So What's the General Feeling About The Flash (CW)?

[Palindromemordnilap_v1legacy]

I like it, yes, because I think it knows exactly what it is and what it wants to be. It knows its about a guy whose powerset spits in the eye of physics every single time he uses it, a guy known for having particularly goofy villains even in a world full of goofy villains, a guy who's generally quite light hearted and optimistic...and so they just roll with it. Its not afraid to have Flash run across water to outrun a two-storey shark-man, to have him run across helicopter blades to catch a dude riding his own personal whirlwind, to have a goddamn psychic gorilla.
Its one of the reasons I don't much care for Arrow (one of the may reasons, but thats a rant for another time), because Arrow is suffering from one hell of an identity crisis. It started out in its first series wanting to be gritty and grounded and while I didn't particularly like the first series (I maintain that the second series is the only good one) I'll freely admit that can work, since Green Arrow is just a guy who's into archery who often fights street level thugs rather than big cosmic threats like some of the other JL members, and it at least gave the show a coherent theme. That theme was "Grrrrr" but whatevs, its someone's cup of tea even if its not mine. And then every series after that they've tried to get away from that, introducing more and more fantastical elements and lighter tones but all while still setting everything in the dark and having the characters main method of communication be scowling at each other. Arrow started with a fairly decent premise of "a guy fighting drug dealers and corrupt businessmen with a bow and arrow" but has since introduced magic, metahumans (including the Flash himself) and a serious abuse of technobabble to try and explain how computers work (seriously, given all they can do with "hacking" I swear they're just in the Matrix). Flash, on the other hand, let you know exactly what you were in for when its first episode featured its hero defusing a tornado by running round it in the other direction, and has stuck to that through both series.
Thats not to say its complete fluff though. The opposite end of the spectrum to Arrow is Supergirl, which felt like someone was trying to pummel me with enormous rolls of bubble wrap. Everything in Supergirl just felt so...consequence free. Every time they had a Big Emotional Moment I just couldn't care because they hadn't gone to enough effort to actually make me feel sad and were just expecting me to do so because they told me to. The equivalent of one of those studio audience Applause signs that lights up when you're supposed to clap.

I won't say The Flash doesn't have problems (the only "romance" plot I found tolerable was the Caitlin/Jay one in series two, I think mostly because it wasn't rammed into front focus and actually developed rather than simply telling us "these two love each other now!") and does take a few missteps, but overall I think it handles its characters, its themes and its premise way better than either of DCs two other offerings

 

[sumanoskae]

Spider-Man 1 and Spider-Man 2 are two of the best films ever made! The Dark Knight is the only superhero film that surpassed them in my book. Watchmen is also pretty awesome, but I think that has a lot to do with its superb source material.

I think that Flash is... overall a pretty decent show. I was way more into it before we got to the second half of season 2; no spoilers, but the motivation for one of the major players for season 2 make absolutely no sense, and the show doubles down on what I consider to be it's most persistent flaw, namely that the writers have no idea how to handle the Flash's powers.

What I mean by that is that so many of the Flash's fights become contrived because super speed is such an absurdly powerful ability; it's ridiculous that anyone can pose him a genuine threat. It seems like he occasionally just... forgets that he can literally DODGE BULLETS.

It kind of has the same sort of problem that Daredevil has; the amount of skill afforded to the main character changes from scene to scene, because they want to maintain tension. But what they accomplish is precisely the opposite; by having Barry and Matt get their asses kicked just... because, they create a constant reminder that the fights will always play out in whatever manner is convenient for the story.

But like I said, I DO like the show; the story is reasonably well paced, the characters are generally likable, and the tone is balanced well; the show never feels monochromatic.

And Detective West is just so awesome, that his presence alone makes up for a lot of flaws; I'm willing to put up with Barry having to learn insipid after-school morals every week because Joe West could dispense practical advice on ethnic genocide and it would still sound like warm, fatherly counseling.

Overall, good show, needs to be tightened up a bit.

