Sega Puts a Stop to Streets of Rage Fan Game

Logan Westbrook

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Sega Puts a Stop to Streets of Rage Fan Game


Eight years of work may have been wasted on what could have been the grandest Streets of Rage game ever.

Fan projects are like the mayflies of the videogame world, in that they seem cursed with a very short lifespans. The most recent causality is Streets of Rage Remake, a fan game inspired by Sega's classic Streets of Rage titles for the Genesis, which was available for just a few days until Sega pulled the plug.

Street of Rage Remake was the result of eight years of work, although the word "remake" was something of a misnomer. SORR wasn't based on any individual Streets of Rage game, but was rather a new game that incorporated elements of them all. According to the project's official blog [http://www.bombergames.net/sorr_project/], all the information about the original Streets of Rage games was gathered by visual comparisons, and all the code in the game is original.

Bomber Games - the site behind the game - said that it had previously contacted Sega about using its copyrighted material, via email at first and then later by way of a formal letter. This doesn't seem to have protected it however. Sega contacted Bomber Games' owners and asked it to remove the download links. One of the site's forum moderators relayed [http://www.bombergames.net/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=2301&start=195#p103636] the news, and asked anyone who had downloaded the game, not to make it available anywhere else.

It seems unlikely that Bomber Games will be able to work anything out with Sega. It's not as if Sega really has anything to gain from SORR's availability; quite the opposite in fact, as it is still selling the Streets of Rage games, both via downloads and as part of compilations. It doesn't bode well for projects like the Sonic Fan Remix [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/104616-Stunning-Sonic-Fan-Game-Gets-Demo] either, which is a remake of Sonic the Hedgehog 2, a game that Sega also still sells.

Source: Kotaku [http://kotaku.com/#!5791059/fan+made-streets-of-rage-remake-pulled-after-request-from-sega]





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Trogdor1138

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It was an awesome fan game, I remember playing it and they got everything down. The soundtrack was also great and I still listen to it every so often. It's sad that after all that it gets taken down for no good reason.

Fuck you Sega, try making some decent games again.
 

Iglock

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Why?
They're not making any money from it- if anything it's free advertising.

Dick move, Sega.
 

Kevlar Eater

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Sega likes to shut down any fan remakes of anything that proves to be better than the original.

Basically, they did this because they suck.
 

Logan Westbrook

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♫Already got it!♫
So yeah, fuck you sega. Pulling this shit after the dude has already finished it.
Shit like this is why fans turn on companies.
 

JoJo

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Iglock said:
Why?
They're not making any money from it- if anything it's free advertising.

Dick move, Sega.
If Sega are still selling SOR games, then this could detract from their sales as some customers might get this version instead of paying for one.

Still sucks for the people who worked on this though :-(
 

Exocet

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Ugh...why publishers do that,especially when the project is complete and years of work have been poured into it,is beyond me.It's digusting really.Then again,this is the same soulless husk of a company that demands sequel after sequel of gradually worsening games.

I could never picture Valve shutting down Black Mesa.
 

SenseOfTumour

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Eight years of combined effort, and they checked with SEGA too. If SEGA are so threatened by a fan game, they need to just up n quit, if they really don't think they can do better.

The biggest dick move is that the makers went out of their way to check with SEGA, then when they showed they know how to make SoR better than SEGA, the bigger kid started throwing his toys out of the pram.

If SEGA had a clue, they'd HIRE the team involved and get SoR 5 a PSP/Steam/XBL/PSN release for $10 instead.

It's out there now, and SEGA getting all legal on it has probably given it more publicity than it ever would have got.

On top of that, stomping all over a fan game may get them maybe 3 more sales of SoR on Steam, but it'll all send a lot of other people looking for the fan game, which will now only be available on torrents, newsgroups and the like, where people who never considered piracy before, will now find all Sega games ever for free. I can guarantee the reaction of the people who've already got this game, will be to upload it to every possible outlet as a huge middle finger to SEGA for acting this way AFTER they'd bothered to ask permission.

Good move lawyers.
 

Gxas

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That bulldozer... The repressed memories... The horror...

Now I want this "remake"...
 

Serenegoose

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A bit too late for that surely? They can 'ask people not to make it available' but they can't exactly compel them. It got plenty of attention, I'm sure quite a few people have it on their hard drives now. Still, sega deserves this. If you ignore an email and written letter, let a team spend so much time on something, and only then try and shut it down, then you're being a deliberate dick, and I hope it gets nice and widely redistributed.
 

Iglock

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JoJoDeathunter said:
If Sega are still selling SOR games, then this could detract from their sales as some customers might get this version instead of paying for one.

Still sucks for the people who worked on this though :-(
True, but that's not really a valid argument.

If people prefer a low-budget fan-made game over Sega's high-budget official games- don't you think maybe Sega should work on making their own games better instead of shutting down fan-games?



SenseOfTumour said:
Agreed.
 

zombie711

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I wounder why didnt these people go to sega and say here a game already made. you can buy it from us and make money off it or you could ignor it and shut it down. your choice.
 

CM156_v1legacy

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To play the devil?s advocate, it says they ?contacted? them, never that they got permission. Perhaps that would be something to consider before making the game.
 

SenseOfTumour

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Also, if I was Bomber, after showing respect to SEGA and having it thrown in my face, I'd rename it 'Beats of Rage', rename all the characters, and release it as a legally protected 'parody' work. Possibly adding a paypal button so people can donate to Child's Play or the like too. Show just how much above Sega they can be. Maybe add a tired, burned out guy in a hedgehog cosplay suit called Chronic as a very easy boss fight.

After all, I'm assuming Activision can't sue over EA's 'Duty Calls', right?
 

fletch_talon

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If the creators of these fan projects did the right thing and asked permission to use what doesn't belong to them then they wouldn't get all the way to the end of their project and be surprised when they're told to take it down.

If you've got the time to make something based on worlds and characters that don't belong to you, surely you've got the time to make something original. You may even get to make some money off it.

As a community, gamers tend to have a go at devs for relying on the same IPs over and over. Yet when a fan does it with an IP in which they had no creative input they become a martyr.

EDIT: Rereading suggests they had contacted Sega. If they were truly given permission to make and distribute (without charge) the game, then I'd say they should refuse to remove it. I think its more likely however that they misconstrued "yes you can make it" as "feel free to make it available to the whole internet".
 

JoJo

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Iglock said:
True, but that's not really a valid argument.

