so the earth is F***ed aparently..

Geth Reich

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Pfft yeah, the glorious days of our pre-Industrial and pre-Capitalist times were reknowned for their stability and prosperity. Who amongst you can honestly say you wouldn't trade in your computer and Escapist membership for a chance to live the exciting, fufilling and completely totally definitely not making this up stable life of someone from the 17th century?
 

BoTTeNBReKeR

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Oct 23, 2008
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6JKWhxNoq5k

I think this guy makes some very good points on how to move forward without going backwards in technology. I mean, to me it sounds like a good idea, but what do I know, right?
 

Augustine

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Jun 21, 2012
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Second book of Freakonomics had made argument about environment that I hold as the most well reasoned(not going to attempt to fit it here, sufficing to state it's conclusion: "No, history disagrees, the Earth is probably not F-d").
This had not shaken it in the slightest. Lack of visible data, review, or evidence reduces it to sensationalism. Once he comes up with something tangible, I would be happy to review and discuss the results.
 

Monsterfurby

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Mar 7, 2008
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The key problem behind the entire discourse is, once again, this:

It is physically impossible for us humans to achieve the "point of no return", where we topple the climate on planet earth indefinitely. Why? Because we as a species would be wiped out LONG before that point is reached. What scientists are talking about is merely the point where WE might not be able to reverse it. So yeah, afraid I'm with George Carlin here - saying that "the earth is fucked" or "we must save the planet" is complete and utter bullshit - it's mankind one should worry about, not the planet itself.
 

mad825

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Mar 28, 2010
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I take it then that Disturbed was right then?


Oh well, it is just another way to die.
 

Auron

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Geth Reich said:
Pfft yeah, the glorious days of our pre-Industrial and pre-Capitalist times were reknowned for their stability and prosperity. Who amongst you can honestly say you wouldn't trade in your computer and Escapist membership for a chance to live the exciting, fufilling and completely totally definitely not making this up stable life of someone from the 17th century?
One of the largest wars in history raging out for 30 years in central Europe and many to follow, no freezer, no electricity, unreliable gunpowder constructs, slavery, monarchies and nobility, churches dominating everything and a fully charged Inquisition... Man those were the times huh?
 

Unsilenced

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Oct 19, 2009
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How do these people expect to commit a genocide of billions of people and enforce strict population control without using modern technology?

And that's what this is talking about basically. You don't get from a population of 7 billion to one sustainable without modern farming practices without killing and/or sterilizing a lot of people, not to mention having people to suppress the re-development of technology. Presumably you have a ruling class allowed access to the fanciest guns and bombs to make sure nobody else makes a cotton gin, otherwise you'll just end up back where you started.


No wonder people with these kinds of beliefs tend to beat around the bush when it comes to logistics.
 

Monsterfurby

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Auron said:
One of the largest wars in history raging out for 30 years in central Europe and many to follow, no freezer, no electricity, unreliable gunpowder constructs, slavery, monarchies and nobility, churches dominating everything and a fully charged Inquisition... Man those were the times huh?
And perfectly [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Albrecht_von_Wallenstein] sane [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vlad_the_impaler] people [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Marie_Antoinette] in [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_III] charge [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ludwig_II_of_Bavaria] (over the course of history).

I, for one, prefer "boring and incompetent" to "made regicide socially acceptable" [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Caligula]. So here's to our modern leaders.
 

Spearmaster

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The earth has always been F**ked, its all a matter of when and what, sun going supernova, electromagnetic field shift, global warming, global cooling, planet killer comet/asteroid...the list goes on. This guy is using climate change, what he is presenting as a solution would solve the problem but even the most green Eco-terrorist would never give up the comforts of modern technology. Of all the ultra-green super environmentalists that Ive met 99.99% of them are hypocrites.

Look at his picture, I bet that hair dye was all natural right? Was his clothing handmade from cotton he grew on his 100% Eco friendly farm, hand woven and stitched by human hands? Truth is people like to think they are helping the environment but nobody actually looks behind them to see if they actually do, corporations prey on peoples good intentions with things like hybrid/electric cars, solar panels and wind turbines, telling people if they buy them they are helping the environment and people are more than happy to believe them, that way they don't have to actually do anything but still parade around with an inflated ego talking about how green they are. because they bought a car?

"There's a sucker born every minute."
- P.T. Barnum
 

maxmanrules

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5ilver said:
Well, as far as food goes, the size of a human has generally seen a steady increase which suggests food was plentiful. If there's a lack of food-> you get smaller or die and vice versa.

As far as stress and happiness, pretty much everything people did back then must have been related to hunting/fishing and eventually growing crops. And sex obviously. Whereas right now, we're forced to spend approx 7-20+ years doing nothing but studying. And then working behind a desk for the next 30 years after that :/
Compare that to doing literally nothing but drinking alcohol, fishing and making babies.
Yes, but you only lived for 20 years back then.

Plus, wars and disease and stuff.
And just because you survived does not mean food is plentiful.
 

Geth Reich

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Sep 16, 2012
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Auron said:
Geth Reich said:
Pfft yeah, the glorious days of our pre-Industrial and pre-Capitalist times were reknowned for their stability and prosperity. Who amongst you can honestly say you wouldn't trade in your computer and Escapist membership for a chance to live the exciting, fufilling and completely totally definitely not making this up stable life of someone from the 17th century?
One of the largest wars in history raging out for 30 years in central Europe and many to follow, no freezer, no electricity, unreliable gunpowder constructs, slavery, monarchies and nobility, churches dominating everything and a fully charged Inquisition... Man those were the times huh?
I know right?

We've been spoiled by our technology and our money and our rock and roll and our life expectancies of greater then 20 years and our internets.....
 

Kelgair

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May 20, 2012
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I might start believing all these doomsday predictors when they start living what they're preaching. Their models being actually accurately predictive might help too.
 

Gecko clown

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Mar 28, 2011
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My favorite part of these conversations is the last generation are basically going, "Yep... we fucked up. GOOD LUCK!"
 

Heinrich843

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Apr 1, 2009
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"YES! Get rid of all your stuff!

And buy my new line of certified earth healthy products! Only three easy payments of 49.99!"


Every time I see one of these. Every. Time.
 

CarlMin

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Kelgair said:
I might start believing all these doomsday predictors when they start living what they're preaching. Their models being actually accurately predictive might help too.
Depends on which doomsday predications you listen to. According to the IEA, we passed peak oil 2006, and might more or less run out of oil within the next 30 or so years. Is that an irrational doomsday predication?

Climate change is another interesting topic. The are observable impacts of climate change and more will come. However, until rising sea levels and expanding deserts will start effecting western countries, rather than some poor African farmers or the Asian megadeltas, nobody gives a crap, pretending that it simply isn't happening.

Even if the world around you would gradually collapse environmentally, with floodings and heat waves and whatnot, you wouldn't know about it, you wouldn't care about it, and you'd still say that these silly doomsday predictions are just bogus.