 

[Jarrito3002]

I enjoyed the first season of Arrow power watched the whole season on netflix. It reminded of SmallVille in the beginning learning the extent of his powers, while fighting the baddie of the week but the over narrative wraps way better than Smallville did.

I think it balanced everything pretty good I liked how some villains got more interesting like Captain Cold went up in points of awesome compared to other interpretations I have seen.

My only gripes are some fights can be wonky, some things are dragged on a bit and I enjoyed Thawne but his whole thing got a bitty silly at times but overall Flash was good stuff and when I get a chance to power watch season 2 I will.

 

[WolfThomas]

The Supergirl crossover episodes is one of the most fun pieces of television ever. I wish it could be like that all the time.

Spoiler: Biiiiiig plot spoilers

It bugged me that Iris' boyfriend (Whose name escapes me) had to kill himself to unmake Dr. Zoom from time. (He's his ancestor) He could have easily just shot himself in the junk or declared "When this is over I'm getting a vasectomy!"

Spoiler: Legends of Tomorrow sheds some light on this, though not directly

There they show that changes in a timeline don't necessarily set immediately, there's some wriggle room depending on what has happened. They accidentally prevented a man from meeting his wife back in time. But later reintroduce them. Meaning the timeline stayed the same.

It's possible that had Eddy decided to have a vasectomy or shot his junk that Eobard Thawne might still have happened some other way. Like Eddy changing his mind or someone creating a child from his sperm against his will (like the Eobard Thawne). Thus not destroying him while he is a threat right then. Whereas Eddy's death was much harder to reverse so the new timeline locked almost immediately causing Eobard to paradox away to nothing.

Still it would have been worth a discussion in the show

 

[FPLOON]

It's great at what it does even if Season 2 tries to amp that shit up with "mixed" results... Then again, it got me into finally watching Arrow and making me realized that I still fucking miss Constantine, dammit! Get on that shit, CW! Have a week's worth of the Arrowverse-based premieres during the fall/spring! Canada be damned!!

Other than that, the Supergirl/The Flash crossover was boss as fuck in comparison to the Arrow/Constantine crossover... Also, spoiler alert, Kevin Smith directed one of the best Flash episodes thus far... (Yes, THAT Kevin Smith...)

 

[Something Amyss]

Sadly, I forgot I made this thread until I made another one. Not ignoring it...just forgot.

You know how Barry's mom was killed by a speedster? Well, in an investigation later on, they managed to extract some images using technobollocks. That's like technobabble but makes even less sense. What happened was that apparently, there was a silver mirror in the room - since silver has also been used for photography (wa-a-ay back), the idea was that they could extract images burnt into the mirror from 10+ years ago. And they'd be burnt in because of the energy around speedsters. So, that's technobollocksy enough, but then they managed to extract multiple images from the mirror. And then use further technobollocks to interpolate those images into 3D images.

And I thought that was fine. The show wasn't really trying that hard to be "scientific" and it worked mostly on arbitrary physics anyway. This was one of the worst offenders in arbitrary physics, though, so, while bad, it wasn't that much out of the ordinary.

This bothered me because I was a photography nerd back in the day. There are certain media where you can pull and separate multiple exposures, but it should have been a mess. But hey, I sort of shrugged it off. The thing that got me was the paradox created in the finale.

Spoiler

It's already established that Barry becomes The Flash in like 2020, until Eobard alters the timeline and creates the event early, altering the timeline so that he can go back to the future, etc. When his ancestor shoots himself, he disappears, but this entire world created by him is fine. Well, there's the singularity, the one that was already going to be created from time travel and that was dealt with. This timeline should no longer exist.

Unless they addressed that in season 2. Episodes 2-6 are up on Hulu, but that's it. I hate streaming sometimes.

It's a shame if the show devolves into more technobabble as it goes. Time travel in the show's already a bit strained.

