what was so bad about 12. I loved 12. I dont exactly remember what went on but i remember loving it to death and playing it nonstop like a madman. I still think Vesperia is my alltime favorite JRPG (the only one i have ever played through twice) but 12 is a close second.

What were people complaints about 12, especially in lieu of this mediocre product we have here.
 

keinushi

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Jaranja said:
BlueHighwind said:
"FF13 feels like a direct reaction to many fans' criticisms of Final Fantasy XII: It was too open-ended and sprawling; there wasn't enough focus on the story to carry things through; it was too easy to get lost, etc."

Who are these people? They sound ill of mind.
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
I hated it as well, and wtf was this guy thinking???? You can not relate to the black guy, in fact, none of my friends can even stand him!!!! I sold it simply so I wouldn't have to listen to any of their voices anymore. the only one I could relate to was Lightning, and that was only because she hated all of them as well! this is the worst review I have ever heard, and I hope this guy goes to the deepest layer of video game hell.
 

Spygon

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Am i the only person who doesnt like the new "one character control"

Several times i have needed a character to do something specific in a battle but the AI decides to do something else that causes a huge problem for me.Then i have to stop what im doing to fix it or lose the battle.
 

Wuvlycuddles

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Spygon said:
Am i the only person who doesnt like the new "one character control"

Several times i have needed a character to do something specific in a battle but the AI decides to do something else that causes a huge problem for me.Then i have to stop what im doing to fix it or lose the battle.
I'm with ya on this one, they should have at least allowed you to swap the active character during battle.

Other than that, i had only two major grievances, firstly, the save point/shop thing was terrible, seeing as you can restart/retry every fight you really only needed to save if you intended to stop playing, so why not be able to save from the party menu? and access the shops and upgrade thing from there also?

Secondly,

i was pissed off at the lack of any really sinister arch villian, sure there is that old fart who crops up like three times during the game, but he was a terrible badguy. I reckon they really dropped the ball on that one, i mean the FF games have had some pretty cool badguys in the past and without a good one in this game it felt like all the fighting was a tad pointless.

Please spoiler tag spoilers. -Mod
 

FinalHeart95

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keinushi said:
I hated it as well, and wtf was this guy thinking???? You can not relate to the black guy, in fact, none of my friends can even stand him!!!! I sold it simply so I wouldn't have to listen to any of their voices anymore. the only one I could relate to was Lightning, and that was only because she hated all of them as well! this is the worst review I have ever heard, and I hope this guy goes to the deepest layer of video game hell.
Aren't opinions just a blast?

The general rule of thumb I'm seeing is:

Liked FFX, hated FFXII = Like FFXIII
Hated FFX, liked FFXII = Hate FFXIII
Liked both = Probably like FFXIII
Hated both = Why were you even thinking of buying this game?
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Spygon said:
Am i the only person who doesnt like the new "one character control"

Several times i have needed a character to do something specific in a battle but the AI decides to do something else that causes a huge problem for me.Then i have to stop what im doing to fix it or lose the battle.
Actually, I've found the AI to be quite good. Just make sure you know the rules.

For example:
Healer will act in this order:
1- Leader HP < 30% - Cure
2- Party HP < 30% - Cure
3- Leader HP < 70% - Cure
4- Party HP < 70% - Cure
5- Party member KO - Raise
6- Leader Status Effect - Esuna
7- Party Status Effect - Esuna

From this we can see the order in which actions will take place. So if you need a quick "Raise", just make your leader a Healer and manually raise the party member if need be. Since most Status ailments can be reversed with a synergist, and Esuna is low priority, you could always use a synergist instead of a healer, for example.
 

kawaiiamethist

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s69-5 said:
Spygon said:
Am i the only person who doesnt like the new "one character control"

Several times i have needed a character to do something specific in a battle but the AI decides to do something else that causes a huge problem for me.Then i have to stop what im doing to fix it or lose the battle.
Actually, I've found the AI to be quite good. Just make sure you know the rules.

For example:
Healer will act in this order:
1- Leader HP < 30% - Cure
2- Party HP < 30% - Cure
3- Leader HP < 70% - Cure
4- Party HP < 70% - Cure
5- Party member KO - Raise
6- Leader Status Effect - Esuna
7- Party Status Effect - Esuna

From this we can see the order in which actions will take place. So if you need a quick "Raise", just make your leader a Healer and manually raise the party member if need be. Since most Status ailments can be reversed with a synergist, and Esuna is low priority, you could always use a synergist instead of a healer, for example.
I didn't have an issue with the AI either, and when I did, it was just out of panic. Once I could choose my party, I went with Lightning/Hope/Fang (what can I say, the guide made a strong case for the trio) with Lightning as leader; she's a decent medic and has access to raise early enough.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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kawaiiamethist said:
s69-5 said:
Spygon said:
Am i the only person who doesnt like the new "one character control"

Several times i have needed a character to do something specific in a battle but the AI decides to do something else that causes a huge problem for me.Then i have to stop what im doing to fix it or lose the battle.
Actually, I've found the AI to be quite good. Just make sure you know the rules.

For example:
Healer will act in this order:
1- Leader HP < 30% - Cure
2- Party HP < 30% - Cure
3- Leader HP < 70% - Cure
4- Party HP < 70% - Cure
5- Party member KO - Raise
6- Leader Status Effect - Esuna
7- Party Status Effect - Esuna

From this we can see the order in which actions will take place. So if you need a quick "Raise", just make your leader a Healer and manually raise the party member if need be. Since most Status ailments can be reversed with a synergist, and Esuna is low priority, you could always use a synergist instead of a healer, for example.
I didn't have an issue with the AI either, and when I did, it was just out of panic. Once I could choose my party, I went with Lightning/Hope/Fang (what can I say, the guide made a strong case for the trio) with Lightning; she's a decent medic and has access to raise early enough.
Is the guide helpful? I haven't picked it up, but might if it's worth it.
 

kawaiiamethist

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Nov 21, 2009
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s69-5 said:
kawaiiamethist said:
s69-5 said:
Spygon said:
Am i the only person who doesnt like the new "one character control"

Several times i have needed a character to do something specific in a battle but the AI decides to do something else that causes a huge problem for me.Then i have to stop what im doing to fix it or lose the battle.
Actually, I've found the AI to be quite good. Just make sure you know the rules.