If people prefer a low-budget fan-made game over Sega's high-budget official games- don't you think maybe Sega should work on making their own games better instead of shutting down fan-games?
In my opinion it's Sega's IP and it's their right to protect their copyright and products, it would be nice if they let fan projects exist alongside their own products but they are business and they've got to do what brings in profit. Shame they didn't pick this up, touch it up a bit and then release it properly as some others have suggested, that would have been a worthwhile solution for all though maybe the legal stuff would be too complicated.
 

ThisIsSnake

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JoJoDeathunter said:
Iglock said:
Why?
They're not making any money from it- if anything it's free advertising.

Dick move, Sega.
If Sega are still selling SOR games, then this could detract from their sales as some customers might get this version instead of paying for one.

Still sucks for the people who worked on this though :-(
If a fan game is legitimately threatening sales of a game made by a large company like Sega then they have bigger issues to deal with.

It's kinda like a major author giving a cease and desist to a large fanfic project (somehow I think this might have happened before) or sueing a garage band for covering a major label song.
 

harvz

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umm, this may sound like a foolish question but couldn't there be some form of agreement where in sega would get a portion of the money? i mean, everyone would win, sega would have free money, developer gets compensation for 8 years (not as much but anyway) and consumer still gets game...oh wait, its free?

in that case sega could buy it and sell it as it sounds like it was better than what their selling anyway
 

Logan Westbrook

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Segac
A company that used to make quality games,
but now shuts down free fan projects.
Probably.
 

Iglock

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JoJoDeathunter said:
In my opinion it's Sega's IP and it's their right to protect their copyright and products, it would be nice if they let fan projects exist alongside their own products but they are business and they've got to do what brings in profit. Shame they didn't pick this up, touch it up a bit and then release it properly as some others have suggested, that would have been a worthwhile solution for all though maybe the legal stuff would be too complicated.
Also true, but I don't really see it as copyright infringement (although I'm sure legally it probably would be).

If they were making money from the game and/or they didn't acknowledge that the games characters and content are owned by Sega- then yes, it'd be fair of Sega to take legal action. However, the game is free and they have clearly acknowledged that the content is owned by Sega.

Hence why I don't personally think there's anything wrong with it.
 

yourbeliefs

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Glad I downloaded this before Sega came down on it.

JoJoDeathunter said:
Iglock said:
True, but that's not really a valid argument.

If people prefer a low-budget fan-made game over Sega's high-budget official games- don't you think maybe Sega should work on making their own games better instead of shutting down fan-games?
In my opinion it's Sega's IP and it's their right to protect their copyright and products, it would be nice if they let fan projects exist alongside their own products but they are business and they've got to do what brings in profit. Shame they didn't pick this up, touch it up a bit and then release it properly as some others have suggested, that would have been a worthwhile solution for all though maybe the legal stuff would be too complicated.
I agree with this. I love when people ***** when companies come down on independent developers who make games based on copyrighted properties of other companies. It's easy to just yell, "Way to kill creativity! What are YOU doing with your IP?! EPIC FAIL! This is better than what the company could make anyway!"

Imagine if it happened to you. It's easy to take the poor developer's side versus the Juggernauts like Activision, Sega, and EA. But imagine you're an independent developer who makes an insanely popular game, and then some guy comes around and uses your title, characters, and plot in their own game and pays you no royalties for it. Odds are you are going to lose money in this endeavor. These laws aren't any less valid based on how much money your company makes.
 

manythings

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Did they actually can it or did Sega ask them to come to the table quietly to hammer out an agreement over usage?
 

MurderousToaster

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Well, at least someone is making something decent out of Sega's IPs these days. All Sega do nowadays is release old games on XBL and make those terrible new Sonic games, seemingly.

I can't help but think that surely they saw this coming, though. If you use a company's coprighted stuff without their legal permission, you can quite easily expect them to come down on you pretty damn hard.
 

Zhukov

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Man, that sucks.

Now it's going to completely disappear.

There is absolutely no chance whatsoever of it turning up on torrent sites. Nuh uh. Won't happen. Never. Ever.
 

Iglock

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yourbeliefs said:
I agree with this. I love when people ***** when companies come down on independent developers who make games based on copyrighted properties of other companies. It's easy to just yell, "Way to kill creativity! What are YOU doing with your IP?! EPIC FAIL! This is better than what the company could make anyway!"

Imagine if it happened to you. It's easy to take the poor developer's side versus the Juggernauts like Activision, Sega, and EA. But imagine you're an independent developer who makes an insanely popular game, and then some guy comes around and uses your title, characters, and plot in their own game and pays you no royalties for it. Odds are you are going to lose money in this endeavor. These laws aren't any less valid based on how much money your company makes.
Fair points, but it's a free game.

My point is that they're not losing any actual money from it (you could argue that they're losing potential sales, but then how do you measure potential sales?).

Like I said, if they were selling it or stating that they owned the rights, then legal action (IMO) would be justified- but they're not.
 

Darks63

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Sega Could work with these guys to make a better SoR but instead go the typical dick route.
 

gellert1984

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Logan Westbrook said:
...all the information about the original Streets of Rage games was gathered by visual comparisons, and all the code in the game is original.
If true rename it 'public thoroughfare of angry' change a coupl of the chars outfit colours and republish, with a title page that says 'f*ck sony in the ass with a (blue) hedgehog'
 

Logan Westbrook

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What the hell? They're not making any money out of it, they're also doing free advertising using a game from the time Sega used to make good games!

Glad I still have a copy of that game on my hard disk, but I think they'll never be able to finish that special ending and extra levels that were still in the works. Screw you, Sega.

Reminds me of the time Square tore down the epic fan made Chrono Trigger 3D remake. Even the soundtrack had been beautifully remade!

Although despite all this, I can still see why Sega would do such a thing... >_<
Still sucks though. It's not like the game will be eradicated from the internet either.
 

Iglock

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gellert1984 said:
Logan Westbrook said:
...all the information about the original Streets of Rage games was gathered by visual comparisons, and all the code in the game is original.
If true rename it 'public thoroughfare of angry' change a coupl of the chars outfit colours and republish, with a title page that says 'f*ck sony in the ass with a (blue) hedgehog'
Heh. You mean Sega. :p

Though Sony may well deserve it too.
 

Toeys

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yourbeliefs said:
Glad I downloaded this before Sega came down on it.

JoJoDeathunter said:
Iglock said:
True, but that's not really a valid argument.