Yeah, actually. For their faults, I find these superhero shows to be more up my alley than...well, most of the others. Even though I didn't really like Arrow itself. I watched the first couple of episodes and...ugh, it just came off as if the Arrow wanted really hard to be Batman. So I dropped that series. I've been told things improved in the later series but...well, Arrow looks way less interesting to begin with.

IIRC, Arrow was created because they had planned on spinning off from Smallvile (they went a different route and with a different actor, so this isn't strictly a spinoff). Green Arrow was part of Smallville primarily as a stand-in for Batman. The Arrow series didn't draw me in like Flash did so I have to agree.

I guess I could also add Heroes since it was pretty much X-Men but reskinned. Even then, only the first season was good - the rest managed to devolve into some barely connected insanity.

I think the big problem with Heroes is that in seasons 2+, it had to actually answer questions it set up, and I'm not sure they had answers.

I'm not sure - try 2 miles per hour. I may be just slightly off - adjust if needed.

I don't know if I can go that fast!

(seriously, I walk with a cane!)

For me, it's "okay." I've said this many times, so this may come off as a broken record, but for me, taking it in isolation, it's fine. I'm not that much of a superhero fan, but if I view it through the lens of pulp sci-fi, then yes, I can enjoy it. Not a "good" show IMO, but not a bad one. I prefer the first two seasons of Arrow, but come season 3, bleh.

Well, I tend to look at it in isolation in part because I don't seem to watch that much in the way of superhero shows. Which is weird, because I am kind of big on superheroes. I guess I'm just used to the days when the bar was pretty low.

That's something you have to run from? I quite like the Rami Spider-Man movies. All three of them.

No, it's something everyone else has to run from. I'm the heretic who hates the Raimi Spider-Man movies, so if I'm saying nice things, clearly the apocalypse is upon us.

At the start of it, we just had Arrow. Realistic, down to earth, dark, gritty. I actually like that, even if I don't like BvS for numerous reasons (like MoS though). Then we have The Flash, which tonally clashes with Arrow, and makes its titular show feel redundant. Of what use is a guy with a bow and arrow in a world of metahumans and time travel? This leaked over into season 3, and it felt like the series was undergoing an identity crisis. Since then, as I understand, the Arrowverse now includes Vixen (totem animals), Legends of Tomorrow (time travel), Constantine (demons), and for all intents and purposes, Supergirl (alternate dimensions and aliens). This coming from a series where, in its first outing, only stretched credulity once (an earthquake machine), and even the mirakuru didn't shatter my suspension of disbelief.

I think that's where we differ. I've had enough "realistic" superheroes, and I like that Flash is all Speed Forcey. Constantine interests me, though I forgot about it, and I'm at least curious about Supergirl. But I just couldn't get into Arrow. And I will probably try again, because all my friends watch it, but still.

In all honesty, I'd probably enjoy The Flash more if it was in its own setting.

More than fair, though.

Are you the goddamn Batman?

Do you really think so? I can understand offing the Suicide Squad, because as bone-headed as that was, Arrow didn't depend on their existence to function. If The Flash can't have...well, The Flash, then how would the show even work? Or is this a Barry Allen vs. Wally West vs. how the heck should I know who these people are? kind of thing?

They didn't want Batman in Smallville because they didn't like the idea of a Batman on the big and small screens, which is how we got to Arrow in the first place. It honestly surprised me when they chose to not only do a Flash movie, but aBarry Allen one. It wouldn't surprise me if they killed off not only Flash, but the show.

 

[DoPo]

Spoiler

It's already established that Barry becomes The Flash in like 2020, until Eobard alters the timeline and creates the event early, altering the timeline so that he can go back to the future, etc. When his ancestor shoots himself, he disappears, but this entire world created by him is fine. Well, there's the singularity, the one that was already going to be created from time travel and that was dealt with. This timeline should no longer exist.

Unless they addressed that in season 2. Episodes 2-6 are up on Hulu, but that's it. I hate streaming sometimes.