For example:
Healer will act in this order:
1- Leader HP < 30% - Cure
2- Party HP < 30% - Cure
3- Leader HP < 70% - Cure
4- Party HP < 70% - Cure
5- Party member KO - Raise
6- Leader Status Effect - Esuna
7- Party Status Effect - Esuna

From this we can see the order in which actions will take place. So if you need a quick "Raise", just make your leader a Healer and manually raise the party member if need be. Since most Status ailments can be reversed with a synergist, and Esuna is low priority, you could always use a synergist instead of a healer, for example.
I didn't have an issue with the AI either, and when I did, it was just out of panic. Once I could choose my party, I went with Lightning/Hope/Fang (what can I say, the guide made a strong case for the trio) with Lightning; she's a decent medic and has access to raise early enough.
Is the guide helpful? I haven't picked it up, but might if it's worth it.
Absolutely. It stopped me from making great errors. Without the guide I would have been attempting to upgrade everything, used up all my buff cans expecting there would be plenty more, wondering where all the gil was and rage quitting because I couldn't get past a boss. The maps are fairly useless, since there's barely anything to map, but the lists, explanations and especially the strategies are solid. The only boss I ever felt hopeless against was the first Bathandulus battle; you can have all the strategies in the world, but goddam you need some luck!
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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kawaiiamethist said:
Absolutely. It stopped me from making great errors. Without the guide I would have been attempting to upgrade everything, used up all my buff cans expecting there would be plenty more, wondering where all the gil was and rage quitting because I couldn't get past a boss. The maps are fairly useless, since there's barely anything to map, but the lists, explanations and especially the strategies are solid. The only boss I ever felt hopeless against was the first Bathandulus battle; you can have all the strategies in the world, but goddam you need some luck!
I hated Bathandalus. Took me three tries to beat him. It was also the only boss battle where I needed to pull out Odin to win or more precisely survive his attack, you know the one (I was also hit with Doom BTW). My party was low on health and he was almost done charging another blast, so I summoned Odin, landed a few hits and he nailed me. That's when I learned that Odin auto-revives the player and leaves. It saved me! Then I went on to win...

Since I'm a compulsive hoarder, I still have plenty of the "aerosol" cans left and until Bathandalus my equipped weapons were lvl 2 (I raised Light's to level 6 for that fight).

I'm only on C Rank missions right now (actually staring the Behemoth mark in the face as I type -- kinda avoiding him -- Behemoths got really strong on Pulse).

Well, back to it!

He was a lighweight compared to the normal Behemoths...
 

kawaiiamethist

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s69-5 said:
kawaiiamethist said:
Absolutely. It stopped me from making great errors. Without the guide I would have been attempting to upgrade everything, used up all my buff cans expecting there would be plenty more, wondering where all the gil was and rage quitting because I couldn't get past a boss. The maps are fairly useless, since there's barely anything to map, but the lists, explanations and especially the strategies are solid. The only boss I ever felt hopeless against was the first Bathandulus battle; you can have all the strategies in the world, but goddam you need some luck!
I hated Bathandalus. Took me three tries to beat him. It was also the only boss battle where I needed to pull out Odin to win or more precisely survive his attack, you know the one (I was also hit with Doom BTW). My party was low on health and he was almost done charging another blast, so I summoned Odin, landed a few hits and he nailed me. That's when I learned that Odin auto-revives the player and leaves. It saved me! Then I went on to win...

Since I'm a compulsive hoarder, I still have plenty of the "aerosol" cans left and until Bathandalus my equipped weapons were lvl 2 (I raised Light's to level 6 for that fight).

I'm only on C Rank missions right now (actually staring the Behemoth mark in the face as I type -- kinda avoiding him -- Behemoths got really strong on Pulse).

Well, back to it!
You're so lucky; it took me way more than three attempts - and we all know how long that battle rages for! Meanwhile, the next two times I faced him the experience was simple and took only one attempt. The only battle that came close to being as annoying as that first fight with him was Cid, but then it only took 2 attempts and felt a heck of a lot more manageable.

I've finished the game, and not quite ready to do the missions. I think I'll play some other games before I return to Pulse, so I can treat it like a separate entity.
 

ZippyDSMlee

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feeqmatic said:
Im sorry, but what was so bad about 12. I loved 12. I dont exactly remember what went on but i remember loving it to death and playing it nonstop like a madman. I still think Vesperia is my alltime favorite JRPG (the only one i have ever played through twice) but 12 is a close second.

What were people complaints about 12, especially in lieu of this mediocre product we have here.
For most poor thought out skill system, simplistic story and simpler characters and a horrible combat system.

I found the characters to be a bit simple but the story was not bad it was just poor skills system and lacking equipment system just made the game boring.Combat was ok but could have been deeper.
 

RUINER ACTUAL

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John Funk said:
Review: Final Fantasy XIII

Final Fantasy XIII stumbles out of the gate, but catches up by the end once it finds its Focus.

Read Full Article
Actually the pre-rendered cut scenes don't make me wonder why they didn't use the game engine, the pre-rendered cut scenes make me wonder why they didn't make a FUCKING MOVIE.
 

iblis666

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ZippyDSMlee said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
Ok let me try and explain it like this, there is a higher level of fun for me in a game that has a high illusion level of non-linearity but has not lost qaulity and polish to making an open world lulz fest. So Quake 1-2,RTCW,Dark Messiah is "deeper" than Bioshocck, FF4,FF6,ff9 are more fun and interesting to me than any other RPG I have played because newer games do not have much depth in the illusion of non-linearity they are more boxed and constricted concepts.

I apologize for my grammar and the way I communicate I tend to stick on easy trains of thought I can easily roll, its difficult for me to find the right words or line of thought sometimes.
Warachia said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.

As for personal opinion, just don't bring it into these arguments, because it is an instant lose argument for both sides, to help you out though, you just aren't looking in the right places, try way of the samurai 3 for massive non-linearity, or try the Star Ocean series if you like Jrpg's.
By the way, I find it funny that you complain about quality when your spelling is horrible.
Ok let me try and explain it like this, there is a higher level of fun for me in a game that has a high illusion level of non-linearity but has not lost qaulity and polish to making an open world lulz fest. So Quake 1-2,RTCW,Dark Messiah is "deeper" than Bioshocck, FF4,FF6,ff9 are more fun and interesting to me than any other RPG I have played because newer games do not have much depth in the illusion of non-linearity they are more boxed and constricted concepts.

I apologize for my grammar and the way I communicate I tend to stick on easy trains of thought I can easily roll, its difficult for me to find the right words or line of thought sometimes.
FF9 was one of the last great games of the final fantasy series because it was balanced. It gave you some nice mini games, good story, exploration, colorful characters, and didnt take its self too seriously.

the problem is that after that we get games like FF12 that felt like just one big bland mini game with bland uninteresting characters and while the battle system was interesting at first after a while it felt like your characters were on auto pilot.

With FF13 It looks pretty, the characters took less bland than FF12, and the battle system looks like it might be more interactive than ff12; but it seems to be too linear what with no exploration and mini games plus it seems that it takes its self too seriously.

Square enix can save this game though with something that wasnt available on earlier ps systems and that is the ability to download addons, with this tool they can release exploration such as: towns, dungeons, and fun secret stuff; they can also release mini games and side quests that can flesh out the game and improve its replayability turning it into some what of a evolving world that will be a bit different every time you replay it after a addon is patched in.
 

