Spider-Man 2 - Does whatever a spider can do

CriticalGaming

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So did they change MJ's model to fill the writer's ego? Is that why?

I'd rather then have made her ugly for some propaganda rather that her being changed to fuel someone's ego trip.
 

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So did they change MJ's model to fill the writer's ego? Is that why?

I'd rather then have made her ugly for some propaganda rather that her being changed to fuel someone's ego trip.
I'm not going to trust a Twitter post taken out of context . Not the first time a game designer or game writer insert themselves (or part of themselves) into a character. I personally don't give a rat's ass, and there's plenty of authors and writers that are and were guilty of this in TV shows, movies, books, and especially comic books.
 
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CriticalGaming

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I'm not going to trust a Twitter post taken out of context? Not the first time a game designer or game writer insert themselves (or part of themselves) into a character. I personally don't give a rat's ass, and there's plenty of authors and writers that are and were guilty of this in TV shows, movies, books, and especially comic books.

Meh it just speaks of the indicative nature of the writer's mindset where they need to self insert rather than telling a compelling story with established characters. MJ didnt need a character model swap just to feed someone's ego.
 

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Meh it just speaks of the indicative nature of the writer's mindset where they need to self insert rather than telling a compelling story with established characters. MJ didnt need a character model swap just to feed someone's ego.
While that may or may not true, MJ is not the main focus of the game, so it don't matter much. Besides, I've seen so much worse when it comes to game directors or writers.
 

sXeth

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Not being a hardcore spider-man fan, but has there been any iteration of him in the symbiote suit going the extra mile? The only time I've seen it was the bad ending for Web of shadows where he starts taking over the world w/ symbiote black cat.
I mean not really. He picks up the costume in Secret Wars, and it is geniuinely helpful. Even (by failure of understanding humans) basically lobbing him around like a puppet at night while he's asleep and fighting crime. Which results in him getting it checked out by Reed Richards and they figure out its alive and work on separating it. When he finally does separate it it saves him and willingly leaves him alone.

Its when it bonds with a very angry Eddie Brock that the symbiote becomes "evil". (and later on essentially rehabiliates to an anti-hero, particularly when held up against some of of its offspring like Carnage).

When its with Peter its basically just alien though, not malicious. Its trying to permannetly bond against his will and does weird stuff trying to help him, but never actively manipulates his personality or anything like that. Ultimately both saving him from dying in the bell incident he set off to force it off him and willingly leaving.

In the far more recent stuff, its even set out moreso that it was an exile or reject from the main symbiote world because it wouldn't fall in line with Knull (the much more actual evil Symbiote God)

I think the "symbiote turns up Peters aggression/evil" was more specifically originated in the 90s cartoon, which was probably for simplicity's sake but due to that series influence would affect later media.
 
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Jarrito3002

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So did they change MJ's model to fill the writer's ego? Is that why?

I'd rather then have made her ugly for some propaganda rather that her being changed to fuel someone's ego trip.
I doubt that the writing department and art department don't usually intersect. In fact most departments anywhere are just passing each other by.

I feel this is a happy coincidence that is getting gassed up for all wrong reasons.
 
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sXeth

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I mean, the guy who makes anime monstergirl porno games might not be the most accurate reference point to begin with.

But two relatively normallish looking people of the same gender having a vaguely similar appearance (the hairstyle is distinct, and the chin/jawline is totally different, MJ's eye spacing is wider and nose is thinner, but I wouldn't expect the cartoon drawer to catch that)

They've also screencapped a particularly off mid-animation (or hell, maybe yanked the model out to force it) compared to. for instance

download.jpg

Probably the only thing that seems to have distinctly changed is they've made her older with more pronounced cheeks and 'laugh lines" and the hairstyle. (idk if she's actually older in the game or how much older (physically or stress wise)

MJ in the comics has bounced all over from more or less normal girl next door to modestly succesful model, but rarely been categorized as some sort of supermodel or extreme sex-symbol character (thats more Black Cats bag as spider man goes)
 
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Jarrito3002

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So I have been playing Aracho Person 2 so far. I have not gotten far cause my brain must do the side quest. I mean it would not be Spider Man to stop a break in or speeding while on your way to punch the villain in the dick in the most acrobatic way.