Oh...about that. See, in Season 2 they don't really deal with time travel as much...at first. But then they not only pull off something even more stupid, they also insist it's a thing by using it multiple times.

Spoiler: Minor spoiler just detailing what the concept is

So, in Season 2, they add a "time remnant". What's a time remnant you ask? Well, it's something that doesn't make sense. Here is it in short: you start your life at point B and continue living until you time travel, which is point C. You go back in time to point A which is before you were alive and you kill your grandfather, so you can never be born. This, of course, changes the timeline and you can no longer exists and you get erased. I think that's clear enough. Now, for the actual time remnant - that's you from point B to point C. According to Season 2, that you still exists until it time travels back. Duh. In case you were wondering - yes, that time remnant exists in the same timeline.

It doesn't necessarily need to be something a version of you that cannot exist. A more concise description would be a parallel spin-off "doomed" version of somebody. It's like it's from a parallel timeline but...it isn't from a parallel timeline.

I really didn't like that.

 

[rosac]

I really liked season 1 and most of season 2, but that ending to the season

Spoiler: season 2 ending

Well done, you've just undone 2 seasons of work of Barry getting over his mothers death. I understand why but fucking hell it feels like we've regressed a long long way. Also, well done on giving zoom a OMGwtfbomb and using time remnants aka the biggest amount of bullshit ever to solve something. His dad being Jay Garret was cool though

Also Arrow season 1 was good, season 2 was really really good, season 3 was crap and season 4 was worse.

Just give me a villain with obvious, tangible motives who actually feels like a menacing threat towards Ollie. Remove the lovey lovey stuff because it's becoming too overbearing. Make felicity somehow better because

Spoiler

fuck making her the new oracle.

just urgh. Dark was such a waste of a good actor for a villain.

 

[DoPo]

I really liked season 1 and most of season 2, but that ending to the season

Spoiler: season 2 ending

Well done, you've just undone 2 seasons of work of Barry getting over his mothers death. I understand why but fucking hell it feels like we've regressed a long long way. Also, well done on giving zoom a OMGwtfbomb and using time remnants aka the biggest amount of bullshit ever to solve something. His dad being Jay Garret was cool though

Since you're at it, let me also chip in with some of my own nitpicks

Spoiler

Let's start with the second season basically following the plot of the first one. There is Reverse Flash Zoom who wants Barry and it turns out they are actually somebody helpful close to him. Barry also apparently needs to gain EVEN MORE confidence in himself, since it's not really that he's not fast enough naturally. So, it's very similar to Season 1 but makes little sense.

Oh, and somehow Flash seems even more incompetent in fights than when he was learning the ropes before - pretty much any fight starts with him SOMEHOW being bested. Sometimes it's lame but almost excusable, like when a GIANT MAN-SHARK SNEAKS UP BEHIND HIM IN THE MIDDLE OF THE STREET. Yeah, sure, he had his back turned. There was also his new girlfriend looking in the same direction yet she didn't spot it. But OK - fine let's add it to the almost excusable list. Then there are situations where the Flash is apparently not fast enough to dodge human reflexes. Even if it's actually a metahuman throwing projectiles - whatever, the baddie hasn't been established as inhumanly quick. That's stupid.

There is also the thing where he didn't completely forget some skills from Season one, he just never really used them. Like the phasing through matter - there were multiple situations where it would have been useful. The one time there was an excuse (he was trapped in a prison cell in the alternative galaxy), he forgot. Until his friends reminded him. Even if the justification was weak (the vibration rate of matter is different) I'd actually take it. It made enough sense for me to buy it.

Then there is the whole romance thing with his childhood friend that magically got poofed away only to get brought back later on in the season.

 

[rosac]

snip

Spoiler

I forgot about patty! It's a shame as she interested me- a cop who wants to hunt metahumans and is very intelligent. Shame she was dropped for his step sister (again.) EXCEPT flashpoint will no doubt mess that up because "Oh noes he messed with time, everything is different now, all this shit has/hasn't happened, the cake is a lie etc etc." I hate that they've redone the timeline when really for now they should be worldbuilding further not hitting a reset button. I want the next season villain to not be a speedster, however there is realistically little choice unless they do an arrow and make a new character up (which I am not against.)