Stylish_Robot

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I actually found XII to be really fun gameplay-wise though I hated the fact I needed like 20 Wolf Pelts to afford one ****ing dagger but aside from Ashe and Balthier, the characters kinda sucked

So far though I'm loving XIII and I got to say the graphics are absolutely stunning and might even go as far to say they're better than UC2 (that game never constantly wowed it, it just did it now and then)
 

Wounded Melody

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ZippyDSMlee said:
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.
You really think FF6 was completely linear?
And I know with some of the FFs, like 5, I would be flying all over the world map trying to find the next spot to go to (if I didn't consult a map). I consider that a bit more open than just running from point A to B as FF13 seems to be.
 

Tjebbe

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Wounded Melody said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.
You really think FF6 was completely linear?
And I know with some of the FFs, like 5, I would be flying all over the world map trying to find the next spot to go to (if I didn't consult a map). I consider that a bit more open than just running from point A to B as FF13 seems to be.
Indeed, I haven't played any since 7, but 4, 5 and 6 all had this great open world, which you could travel through and explore freely (after a certain while), the main story might be linear (doh), but the games certainly weren't.

Oh man remember that magic-only tower in 6? :)
 

bjj hero

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Susan Arendt said:
"Humidity and Chance of Rain"

*giggle*
I'm waiting for sleet and drizzle myself.

I don't think I can invest 20 hours of work into a game before I get to the good part. For the record I thought FF12 was a breath of fresh air to FF.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Warachia said:
Dakeyras-Way said:
First of all the date scene IS part of the main story.. you can't continue in the game without doing it...

Second of all when i say that not all are linear i agree that they are partially linear but NOWHERE near as linear as this... And yeah putting the 'linear story' on pause to do something else for a few hours may not in actual fact change the story (and lets face it ALL stories are linear) but the choice to do something other than the story is there, and in many FF games the Side quests are long and just as much fun as the main quest. By forcing the player to follow a single path through the ENTIRE game counts as linear whereas when you have the opportunity to say "hey i don't really feel like going there right now i'd rather go wander in that forest or in the cave" it not only gives you other paths (making it LESS linear) but also makes the game feel less like it is simply a single path straight from start to boss...

Oh and not having side-quests or optional quests DOES downgrade the game.. You personally might not like exploring the world or doing side quests finding them 'boring and insipid' but a lot of people (myself included obviously) quite enjoy finding out all the secret cool stuff that the developers put in for you to find if you work hard enough.. I mean i spent hours fighting in the Golden Saucer to get Cloud's Limit Break "Omnislash" which was definitely a side quest worth the work as was racing the chocobo's and breeding them to get a Golden one with which you could (guess what) EXPLORE the WORLD. Most of my fondest memories of the game were of completing these sidequests. (along with killing Ruby and Emerald Weapons')

And yes you didnt say that the towns being boring and insipid made them linear you said that you never wanted to go back to them because it would degrade the experience without events... MY point was that the towns (for some) were still fun to explore and had heaps of secrets to find.. For example in VII there were a lot of secret events in Nibelheim (i think that's how its spelt) such as in the basement of the Shinra mansion there were about 3 from memory..
First, whereas you could change the character Cloud went out with it changed absolutely nothing, as well as getting Vincent, it might unlock slightly more dialogue but has no effect on the story at all.

Second, I'm not going to argue about how you felt about the sidequests or cities or about how we choose to remember them, because that is personal opinion and an instant lose for both sides, you might think that the game is for the worse without sidequests, I might think that sidequests have little to no effect on certain games, and FF games definantly fall into that section.
Personally, what I would like in a city is what the games Enchanted arms or Tales of Symphonia did, where the cities are there, changed/destroyed, and you help rebuild and watch as the city changes due to your efforts, but that's just me. Also, I never said I didn't want to go back to any city, I just said going back ruins the shock and awe value (if there is any).
I feel we are arguing about 2 different things... and some parts are as you said personal opinions.. I have been slightly over enthusiastic and as such I apologise for being rude...

I did like the way the towns changed in Enchanted Arms... It was always good to work for something like that... I just feel that perhaps that isnt the only thing that works... Linearity isnt a bad thing... And throughout all the discussion we have agreed that FF is linear to differing degrees...

I really enjoy the exploration, the side quests and finding all the secrets in a game. You appear to prefer only working towards valuable things in the game like unlocking different endings or such (which dont really happen in FF as you have said).

I do however say (from what i have read undisputedly) that FFxIII is LINEAR to the extreme and sadly so...
 

ZippyDSMlee

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iblis666 said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
John Funk said:
Mythrignoc said:
@Zippy,

Not one final fantasy game will let you open endedly explore the world until the end of the game.
Not one final fatnasy will allow you to choose your own background and story.
Not one will have an ending based on who you fight and who you don't fight, or which moral/ethical side you are on.

They give you the illusion of choice in some game but the end result is still the same. For instance, in 5, you could do whatever job you wanted, allowing you to have say Bartz as the mage and Krile as the warrior instead of the stereotypes, but no matter what you do, the end story and end result of the game will always be the same no matter how you play it. Exdeath, Sephiroth, Kefka, Sin, Edea, all of them will die by your hands no matter what you do in the games.


Don't kid yourself into thinking that there's degrees of linearity in games. You either do or don't have a choice, there's no maybe with something like that and while I hate black and white analysis', this is one of the few that I have yet to find any middle ground.
And IMO thats what made them great and what modern gaming is nearly incapable of doing creating the illusion of being open ended without making things horribly disconjointed. We either get linear as frak (anything bioware or capcom made)and disconjointed (anything Bethesda made and most sand box designs) because it takes to much time to build a sand box with rules.....

Erm...I never said linearity is a bad thing. All I'm saying is looking for non-linearity in a game designed to be linear is pointless, and final fantasy is one of those kinds of games.
Linearity ISN'T a bad thing. I really don't know where he's coming from here, to be honest.
Ok let me try and explain it like this, there is a higher level of fun for me in a game that has a high illusion level of non-linearity but has not lost qaulity and polish to making an open world lulz fest. So Quake 1-2,RTCW,Dark Messiah is "deeper" than Bioshocck, FF4,FF6,ff9 are more fun and interesting to me than any other RPG I have played because newer games do not have much depth in the illusion of non-linearity they are more boxed and constricted concepts.

I apologize for my grammar and the way I communicate I tend to stick on easy trains of thought I can easily roll, its difficult for me to find the right words or line of thought sometimes.
Warachia said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
There is no "diversity" in the linearity of free form things........ I suppose you have given up the fight on "qaulity" and go with whatever the flow is as most reviewers seem to do with today's 8's are yesterdays 6s and all.....

My "preferences" are more options,more content, more quality which seems to fly like sht hitting the preverbal fan in a 180 direction and less content,options lead to more money for the questionably "diverse" game industry.

I suppose art is in the eye of the beholder and all but it dose not make twilight(or "insert pathetic media here") any better and I am not getting any younger, all I need is a cane with a golf ball on it and I will be all set!
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.