If people prefer a low-budget fan-made game over Sega's high-budget official games- don't you think maybe Sega should work on making their own games better instead of shutting down fan-games?
In my opinion it's Sega's IP and it's their right to protect their copyright and products, it would be nice if they let fan projects exist alongside their own products but they are business and they've got to do what brings in profit. Shame they didn't pick this up, touch it up a bit and then release it properly as some others have suggested, that would have been a worthwhile solution for all though maybe the legal stuff would be too complicated.
I agree with this. I love when people ***** when companies come down on independent developers who make games based on copyrighted properties of other companies. It's easy to just yell, "Way to kill creativity! What are YOU doing with your IP?! EPIC FAIL! This is better than what the company could make anyway!"

Imagine if it happened to you. It's easy to take the poor developer's side versus the Juggernauts like Activision, Sega, and EA. But imagine you're an independent developer who makes an insanely popular game, and then some guy comes around and uses your title, characters, and plot in their own game and pays you no royalties for it. Odds are you are going to lose money in this endeavor. These laws aren't any less valid based on how much money your company makes.
Having the law on their side doesn't mean that what they are doing is fair or right. I agree with the law and its purpose. I don't think that's what everyone are getting fussed up about either.

People are annoyed with Sega going to battle cause of principle against this non-profit developer which doesn't try to hide the fact that it's a remake of a Sega original.
No one are showing anger towards the laws or that they are allowed to do this.

Sega doesn't have to do this. They've lost more by doing it.
 

Sixties Spidey

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Wow. Sorry, Sega. I didn't know you were still butthurt about the fact that fans are still capable of doing much better work your franchises than you ever were to begin with. Apparently, they're still in denial about the fact that all they were ever capable of post-Dreamcast is dry-humping their franchises to death and re-releasing old Dreamcast games on the Xbox Live Arcade.

Grow the fuck up, Sega.
 

Mr C

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SenseOfTumour said:
If SEGA had a clue, they'd HIRE the team involved and get SoR 5 a PSP/Steam/XBL/PSN release for $10 instead.
This is what I was going to say.

This is really depressing for me, as a crusty old gamer I remember Sega when they were awesome. I still play and cherish my old Sega Megadrive and the Dreamcast was the best system nobody ever bought.
 

LawlessSquirrel

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SEGA seems to be very...unfriendly to their fanbase. One of the worst of the big companies, I'd say. I look back with nostalgia at the old SEGA, but the current one is like a grumpy old man telling the kids to get off his lawn.

I hope these guys take a legal sidestep, rename the game and throw in a pallete swap or something to keep SEGA away. It's a real shame when loyalty is rewarded by destroying years of your fan's work on a tribute.
 

UberNoodle

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This remake looks fantastic. And the Sonic game looks better than any Sonic produced by Sega themselves. It will killed soon, sure of it.

Sorry that this is long, but what I have to say, can't be said quickly. If you want to read it, click below.

In all fairness, these fan projects are using Sega's IP, but they are not for profit and are soley for the LOVE of these Sega games. These remakes aren't examples of theft. They are declarations of LOVE. Can't Sega see that? Who issued the cease and desist letters anyway? A number cruncher or Yuji Naka himself? There is a big difference between ripping off an idea for self serving purposes (as described earlier in this thread) and making something out of love FOR the IP holders.

I've been waiting with baited breath for Black Mesa to be finished, which is a total conversion for Half-Life 2 which remakes from the ground up the original game. It looks amazing and faithful like only a devoted fan project can be. Valve, Epic, etc know that fans remake games and use their IPs not for theft but out of love.

We are in the middle of a revolution in communication technology. The advent of the Smartphone is the beginning of what will be, for our grandchildren, constant Internet integration in our lives, augmented reality, digital duality becoming unified. Already there is fervent debate on dealing with 'protecting' IP in cases where logos are photographed or recorded in blogs, trademarks are spoken or shown without license, etc.

As we move towards this life-Internet integrated future, powered by portable devices and matured social Networking, features seen in sights like Youtube will be standard everywhere. It will open the door to mass expression of personal creativity on a global level. But it will also be a world founded on brands, consumerism and consumption, where there will be no cultural definition between owned IP and cultural iconography.

I don't know where I'm going here, but what I'm trying to describe is a future that is a nightmare for overprotective IP holders. They can either embrace this change in culture and find new ways to define IP theft, thus using the rabid creativity of the Internet community, OR they can litigate and threaten these people who only want to rejoice and celebrate the pop-culture which they love. The designation of 'art' allows the use of IP for artistic purposes, but getting the 'art' label is very difficult. Games are products. Videos are products. Etc.

I believe that we as fans should be allowed to celebrate what we love by making fan games and art, and so forth. The IP holders can't eat their cake and have it too. If they want to make their characters part of the cultural heritage of the age, they have to accept that it will be reappropriated by the culture. It will no longer soley belong to them. George Lucas gets it. He doesn't threaten legal action to the thousands of fan films being made. Valve and Epic get it. Does Sega get it - that Sonic and SOR are icons for a multiple generations?

Anyway, is this too heavy? Sorry for the flood of text. I hope I have explained what I'm talking about. IP law is to protect a profit when threatened by a theft of ideas. Copyright is to protect the physical manifestations of those ideas. I can understand legal threats about theft of code and pixels, but when the only 'stolen' thing is the IDEA, or concept, and everything else is newly generated, it is an abuse. User generated content is the new buzzword in the console world, but on PC it has been a foundation of gaming for many many years.

For inspiration, and it is a great site to read, check out Orion's Arm (http://www.orionsarm.com/). It is an encyclopedia of the next few thousand years of human evolution. It is entirely community generated and controlled. Pretty amazing. And what about Metro 2033? The novel was released for free in Russia. It became a community, multimedia project, before finally becoming a killer PC game and a newly edited, published version of the novel is now being sold. That's amazing as well.

Can you imagine when user generated gaming is not just mods and conversions, but if a community like at Orion's Arm got together and made the most ambitious and intricate space opera RPG ever attempted? If we are talking about IP, every single contributer has their own claim to their own IP, but if they all sought to 'protect' it, very little of the magnitude done already would be possible.

That's the power of community creativity, and they are the next waves of star game designers - the next Miyamotos or Syd Meads! Killing fan projects is the wrong way to go. They are part of a spectrum that includes indie, experimental, and the next hardcore blockbusters. Sega should have the confidence to nuture these fan projects, because they only exist out of love for the brand and what it stands for. But what does it stand for now?