Also regarding arrow, it needs to decide what it wants to be and how OP the villains should be. The introduction of metas and magic has seriously fucked it up. Hell they use Barry as a deux ex machina in season 3. Darhck was so well acted I didn.t think he needed magic powers, he was very very menacing. I honestly think it jumped the shark villains wise with slade.

rant rant rant

EDIT- Arrow season 4 spoilers

Spoiler

I just watched the 2 non-Dark episodes of season 4 and they were fantastic. Lovey-Dovey stuff kept to a minimum, league of assassins being deadly, Oliver using his brain, interesting villains, Nyssa and Malcolm stepped it up a gear in intensity and the calculator was well done although his arc felt far too rushed.

However, the fallout of the episode is dire. The league of assassins has been disbanded... So what on earth are the legion of highly trained killers going to do now? They are living weapons, they have no other function than to obey the will of another.

I also feel that the flashback villain is more interesting than the current series villain motivation wise. Dark is too wishy washy. I had the same issue with R'as.

 

[Something Amyss]

The Flash has it's ups and downs. Sometimes its almost unbearable, sometimes its perfectly CW-style cheesy, and sometimes it toes the edge of "really good on purpose"

I can't think of any examples. I do have fun with the show, though.

I love it. Its comic book cheesiness that is needed. It knows what it is and isnt trying to be something its not. At the end of it all, comic books are mostly silly and outrageous anyways thats meant to fun as well as challenge emotions from time to time. Flash does it well.

Any live action series that brings in Gorilla Grod definitely isn't taking itself too seriously XD

The fact that Iris is basically Barry's step-sister is kind of creepy to me. He literally calls her dad (Whose name escapes me) "Dad" a couple of times. I like the actress who plays her though, and she is smoking.

Yeeeeeeeah, that's all kinds of creepy. Ans Joe being onboard with Barry and his daughter hooking up seems like the sort of thing that wouldn't work in their relationship.

Spoiler: Biiiiiig plot spoilers

It bugged me that Iris' boyfriend (Whose name escapes me) had to kill himself to unmake Dr. Zoom from time. (He's his ancestor) He could have easily just shot himself in the junk or declared "When this is over I'm getting a vasectomy!"

[/quote]

Spoiler

I assume it's to make sure nothing like cloning happens. Though it's a comic book show, so they can probably resurrect him. His last words should have been "burn my body" or something.

 

[Something Amyss]

Oh...about that. See, in Season 2 they don't really deal with time travel as much...at first. But then they not only pull off something even more stupid, they also insist it's a thing by using it multiple times.

Spoiler: Minor spoiler just detailing what the concept is

So, in Season 2, they add a "time remnant". What's a time remnant you ask? Well, it's something that doesn't make sense. Here is it in short: you start your life at point B and continue living until you time travel, which is point C. You go back in time to point A which is before you were alive and you kill your grandfather, so you can never be born. This, of course, changes the timeline and you can no longer exists and you get erased. I think that's clear enough. Now, for the actual time remnant - that's you from point B to point C. According to Season 2, that you still exists until it time travels back. Duh. In case you were wondering - yes, that time remnant exists in the same timeline.

It doesn't necessarily need to be something a version of you that cannot exist. A more concise description would be a parallel spin-off "doomed" version of somebody. It's like it's from a parallel timeline but...it isn't from a parallel timeline.

I really didn't like that.

I think I know whata stroke feels like now.

 

[Tanis]

GASP! The Question!

Unless he's played by Jeffrey Combs, I'd feel very cheated.



OT:
I enjoyed the 1st Season.
I liked, most, of the 2nd Season.
I am curious about how they're going to handle the 3rd Season.