As for personal opinion, just don't bring it into these arguments, because it is an instant lose argument for both sides, to help you out though, you just aren't looking in the right places, try way of the samurai 3 for massive non-linearity, or try the Star Ocean series if you like Jrpg's.
By the way, I find it funny that you complain about quality when your spelling is horrible.
Ok let me try and explain it like this, there is a higher level of fun for me in a game that has a high illusion level of non-linearity but has not lost qaulity and polish to making an open world lulz fest. So Quake 1-2,RTCW,Dark Messiah is "deeper" than Bioshocck, FF4,FF6,ff9 are more fun and interesting to me than any other RPG I have played because newer games do not have much depth in the illusion of non-linearity they are more boxed and constricted concepts.

I apologize for my grammar and the way I communicate I tend to stick on easy trains of thought I can easily roll, its difficult for me to find the right words or line of thought sometimes.
FF9 was one of the last great games of the final fantasy series because it was balanced. It gave you some nice mini games, good story, exploration, colorful characters, and didnt take its self too seriously.

the problem is that after that we get games like FF12 that felt like just one big bland mini game with bland uninteresting characters and while the battle system was interesting at first after a while it felt like your characters were on auto pilot.

With FF13 It looks pretty, the characters took less bland than FF12, and the battle system looks like it might be more interactive than ff12; but it seems to be too linear what with no exploration and mini games plus it seems that it takes its self too seriously.

Square enix can save this game though with something that wasnt available on earlier ps systems and that is the ability to download addons, with this tool they can release exploration such as: towns, dungeons, and fun secret stuff; they can also release mini games and side quests that can flesh out the game and improve its replayability turning it into some what of a evolving world that will be a bit different every time you replay it after a addon is patched in.
Well looking at FF7 and FF8 you can see the trend to smaller towns and explorable environments, FF9 was a god send the last true FF game and it was a true FF game not due tot eh fantasy theme but because it was well balanced and fun in a complete world environment. FFX showed corridors sell just as well so why put all this time and money into a larger more balanced game when anything will do......

These days publishers are not interested in putting more into a game what you tend to get is left overs and stuff locked on the disc as DLC.....

Wounded Melody said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.
You really think FF6 was completely linear?
And I know with some of the FFs, like 5, I would be flying all over the world map trying to find the next spot to go to (if I didn't consult a map). I consider that a bit more open than just running from point A to B as FF13 seems to be.
Tjebbe said:
Wounded Melody said:
ZippyDSMlee said:
As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well.
You really think FF6 was completely linear?
And I know with some of the FFs, like 5, I would be flying all over the world map trying to find the next spot to go to (if I didn't consult a map). I consider that a bit more open than just running from point A to B as FF13 seems to be.
Indeed, I haven't played any since 7, but 4, 5 and 6 all had this great open world, which you could travel through and explore freely (after a certain while), the main story might be linear (doh), but the games certainly weren't.

Oh man remember that magic-only tower in 6? :)
Guys Warachia said that not me
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/6.181176-Review-Final-Fantasy-XIII?page=4#5365818


FF's were open world leaning they tied everything together to make a small planet these days you get a bunch of corridors......
 

Warachia

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Dakeyras-Way said:
I feel we are arguing about 2 different things... and some parts are as you said personal opinions.. I have been slightly over enthusiastic and as such I apologise for being rude...

I did like the way the towns changed in Enchanted Arms... It was always good to work for something like that... I just feel that perhaps that isnt the only thing that works... Linearity isnt a bad thing... And throughout all the discussion we have agreed that FF is linear to differing degrees...

I really enjoy the exploration, the side quests and finding all the secrets in a game. You appear to prefer only working towards valuable things in the game like unlocking different endings or such (which dont really happen in FF as you have said).

I do however say (from what i have read undisputedly) that FFxIII is LINEAR to the extreme and sadly so...
Seems that way, and here I am surprisingly going to agree with everything you said.
 

Warachia

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I would like to deeply apologize to ZippyDSMlee for accidently making it look like his post when I was trying to quote him.

I said:

"As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well."
 

ZippyDSMlee

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Sep 1, 2007
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Warachia said:
I would like to deeply apologize to ZippyDSMlee for accidently making it look like his post when I was trying to quote him.

I said:

"As I said before, all FF games that are linear, if you don't want linearity, don't play FF games, I don't know what you were expecting if you complain about this game being linear as well."
No prob man the quote system is a bit finicky still.


As for the linearity argument and my lacking ability to exspress what I mean let me try it again.
"I am not talking about linearity in the hard felt limits of a game but how one finds and interacts with those limits. Newer games are bad about banging you against a wall than leading you around it."
 

Taern

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So, first and only main-series Final Fantasy game I've liked so far.

As for the complaints about linearity... Well, it's Final Fantasy, were you expecting Fallout or something?
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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Great review!
Can't wait to try the game; Even if it is a trifle linear.
 

SomeUnregPunk

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Mythrignoc said:
FF2 Characters- Firion, Leon, Maria, Guy
FF3 Characters- Luneth, Ingus, Arc, Refia
FF4 Characters- Cecil, Rydia, Tellah, Edward, Yang, Palom, Porom, Edge, FuSoYa
FF5 Characters- Bartz, Faris, Reina, Galuf, Krile
FF6 Characters- Terra, Locke, Celes, Edgar, Cyan, Sabin, Setzer, Shadow, Mog
FF7 Characters- Cloud, Tifa, Barret, Red XIII, Yuffie, Cait Sith, Cid
FF8 Characters- Squall, Quistis, Rinoa, Selphie, Irvine, Laguna
FF9 Characters- Zidane, Dagger (Garnet), Steiner, Vivi, Amarant, Eiko, Quina, Freya
FF10 Characters- Tidus, Wakka, Yuna, Lulu, Rikku, Auron, Kimhari
FF12 Characters- Vaan, Balthier, Ashe, Basch, Penelo, Fran
FF13 Characters- Lighning, Snow, Vanille, Sazh, Yun Fang, Hope

Well, if you count Cloud, that is a total of 3 out of 71 names involving the weather. 4 if you count Terra which is just a latin name for land and a fairly common american name.

Your point about meteorological names is moot.

No offense but I believe I'm done with your reviews as this is the second instance where I've found you complaining about something that doesn't warrant frustration of any kind.
Oh, and final fantasy has ALWAYS been linear. Always.
--
If terra is considered meteorlogical then maria can be too.
Luneth ... they combined the moon and a name to get something new. OMG! maybe i shouldn't call them out on all the their elemental spells too.
Ingus .... in·cus which is Spelled[ing-kuhs] ... is a cumulonimbus cloud form.
Arc... either can be found in electricity or astronomy or etc. Lightening does arc at times.
Yang ... means daylight
Reina ... a somewhat less common name form of Rena which is the female name form of marina which then leads you to the sea.
cloud and Squall of course.
Laguna... is more closely related to the nautical. But if Squall and Tidus is accepted, then so is this one.
Lighning.... obvious where that came from...
snow....
--
 

keinushi

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FinalHeart95 said:
keinushi said:
I hated it as well, and wtf was this guy thinking???? You can not relate to the black guy, in fact, none of my friends can even stand him!!!! I sold it simply so I wouldn't have to listen to any of their voices anymore. the only one I could relate to was Lightning, and that was only because she hated all of them as well! this is the worst review I have ever heard, and I hope this guy goes to the deepest layer of video game hell.
Aren't opinions just a blast?