I am loving the web slinging get the momentum right and I am shocked how they can improve upon it. I have not turned on the eat shit setting I like my web sling relaxing and being able to go with the flow.

Combat feels a little more fined tuned though I find my self not doing the intended combo or action at times. I have not gotten far in the story but Peter feels deprived since Miles has electricity powers because any while a boricua he is still half black so he must have electricity powers as is tradition. Add on the invisibility and he is just more dynamic. I still love you thought Pete.

The world man I am sorry Insomniac I am so busy web sling at the speed of light and punching that I forget to take in the scenery and the details. New York feels lived in like NPC go about their day indepdent if I am even playing which even most open world games.

Plus kudos to Insomniac by including some elements and gameplay from the Ratchet and Clank Rift Apart and using them in this game. I hope Insomniac does that more often even as the transition into company that makes really good Marvel games.

With the way Sony is batting with open world games with Spider Man, Ghost of Tsushima and Horizon shout out to Sucker Punch and Guerilla games I don't need nothing from Ubisoft for a while unless it has Rayman in the name.

Black Cat was apparently already confirmed bisexual in 2021, so yes she is still into men as well. And gay, straight, or bi, I don't see why this would ruin her as femme fatale.
You know I am just going to be stickler meeseeks and say that many women refer to their same sex friends as girl friends platonically.



Until next time.
 
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CriticalGaming

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I doubt that the writing department and art department don't usually intersect. In fact most departments anywhere are just passing each other by.

I feel this is a happy coincidence that is getting gassed up for all wrong reasons.
I am going to eat crow in this. I apologize it turns out that Spider-Man 2 Mary Jane is using the same character model as they did for her in the 2018 game. This was confirmed by a developer on Twitter.

However it doesn't explain why her character model is so fucking ugly this time around. You'd think the game built for the Ps5 next gen would be able to use better textures and polish on the main character models to make them better looking.

My thinking is that character models had to get a detail hit (because even the Spider-men are a bit lacking compared to the other games) in order to bulk up the city traffic, to keep the optimization clean, to make fast travel work as fast as it does. So the overall game on a technical level benefits from having these downgraded models. That's my theory in that regard, I don't know but it's the only thing that makes sense.

I mean Mary's fucking hair isn't even the same color, it's all washed out and shit in the new game. Fuck me. I hate it.
 

hanselthecaretaker2

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I am going to eat crow in this. I apologize it turns out that Spider-Man 2 Mary Jane is using the same character model as they did for her in the 2018 game. This was confirmed by a developer on Twitter.

However it doesn't explain why her character model is so fucking ugly this time around. You'd think the game built for the Ps5 next gen would be able to use better textures and polish on the main character models to make them better looking.

My thinking is that character models had to get a detail hit (because even the Spider-men are a bit lacking compared to the other games) in order to bulk up the city traffic, to keep the optimization clean, to make fast travel work as fast as it does. So the overall game on a technical level benefits from having these downgraded models. That's my theory in that regard, I don't know but it's the only thing that makes sense.

I mean Mary's fucking hair isn't even the same color, it's all washed out and shit in the new game. Fuck me. I hate it.
It’s a design choice. The odds that they’d need to compromise model facial details during the web slinging action scenes they’re largely absent from anyways are slim to none. Even back on PS3 character models like Kratos had no LoD scaling during those set pieces. They implemented it later on, but damn it reminds me of how much magic was worked back then with far less. I miss the PS3 wow factor sometimes.
 

Casual Shinji

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I haven't even talked about the combat at all, even after finishing it, but something about it feels off compared to the previous two games. This'll get a bit complicated for me to explain, but I'll try anyway.

In Miles Morales your (venom) abilities were tied to your focus bar and your finishers required a combo of x15. You could get three total focus pips, and I think you could stack two finishers with a skill upgrade. And focus ofcourse is generated by punching and dodging. You were free to use whichever ability you had so long as you had a focus pip filled, meaning you could unleash three venom punches or slams back to back once you had the entire focus bar unlocked.

