Some design choice you question

Xprimentyl

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The Burnout franchise was wildly popular on the Original Xbox, so when Revenge hit the scene as the first iteration of a next generation of hardware, it was glorious. The explosions looked so much better and violent, the speed felt faster, the engine revs sounded more threatening; it was glorious. So when they announced Burnout Paradise, the bar was severely high, but attainable seeing as they?d been getting consistently better. But what they do? REMOVED explosions and Crash Junctions, arguably the franchise?s calling card feature and game type respectively. I will never understand who thought that was a good idea, removing the things that?d literally made the franchise what it had become to that point. What?s worse was their addition of the open world! A point-to-point racing game played at speeds of +100mph with explosions without set tracks made the race feature (y?know, all that was basically left of the game) a largely frustrating and stressful affair. Yahtzee?s review nailed it; you spent the entire time racing looking at the minimap, and that?s not conducive to, well, RACING. We have laws about cell phone use while driving at legal speeds, and GPS isn?t exempt.
 

sXeth

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Xprimentyl said:
What?s worse was their addition of the open world! A point-to-point racing game played at speeds of +100mph with explosions without set tracks made the race feature (y?know, all that was basically left of the game) a largely frustrating and stressful affair. Yahtzee?s review nailed it; you spent the entire time racing looking at the minimap, and that?s not conducive to, well, RACING. We have laws about cell phone use while driving at legal speeds, and GPS isn?t exempt.
Ah yes, the open world racing game is one I really don't get. Its either pointless timesinking for travelling from race to race. Or the utter mess of not having actual polished and tested courses as you mention when you start just having people race through it.
 

BrawlMan

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Xprimentyl said:
The Burnout franchise was wildly popular on the Original Xbox, so when Revenge hit the scene as the first iteration of a next generation of hardware, it was glorious. The explosions looked so much better and violent, the speed felt faster, the engine revs sounded more threatening; it was glorious. So when they announced Burnout Paradise, the bar was severely high, but attainable seeing as they?d been getting consistently better. But what they do? REMOVED explosions and Crash Junctions, arguably the franchise?s calling card feature and game type respectively. I will never understand who thought that was a good idea, removing the things that?d literally made the franchise what it had become to that point. What?s worse was their addition of the open world! A point-to-point racing game played at speeds of +100mph with explosions without set tracks made the race feature (y?know, all that was basically left of the game) a largely frustrating and stressful affair. Yahtzee?s review nailed it; you spent the entire time racing looking at the minimap, and that?s not conducive to, well, RACING. We have laws about cell phone use while driving at legal speeds, and GPS isn?t exempt.
I'm with you there man. After completing Burnout Paradise and doing everything, I never wanted to play it again. I refuse to buy it for next-gen or the older generation consoles. To me the series reached its peak with Revenge.

Sengoku 3. A lot of people say this is a great beat em up and while I do agree, there are several design choices that don't sit well with me. Unlike a lot of 2D Brawlers from that era, despite the combo system you can't cancel out of your own move. Not to mention that enemies are really overpowered and the fact that sometimes every enemy type can block your attack is frustrating when you're trying to land a great combo. It's better than its other two games, but there are still a
Brawlers better than the third game in the series. And I hate that one freaking Samurai that always does is overpower charge attack. It has way too much range and can pretty much knock you out of your jump attacks. I will give it this, it was one of the first Brawler's to have a light and heavy attack before games like Dynasty Warriors, the Ninja Gaiden reboot, a God of War brought them to the table. So kudos to SNK on that one.


I always hated the final levels in motion Obi games. Whose idea was it to have a bunch of freaking mazes. Revenge of Shinobi, GG Shinobi, and even Shinobi 3 (though nowhere near as bad) all suffered from this. It does nothing but pad the game. The game itself is already challenging, there's no need to add in a confusing maze nobody asked for. What the fuck was Sega thinking. Oh and sword draining Health mechanic from the PS2 Shinobi can go fuck itself.

The motion controls in Donkey Kong Returns. This was definitely a mechanic nobody was asking for, and that platforming itself is really frustrating and not that fun. And before you say buy the 3DS version, I shouldn't have to buy another version of the game that fixes the problem. Nintendo just had to force motion controls on the original version. Which doesn't make sense as most of their other games had classic control or GameCube controller support why not a platforming game. I am so glad they're out of that phase of forcing most controls on almost every single game. Tropical Freeze fixed every single problem I had with Returns and I am more than happy to we buy it on the switch.