The general rule of thumb I'm seeing is:

Liked FFX, hated FFXII = Like FFXIII
Hated FFX, liked FFXII = Hate FFXIII
Liked both = Probably like FFXIII
Hated both = Why were you even thinking of buying this game?
I bought it because I am a true blue FF fan, and have enjoyed almost every single ff game ever released. Minus 6 & 7 of course. all the others have been pretty good, but this one, you don't even get to control your entire party. wtf???
 

Wounded Melody

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Regarding names--
Tidus and Yuna meant sun and moon in Japanese, or so I've heard
Lightning is weather related but not her real name, although her real name is also weather based *gah*
Don't forget Raine and Laguna, which some ppl have surmised means 'rain' + 'lagoon' = 'squall'
And Terra is the English name, Tina is the Japanese one.
 

Dakeyras-Way

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So if we go back to the word meanings like 30% of the characters are weather or elementally related :p

Cloud, Raine, Squall, Laguna, Tidus, Yuna, Lightning, Luneth, Terra

Oh and I dont know for sure but i'm pretty sure Firion means "of the fire"...
 

Dakeyras-Way

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Dakeyras-Way said:
So if we go back to the word meanings like 30% of the characters are weather or elementally related :p

Cloud, Raine, Squall, Laguna, Tidus, Yuna, Lightning, Luneth, Terra, Arc

Oh and I dont know for sure but i'm pretty sure Firion means "of the fire"...
Actually i hate to double post but Maria means "bitter sea", Locke means "forest", Shadow (well obviously) means "Shade from Sun", Garnet means "gem" (DUH) which while not meteorological is sort of elemental. And Lulu means "pearl".. And Ashe means "ash", OOO and Faris means "Iron strong", and

So thats actually about a third of the characters which have elemental/meteorological names.. Plus the site i was using only could work out about 1 in 3 of the names so the others that it didnt work out could quite easily be elemental/meteorological as well...

(PS Ironically Cecil means 'Blind' which if you've played the game Cecil definitely starts the game as this (metaphorically)
Oh and Vivi means alive.. which again is really ironic... Actually researching most of the names actually in hind sight is an accurate representation of most characters in the games. Obviously not the ones previously mentioned..
 

SomeUnregPunk

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Maria is also the plural form of mare which is then means the many dark spots of the moon.

I only know that because I find it funny that both Terra and Maria is female names of plant size things.

CORRODED SIN said:
John Funk said:
Review: Final Fantasy XIII

Final Fantasy XIII stumbles out of the gate, but catches up by the end once it finds its Focus.

Read Full Article
Actually the pre-rendered cut scenes don't make me wonder why they didn't use the game engine, the pre-rendered cut scenes make me wonder why they didn't make a FUCKING MOVIE.
They tried that already. It didn't do as well as traditional cartoon movies did.
That spirits movie would have been better as a game anyhow.
 

John Funk

U.N. Owen Was Him?
Dec 20, 2005
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no kidding. I even named Cloud Cirrus once. Probably thats what they'll start doing next. Going throgh the various types of clouds. I may rent this. It has a comiedic gun toting black guy in it. Reminds me of Barret wallace. This is the SECOND game to have a (native american?) in it.
 

Deady Kwob

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Personally, when I hear that the game is "linear" it don't read it as applying to the plot. All CRPGs, Final Fantasy ones in particular, have very linear plots. I'm more disappointed about the lack of variety in player actions.

Consider, I'm about 6 hours in, and all I've done is
-run along a fairly narrow path, occasionally going on small branches to get treasure chests
-fight monsters
-watch non-interactive cut scenes
-read background information found by selecting items in the game menu!

As a comparison, the in the same time period in FF7, up to the escape from Midgar, I did all of the above, plus:
-wander around towns talking to people, learning background information that way
-learn the materia system, which for provided greater character customization than anything in FF13
-participate in several "action plus battle" sequence, like the escape from the train or protecting Aerith from guards using dropped barrels
-go around a town gathering cross-dressing items for Cloud
-the epic escape from Shinra HQ, which involves several boss fights and a motorcycle minigame

It's not a lot, but I find the mini-activities in FF7 provide a nice change of pace from the relentless "run. fight. watch. repeat." stuff in FF13.
 

FinalHeart95

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keinushi said:
FinalHeart95 said:
keinushi said:
I hated it as well, and wtf was this guy thinking???? You can not relate to the black guy, in fact, none of my friends can even stand him!!!! I sold it simply so I wouldn't have to listen to any of their voices anymore. the only one I could relate to was Lightning, and that was only because she hated all of them as well! this is the worst review I have ever heard, and I hope this guy goes to the deepest layer of video game hell.
Aren't opinions just a blast?

The general rule of thumb I'm seeing is:

Liked FFX, hated FFXII = Like FFXIII
Hated FFX, liked FFXII = Hate FFXIII
Liked both = Probably like FFXIII
Hated both = Why were you even thinking of buying this game?
I bought it because I am a true blue FF fan, and have enjoyed almost every single ff game ever released. Minus 6 & 7 of course. all the others have been pretty good, but this one, you don't even get to control your entire party. wtf???
Wait, you mean you DIDN'T like 6 or 7?

Also, in XII you only controlled one character as well, for the most part. Hell, you could control NONE OF THEM if you set your gambits correctly.
 

Buffoon

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Couldn't agree less with the reviewer's assessment of the plot. I absolutely loved the opening sections, I thought it was fantastic use of in media res, which is something the FF series has done rather well. I found it extremely intriguing to actually not know a lot about why the characters were doing what they were doing, and the revelations that came throughout the game were strengthened by the fact that not everything was clear.
 

Olrod

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Onyx Oblivion said:
The soundtrack is great, I especially like the Chocobo Theme from Nautilus. There. That doesn't spoil a damn thing.

I was bitterly disappointed that this piece of music (or rather, the English translation) wasn't included in the CD that came with the Collector's Edition.

Boo, Square Enix, boo.
 