SO yes, Sega have a right to keep their IP to themselves, but by the same token, their classic IP is now so much more than product. It is culture and part of so many people's lives. I'm sure that Sega could have found a way to support this remake and also be happy it was getting what it 'deserved'. In all, the remake says a resounding THANK YOU to Sega, so Sega should give a resounding thank you back by not treating devoted fans as criminals trying to steal a buck.
 

Cliff_m85

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I completely understand and have to side with Sega. I mean, do they really want to sully their reputation by having a good game tied to them? They worked hard to turn to shit, and I'd be damned if some interweb nerd tried to take that away from them.

ofst ficled
 

FarleShadow

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They're prolly D&C'ing it until someone in their programming department can go through it with a fine tooth comb to make sure it doesn't have like, a secret sex game built in, then they'll prolly just ask for a % cut of the sales and release it.

Well, that's what I'd do.
 

MrJoyless

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Why couldnt they just make a different game with different characters and a different name and market it as the spiritual successor to Streets of Rage...attaching ones self to an unlicensed IP is just asking for someone to butthurt...

On that topic off to make a remake of General Chaos....fuck that game was awesome....
 

ace_of_something

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As cool as it is to do fan tributes and remakes. I can see why companies don't like that. Just because they haven't touched an IP in some years doesn't give people the right to use it.
[a href=http://copyright.cornell.edu/resources/publicdomain.cfm]Public Domain does not work that way![/a]
 

ComicsAreWeird

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Sega, get your shit together and make a brand-new HD Streets of Rage game. Or maybe look at what Capcom did with Street Fighter 4 and take what made the game great and enhance the graphics (but keep it a side-scrolling beat´em up). What we dont need is dick moves like this.
 

DTWolfwood

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LawlessSquirrel said:
SEGA seems to be very...unfriendly to their fanbase. One of the worst of the big companies, I'd say. I look back with nostalgia at the old SEGA, but the current one is like a grumpy old man telling the kids to get off his lawn.

I hope these guys take a legal sidestep, rename the game and throw in a pallete swap or something to keep SEGA away. It's a real shame when loyalty is rewarded by destroying years of your fan's work on a tribute.
seconded that motion
 

SenseOfTumour

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Sadly, it seems to be the way of the big corporations nowadays, why on earth would they contact the makers and offer them a deal where both Sega and the creators could make some cash on a dead IP, when they can just stomp all over a non profit fan project and ensure they make zero cents entirely.

The makers said on their site that they were struggling to make online multiplayer, so left it out rather than have a second grade option in their game, Sega could have put their team on it for what..a day maybe, and had a great multiplayer release ready to go. Easy big sales on Xbox Live, the PSN network, Steam, etc. Big piles of $10 sales all over the place.

Of course, a days work on putting some network code into a game is far more effort than cut n pasting old dreamcast and megadrive games over with zero effort or improvements.

I'd be interested in seeing the curve of Steam sales of Streets of Rage over the last and next month.
 

v3n0mat3

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The thing is, SEGA hates being upstaged, especially by fans. Because they keep making shit sequels of their own games, then when someone else comes along with a better remake... SEGA will not have that. I'm a SEGA kid all the way, but when they pull this kinda crap, it makes me wonder...
 

similar.squirrel

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Why didn't they just make some cosmetic changes, then have some seemingly random user release a mod that brought the game back into it's original glory?
 

Quiet Stranger

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John Marcone said:
&#9835;Already got it!&#9835;
So yeah, fuck you sega. Pulling this shit after the dude has already finished it.
Shit like this is why fans turn on companies.

*whispers* hey man, can ya hook me up?


OT: Fuck you sega ya fucking ass holes
 

Zeraki

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Hey Sega I've got this really crazy idea. Instead of pissing on the fans that actually want another Streets of Rage, make a new one! Seriously Streets of Rage 3 came out in the mid 90's, it's time to try making good games again.
 

Logan Westbrook

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SenseOfTumour said:
Also, if I was Bomber, after showing respect to SEGA and having it thrown in my face, I'd rename it 'Beats of Rage', rename all the characters, and release it as a legally protected 'parody' work. Possibly adding a paypal button so people can donate to Child's Play or the like too. Show just how much above Sega they can be. Maybe add a tired, burned out guy in a hedgehog cosplay suit called Chronic as a very easy boss fight.

After all, I'm assuming Activision can't sue over EA's 'Duty Calls', right?
Whether or not you were joking, hat's a very good point - parodies have special exemption from copyright law, so doing this could not only be a massive take-that to Sega but also a way for the developer to get his work out there.
 

Madman123456

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Sega is one of the "Asshole Companies". They didn't care much about the Games when their consoles where dying, they cared for the Money they could get right now. Well, every Company does that of course or otherwise they wouldn't be a company for much longer.
But Sega here doesn't understand PR. They may have wanted to keep their Options open, see how this remake is going and then decide if the old games will be on another old games compilation.

They probably figured that if this remake is going to be downloaded very often, People want Streets of Rage. So they'll sent a cease and desist order and on the next Sega Genesis collection, you're going to see Streets of Rage again.

And if Collections are the only way to play Streets of Rage, People will buy these Collections. They wont buy Collections if there's a Streets of Rage game better then anything Sega has ever done. Sega seems to think so at least.


Sega has proven to be even more greedy and lazy then usual for a big Company once again.

Bomber Games should rename their Game to "Streets of Greed" and redraw some Sprites. "Mr.X" should be replaced by a old drunk blue Hedgehog who constantly drools and tries to sell copies of old games.
 

mindlesspuppet

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I have to wonder why these guys didn't just save themselves sometime and use the Beats of Rage engine... oh well.
 

SenseOfTumour

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InterAirplay said:
SenseOfTumour said:
Also, if I was Bomber, after showing respect to SEGA and having it thrown in my face, I'd rename it 'Beats of Rage', rename all the characters, and release it as a legally protected 'parody' work. Possibly adding a paypal button so people can donate to Child's Play or the like too. Show just how much above Sega they can be. Maybe add a tired, burned out guy in a hedgehog cosplay suit called Chronic as a very easy boss fight.

After all, I'm assuming Activision can't sue over EA's 'Duty Calls', right?
Whether or not you were joking, that's a very good point - parodies have special exemption from copyright law, so doing this could not only be a massive take-that to Sega but also a way for the developer to get his work out there.
I indeed did mean it, and depending on how the creators feel about their treatment, I'd certainly look into it.