Any game that forces loot boxes, day one DLC or season passes, or high price DLC characters in fighting games. They all suck and should be banned from gaming. Looking at you Capcom and Arc System works. It ain't about player choice.

Koei Tecmo use of asset flipping. Jim Sterling pointed this out and it's ridiculous how often KT got away with this. You guys ain't hurting for cash, it's just straight up laziness; especially with all of your DLC practices.
 

Pyrian

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DrownedAmmet said:
Rpgs that lock equipment for certain classes
I've come to think it's a waste of time to unlock equipment the character isn't skilled with. Typically what you do, is you let everyone use anything, and then make the skill systems (whatever they are) in such a way that characters only use certain items in practice anyway. So... What's the point? The end result looks so much like the starting point, yet takes a lot of work to reach.
 

maninahat

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I think it is an objectively terrible design choice to give out rare upgrades for guns in a game that limits your carrying capacity somehow. Bio shock Infinite is a great example of this problem: upgrades cost a fortune, and you can only carry two guns at once. The upshot is that there is an incentive to min max two specific guns and keep using them the entire game, instead of trying all the guns and spreading out the money and upgrades too thinly. You don?t dare trade your maxed out guns or experiment with others because you have no idea when an enemy might drop them again.

Either make upgrades cheap and plentiful, or better yet let me carry all the guns so I don?t get so jealous and stingy with particular ones.
 

Dudemaker

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I've only recently bothered with UVHM on Borderlands 2.
I have to question Rabids as an inclusion.
Why rabids, just...why??
 

Kotaro

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Final boss fights that throw out the established gameplay genre in favor of something completely different.
Looking at you, Devil May Cry rail-shooter boss. And you, Drakengard ending E rhythm minigame boss. And you, other examples that I could probably name if I wanted to spend more time on this post.

Oh, and an unrelated one that's calling out one specific game: Dark Cloud 2. There's a weapon upgrade path that can lead to you ending up with the Dark ability (you lose HP every time you attack but your attacks are way more powerful, theoretically a really strong ability) on the Desperado. Which is a machine gun. You lose HP with every single bullet. This can completely drain your health in seconds. And now your weapon is unusable garbage and everything you've used to upgrade it is completely wasted. Congrats.
 

Dalisclock

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Kotaro said:
Final boss fights that throw out the established gameplay genre in favor of something completely different.
Looking at you, Devil May Cry rail-shooter boss. And you, Drakengard ending E rhythm minigame boss. And you, other examples that I could probably name if I wanted to spend more time on this post.
Metal Gear Solid 2. The final boss fight is a sword fight. Prior to this fight, you've probably had about a grand total of 10 minutes of actual combat practice with the sword, just before you fight a bunch of Metal Gear RAYs(which require a rocket launcher to fight) and a bunch of long cutscenes. Also, none of the enemies you sword fight are nearly as good with it as the boss.

Honestly, though, it felt like MGS2 was a bunch of "Fuck you"s, one after another, as far as gameplay was concerned.
 

Rangaman

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Life systems. Why, in 2018, do we still need life systems and game over screen that don't actually mean anything?

Sleeping in order to level up in Oblivion. I understand the intention with this mechanic, it was meant to make you think about whether or not you wanted to venture further into the world and risk losing your XP. Fair enough. But it effectively puts a gold price on leveling up, unless you want to bumble around Cyrodiil looking for an abandoned house or camp. And for those who don't want to abuse the fast-travel power, it's a pain in the dick.

The simplified GUI in Sam & Max (and all future SCUMM games). Again, I understand the intention, but it actually made everything less practical.
 

Kotaro

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Dalisclock said:
Kotaro said:
Final boss fights that throw out the established gameplay genre in favor of something completely different.
Looking at you, Devil May Cry rail-shooter boss. And you, Drakengard ending E rhythm minigame boss. And you, other examples that I could probably name if I wanted to spend more time on this post.
Metal Gear Solid 2. The final boss fight is a sword fight. Prior to this fight, you've probably had about a grand total of 10 minutes of actual combat practice with the sword, just before you fight a bunch of Metal Gear RAYs(which require a rocket launcher to fight) and a bunch of long cutscenes. Also, none of the enemies you sword fight are nearly as good with it as the boss.

