Spec Ops The Line Discussion in 2020 Cause why not.

[Jarrito3002]

Hello Everyone
Wanted to talk about this game cause I had recently played myself for the first time. I bought it for about 10 bucks from a local brick and mortar shop I love. I had the demo for the longest but never played the full game.

First I was well aware of how discussion about this this game are split down the middle of great deconstruction vs shallow forced message of making the gamer feel bad.

My take after playing it.

Graphics
For the time I don't it has age that badly. The bloom and the shading probably help but even up close character model especially in the faces are still good. It has the best sand in a video game up there with Journey and Outer Wilds. It helps that the sand feels alive like it can crush you or lift you at a moments notice despite those moments being scripted.

Gameplay
McDonalds. I was told the game play is the weakest part and even most camps agree. I felt since I played the 3rd person cover games of those era this was alright. I ran into issue of trying to run to cover and would still being standing up or crotching endlessly cause of jank. But overall when it played normally it was fine. Like sometimes I want a McDouble and it was that McDouble. I will give it credit its like the only game I have played where blind firing has practical application and can actually work as opposed to being there just for aesthetic than function.

Story
The reason this game is still talked about to this day. Now i suck at this spoiler tag and I don't know the statutes of spoilers for a game that is almost 8 years old but I will try my best. I think it was a great take and observation about the military shooter genre which was popular at the time. I have played my Call of Duties, Battle Fields so I wanted to see what Spec Ops had to say. And I thought it was great cause it actually showed and gave reaction to the shit you do in these games and are usually written off.

Spoiler: spoiler

The White phosphorus scene even I heard about it still had my fucked up when it happen. I can understand people saying it took player choice out of the player to make its message work but sense most military shooter are scripted sections by the book I think that just makes it work better.

Walker is going to stick with me in a sea of standard issue shooter game protags of the time just because of his inner turmoil, his deslusion and how his ending play out was greatness in my opinion. And through it all I didn't feel like I was being told I was a bad person. I get the loading screens are all like "do you feel like a hero" but I kind of like when games fuck with now and then.

Overall I say Spec Ops the Line story and turning a military shooter into Heart of Darkness, Jacobs Ladder and some good mental purgatory motif has earned it its lasting legacy. That is its strength. The game play is the weakest part only that it is meh. It was a nice and short experience that will stick with me.

Now that I am dumb rambling. What are my fellow escapist opinions for those who played it and what are you feelings bout the current state of military shooters.

 

[Casual Shinji]

I think Spec-Ops: The Line suffers from its own sales pitch. You kinda need to go into the game blind in order truly experience its deconstruction, but on the surface it's too generic to want to go in blind. So the only way it can hook you in is by spoiling its own suprise. I'm not so much speaking about the game itself here, but the marketing and praise.

 

[wings012]

They introduced the whole sand thing, but it was highly contextual and limited to a few areas. But I feel like they could've done a lot more with it. Some more open ended design, where you had to choose where to let sand in or not, perhaps sometimes even to your own detriment if you are being silly about it might have led to more interesting areas and gameplay.

I didn't find the gameplay bad or anything though, if somewhat unremarkable. I did like how it had a few enemy types, some heavy dudes and some melee dudes towards the end. Rather than just a sea of dudes with guns a la CoD. I also liked the squad commands.

 

[gorfias]

I have yet to finish this game but am enjoying what I've played to date. Thank you for not spoiling anything for me. I have an idea what is coming but it hasn't happened yet. Just a lot of good military combat. I will write someone on this forum advised me to heavily use the cover mechanic. Don't fight it: Understand what kind of game you are playing. That advice got me through a really tough spot that had me stuck for literally years. I just have to get back to it. Tomorrow, new PS+ games to download.

 

[Jarrito3002]

I think Spec-Ops: The Line suffers from its own sales pitch. You kinda need to go into the game blind in order truly experience its deconstruction, but on the surface it's too generic to want to go in blind. So the only way it can hook you in is by spoiling its own suprise. I'm not so much speaking about the game itself here, but the marketing and praise.

That is why I have not touched after so long. I had the demo and it was alright but it did nothing to make me go got to grab this. Especially cause it hit me on my brown shooter down turn. It is a shame cause it can't spoil itself cause that cuts the experience. Makes me upset I missed out on that pure blind experience.

 

[deleted20220709]

DELETED

 

[Jarrito3002]

One of the best details in the game is how the voice lines from both the PC and the squad mates get increasingly brutal and nasty as the game progresses. It starts out as cookie cutter military stuff like "tango down" or "take out the machine gun" in calm voices and ends up with barks like "Fuck that guy up!" and "Die you bastard!" shouted at the top of their lungs.

That was perfection. Like later on I knew shit was about the get worse but watching the PC and squad mates lose all sense of military decorum and just get blood thirsty was amazing.

 

[Neuromancer]

Spec Ops has a lot of great details as the game goes on that really show the decline. The flag on the main menu constantly deteriorates with each chapter, for example. My favourite such detail however is how the loading screen quotes change.

"White phosphorus is a common allotrope used in many types of munitions. It can set fire to cloth, fuel, ammunition, and flesh."
"White phosphorus is a common allotrope used in your slaughter at the Gate. It can set fire to soldiers and the innocent civilians they are trying to help."

 

[Ezekiel]

Didn't see what the big deal was. I didn't care about the story, and the combat was pretty average. I think Superbunnyhop touched on it in his war games video, how the brutality you were forced to inflict felt... forced.

 

[Dalisclock]

One of the best details in the game is how the voice lines from both the PC and the squad mates get increasingly brutal and nasty as the game progresses. It starts out as cookie cutter military stuff like "tango down" or "take out the machine gun" in calm voices and ends up with barks like "Fuck that guy up!" and "Die you bastard!" shouted at the top of their lungs.