It's like buying your first love a ring then seeing it in a pawnbrokers window the next day.

I know if I'd spent eight years on something, and kept the IP owners, who I had so much respect for, informed of what was going on, and then on release, they decide 'now you've spent 8 years on this, we don't like it, throw it all in the bin or we'll bankrupt you, your family, your friends and your pet rabbit.', well, I'd probably change my opinion, and be happy to rewrite a few parts, 'Duty Calls' style, while still making it better than Sega's output, as an extra slap to their spoiled child reaction.

Reminds me of the 'immigrant' argument 'they come over here, can't even speak the language and take British jobs!'

If you're so bad at your job that someone who can't speak the language can fall off the back of a lorry and take over, you need to get better, not complain about them :D

Sega need to get better, not complain because they're getting schooled in game design by a group of fans.
 

Vibhor

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Aug 4, 2010
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Actually this made me go download the game illegally (the fan game) just to show sega the finger.
Its always something with japanese developers.
First make a good game and then forget it for eternity but when someone makes a remake and distributes it for free, they throw in a cease and desist.
That same happened with Chrono Trigger remake and now this. I actually loved this one as I had played it.
 

CM156_v1legacy

Revelation 9:6
Mar 23, 2011
3,997
0
0
SenseOfTumour said:
Sega need to get better, not complain because they're getting schooled in game design by a group of fans.
To be fair, it is rather demanding to expect them to compete with "free".

Personally, I don't know why you would spend 8 combined years on a project like this. It just seems like a waste of time to me.
 

ArmorArmadillo

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Mar 31, 2010
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While I'd like to say that this is a purely Stupid move on SEGAs part, since a fan project like this would only have renewed fan interest in a property that is otherwise gathering dust and provided a springboard for an official follow up, there is one thing they have that justifies their conduct.

US Copyright law has an unfortunate feature due to the evolution of juris prudence and civil procedure that failing to make claims on an issue that you are aware can hamper your claims in the future. Which is to say, not trying to enforce copyright on a small issue now may lose them the all their copyright protections on big claims in the future.
Sadly, as a result, companies often have to pursue claims like this just to protect their copyrights.
 

GGZeta

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Mar 11, 2011
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-Zen- said:
Sega: its pussy hurts because their fans make their own games better than they do.
Pretty much sums up my feelings as well. Also, when I heard the music and saw the character collection it got me all excited again for the franchise. I really want to find my sega and dig these games out to replay them.

I know from a business IP management sort of standpoint you can't let people make games for a franchise they haven't bought a license for... but why doesn't Bomber just change the sprites and call it Roads of Anger? They've stated that all of the code is there own, if they change the sprites and environment they'd have a completely different game that Sega couldn't get all butt hurt over. Heck, I'd volunteer to do the artwork for it for free too just for the opportunity to breath life into the genre of side scrolling beat-em-ups.
 

Logan Westbrook

Transform, Roll Out, Etc
Feb 21, 2008
17,672
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SenseOfTumour said:
Reminds me of the 'immigrant' argument 'they come over here, can't even speak the language and take British jobs!'

If you're so bad at your job that someone who can't speak the language can fall off the back of a lorry and take over, you need to get better, not complain about them :D
I know this is almost completely unrelated, but you'd think that they would blame the employer who is firing a worker and employing a new one just because he's such a greedy twat that he'll put one person out of a living and exploit the desperation of another by making him work for less.

Y'know, instead of blaming the other guy who needs to make a living and is getting screwed. But hey, the immigrant is more easily identifiable and is easy to complain about using bullshit rheoric, right?

*sigh*

sorry for rant.
 

DrunkMc

New member
Jul 20, 2009
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I say these guys "rebrand" the title Raging Streets, change the color scheme of the character's hair and clothes, and re-launch it. People will already know what it is, and they can get away with it.
 

True Nero

Dahaka Trainer
May 26, 2009
284
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0
i never really understood the things that Sega does. i mean, you've got a fanbase bigger than the entire population of Canada even though you CONSTANTLY disappoint us with horrible Sonic games and other lack luster wastes of time. and so when a bunch of rabid fans try to pay homage to their childhood and how awesome Sega is, LAWYERS AWAY!

seriously, Sega doesn't seem to give a crap about their fans at all. hell, you look at any other developer out there right now, and they would be ecstatic to see fans do all this work. having fans show that you guys are doing something right. not only that, but having fans be so motivated to make something like this Streets of Rage fan-game, it's a sign that you guys really made an impression on someone.

this is the same thing that Sega did to YTMND with all the sega parodies. they should feel honored that people love them so much even though all they do is practically everything but punch us all in the face individually. it's like they live to destroy.
 

ZombieGenesis

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Jealousy on Sega's part, they know they can't make anything that good anymore. They aren't allowed to.
 

ArmorArmadillo

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Mar 31, 2010
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True Nero said:
i never really understood the things that Sega does. i mean, you've got a fanbase bigger than the entire population of Canada even though you CONSTANTLY disappoint us with horrible Sonic games and other lack luster wastes of time. and so when a bunch of rabid fans try to pay homage to their childhood and how awesome Sega is, LAWYERS AWAY!

seriously, Sega doesn't seem to give a crap about their fans at all. hell, you look at any other developer out there right now, and they would be ecstatic to see fans do all this work. having fans show that you guys are doing something right. not only that, but having fans be so motivated to make something like this Streets of Rage fan-game, it's a sign that you guys really made an impression on someone.

this is the same thing that Sega did to YTMND with all the sega parodies. they should feel honored that people love them so much even though all they do is practically everything but punch us all in the face individually. it's like they live to destroy.
Again, its an unfortunate aspect of copyright law (and probably one of its bigger flaws) that you are obligated to go after known copyright infringements or you risk losing any claim to them.
 

Syntax Error

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Sep 7, 2008
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I would understand if Sega just pulled the plug quickly, but the fact that the makers contacted them about it beforehand is what makes this really asshole-ish.

EDIT:
DTWolfwood said:
LawlessSquirrel said:
SEGA seems to be very...unfriendly to their fanbase. One of the worst of the big companies, I'd say. I look back with nostalgia at the old SEGA, but the current one is like a grumpy old man telling the kids to get off his lawn.

