Super straight on tiktok

Seanchaidh

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Not according to the LBGT community who seem to who their genitial preference as one of the only key factors in who they are. Gay pride has an entire public parade to celebrate it.
Aside from probably missing the point of gay pride, you seem to have mistaken "cannot be proud without" for "can be proud about"
 

Kwak

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If the far left progressive Twitter mob uses all of their crumbs of influence to be as nasty as possible, it's everyone's -- gay or straight -- duty to point that out. If that sinks someone's perception of non-straight people... well, you win some you lose some. Letting them stay in their little bubble is generous enough. Pride events are large enough that some wackos get to air their pent up frustrations without it sticking out too much, and because of that I'm personally on the fence (as usual) about the whole thing.
What 'thing'? Letting them exist as equals in society without undue harassments and discrimination?
 
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McElroy

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What 'thing'?
Pride day/week/month. Even if most people don't make it about human rights now that laws are inclusive to them, far left progressives will gladly try to push for a next thing that they so desperately need. During Pride that shit gets airtime while criticizing it is evil, of course.
 

Mister Mumbler

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Pride day/week/month. Even if most people don't make it about human rights now that laws are inclusive to them, far left progressives will gladly try to push for a next thing that they so desperately need. During Pride that shit gets airtime while criticizing it is evil, of course.
"I've been discriminated and attacked for years and all I got was this lousy parade."
 

McElroy

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While sneaking socialism and communism in there (y'know, "far left" 'n' all): Gender abolition, redefinition of terminology (more genders, more orientations, rape and consent), gender studies to be taken seriously and applied, normalization of trans-children as well as any non-normative sexuality that people normally get criticism for if it's made a show of -- especially to kids because hey it's "inclusive education" that they just don't know to ask for. This year I bet it'll be a push against the trendy new(-ish) perceived enemy: TERFs.

Note that I don't see these people as any sort of a threat to anything. The social media circles this shit comes from is far from the mainstream. However, they probably will try to co-opt Pride which will have to turn them away or admit it's just helping any far left progressive to get their message heard.
 

Avnger

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While sneaking socialism and communism in there (y'know, "far left" 'n' all): Gender abolition, redefinition of terminology (more genders, more orientations, rape and consent), gender studies to be taken seriously and applied, normalization of trans-children as well as any non-normative sexuality that people normally get criticism for if it's made a show of -- especially to kids because hey it's "inclusive education" that they just don't know to ask for. This year I bet it'll be a push against the trendy new(-ish) perceived enemy: TERFs.
Wait... How are any of those issues "socialism and communism"? And why do you believe things like redefining terminology (a process that has literally existed for as long as language has) and normalization of non-normative sexualities is bad? And why are TERFs not bad?
 

Secondhand Revenant

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Quite a few, I fear. After all, part of winning people over can be padding their egos.
Tbh I mean, I believe it's also because at their core they really have little value for those rights. It's not that they were just swayed by insults, it's that they didn't care in the first place.
 

Secondhand Revenant

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While sneaking socialism and communism in there (y'know, "far left" 'n' all): Gender abolition, redefinition of terminology (more genders, more orientations, rape and consent), gender studies to be taken seriously and applied, normalization of trans-children as well as any non-normative sexuality that people normally get criticism for if it's made a show of -- especially to kids because hey it's "inclusive education" that they just don't know to ask for. This year I bet it'll be a push against the trendy new(-ish) perceived enemy: TERFs.

Note that I don't see these people as any sort of a threat to anything. The social media circles this shit comes from is far from the mainstream. However, they probably will try to co-opt Pride which will have to turn them away or admit it's just helping any far left progressive to get their message heard.
Socialism and communism have pretty little to do with lgbt rights and place in society. The others are pretty relevant.
 

Silvanus

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While sneaking socialism and communism in there (y'know, "far left" 'n' all): Gender abolition, redefinition of terminology (more genders, more orientations, rape and consent), gender studies to be taken seriously and applied, normalization of trans-children as well as any non-normative sexuality that people normally get criticism for if it's made a show of -- especially to kids because hey it's "inclusive education" that they just don't know to ask for. This year I bet it'll be a push against the trendy new(-ish) perceived enemy: TERFs.
Rape and consent are not getting "redefined" at Pride. New orientations or genders are not getting invented or conjured out of the ether. What's happening is that valid concepts that get next-to-no airtime for the rest of the year get a little more exposure.

It is not "far-left" to talk about stuff that isn't heteronormative or strictly within the gender binary. It's fine. And kids finding out this stuff exists-- or learning about gender dysphoria-- is a lot more healthy than the "old" approach of denial, shame & closeting.
 