In Spider-Man 2 your abilities have their own individual charges. Spider Barrage for Peter for example isn't tied to your focus bar, but will charge individually as you fight. The focus bar now is reserved for finishers, like in the Spider-Man PS4 game. This in essense gives you more special attacks to use during a fight than in the previous games. Whereas in Miles Morales you could have three abilities and two finishers lined up during a fight, in Spider-Man 2 you can have four abilities and three finishers.

However, the way this ends up in practice means you're no longer really thinking what abilities to use during combat, and instead just unleashing whatever ability is available. Same with the gadgets which function similarly, and are now as easy to access during combat as your abilties. Enemies are also susceptible to pretty much every ability and gadget you have, without any being more vulnerable to certain abilities are gadgets, so it really doesn't matter - just press the button to the corresponding ability or gadget available and enemies will get hurt. It also means that once you've used an ability then that's it - you have to wait for that ability to recharge. You can no longer pit out of a universal energy pool to fuel your abilties and decide which one to use based on the focus you have available. The decision making during combat is partially removed, with your abilties relegated to 'can you use it, then use it'.

And then there's Miles' invisibility which has been completely neutered. It really might as well not even be there now. In Miles Morales you could pretty much stealth fight during combat if you had your skill tree filled out, but in Spider-Man 2 Miles' invisibility skill is completely removed from his skill tree. The best you get is a gadget from Uncle Aaron which allows an increase of your first attack when you're invisible. That's it. The game doesn't even mention or show Miles turning invisible during a cutscene or a tutorial, nothing. They just completely neglected it. It's fucking weird.

The last bit of annoyance, though to a lesser degree, is that you can no longer drip-feed yourself on the focus bar. In the previous two games whatever sliver of focus you had you could add to your health bar by pressing down on the D-pad. This made getting out of danger zones a lot smoother, as you could quickly try to get some attacks in to build a bit of focus and then slurp it into your health bar. In Spider-Man 2 though you now need a full pip of focus to heal. So when you're in the red during combat (and don't have nearly enough focus for a full pip) it serves less to stay in the fight, and you'll be more prone to dodge and use whatever ability you can unleash.
 

CriticalGaming

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@Casual Shinji i think the combat was changed in order to throw more enemies at you. Because almost every encounter is just dozens of enemies all at once all the time so you are expected to be squirting off abilites and gadgets all the time. The venom nests are really actually quite hard because of how many enemies they throw at you. Combined with some really dumb enemy types.

That being said i agree that the combat here doesnt feel as tight as the previous games. The abilites and gadgets make it feel more spammy.
 

Bob_McMillan

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I cannot believe the discourse about Mary Jane is not "why the fuck do they keep making us play as Mary Jane" and is "Mary Jane is OP". Man, fuck of all you. And this is probably just that stupid IGN article I read, but still.
 
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CriticalGaming

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I cannot believe the discourse about Mary Jane is not "why the fuck do they keep making us play as Mary Jane" and is "Mary Jane is OP". Man, fuck of all you. And this is probably just that stupid IGN article I read, but still.
I mean I don't like the Mary Jane sections, but like I understand the idea of sort of breaking up the gameplay pace and giving you a break. They make sense in context and aren't as bad as people make them out to be. They didn't need to be in the game, but also it's fine that they are there.
 

Casual Shinji

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I cannot believe the discourse about Mary Jane is not "why the fuck do they keep making us play as Mary Jane" and is "Mary Jane is OP". Man, fuck of all you. And this is probably just that stupid IGN article I read, but still.
I will say, near the end when M.J. gets the gun that takes out enemies in two or three shots, I was getting some major deja vu to RE2 Remake where Annette has that gun that puts Birkin on his ass in one shot. Like why the hell do I not have that game!? If Peter was dual wielding two of those guns he'd be wiping the floor with those guys.
 

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Annette has that gun that puts Birkin on his ass in one shot.
That stuns him more so than puts his ass down (for barely a minute). Besides, Annette used acid rounds and Claire can do the same to Birkin, if she has any acid rounds.