So,,, technically KOTOR never happened and Kyle Katarn probably isn't a Jedi anymore...

[Echopunk]

With the Disney deal done, everything that "happened" post Return of the Jedi no longer happened, or exists in some alternate universe, slider's style. Knights of the Old Republic should still be fine, right? It, and the Tales of the Jedi comics from Dark Horse that first introduced that period in Star Wars history, occured thousands of years before ROTJ, so they should be safe?

Not so. The basis of the Tales of the Jedi books came out of a section of end notes in Dark Empire, which took place after ROTJ. Exar Kun, a major character in the TOJ mythos, first appeared as a spirit in the Jedi Academy Trilogy. Those books were also set post ROTJ. It isn't looking good for my favorite era of the Star Wars timeline.

What about Kyle Katarn? Dark Forces was set both before and during the course of Episodes IV - VI, so he has a chance of actually existing. His status as a Jedi is uncertain, as it did not occur until after Return of the Jedi. Does this mean the Valley of the Jedi is still waiting around, untapped, on good old Ruusan?

If Darth Bane is canon, and he probably is since Emperor Palp... I mean Darth Sidious espouses the Rule of Two, that means that the comic series Jedi vs Sith probably had to happen. So, Ruusan is still full.

Or is it? It was originally conceived as part of the plot for Dark Forces 2:Jedi Knight, which took place in the, now contested, post ROTJ timeline. Wouldn't that make it fruit of the poisonous tree?

If Ruusan doesn't exist, and the New Sith War never happened, then it would follow Darth Bane doesn't exist anymore either. Since his Rule of Two was used in the prequel trilogy, is it possible that those movies are no longer canon as well?

That is an interesting trade-off. Sacrifice all of the Tales of the Jedi and Knights of the Old Republic themed material in exchange for striking the prequels from the timeline? I could almost take that deal.


Just thought I'd burn up some of my lunch hour by sharing some pointless ruminations. I am perfectly aware that none of these events happened, as they exist as films, novels, comic books, and games. Now, I'll just head back to my thorazine drip... I mean grilled chicken.

 

[DoPo]

Wait, did Disney announce they are retconning anything? I'm not up to speed but it seems you're suggesting it, yet I don't actually see why.

 

[hermes]

George Lucas already said the only true cannon was the one introduced by the movies, and everything else is, in different degrees, up for grabs and changes.

So, the plot points of comics, games, cartoons, spin-offs movies, novels, etc... are completely retconnable if it suits the writers.

 

[Scrustle]

At the moment at least, I don't think Disney have put much thought in to what exactly is and is not canon in the extended universe. I don't think they even care at all. As far as they're concerned, they just want to make sequels to the already existing films. They're not maliciously trying to erase anything from existence, they just want to extend the story beyond the currently existing films with yet more of them. Sure, you could respond to that with "but they already extended on the story", but I don't think Disney gives a damn. I don't think that's necessarily a bad thing though. The Star Wars universe has got pretty convoluted, so perhaps it could use a partial "reboot" of sorts.

 

[Zhukov]

Ah, the Star Wars extended universe.

Despite playing both the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight and KOTOR games, I barely understood a thing you said.

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

 

[boradam]

Ah, the Star Wars extended universe.

Despite playing both the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight and KOTOR games, I barely understood a thing you said.

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

My understanding of EU extends only to what I learned from KotOR, Battlefront, Dark Forces, and Empire at War/Force Commander -- so I know that feel.

 

[Echopunk]

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

That gave me flashbacks to the worst roommate ever.

My understanding of EU extends only to what I learned from KotOR, Battlefront, Dark Forces, and Empire at War/Force Commander -- so I know that feel.

Same here, for the most part. Never got into Battlefront though. The Darth Bane and Jedi vs Sith knowledge came out of the misguided decision to mention that I liked Star Wars when the topic came up at a friend's house. One of his kids proceeded to give me an overview on everything that happened in the EU since I'd given up on the novels after the late 90's. If I never hear the words "Yuuzhan Vong" again, it will be too soon.

There are some times when having a near photo- and phonographic memory works against you!

 

[Hoplon]

Ah, the Star Wars extended universe.

Despite playing both the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight and KOTOR games, I barely understood a thing you said.

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

Gorgonzola.

it's the smell of a ripe Gorgonzola.

If they have canned the Eu, well good, for the tiny fraction that is good are vast swathes of awfulness and Boba Fett worship.

 

[Hero in a half shell]

Ah, the Star Wars extended universe.

Despite playing both the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight and KOTOR games, I barely understood a thing you said.

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

Hello.

I imagine that right now you're feeling a bit like Alice: Tumbling down the rabbit hole.


Take the blue pill, and you can exit the rabbit hole, go home, and believe whatever you want to believe.
Take the red pill and I show you just how deep the rabbit hole goes.

Spoiler: Blue

Spoiler: red

Spoiler: green

Where'd that green pill come from? Oh nevermind, I'm sure it's not important.

 

[Zhukov]

Ah, the Star Wars extended universe.

Despite playing both the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight and KOTOR games, I barely understood a thing you said.

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

Gorgonzola.

it's the smell of a ripe Gorgonzola.

Hey, I'll have you know that a correctly applied gorgonzola makes for a rich and tasty pasta sauce.

...