Honestly, though, it felt like MGS2 was a bunch of "Fuck you"s, one after another, as far as gameplay was concerned.
I actually really like MGS2, and that final act with the swordfighting is thematically appropriate given the story (that's around the time that Raiden more or less escapes being manipulated into becoming a copy of Snake and chooses a path to become his own person... maybe. The game's such a mindfuck that I'm not even 100% sure in my interpretation there). Which is why I didn't list it as an example: it actually makes sense in context.
 

sujalkaushal995

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spartandude

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Phantoms in Mass Effect 3. Ok so we have an enemy that's small, fast with a powerful melee attack? Sure that sounds find. But they also have lots of barriers so they're surprisingly tanky. They can dodge most of your powers and when they cant they simply throw up a shield which makes them immune to power combos... have lot's of characters do most damage. They can turn invisible so they can't be targeted by powers. They have a powerful ranged attack, which is essentially a sniper rifle, they fire while moving towards you. And lets talk about their melee attacks. They have one which is really powerful, knocks you back and stuns you, then another which literally insta kills you.
Ok fighting one or two isn't a problem. But if you play multiplayer on higher difficulties the game just spams these at you and it's annoying,
 

Dalisclock

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Kotaro said:
Dalisclock said:
Kotaro said:
Final boss fights that throw out the established gameplay genre in favor of something completely different.
Looking at you, Devil May Cry rail-shooter boss. And you, Drakengard ending E rhythm minigame boss. And you, other examples that I could probably name if I wanted to spend more time on this post.
Metal Gear Solid 2. The final boss fight is a sword fight. Prior to this fight, you've probably had about a grand total of 10 minutes of actual combat practice with the sword, just before you fight a bunch of Metal Gear RAYs(which require a rocket launcher to fight) and a bunch of long cutscenes. Also, none of the enemies you sword fight are nearly as good with it as the boss.

Honestly, though, it felt like MGS2 was a bunch of "Fuck you"s, one after another, as far as gameplay was concerned.
I actually really like MGS2, and that final act with the swordfighting is thematically appropriate given the story (that's around the time that Raiden more or less escapes being manipulated into becoming a copy of Snake and chooses a path to become his own person... maybe. The game's such a mindfuck that I'm not even 100% sure in my interpretation there). Which is why I didn't list it as an example: it actually makes sense in context.
Don't get me wrong. I generally liked MGS2(with the exception of the EE escort mission...all of it) and the sword thing works fine thematically. It's just damn frustrating because you've spent almost the entire game...not using a sword. Then you get to fight a boss where you have no other choice. Hope you got good with it during those fights in arsenal gear....
 

Johnny Novgorod

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Any game that puts emphasis on looting, such as Borderlands, that doesn't let you tag or label items as trash or keepsakes. The second game does it but for some reason Pre-Sequel removes the X for "trashing", making sorting stuff at the end of the day more of a chore for no good reason. For that matter, I wish the bank/stash/whatever where you store your gear had more slots.
 

Phoenixmgs_v1legacy

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spartandude said:
Phantoms in Mass Effect 3. Ok so we have an enemy that's small, fast with a powerful melee attack? Sure that sounds find. But they also have lots of barriers so they're surprisingly tanky. They can dodge most of your powers and when they cant they simply throw up a shield which makes them immune to power combos... have lot's of characters do most damage. They can turn invisible so they can't be targeted by powers. They have a powerful ranged attack, which is essentially a sniper rifle, they fire while moving towards you. And lets talk about their melee attacks. They have one which is really powerful, knocks you back and stuns you, then another which literally insta kills you.
Ok fighting one or two isn't a problem. But if you play multiplayer on higher difficulties the game just spams these at you and it's annoying,
The phantoms were awesome in ME3, there were quite a few characters that completely nullified them like the Salarian Infiltrator could one-shot them, the Geth Infiltrator could literally melt them, and any Adept with stasis.