I hope these guys take a legal sidestep, rename the game and throw in a pallete swap or something to keep SEGA away. It's a real shame when loyalty is rewarded by destroying years of your fan's work on a tribute.
seconded that motion
Making palette swaps might take a lot of time though.
 

Dastardly

Imaginary Friend
Apr 19, 2010
2,420
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Logan Westbrook said:
Permalink
It's a hard truth to swallow, but sometimes something done as a well-meaning tribute can be bad for the company. If you're giving away part or all of a product I'm selling, you're undercutting me... it amounts to unfair competition. Publicity is nice, but it's not as though Sega is an unknown. And publicity doesn't pay the bills for the next game's team.

Gone are the days when a fan-made tribute could be expected to stay within a close-knit circle of friends, or even a fairly-limited web. Now, if you create it, everyone can get their hands on it. That means even the simplest, most well-intentioned projects are subject to greater scrutiny, because they sometimes really are in competition with the real thing.

My heart goes out to the guys, but it appears this was a "labor of love" to begin with, so this ending shouldn't change much for them.
 

Aurora Firestorm

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First Square Enix shuts down all the Chrono Trigger fan projects when they have no desire to give the series a real remake or a better sequel, and now Sega?

Man, you guys. May as well try to shut down the fanfiction and fan art communities. Don't want anyone doing better than your artists, right? It's not like fans actually need creative outlets, or want to sing praises to your games by making their own, huh? Nope, fans never need to be happy.

A big Screw You to Sega, and Squeenix while I'm at it.
 

shadowmagus

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Feb 2, 2011
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So first Sega tries to slam Nintendo in the portable gaming market and gets egg not only on their face but their fancy shoes as well, and now they shut down an insignificant group doing a remake of a game over 10 years old.

Someone in Sega's press department needs to be shot for suggesting "Let's make bad press" week.
 

noble cookie

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Fucking SEGA.

(Supposed to read that in the original "SEGAAA" way, got it?)

Fucking SEGAAA, they be all jelly up in this ***** because homeboys makin' dey own games better dan SEGAAA. Dayum.
 

SenseOfTumour

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Dastardly said:
Logan Westbrook said:
Permalink
It's a hard truth to swallow, but sometimes something done as a well-meaning tribute can be bad for the company. If you're giving away part or all of a product I'm selling, you're undercutting me... it amounts to unfair competition. Publicity is nice, but it's not as though Sega is an unknown. And publicity doesn't pay the bills for the next game's team.

Gone are the days when a fan-made tribute could be expected to stay within a close-knit circle of friends, or even a fairly-limited web. Now, if you create it, everyone can get their hands on it. That means even the simplest, most well-intentioned projects are subject to greater scrutiny, because they sometimes really are in competition with the real thing.

My heart goes out to the guys, but it appears this was a "labor of love" to begin with, so this ending shouldn't change much for them.
I agree in part, I think however instead of getting straight on the hotline to the lawyers, they could have tried a compromise and worked on making it an official Sega release.

Maybe they did and Bomber didn't go for it, who knows, but I just sense it's another case of using lawyers to crush anything that can't afford to legally defend itself, right or wrong being irrelevant. I'm sure with some actual thought Sega could have made easy profit here, especially by treating a team that already love them the right way.

Hell if I did some Faith No More inspired songs and covers and released them for free online, and Mike Patton contacted me and said 'I love your stuff, I'd like to release it on my own record label, but it's gonna be a 95%/5% cut in my favour' I'd just be so happy he liked my stuff I'd go with it.

I sense Sega heard the old line 'no publicity is bad publicity' and decided Zynga, EA and Activision were getting way too much press attention. In breaking news, Bobby Kotick is looking for a transfer to Sega.
 

Gennadios

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I would like to thank Bit Torrent for making the download possible and for Sega being douches for letting me me know the game existed.

Forget Sega getting publicity, SORR will get more downloads this way than the devs could have hoped to otherwise.
 

Arsen

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Nov 26, 2008
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Dear people who remake, revise, or do "fan projects"...

DO NOT MAKE IT PUBLIC UNTIL YOU HAVE FINISHED THE GAME. I repeat. DO NOT IN ANY WAY, SHAPE, OR FORM MAKE IT OBVIOUS THAT YOU ARE WORKING ON A GAME SUCH AS THIS.

Release it later.

Arsen
 

Rad Party God

Party like it's 2010!
Feb 23, 2010
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Sega does what Ninten... ehh... does?

Seriously, what a dick move, just like Nintendo with anything fan related to their games.
 

Aurora Firestorm

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May 1, 2008
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Arsen's right. The correct way to do this is never publicize your fan game, then blast it out over the Internet when it's done too fast for anyone important to notice.

I don't know if you'd get sued or not, but in the end, no one could stop it.
 

punipunipyo

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Jan 20, 2011
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um, one point down for SEGA, for being a dick-tits, but on the other hand, the "remake" team, should REALLY consider their project now having NOT as a TOTAL ANNIHILATION, but just a "set back", because they ACTUALLY TOTALLY RE-coded the entire game from GROUND UP! at this point, FORGET SEGA's characters, dump the old arts, and "re-skin", "re-name" all the characters, heck, a cheap Monday-night cop-beat-on-gangs story plot is NOT that hard to make...

What I'm saying is...
"hey, guys at the RAGE REMAKE PROJECT, i followed(watched) your project grow, and have always wondered, why remake/revamp a game that's this old, and are accessible through emu? and having risks that the regional makers would come out and put a stop to your project(which DID happened)... I'd say since you are THIS close to finish the game, why not MAKE a brand new game!? (I bet the next move from SEGA is to sell you short, offer you fraction of your worth, and say... perhaps play good cop, and BUY the project off you, and make it a DLC game, offering you last resort...) DON'T! make this your own! You can do it! if you need (pixel? maybe HD? to catch up to current demands? like the new KOF?) art works in (ani)gif form, ask, I can help you, after all, I AM a animator (actually, an animation teacher, who couldn't finish my education at Academy of Art University; it was too RICH for my ass...) and I CAN animate, and I AM a okay character designer, didn't have a portfolio, but I did once have a DA account(long ago... need to update...)... (PuniPuniChan is the name) anyhow... don't let that get you down, these days... many new-retro-look titles CAN and WILL stand on their own, if half wit games like Scott Pilgrim; with game flaws and overpowering items, money bugs...etc can make big bucks... your game CAN, and WILL stand alone, and you don't NEED to pay loyalty to stupid SEGA. Form your own team... call it... RAGE-GAMES, or something... "

YOU CAN MAKE IT, you HAVE SUPPORTERS!
 