Swmystery

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Mar 21, 2010
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I'll throw in my two cents, though I haven't finished the game yet so I can't comment on the story. There are many good things about FF13. The graphics are amazing, the characters feel human (in that they have likeable and dislikable aspects, and they do grow on you over time), and the combat system is one of the best of the series, I think. This being said, I think there are several flaws which keep it from being a great game, and merely make it a good one instead:

As many have said, all FF's have been linear. However, there are degrees of linerarity, ranging from the near-complete lack of linearity present in the latter half of VI to the tightly controlled X and XIII. I agree with the main reviewer that linearity is not inherently bad. I enjoyed X and I have enjoyed what I've played so far of XIII despite their linear natures. But additional side quests that involve more then just combat (as in this game's version of 12's god-awful Mark Hunting), a world map, and an airship to fly around said world map would have done wonders to soothe the feeling that FF13 is a series of dungeons, in that they would have helped maintain the illusion of choice present in previous titles, and allowed greater control over the pacing of the plot. The linearity is a flaw in the game that will bother some people more then others, but me not so much.

Next, the oft-mentioned no towns issue. This may not be a justified criticism, simply because the storyline makes it so that it wouldn't make sense for you to be running around traditional towns even if they did exist. The game makes it very clear that anyone fron Cocoon is terrified of anything and everything related to Pulse. So how, given what you are in the game, could you chat to random npc's for information when they're either too scared to talk to you, or will inform the police as soon as you walk away? How could you acquire new items and gear when the weapon shop owner's more likely to use his weapons on you then he is to sell them to you? Some particularly money-grubbing individuals might be willing to overlook it, but it couldn't have worked for all of them. The developers themselves acknowledged this, for better or worse. I am willing to bet the towns which linger in people's memories from previous FF's do so because of how they look and feel, and not because of where the item shop was.

On the other hand...would it really have been so hard for your party to go undercover while in said towns? L'Cie brands aren't exactly difficult to conceal- Serah proves that herself, and there is potential for drama if your team is found out while in one of them, not to mention the change of pace. And even if it's true that the defining characteristic of a town is how it looks and feels, the town needs to be of a certain size to accomplish that, which is apparantly not the case here.

The other thing which bugs me a little is the slow way in which the combat system is introduced to you. While only controlling one character doesn't bug me since you'd probably be dead by the time you finished manually inputting commands to all three later on, and I love the Crystalaium system more then any other since IX (simply because I'm picking my characters because they each offer something unique, as opposed to it not making any real difference who I make do what, as in VII, VIII, X-2, and most of all XII), because you only control one character, and until chapter 3 you only have access to the bare minimum of skills, it makes for a somewhat lacklustre experience to begin with. Storyline wise, the opening's fine, but in terms of combat it's repetitive and dull for the most part. Even then, it seems to unneccessarily limit your choices and options early on, where you have more then 3 party members, yet you can't swap them around or change the character you control until later. It would have almost better to give you total freedom over everything from the start and letting you experiment in the early game instead of holding your hand for so long, especially since the retry option means you won't be risking much by doing so.

Sorry for the long post. I reckon 13's a solid, enjoyable game, but lacks in several areas that make it not up to standards of the greatest games in the series. I'd say it's definetly worth getting if you enjoyed X.
 

keinushi

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FinalHeart95 said:
keinushi said:
FinalHeart95 said:
keinushi said:
I hated it as well, and wtf was this guy thinking???? You can not relate to the black guy, in fact, none of my friends can even stand him!!!! I sold it simply so I wouldn't have to listen to any of their voices anymore. the only one I could relate to was Lightning, and that was only because she hated all of them as well! this is the worst review I have ever heard, and I hope this guy goes to the deepest layer of video game hell.
Aren't opinions just a blast?

The general rule of thumb I'm seeing is:

Liked FFX, hated FFXII = Like FFXIII
Hated FFX, liked FFXII = Hate FFXIII
Liked both = Probably like FFXIII
Hated both = Why were you even thinking of buying this game?
I bought it because I am a true blue FF fan, and have enjoyed almost every single ff game ever released. Minus 6 & 7 of course. all the others have been pretty good, but this one, you don't even get to control your entire party. wtf???
Wait, you mean you DIDN'T like 6 or 7?

Also, in XII you only controlled one character as well, for the most part. Hell, you could control NONE OF THEM if you set your gambits correctly.
6 was just a bit too long winded for me, 7 was overhyped for a game where you play as a crossdressing Popeye the Sailor impersonator, and your right, 12 was crap too, got it confused with the ds version, which was actually fun
 

xerofayte

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I was bitterly disappointed that this piece of music (or rather, the English translation) wasn't included in the CD that came with the Collector's Edition.

Boo, Square Enix, boo.[/quote]


As was I. I just passed that part of the game this evening and was whistling along to it and driving the girlfriend insane at the same time. Its soo catchy!
 

AgentNein

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Just hit the point in the game where things open up and I finally have control over my party.

IMPRESSIONS! (yes their may be SPOILERS)

Love the game. Really, really dig it. The first bit was such a mind numbing trudge, any strategy consisted of getting the jump on the enemies. Thank god the magic and paradigm system hit. Made the game much more interesting.

Anyone else agree that at this point he only honest to god memorable area in the game at this point is that theme parkish place? On an aesthetic level it reminded me of a mashup between the Golden Saucer from FF7 and the Dark City Treno from FF9. You know, only without...anything to do....

On a side note, Square are a bunch of bastards for giving us a theme park area with nothing to do but chase around a chocobo chick for a few minutes. What the hell is that all about Square?!

Love the general pallet of the game. I was running around the outside of some airship with Lightning and it struck me. The game just has a wonderful use of color.

The general concept of Vanille as a character makes me worry for Square and their eternal salvation.

I have to admit, I miss towns. The theme park type area really highlighted this. Even walking around Hope's dad's pad was a nice change of pace. Sure the marker was clear as day but I just walked around for abit, checked out some pictures, it was just a nice change of pace. That's what this game needs more of in the first ten or fifteen hours. CHANGES OF PACE. Come to think of it, I also miss dungeons. Not just any old dungeon, but when Square would put some thought into them. It's the little things, like remember that area in FF9 where the castle was upside down? And at some point you realized that stats were reversed and you had to put on your worst equipment? Sometimes it's the little things, Square.

I dig all of the characters for the most part. Yeah they're still Final Fantasy characters, they still launch into gradeschool motivational speeches. I guess it's just something you have to accept if you're going to play a Final Fantasy game. For what it's worth, these guys some of the best. Even Snow redeemed himself for me, of course that involved being a badass driving around on a motorcycle made of two chicks.

On the whole Sazh suicide thing cop-out, it was sort of interesting because my roommate just started re-reading The Myth of Sisyphus when that happened. We both nodded our heads and made intellectual grunts at eachother. It was good times. But really, what a cop-out. They carried him away in a freaking coffin! How do they explain that one? Not that I don't like the character. I honestly do. I liked him so much that something like that might've effected me on an emotional level if I didn't already know it was a cop-out and that Square doesn't have the cajones to do something like this any more. YES I'M CHALLENGING YOU SQUARE.

The summons are just insane. It's Square at their most insane. And you know what, I like it. When they don't pull any punches, and show how fucking nuts they are, there's something liberating about it. Zazh has a devil type dude who transforms into a Hotwheels racecar. That's just fantastic.