Johnny Novgorod said:
Any game that puts emphasis on looting, such as Borderlands, that doesn't let you tag or label items as trash or keepsakes. The second game does it but for some reason Pre-Sequel removes the X for "trashing", making sorting stuff at the end of the day more of a chore for no good reason. For that matter, I wish the bank/stash/whatever where you store your gear had more slots.
I find loot systems a completely horrid game element that really accomplish nothing but waste player time. Why do I have to constantly keep switching out gear for slightly better gear? It could all be tied to character leveling instead. Then, when you do get an great piece of gear that gives a bonus to something crucial to your playstyle, you don't have to find another one in an hour when your current one is now obsolete. Loot systems only ever work for end-game because what's the point in getting an orange drop in Borderlands at level 10, it'll be useless after a couple levels anyway. When you do actually find something awesome, it should have permanence to it.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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Phoenixmgs said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Any game that puts emphasis on looting, such as Borderlands, that doesn't let you tag or label items as trash or keepsakes. The second game does it but for some reason Pre-Sequel removes the X for "trashing", making sorting stuff at the end of the day more of a chore for no good reason. For that matter, I wish the bank/stash/whatever where you store your gear had more slots.
I find loot systems a completely horrid game element that really accomplish nothing but waste player time. Why do I have to constantly keep switching out gear for slightly better gear? It could all be tied to character leveling instead. Then, when you do get an great piece of gear that gives a bonus to something crucial to your playstyle, you don't have to find another one in an hour when your current one is now obsolete. Loot systems only ever work for end-game because what's the point in getting an orange drop in Borderlands at level 10, it'll be useless after a couple levels anyway. When you do actually find something awesome, it should have permanence to it.
You're upgrading more often than not but I've found some things in Borderlands that have been with me pretty much from the start of the game. Usually class or grenade mods, and the occasional gun with the one perk that is still handy no matter that you find something similar with slightly better stats. To me the game lends itself to hoard certain weaponry with a very specific use, it's not just scrolling down the Excel list for higher numbers.
 

Phoenixmgs_v1legacy

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Johnny Novgorod said:
You're upgrading more often than not but I've found some things in Borderlands that have been with me pretty much from the start of the game. Usually class or grenade mods, and the occasional gun with the one perk that is still handy no matter that you find something similar with slightly better stats. To me the game lends itself to hoard certain weaponry with a very specific use, it's not just scrolling down the Excel list for higher numbers.
The only time I held onto a weapon with a specific bonus was when I played a melee Zero and kept a gun that gave some great melee bonus as I didn't actually shoot anything with it. If you're playing a character that shoots guns (highly likely), the damage goes up so much per level you can only use the same gun for a couple levels without being totally gimped. I remember I would like a specific sniper rifle, SMG, and shotgun, and it would suck having to find basically the same gun again (same manufacturer and element) that was just a higher level version of my now obsolete one. Just tie damage increases to character leveling and/or weapon leveling and that fixes all the inventory management busywork while accomplishing the same exact thing. Hell, Monster Hunter is all about that same grind and you're literally never in your inventory at all. I also hated how you have to stay close to your friends' levels to actually play with them because if you're maybe even just like 3 levels above/under someone, you either can't kill anything or you're one-shotting all the enemies. Then, even the people that are the exact level for the quest aren't having fun because lots of characters have needed skills that proc when they kill enemies, which they aren't doing when a friend is one-shotting everything. Borderlands was a blast to play with friends but the game made it so hard to actually play with them in a fun manner.
 

Aerosteam

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Pyrian said:
DrownedAmmet said:
Rpgs that lock equipment for certain classes
I've come to think it's a waste of time to unlock equipment the character isn't skilled with. Typically what you do, is you let everyone use anything, and then make the skill systems (whatever they are) in such a way that characters only use certain items in practice anyway. So... What's the point? The end result looks so much like the starting point, yet takes a lot of work to reach.
Why not? Since the dawn of time people have been purposefully handicapping themselves to make their experience more difficult. Whether it be experimentation, boredom, or just showing off, there are people like me who appreciate it when we can equip a shield on both hands.

OT: Make all haircuts unisex damn it. Beards too.
 

Imaynotbehere4long

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Kotaro said:
Oh, and an unrelated one that's calling out one specific game: Dark Cloud 2. There's a weapon upgrade path that can lead to you ending up with the Dark ability (you lose HP every time you attack but your attacks are way more powerful, theoretically a really strong ability) on the Desperado. Which is a machine gun. You lose HP with every single bullet. This can completely drain your health in seconds. And now your weapon is unusable garbage and everything you've used to upgrade it is completely wasted. Congrats.
Speaking of Dark Cloud 2, you need capacity in order to equip the item that gives your robot more capacity. When I played the game, I didn't have enough capacity to increase my capacity (and I couldn't remove capacity since the upgrades were permanent).