Sony: Xbox One Policies Were A Surprise To Us

[Lightknight]

I'd been wondering what Sony was thinking all this time. I mean, what does a company actually see when their main competitor starts tearing itself down so systematically?

as much as i think this may be the last stand alone console generation i also think it'll go off with a bang...and sony will "win it"...getting a whole "updated PS2" vibe off this new machine and there are supposedly approx 180 titles in development already and as far as bringing the PC F2P crowd and "indy" support sony seems to be doing and trying to do everything right.

Unless PCs become decidedly more living room friendly then something new will need to come along to make this true. Standardised hardware with a firm client base benefits everyone involved.

So, while I am a PC gamer in addition to my console game, I really don't have any indication that this is indeed the last generation. Not when the previous generation sold nearly 250 million home consoles so far. According to the mostly ridiculous ESA study for 2013, the average U.S. Household owns at least one dedicated gaming console, pc or smartphone. 51% of U.S. households specifically own a dedicated game console and those that do own at least one own an average of 2 total (keep in mind, this is per household, not per person).

A lot is going to have to change before consoles as we know them are obsolete. It honestly just looks like consoles are merely becoming more and more like pcs while maintaining a standardized configuration for easy development. I'm not 100% sure I wouldn't call the ps4 a pc console due to the x86 architecture.

There may be a future where no one owns consoles and everything is processed remotely and streamed. But our internet infrastructure is going to have to step it up and stop wasting our money when it would be easy for them to do better.

 

[EffectiveKill]

Hey Sony, what about all those DRM patents you were filling back in December?

 

[Signa]

I find this scene from Joe Dirt to be a pretty good metaphor for the Microsoft-Gamer relationship, in particular the very last line of the clip:


Indeed, "Well that might be your problem. It's not what you like, it's the consumer." Just seems that everything MS is doing is based off of stuff that they find appealing, completely disregarding the wants of the consumer. Considering the fact that they've pulled back on pretty much everything (the last bugaboo being their refusal to uncouple the Kinect as a bundled item, thus driving up the price of their console) this is more fitting to how the XBone was when first announce. Still, I think the comparison fits.

You know that MS is screwed if Joe fucking Dirt is giving them sounder advice than their current marketing strategists.

 

[RJ 17]

I find this scene from Joe Dirt to be a pretty good metaphor for the Microsoft-Gamer relationship, in particular the very last line of the clip:


Indeed, "Well that might be your problem. It's not what you like, it's the consumer." Just seems that everything MS is doing is based off of stuff that they find appealing, completely disregarding the wants of the consumer. Considering the fact that they've pulled back on pretty much everything (the last bugaboo being their refusal to uncouple the Kinect as a bundled item, thus driving up the price of their console) this is more fitting to how the XBone was when first announce. Still, I think the comparison fits.

You know that MS is screwed if Joe fucking Dirt is giving them sounder advice than their current marketing strategists.

You know, it really is amazing...after watching that clip a few times it became clearer and clearer how close the parallel is. Can't you basically see an MS rep as the Native American guy? Just replace all the fireworks lingo with gamer stuff and yeah, it's pretty funny, actually.

 

[Something Amyss]

Wait didn't Sony say they decided their polices because of Microsoft now they are trying to spin it that they always knew best it would be better if they spent less time taking pot shots at Microsoft and tell us more about the console.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/125411-Shuhei-Yoshida-Xbox-One-Negativity-Made-Sonys-Decision-Easy

As Andrew's brother famously said, "everybody lies."

I'm not surprised they're spinning this, in all seriousness.

 

[Lightknight]

I find this scene from Joe Dirt to be a pretty good metaphor for the Microsoft-Gamer relationship, in particular the very last line of the clip: *snip*

Major props on that link.

Though I'll point out a slight flaw here. Microsoft has two sets of consumers. Gamers are certainly one, the other is game development studios that wish to sell their wares on the system. Microsoft isn't the department store, they're the mall the department store rents from.

What microsoft did here was cater to the development studios/publisher customers at a severe cost to the gamers. The problem is, the gamers are also the product that Microsoft is selling to development studios/publishers so when they did too much against us and we started going elsewhere, the development customers were also getting harmed and so no one won except game consumers that had a better option to go to. Imagine a mall that demanded an entrance fee that they distributed the proceeds to store owners (while taking a cut themselves) and forced the customer to walk through ever store instead of just the one they came to the mall for in the first place. That setup may feel pretty beneficial to store owners as long as they still get a steady stream of customers, but as those thin out the setup quickly proves itself to be a double edged sword.

That Microsoft did not foresee causing a customer exodus by trying to take away their consumer rights amongst other things is surprising. Someone somewhere really messed up in their market analysis. That Sony, the company that lost so much of its previous market share, got this right is amazing. Total role reversal.

 

[RJ 17]

I find this scene from Joe Dirt to be a pretty good metaphor for the Microsoft-Gamer relationship, in particular the very last line of the clip: *snip*

Major props on that link.

Though I'll point out a slight flaw here. Microsoft has two sets of consumers. Gamers are certainly one, the other is game development studios that wish to sell their wares on the system. Microsoft isn't the department store, they're the mall the department store rents from.

What microsoft did here was cater to the development studios/publisher customers at a severe cost to the gamers. The problem is, the gamers are also the product that Microsoft is selling to development studios/publishers so when they did too much against us and we started going elsewhere, the development customers were also getting harmed and so no one won except game consumers that had a better option to go to. Imagine a mall that demanded an entrance fee that they distributed the proceeds to store owners (while taking a cut themselves) and forced the customer to walk through ever store instead of just the one they came to the mall for in the first place. That setup may feel pretty beneficial to store owners as long as they still get a steady stream of customers, but as those thin out the setup quickly proves itself to be a double edged sword.