I'm still finding the storyline pretty interesting, but is it me or is there not really a clear villain yet? I've always preferred the Final Fantasies that gave you a villain right off the bat more or less, and then didn't bring some wacky asshole out of left field as the REAL villain.

I miss random, optional secret junk in Square games. Is there any chance that I'm going to fight a sandworm and that this sandworm might eat me and my party, sending us into a secret optional area with a secret optional party member? No. Boo Square, Boo.

But yeah. So far so good. I don't know if I touched on the battle system but I love it to death.
 

VMerken

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Well, played it last weekend for about 8 hours trying to like the game, then stopped out of sheer boredom (what a godawful lame storyline, what papier-mache characters, what a simple battle system).

Now, I don't mind linearity. All games are linear - they start and they end. However, I hadn't thought the developers at Square-Enix would turn a huge part of a RPG into an action-oriented one-track dungeon corridor crawler. Because let's face it - the first part of FFXIII is not a RPG.

Maybe in a few weeks, I can muster up some motivation again to get to the part where things apparently get interesting. I pray that it will be worth it, that I get to play something resembling a RPG. But right now... yeesh.

Oh and yeah, for the statistics: I loved FFXII, the best Final Fantasy title to this point. Exploration, open ended-ness, solid storyline and likable characters which make sense - love all that. Needless to say, I didn't like FFX, which is also pretty corridor-like.

Have a good one!
 

Pocket Apocalypse

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Right, because it seems to be possible to predict closely what people will think of FF13 based on their opinions of FF10 and FF12, I'll start this by saying that I loved both games, though my preference is definitely for 12. Those of you who now think I'm retarded, please stop reading now. Clearly we are of such different preferences that no conversation on this topic is possible.

I more or less agree with Funk's review, in that I think the game starts off achingly, patronisingly slow, but is carried along by an impressively well-realised cast of (varying degrees of) assholes (major points, by the way, to Square for actually letting 'you' - Lightning - punch Snow in the face for being annoying XD) and nice-guys. It does come together neatly about the 25-hour mark, if you can get that far, and after that, there's some genuinely enjoyable, inspiring gameplay. I still get a shiver down my spine looking out across the Archylte Steppe.

There are two problems I've had with the game, though, that haven't seen much mention. Firstly, the rewards for each ordinary encounter feel frustratingly weak through most of the game, both in terms of XP and loot. I've never felt so strapped for cash in the final third of an FF game, never mind how tedious grinding upgrade items can be (I'm just past 70 hours in, deep in the optional content, and I've still not seen a Trapezohedron). It doesn't sound like it should be a substantial issue, but it makes the not-so-random encounters feel like such a chore, particularly since at lower levels, ordinary monsters can take several minutes to kill.

The second problem, for me, is the ending. I have to apologise; I don't know how to do spoiler cover-ups, so I'm going to try to describe my problem without spoilers. The warning signs come when you figure out who the main villain is, because the main villain is pants. You can see what Square were shooting for, but they're wide of the mark in every way; he's a scenery-chewing monster that you couldn't take seriously if he were real and had you at gun-point, and the attempt to give him motivation and sympathy falls completely flat because of it. No-one with supposedly noble motivations EVER cackled that hamishly over the heroes.

Far worse than that, though, is that at a point about 40 hours in (around the end of chapter 11, once everything's out in the open), two bizarre and distressing changes come over the central cast. Firstly, they stop being able to say anything that isn't either a whiny loss of faith or a farcical, cod-inspirational soundbyte barely worthy of a presidential candidate, and every cutscene for the remaining ~10 hours of the game consists of one of them whining and then the rest effectively saying 'Come on, don't give up!' in the most trite ways possible.

The second, more damaging, thing is that their actions stop making any sense at all. There are a couple of points where everything the characters have ever said they're trying to do goes out the window so they can smash stuff. The first of these happens at the start of chapter 12 and is mostly superficial given how the machinations of the bad guy unfold shortly afterwards. The second is actually the set-up for the final boss of the game. I'm sure most people reading this are familiar with what happens with the final boss of FF9 (again, I'm trying to avoid spoilers - sorry for my ineptitude); it's been the consensus of my housemates that this is at least as inexplicable, albeit slightly less random. Given how far the story and characters carry the game, to have them collapse on the final straight is really frustrating.

Having the final part of the levelling system - the bit that makes some of the optional content conceivably doable - only unlock after you beat the final boss is galling, as well, but that's a minor niggle.
 

F8L Fool

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Slycne said:
Linearity in and of itself isn't a bad thing. For example, pacing is generally much improved, but I think it's safe to safe Final Fantasy XIII is more linear then previous games in the series.
True. Sometimes the experience and overall gameplay is enhanced when the developers hold your hand, tell you where to look, and how to perceive things. At times a bit of structure really can help you feel sane and really involved with the story. At other times it can make you feel smothered, lacking control, and almost as though you're in an interactive movie of sorts.

Uncharted 2 is an example of when it's nice for a developer to put things on rails, yet still make you feel like you have freedom to explore throughout the entire game.

Oblivion is an example of when not having that guiding light (linearity) can at times feel overwhelming, and devoid of purpose. The only times where order is restored being when you stumble across the main quest line.

I have to agree however that it's far more linear than games in the past. Previous games have more diverging sections even in the linear dungeons. If you go down path A instead of B or C, you run the risk of missing something valuable. In this game you run the risk of missing essentially nothing that's of real value until 85% of the way through.

Jaranja said:
Me, I hated FFXII because it just wasn't a FF game any more.

OT: Why did you say the linearity was a bad thing to people that enjoy exploration? This is a FF game, people who don't like linearity shouldn't buy it.
The games really vary in how linear they are. Some sections have a lot more freedom to explore than the others. Not only that but at what point the world map opens up, how complex it is, and how populated with side quests it is, really varies a lot from game to game.

The games that are more linear generally speaking are the ones without the means to expand upon the ideas. When you look at games like FFVII, X, and IX they all had really expansive sections that were devoid of any sense of linearity.

PedroSteckecilo said:
When most of the dungeons are quite literally LINES I think calling the game "Agressively Linear" is fair.
Ha I agree. When you can look up at the mini-map and go "Strange, there's nothing there but a canal-esque path to 'explore' here", that's different than your typical linear games.

I mean there are dungeon crawlers that are expansive, consisting of many floors and layers, secret rooms, multiple bosses, and so on.

There's multi-path dungeons that are somewhat linear, but varied.

Then there's the one route straight to the end of the dungeon, with perhaps one or two culdesac's (that are easily distinguished as so) on the way. I think the latter would fall into the category of "Aggressively Linear", and sums up about 75% of the content within this game.
 

Fearzone

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Dec 3, 2008
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Just finished it, as a first time FF and JRPG player ever wanted to throw in my two cents.