Sabrestar

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Apr 13, 2010
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Being legally in the right doesn't equate to being smart.

How much money would they be losing off of (legitimate, but probably negligible) non-sales of old SoR games, versus getting the rights to this (perhaps by hiring the designers on a contractual basis?) and selling it themselves?

Congrats Sega, you did the right thing legally and in the process shot yet another hole in your own foot.
 

vid87

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May 17, 2010
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I can understand the need to protect an intellectual property, even just on principle rather than profits, but this really strikes me as a missed opportunity on Sega's part to really look into consumer demand: maybe there were enough downloads of this project to justify a proper sequel. Megaman 9 + 10 and Final Fantasy The After Years apparently did well and those were primarily driven by nostalgia.
 

AugustFall

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May 5, 2009
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Why not do a valve and take what is no doubt better than anything you could have done and hire the dudes and rerelease it? Eugh I dunno I see why they did it but it still sucks.

This seems appropriate:

<youtube=sUXEpO4uflE>
 

PrototypeC

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Apr 19, 2009
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Sega is destroying this for no reason. What was your big plan for Streets of Rage, Sega? Full 3D? A tetris rip-off with a Streets of Rage theme?

You weren't gonna do shit except re-release the old ones online. Now sit the fuck down and leave your true fans alone.
 

Fappy

\[T]/
May 1, 2020
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What I would give for a new Streets of Rage. SEGA (at least in America) has been kicking their fans in the balls for the better part of the last decade. This and the Sonic 2 remake could be opportunities to win some of these fans back. They don't have to damn the projects! :<
 

FogHornG36

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Jan 29, 2011
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sega, you know, that company that failed at making consoles, and are now failing at making video games.
 

bricklayerofd00m

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May 17, 2010
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I have it here, downloaded it before Sega had it removed. Awesome game, you can play with a bunch of extra characters, you can make your own SoR game (with a feature called SoRR editor), you can play a bunch of extra modes (battle, volleyball, survival, boss rush). The single player campaign is a branching one, with multiple routes to be taken and tons, tons of extra features to unlock (from cheats to little cool extras such as character profiles and stuff).
 

fulano

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Oct 14, 2007
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This is hearbreaking. I, myself, spent some time with the game and can attest to the quality of the overall product.

I'd like for them to sort of change the name and the graphics so that they could keep going, but who knows. As far as I can remember the project was open source so I could see someone forking the project into something else ala Rage of the Dragons (anyone remember that game?).
 

gussy1z

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Aug 8, 2008
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Its harsh that the developers thought they had written permission to go ahead with this project for the last 8 years, just for Sega to change there minds. IT's not as if anyone's making money if it. My only thought is that maybe sega themselves are in the middle of making a new streets of rage game.
 

fulano

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Oct 14, 2007
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gussy1z said:
Its harsh that the developers had written permission to go ahead with this project for the last 8 years, just for Sega to change there minds. IT's not as if anyone's making money if it. My only thought is that maybe sega themselves are in the middle of making a new streets of rage game.
I, too, remember this. That blows hard.

Anyways, I started lurking around a few moments ago and quickly found a days' old download link. Now I'm waiting for the whooping 275m file to finish 'loading (hopefully it's not some killer virus, or something), to see what got SEGA's panties in a bunch so much.

I wasn't even gonna do it until I found out that the version they cancelled, 5.0 was the very last one. The game was done. Finished. After 8 years the project, which had been called an obsession by many, was finally over; so, I was like "Fuck it," and went to see what was up.

Either way, the gig is up for SEGA on this thing. They had 8 years to act and decided to get testy when all was said and done and the game was finished and out in the open. If I could easily find it on my own, just some days removed from them turning the hammer on the devs, I can tell in no uncertain terms that it will only get worse for them. What they managed was to give Bombergames free advertising and swell interest for the project.

My parting words would be that I'm pretty sure that SEGA's legal department must be filled with dummies.
 

drakythe

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Feb 10, 2011
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Quite literally, this is spilled milk. This is the internet circa 2011, Sega, The link was up long enough to be downloaded thousands of times. Trying to contain this won't work terribly well. In fact, it might kind of backfire given all the publicity SoRR is now receiving.
 

Jabberwock xeno

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Oct 30, 2009
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Iglock said:
Why?
They're not making any money from it- if anything it's free advertising.

Dick move, Sega.
This.

if you can argue it's an improvement, criticism or parody of the orginal, then sega can't do anything about it, take it to court.
 

Atmos Duality

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Mar 3, 2010
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It's always a head slapping dilemma when the fans create a better version of a classic game than the original creators do; and the original creators pull the plug to retain copyright enforcement.

Bet Sega was feeling pretty salty when they found out about that fangame.
 

lettri

New member
Oct 17, 2010
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Stupid SEGA. They let them finish it on purpose, and sue them only later, what? Why? They should have responded to the e-mails! Bastards!
 

Rabarberskurk

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Mar 31, 2010
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Gennadios said:
I would like to thank Bit Torrent for making the download possible and for Sega being douches for letting me me know the game existed.

Forget Sega getting publicity, SORR will get more downloads this way than the devs could have hoped to otherwise.
The streisand effect truly is wonderful, isn't it?
 

True Nero

Dahaka Trainer
May 26, 2009
284
0
0
ArmorArmadillo said:
True Nero said:
i never really understood the things that Sega does. i mean, you've got a fanbase bigger than the entire population of Canada even though you CONSTANTLY disappoint us with horrible Sonic games and other lack luster wastes of time. and so when a bunch of rabid fans try to pay homage to their childhood and how awesome Sega is, LAWYERS AWAY!

seriously, Sega doesn't seem to give a crap about their fans at all. hell, you look at any other developer out there right now, and they would be ecstatic to see fans do all this work. having fans show that you guys are doing something right. not only that, but having fans be so motivated to make something like this Streets of Rage fan-game, it's a sign that you guys really made an impression on someone.

this is the same thing that Sega did to YTMND with all the sega parodies. they should feel honored that people love them so much even though all they do is practically everything but punch us all in the face individually. it's like they live to destroy.
Again, its an unfortunate aspect of copyright law (and probably one of its bigger flaws) that you are obligated to go after known copyright infringements or you risk losing any claim to them.
yes, i will admit, copyright laws are there for reasons. but this isn't like they were trying to steal anything and there is such a thing as "having a sense of humor". companies have a choice not to file these complaints. look at nintendo and how many parodies there are of that. look at sony and see how many parodies there are of that. look at legend of zelda, metal gear solid, half life 2, portal, halo, everything. these are all companies that understand that by letting the fans show their support, it may open up a whole new market base. people who have never played halo or call of duty might see a fan video based on it, become interested and try it out.

now im not saying it should be ok, but i honestly don't see a problem if no profit is involved. and this isn't the first time that Sega has taken something way too seriously.
 