That Microsoft did not foresee causing a customer exodus by trying to take away their consumer rights amongst other things is surprising. Someone somewhere really messed up in their market analysis. That Sony, the company that lost so much of its previous market share, got this right is amazing. Total role reversal.

And really that's what I was getting at. Keeping with your mall metaphor, the mall that is MS instituted too many policies that had customers saying "screw this, lets go to the Sony mall down the street." In the end I know that MS has to keep the publishers happy too or they'll end up abandoning it (as they've done with the WiiU), but on the other hand I'd argue that it's much more profitable for everyone involved to make sure that the end-consumer is the happiest, ensuring that they'll want to keep coming back to your "mall".

Hence the Joe Dirt comparison: "It's not what you like, it's the consumer."

 

[Atmos Duality]

Wait didn't Sony say they decided their polices because of Microsoft now they are trying to spin it that they always knew best it would be better if they spent less time taking pot shots at Microsoft and tell us more about the console.

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/news/view/125411-Shuhei-Yoshida-Xbox-One-Negativity-Made-Sonys-Decision-Easy

As Andrew's brother famously said, "everybody lies."

I'm not surprised they're spinning this, in all seriousness.

Good, bad. They're the ones competing.

At this point, they can give whatever reason they'd like to spin it.
For all we know, they could be telling the truth, been completely indecisive prior to the Xbone reveal, or had planned something just as bad as the initial Xbone offering (or worse). PSN has the potential for abuse (of course, so does Steam, and it's a much scarier amount of potential).

For now, I'll just wait and see if Sony sticks to their guns. Maybe see if they can keep that goodwill going post-launch.

The real interesting thing is to watch Sony's response if Microsoft flip-flops again after the Xbone launch.
Then we will see just how much the so-called "Vocal/Whiny Minority" matters.

 

[Lightknight]

In the end I know that MS has to keep the publishers happy too or they'll end up abandoning it (as they've done with the WiiU), but on the other hand I'd argue that it's much more profitable for everyone involved to make sure that the end-consumer is the happiest, ensuring that they'll want to keep coming back to your "mall".

Yes.

What's funny is that in order to keep publishers happy, all you really need to have is a platform that consumers use. You don't even have to be hard to pirate on as evidenced by the PC still being a vibrant gaming platform. Microsoft wanted the money that selling the same game over and over again would bring. They wanted to push DRM on all games along with destroying the preowned market. While very lucrative if successful, that's insanely anti-consumer and I'd argue infringes on consumer rights. I believe they may have lost in court had they tried this.

Something that's a bit scary is they're still going to get their DRM. This push for cloud computing being encorporated in gaming is the excuse (lie) EA hid behind with Sim City 5 and it will be used as often as possible to make even basic games be always online titles just because dev teams made the servers process lighting or something even more trivial.

 

[Something Amyss]

Good, bad. They're the ones competing.

At this point, they can give whatever reason they'd like to spin it.

I make no judgment about them spinning it, only that I am unsurprised they are spinning it.

Good or bad, who wouldn't do it?

The Xbone was massively unpopular and capitalising on that just makes sense, from a business perspective. And honestly, if my business opposition had just handed me a massive shift in consoles, I'd have trouble not doing a victory lap to the theme from Rocky.

 

[Atmos Duality]

I make no judgment about them spinning it, only that I am unsurprised they are spinning it.

Good or bad, who wouldn't do it?

The Xbone was massively unpopular and capitalising on that just makes sense, from a business perspective. And honestly, if my business opposition had just handed me a massive shift in consoles, I'd have trouble not doing a victory lap to the theme from Rocky.

Well, we're certainly in agreement there.
Especially if I were in Sony's position; one of the biggest players in the video game market and their biggest rival just threw the fattest slider...yeah, I'd try to hit it out of the park too.

 

[Something Amyss]

[And really that's what I was getting at. Keeping with your mall metaphor, the mall that is MS instituted too many policies that had customers saying "screw this, lets go to the Sony mall down the street." In the end I know that MS has to keep the publishers happy too or they'll end up abandoning it (as they've done with the WiiU), but on the other hand I'd argue that it's much more profitable for everyone involved to make sure that the end-consumer is the happiest, ensuring that they'll want to keep coming back to your "mall".

Hence the Joe Dirt comparison: "It's not what you like, it's the consumer."

But that's the thing: if this was done to keep publishers happy, it was unnecessary. Nintendo seemed to piss off pubs with the tablet, cheap hardware, etc., but Sony's still got strong publisher support at launch. It loses in first party to Microsoft, but since those lineups are still sparse it's not the biggest of deals.

People were so dead sure the PS4 would have the same restrictions, in fact, because there was NO WAY that publishers would go for the PS4 otherwise.

To be honest, though, cowtowing to publishers has been the model for a while now. They just took it too far.

 

[Something Amyss]

Well, we're certainly in agreement there.
Especially if I were in Sony's position; one of the biggest players in the video game market and their biggest rival just threw the fattest slider...yeah, I'd try to hit it out of the park too.

Yeah, that's kind of the thing. We could argue whether or not what Sony did with the PS4 was good or bad, what they knew when, etc., but the ultimate point is that it's relatively irrelevant because Microsoft gave them a massively easy pitch and all they did was swing for the fences.

Although it's more like Sony hit an easy grounder, the shortstop tripped, and two runners got home. I mean, Microsoft just had one error after another and I think hurt their reputation for this generation. I could be wrong, and time will tell, but I don't think people are going to forget that easily.