Gameplay: Interesting system that handles team commands better than many games, maybe even better than most. It needs some refinement, but hopefully this is the starting point to deeper development (and hopefully more control) of this sort of "paradigm system." My main beef is the controls. Why is it to use a potion or change a target I have to navigate a ridiculously complicated menu system? Why do I have to specify that a potion be used on all of my party member when potions ONLY work on all party members? Why do I have to specify who to use the Phoenix Down on when only one is KO'd? For actions that need to be done on the fly it sometimes takes 4 or 5 steps. Bad, bad Square Enix!!

On linearity and RPG elements: For a game that forces us down highly linear pathways in all parts but Chapter 11, the whole upgrading weapons system was a chore, that was under-explained, and seems very random. In a more open world system where you can grind infinite amounts of components and gil, such a thing would makes sense, but in a linear and confined world things like crafting just feel misplaced. It slowed things down a lot and made the game less fun.

The story: WTF?!? Where it wasn't totally unintelligible it was laughably melodramatic, which never changes or tones down from opening sequence to closing. Mostly, I view it as a window into a different culture with different narrative standards than my own, and found some appreciation in it that way. I pretty much liked all the characters except Lightning. Sasz needed more soul.

Despite these critiques, it is a game which rises above the sum of its parts to be a fun and addictive experience that leaves me wanting more. The over-the-top story is laughably bad but at least is laughable, boss fights are tense, and the combat system is hopefully the first step in a new system for group control.

Finally, I'm in the camp that DID like the Chocobo song, with vocals.
 

Swmystery

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Pocket Apocalypse said:
Right, because it seems to be possible to predict closely what people will think of FF13 based on their opinions of FF10 and FF12, I'll start this by saying that I loved both games, though my preference is definitely for 12. Those of you who now think I'm retarded, please stop reading now. Clearly we are of such different preferences that no conversation on this topic is possible.

There are two problems I've had with the game, though, that haven't seen much mention. Firstly, the rewards for each ordinary encounter feel frustratingly weak through most of the game, both in terms of XP and loot. I've never felt so strapped for cash in the final third of an FF game, never mind how tedious grinding upgrade items can be (I'm just past 70 hours in, deep in the optional content, and I've still not seen a Trapezohedron). It doesn't sound like it should be a substantial issue, but it makes the not-so-random encounters feel like such a chore, particularly since at lower levels, ordinary monsters can take several minutes to kill.
Surely 12 suffers from this problem far more then 13 does? Unless you actively sit down and grind through long chains of enemies to amass hordes of loot, you won't be able to afford most of the equipment and spells by around the midpoint of the game, if not before. I also personally believe 12's combat to be far more tedious then 13's, but that's obviously something which is a personal dislike and so means little. These two factors meant that I found the combat in 12 was more tiresome by far then that of 13.

As far as XP goes, I actually liked the fact that they were actively trying to discourage griding for experience, because without any such caps almost all previous FF's have been too easy, at least in the main story, because all it took was running around an area or the world map beating up monsters and you could take on almost anything. By limiting your development it ensures a sense of challenge which can be removed in any other FF.
 

Xarandele

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Final Fantasy is absolute crap now,a nd people trying to give it nice reviews like this is why it will remain to be crap, The story was severely stupidly lacking, and no the battle system wasn't a great innovation or the best one they've had yet, it's complete shit, they've fixed it some in accordance to how FF12 was which was as we all know a complete load of crap, and Yahtzee has nailed this game completely on the head, I felt no compelling force what so ever to finish this game after the first disc because it was just completely and sadly a suck fest.

WOOOOOOHHHH You can control one character at a time and even then you just use fucking autobattle at a ratio of 99:1 And why the fuck would you not want to control your other characters? "You died, game over, these other two useless fucks can't revive you or continue the battle by themselves because they're absolutely retarded, start over again." It's absolute stupidity, I was once a long time fan of Final fantasy and I feel it's increasingly sad that retards are continueing to try and say Final Fantasy is good after it clearly started dying after 9. 10 was okay but it's like the last dying breath of a man and 10-2 and up so far have just been travesties to the greatest series that has existed, no let me rephrase that, used to exist.

Maybe it has skipped the minds of most people that USED to be fans of this series that its dying because they're trying to make it somethings its not, You don't play RPG's for the "Story" in most instances though yes story makes it better, You play this to become an absolute badass and for saying "Oh look, I found everything." Grinding was an essential part of the Final Fantasy series as it made you actually have to fight things thus making you appreciate many different aspects of the game more, such as concept and design as well as gave you something to look forward to obtaining as a reward, Why the living hell does anyone say that 13 is good is beyond me, You spend countless hours of your life playing extremely one track levels where you run in a straight line for an hour, enjoy 5 cutscenes that make half to absolutely no fucking sense and then you repeat, You get virtually no loot and the level system is severely lacking by making you get stronger on only SOME parts of the game and even then your still shit balls weak to even the weakest random encounters, which by the way is no longer a "Random Encounter" if you take into consideration it's the same damn monsters in the same damn place every damn time. You require gobs of upgrade materials and money to buy things of which you virtually find none, if you're lucky you may find one or two upgrade materials for stuff but unfortunately most of the ones you found in the beginning of the game are sold to the market because the game IS TO RETARDED TO TELL YOU TO KEEP THEM. Which I find is highly amazing considering a good portion of basically ALL OF THE FIRST DISC is pretty much a massive fucking tutorial. And they don't give credit to the materials until you figure it out mostly by yourself after its too late. But returning to the loot system, When I kill something I expect a reward, Not just the great grind of doing so in great aspects (Sarcasm) of getting to raise my near non existent 1 sphere in the next fucking disc, and usually even if I sell the sparse rewards I do receive Its not even enough to purchase enough potions to matter.

Then you move to the magic and summoning system, I suppose the return of the summon system that allows you to actually control the summon is okay, Though I find it highly pointless the way it is given, You spend 5 minutes whacking on a monster to raise your Gestalt gauge and then when you finally go into gestalt mode after the monster has been rather undestroyed by this supposedly OP summon wailing on them, You then go into a second form wh ere you wail on them using special attacks and/or can sacrifice all your gestalt moves to execute a finisher/final move or what I am gessing that is meant to be. Yet sadly this one move that can take up 2 gestalt moves or 30 causes the same ammount of damage NO MATTER WHEN ITS USED. Come on, you'd think if I accidentally hit the wrong button or did it intentionally and sacrificed 30 other moves it would at least do more damage, give something extra, at least put the monster in fucking chain break mode. Which was another sad part, after the summons finisher, for some reasont he monsters break chain magically resets to zero despite a millisecond previously it being at 199.9/200

All in all, final fantasy has once more proven why it's less desirable then a bullet to the brain.
 

ghostrider409895

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Mar 7, 2010
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The game seems pretty cool. I might rent it to see what it is like.

Also, good comment on the weather related names.

Just remember FF team, moving on to days of the week, months and the colors to name your characters is not a step in the right direction. We want actual names, not a random things you spot around your house. (I apologize if anyone was offended by the names comment. I am sure your name is lovely.)