CM156_v1legacy

Revelation 9:6
Mar 23, 2011
3,997
0
0
Fronzel said:
As usual, lawyers make the world a darker, colder place.
We have to, for soon we will be sent to a brighter, hotter place.

OT: It does really suck, but to be fair, IP laws require you to protect your IP, else you loose it.
 
Mar 26, 2008
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I'm hoping this may be because Sega is working on Streets Of Rage 4, but given their track record with demolishing their own franchises I say leave it to the other guy.
 

oldtaku

New member
Jan 7, 2011
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I'm not sure about 'wasted'. At least they were smart enough to release it before pre-releasing it. So it's out there, people got it before SEGA C&Ded them... and it will live out there forever on teh interwebs. I see some active torrents for it.

The ones really wasting an opportunity here are SEGA. Did I say wasting? Pissing away.
 

fulano

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Oct 14, 2007
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Gave it a crack already, and it was awesome. It's got mad amounts of hard work; it still feels like a Streets of Rage game, but it is including multiple selectable characters (including Adam plus a few secret ones), redone soundtrack, redone levels, extra visual effects like transparencies, optional redone particle effects it seems, visual filtering, joypad support, unlockable extra mini-games including a freaking volleyball one, variable paths, bike chases (don't ask), 2-player coop, CPU-coop, what looks like leaderboards, etc.,...hell, there's even a level editor, from what I can gather--yes, a freaking level editor to make SOR levels... ...and a shop to buy stuff, kinda like MvC2, I think.

It does have a few odd shortcomings (it has crashed twice on me, but it stays mostly stable) but nothing that should be a deal breaker for anyone that would've been interested in a cool retro beat-em up.

Honestly, what the guys at Bombergames accomplished is nothing short of insane. It was a labor of love through and through, and a massive step forward from the previous version (which I also had the joy of playing at one point). Had the game have SEGA's marketing push, it would do freaking wonders for their reputation. The whole thing is that good. It, imho, easily blows away current professional offerings like Megaman 9 or 10, or any other retro inspired games these days, and this guys coded the entire thing on their own.

How hard can it be for SEGA to do the same as western companies? Take Bethesda for example, they left a bunch of tools laying around for gamers to fuck around with, and they're not suing anybody.

I understand if they want a cut of the whole thing, but the best way for them to do that would have been to just let the whole thing play out as it did, hire the devs, make a deal, and release an expanded, more polished version under their stead. Instead, they soured everyone's view of the whole thing.

What a sad waste...
 

Diablo2000

Tiger Robocop
Aug 29, 2010
1,159
0
0
fletch_talon said:
If the creators of these fan projects did the right thing and asked permission to use what doesn't belong to them then they wouldn't get all the way to the end of their project and be surprised when they're told to take it down.
But they DID ask permission from Sega before getting real about making this game, Sega didn't think they would get this far in the project probably so let them run loose (AKA Ignore them). Now that game released, they though:
Guy A: Oh, Shit, we shouldn't have let this happen, this are showing how horrible game makers we are.
Guy B:Let's sue them!
Guy C: But couldn't we work out a deal which benefits both sides? That way we would look less like jerks and making some money out of it.
Guy's Boss: You actually showed some clever thinking Guy C, so you are fired! We don't have such concept of good game making or clever ideas in here, we just want to make another shitty Sonic 3d plataform, this having a giant gay pink T-Rex as a Sonic friend.

Now, go searching before going all jerk over it, your troll.
 

Logan Westbrook

Transform, Roll Out, Etc
Feb 21, 2008
17,672
0
0
Lame move Sega, lame move.

Bets they some how acquire the content and release it for a "small sum"?
 

fletch_talon

New member
Nov 6, 2008
1,461
0
0
Diablo2000 said:
But they DID ask permission from Sega before getting real about making this game, Sega didn't think they would get this far in the project probably so let them run loose (AKA Ignore them). Now that game released, they though:
Guy A: Oh, Shit, we shouldn't have let this happen, this are showing how horrible game makers we are.
Guy B:Let's sue them!
Guy C: But couldn't we work out a deal which benefits both sides? That way we would look less like jerks and making some money out of it.
Guy's Boss: You actually showed some clever thinking Guy C, so you are fired! We don't have such concept of good game making or clever ideas in here, we just want to make another shitty Sonic 3d plataform, this having a giant gay pink T-Rex as a Sonic friend.

Now, go searching before going all jerk over it, your troll.
You suggest I get my facts straight and call me a troll...
Can you spell hypocrite?
Better yet, can you read the following paragraph?

fletch_talon said:
EDIT: Rereading suggests they had contacted Sega. If they were truly given permission to make and distribute (without charge) the game, then I'd say they should refuse to remove it. I think its more likely however that they misconstrued "yes you can make it" as "feel free to make it available to the whole internet".
That edit was added almost immediately after I posted as I realised my mistake. So unless you've been sitting with my post quoted in your "Reply to Thread" box since somewhere around 12:15am this morning (AEST) then you don't have an excuse for insulting me or otherwise making a fool of yourself.

For your benefit, I'll repeat.
If they asked Sega if they could use AND distribute (please note the bold) their copyrighted material, then they should feel free to keep it up.
If however they just asked to use it, and did not dscuss distribution, then they havn't got a leg to stand on and they should have seen this coming.
 

AgentBJ09

New member
May 24, 2010
818
0
0
Thankfully, I already have the game, and the UGC, so I'm covered.

Not too smart a move by SEGA. By doing this, all they're doing is encouraging people to find copies of the fan game instead of buying games from them.

And I'm quite sure the thing has spread so far that it's impossible now to remove it fully from the web.
 

hooksashands

New member
Apr 11, 2010
550
0
0
So much for user-made content seeing the light of day. Thousands will never know the joy of kicking a bulldozer to a stop.
 

Antari

Music Slave
Nov 4, 2009
2,246
0
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I loose all respect for a game company when its large enough to have a live-in Legal Team.