It's also been pointed out that the melee takedowns in the game start out being fairly clean and efficient and get more and more brutal as the game goes on, further reinforcing how Walker is slowly losing his shit.

It's also been pointed out long before now that if you pay attention to the maps, you're always descending(up until the very end when you reach the Burj Khalifa(that super tall tower), even though after a certain point it should be impossible to do so. To put this in perspective....Dubai is at Sea level or just very slightly above it. Even taking the massive sand dunes(which are ridiculously huge) into account, there's no way you should be able to keep going downward so much.

Then again, considering Walkers state of mind.....

 

[Dalisclock]

That is why I have not touched after so long. I had the demo and it was alright but it did nothing to make me go got to grab this. Especially cause it hit me on my brown shooter down turn. It is a shame cause it can't spoil itself cause that cuts the experience. Makes me upset I missed out on that pure blind experience.

The demo honestly does a really poor job of selling it. I tried it out before buying and found it very meh. It wasn't until people started talking about it a lot that I bought it and realized how little the demo really represents what the game does well.

 

[Jarrito3002]

Didn't see what the big deal was. I didn't care about the story, and the combat was pretty average. I think Superbunnyhop touched on it in his war games video, how the brutality you were forced to inflict felt... forced.

I guess it could be forced. But when a theme being tackled is how far can "just following order. Also most military shooters have scripted events this one just gave a full face of the aftermath.

 

[Dalisclock]

Didn't see what the big deal was. I didn't care about the story, and the combat was pretty average. I think Superbunnyhop touched on it in his war games video, how the brutality you were forced to inflict felt... forced.

I guess it could be forced. But when a theme being tackled is how far can "just following order. Also most military shooters have scripted events this one just gave a full face of the aftermath.

I'm not arguing it's not railroaded, because it is. However, one can make the same argument about pretty much every other game trying to make a statement about violence that isn't Undertale. Spec Ops, Metal Gear Solid series, Last of Us Part 2, Bioshock, etc. Pretty much all of those chide you on killing without thinking but pretty much all of them force you to do so(and kind of expect you to do so). It's kind of an inherent issue with the medium that games want to talk about how killing is wrong....and then give you no other option(or no other realistic option). I mean, yeah, you could turn the game off but that kinda goes against why you bought the game in the first place.

 

[Jarrito3002]

It's also been pointed out that the melee takedowns in the game start out being fairly clean and efficient and get more and more brutal as the game goes on, further reinforcing how Walker is slowly losing his shit.

It's also been pointed out long before now that if you pay attention to the maps, you're always descending(up until the very end when you reach the Burj Khalifa(that super tall tower), even though after a certain point it should be impossible to do so. To put this in perspective....Dubai is at Sea level or just very slightly above it. Even taking the massive sand dunes(which are ridiculously huge) into account, there's no way you should be able to keep going downward so much.

Then again, considering Walkers state of mind.....

That is what got me too. Like the sand was just unnatural like it was alive and moving . I do someone pointing out how despite descending your always at ground level.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

I think it's one of the great games I've played, and a reliable magnet for the crowd that translates any sort of reflection on human condition as a personal attack.
Generic is usually fair criticism, though I feel Spec Ops *uses* it in a clever, original way. You need the lull of a generic war shooter to give any impact to the psychological subversion in the second half of the game. It compounds it. And I think the game is also pretty arduous, even in standard difficulty, that for all the familiarity of the genre it still keeps you on your toes and forces you to play defense. Every battle is essentially a siege scenario: your pick your spots and hold your ground.

Didn't see what the big deal was. I didn't care about the story, and the combat was pretty average. I think Superbunnyhop touched on it in his war games video, how the brutality you were forced to inflict felt... forced.

Every game "forces" everything that happens in it. It's all scripted and accounted for. All those sweet Max Payne 3 no scopes have all been coded in for your personal thrill.

 

[XsjadoBlayde]

Had a pretty good experience with the game, avoiding any spoilers and played it with a friend who was a proper Call of Duty Stan. To this day he still brings it up in a positive way, so it definitely made the mark it wanted to make in the mind of people it was aiming for.

 

[Ezekiel]

I guess it could be forced. But when a theme being tackled is how far can "just following order. Also most military shooters have scripted events this one just gave a full face of the aftermath.

But most military shooters aren't themed around killing being bad. Would have had more significance if you had some control over it, meaning choice. Spec Ops just didn't make me care.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

But most military shooters aren't themed around killing being bad. Would have had more significance if you had some control over it, meaning choice. Spec Ops just didn't make me care.

Does "If I don't have a choice I don't care" translate terribly well in other aspects of your life, like when you read - if you read - or watch a movie or a show? Or is that just for games that offend your comfy sense of moral high ground by suggesting people 1) don't necessarily know better because 2) they don't have the whole picture so 3) they can get carried away in their actions and 4) will make excuses for their actions even when they directly contradict reality because 5) reality is too painful to bear?

 

[Houseman]

Does "If I don't have a choice I don't care" translate terribly well in other aspects of your life, like when you read - if you read - or watch a movie or a show? Or is that just for games that offend your comfy sense of moral high ground by suggesting people 1) don't necessarily know better because 2) they don't have the whole picture so 3) they can get carried away in their actions and 4) will make excuses for their actions even when they directly contradict reality because 5) reality is too painful to bear?

Books and movies aren't interactive. Books and movies don't make you, the audience, kill a dog before the plot can advance.

 

[Johnny Novgorod]

Books and movies aren't interactive. Books and movies don't make you, the audience, kill a dog before the plot can advance.

Different narrative mediums. It's all about having an emotional or intellectual response and making sense of it. Being repelled or disturbed for effect is a universal technique.