Just don't try and kiss the girlfriend immediately after dinner. You'll both regret it.

 

[Hoplon]

Ah, the Star Wars extended universe.

Despite playing both the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight and KOTOR games, I barely understood a thing you said.

I feel like I'm staring into a vast, deep, damp and slightly funny-smelling chasm.

Gorgonzola.

it's the smell of a ripe Gorgonzola.

Hey, I'll have you know that a correctly applied gorgonzola makes for a rich and tasty pasta sauce.

...

Just don't try and kiss the girlfriend immediately after dinner. You'll both regret it.

Sure, but it smells like creeping death.

 

[Neverhoodian]

snip

Whoa there, slow down a sec! No need to throw out the baby with the bath water, so to speak. Just because something is referenced in a story that is non-canon (and Dark Empire isn't non-canon at this time...though I wish to God it was) doesn't automatically render it non-canon as well. Besides, it's not as if the Star Wars canon has been terribly consistent in the first place anyway. KOTOR hardly resembles the Tales of the Jedi series in many respects, even though it supposedly takes place around the same time.

As for Kyle Katarn, I think he's safe. Most of his adventures are self-contained stories that are removed far enough from the main films so as to not cause any continuity hiccups. Even if the new films cause inconsistencies (like removing the Imperial Remnant or Luke's Jedi Academy on Yavin IV), you can always take a leaf from Star Trek's book considering EU sources and consider it part of an "alternate reality," where different events and decisions led to different outcomes.

Or you can just do what I do, and stick with your own "head canon." For example, my "head canon" dictates that there were four Star Wars films (A New Hope, The Empire Strikes Back, Return of the Jedi, and The Phantom Menace), the Genndy Tartakovsky Clone Wars cartoon, the two KOTOR games, the Dark Forces/Jedi Knight series, the X-Wing series of games and books, The Han Solo Adventures by Brian Daley, and Timothy Zahn's Thrawn trilogy. As for the other films and EU sources, I just pretend they don't exist.

 

[Quaxar]

Wait, did Disney announce they are retconning anything? I'm not up to speed but it seems you're suggesting it, yet I don't actually see why.

Well they're doing the new film... and of course no writer likes to have his story restricted by some silly decades of EU so necessarily whatever possible shit they come up with will be canon and everything contradictory fall out.

I guess I'm lucky that I didn't like most of the post-ROTJ stories anyway. I'm more of a Old Republic kind of guy. Hyperspace war, Great Sith War, Revan, ... ah, those were the times.

 

[The Selkie]

I haven't heard any announcement of a mass-retconning of everything post-ROTJ? And I'm not sure how your logic shows they'd have to retcon KOTOR?

I imagine they'll just let the writers take the story pretty much wherever they want, then the chap who's in charge of the continuity (who's name I've forgotten) will have the unenviable job of cutting out and tweaking whatever EU novels contradict the new trilogy.

 

[TheDrunkNinja]

Whoa there, slow down a sec! No need to throw out the baby with the bath water, so to speak. Just because something is referenced in a story that is non-canon (and Dark Empire isn't non-canon at this time...though I wish to God it was) doesn't automatically render it non-canon as well. Besides, it's not as if the Star Wars canon has been terribly consistent in the first place anyway. KOTOR hardly resembles the Tales of the Jedi series in many respects, even though it supposedly takes place around the same time.

Thank you for pointing that out. This was my first thought in regards the OP's mentioning of KotOR. Just because the ToJ has its roots in another story doesn't mean that all canonicity that followed it has now been rendered moot.

Like you said, KotOR has bigger continuity problems explaining the radical, galaxy-altering leap in technology in the 40-year gap between ToJ and the original KotOR.

 

[KingsGambit_v1legacy]

I was under the impression that everything in the novels at least, forming the "extended universe", was canon. All of it was approved by George Lucas for one thing. I remember reading a story about the killing off of a main character in NJO. The first proposition was Luke. Lucas said no. Han Solo was the next suggestion. No. Lando. No. The character they did kill in the end was approved by GL. So the "extended universe" is also null and void? What about Mara and Luke?

Ultimately, it doesn't really matter. The novels and games are still enjoyable and have little need to link to or reference the films.

 

[Soviet Heavy]

Ummm, nobody said it was non canon. The films are apparently going to star the main trio from the original films. If you look at where the timeline for the current EU novels ends, it just about matches up with the ages of the actors. So if they really want to create a whole new story, they will be looking at showing something immediately during the current period in which Han Luke and Leia find themselves.

The only things that might have an effect are Han and Leia's children, Chewbacca might be alive again, and Mara Jade will not be mentioned. Other than that, most of the post Return of the Jedi EU is okay. It's in the past.

 

[sextus the crazy]

You know what, who gives a fuck if it's canon?

It's not like being non-canon makes it disappear. It's still there if you like it.

Besides we're getting more star wars movies, and maybe they'll be alright.

 

[Abomination]

I thought they were canon but films take precedence if there's a conflict... right?

 

[Kolby Jack]

Honestly, I HOPE KoTOR gets removed from canon. It's a great game (as is KoTOR 2), but if KoTOR happened, that means SWTOR happened, and SWTOR's story suuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuucks.

BAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAADLY.

That was part of the reason I get so fed up with SWTOR. The constant grinding was, well, grinding, but I couldn't even get a decent story out of it? Good riddance.