Also:
The new season of Arrow looks to be going back to what made it good, Batman with arrows.

Plus, Supergirl is coming to CW.
So...I'm hoping they're gonna merge that universe into the 'Arrowverse'.

Plus, Constantine has shown up, and I hope it gets moved to the CW and renewed.

Plus, I kind of enjoyed the Vixen cartoon, which I hope gets another season or something.

Plus, Legends of Tomorrow ended with a very enticing cliffhanger.


So...TL;DR?
I'm liking the DC TV series FAR more than the DC movies.
Moar PLZ.

 

[McMarbles]

So yeah. Are people enjoying it? Would you like to see the "Arrowverse" expanded further? Are you just here to post the obligatory "I'm sick of superhero shows and wish they would go away" stuff? Are you the goddamn Batman? How fast do I have to run to get the time I spent writing this back?

It's pretty great, though sometimes you kinda wanna slap Barry.

I, for one, would LOVE to see a full-length, non-animated Vixen series.

No, my ass is completely free of sticks.

Hmmm... I do get really pissed off when I hear the name "Martha"....

RUN, AMYSS, RUN.

 

[Bob_McMillan]

Plus, it has this golden trailer.

God, I love that thing. Especially that shot at the end with the villains. All such great actors in such a small space.

 

[Lightknight]

Yeah yeah, I'm a bit late to the party. But I've been watching The Flash for about a week now, and thought it was particularly relevant in contrast with the DCEU and the arguments over whether ornot it's the worst Superman stuff ever, or just the worst ever committed to film.

And I know it's generally well received, because I have access to Google and IMDb and stuff. But with the arguments that have cycled around here about the DCEU, I'm curious what people specifically here think about it.

Mostly because I think it makes a point a lot of people complaining about the DCEU have been making: that a show can be darker without being grim or bitter or joyless. Now, admittedly, I'm only a few episodes in (well, I'm up to episode 8, it turns out), so maybe everything changes later in the series. Also, it's darker than I think I'd prefer, but I expected that going in, based on both Arrow and Smallville. The major thing is it's not so dark it comes off as brooding or head-up-its-own-ass.

And it does this without being Marvel levels of silly and absurd. Actually, I get a bit of a Raimi Spider-Man vibe from this--and I mean that in a good way. Yup. I just made a positive comparison to Raimi's Spider-Man movies. Run.

So yeah. I'd kind of like a tonally brighter Wally West Flash, but this is enjoyable. And that's the thing. It doesn't have to be exactly what I want to be watchable.

So yeah. Are people enjoying it? Would you like to see the "Arrowverse" expanded further? Are you just here to post the obligatory "I'm sick of superhero shows and wish they would go away" stuff? Are you the goddamn Batman? How fast do I have to run to get the time I spent writing this back?

I actually dislike the Arrow in this universe as a character both tonally and thematically. Just seems to be some rich asshole that isn't likeable or relate-able. I cringe every time Oliver and Barry meet up for fear that Barry will get some of his crap on him.

The Flash seems to be more on the light-hearted side of things. A true hero just trying to do good. I really like that since we have so many anti-heroes already. You're right that it could be even brighter and feel fresher today even though that was the original hero motif.

I'm sure they're going to drag him back down in the mud with the others soon though. I just haven't felt that way yet.

 

[Captain Marvelous_v1legacy]

Snip

Spoiler: Flash Season 3 Spoilers (But we all saw it coming, right?)

So, yeah, we'll be getting Kid Flash. And if Jessie can bounce between worlds like Spider-Gwen, then we may just get our Jesse Quick.

 

[SweetShark]

Saw only Season 1 and then I gave up.
As I said multiple times, the formula get REALLY old:
A Villain Appear. Flash go to stop him. Flash Fails. Flash and friends find a solution. Villain Appear again. Flash go stop him/her/them. FINISH HIM! FATALITY!!!!!! FLASH WINS!!!!!
Repeat and repeat and repeat and repeat and repeat and repeat.....