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Revnak

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Note that I don't see these people as any sort of a threat to anything. The social media circles this shit comes from is far from the mainstream. However, they probably will try to co-opt Pride which will have to turn them away or admit it's just helping any far left progressive to get their message heard.
The first pride was a riot led by transwomen, and at the time all minority sexualities and genders were associated with communism by the definitely homosexual himself Joseph McCarthy, as you are doing here. The left and the transgenders aren’t “co-opting” pride, they invented it and your middle of the road type always opposed it.
 

Kae

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I dont think that is fair man. Im talking about it in context of stupid tweets and whatever tik tokkings are.

The problem is that people on this forum and frankly everywhere else on the internet always escalate and exaggerate things into completely different circumstances and situations.

"Dont insult someone and expect them to not insult you back."

"These insults cause genocide!!!"

It not the same thing. These super straight lads are not killing anyone and they arent hurting anything more than feelings maybe and that's kind of a big maybe.

Just rolling your eyes at it, does not mean you are supporting physical abuse, murder, or any sort of oppression. And clapping back with some dumb tweet or tiktok only feeds fuel to the trolls. It is trolling 101, do not feed them!
Well actually, as you can see here that a lot of people rallying behind this super straight thing are literal fucking nazis, to the point that the super straight flag has the SS from the Schutzstaffel's insignia, so I don't think it's a stretch to suggest they're actually in favour of genocide, since you know that's the thing that nazis love more than anything else in the world, and do keep in mind that's an article correcting the exaggerated rumours of nazi involvement in the movement and it still has like a shit-ton of evidence of nazi involvement.

That being said the whole thing is mostly just stupid, but I think you're severely undermining the capacity of politicizing a meme and turning it into propaganda, which is clearly what's happening here, like there's no ambiguity nazis are literally saying they did exactly that, like it's them openly admitting it, basically nazis love to hide behind the "Just a joke bruh, you're being sensitive" while simultaneously using that joke to normalize harmful idea, again this meme is a very obvious example of this, again read the article there are images of nazis talking about how this is useful to radicalise people to their cause.

And regarding that "Not feeding the trolls", it doesn't exactly work because if you let them spew this bullshit around you're letting them spread their (again by their own admission) propaganda, so at this point it's better to call them out so that people can see what their doing and avoid falling into their trap.
 
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Trunkage

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Socialism and communism have pretty little to do with lgbt rights and place in society. The others are pretty relevant.
Just to add to this, gender deconstruction' is Post Modern. Not Marxist. These two groups are pretty at odds with each other. Pretending these groups are the same just details how you didnt bother looking into either of these groups.
 

Dreiko

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Because gay people have been forced to live in shame for centuries. Pride is a direct response to that. Do straight people have the same history, of being unable to be open about who they love? Fucking no.
Straight people were also forced into shame during that same time for perfectly normal heterosexual activity. What do you think puritanism is if not shaming people for being heterosexually sexual?


Once you start understanding it's not straight people as a group forcing people to live in shame but rather religious and political leaders who wish to control you, you will stop seeing random straight people as the enemy and will finally focus on the actual people with power. The random twitter poster who doesn't like penis in his icecream is not the enemy. The actual power is in the hands of someone who wouldn't even have to worry about such issues in their daily life.
No, I don't think Dreiko has empathy for people in power, he is merely supremely self-interested. He is liberal only as far as it suits his ability to do as he pleases, and everyone else's liberty can go drown in a lake.

That's the idea of being liberal. Everyone is tasked with finding a way to do as they please and pursue what they find meaningful in life. You are to not hinder other people for you do not want them to hinder you back, but you are also not obligated to worsen your happiness out of some nebulous moral duty to them, either.


The cool thing is that if everyone did this for themselves they wouldn't need someone else to help them since they'd have already managed to achieve their desires by themselves, so everyone ends up happy this way.


The only way this fails is when people are unwilling or unable to achieve what others are achieving, which leads to things like jealousy and enmity, but you don't fix that by hating on the people who didn't fail at what you failed at, you fix this by realigning your goals and finding a new target to pursue, one that you may be more capable of achieving.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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Straight people were also forced into shame during that same time for perfectly normal heterosexual activity. What do you think puritanism is if not shaming people for being heterosexually sexual?


Once you start understanding it's not straight people as a group forcing people to live in shame but rather religious and political leaders who wish to control you, you will stop seeing random straight people as the enemy and will finally focus on the actual people with power. The random twitter poster who doesn't like penis in his icecream is not the enemy. The actual power is in the hands of someone who wouldn't even have to worry about such issues in their daily life.
Anyway, Arkansas has a bill in front of the governor restricting doctors from giving care to trans people, up to and including not allowing doctors to refer patients of other doctors about said healthcare.

"Random straight people" were never the enemy. Straight people who feel so strongly about being straight that they support legislation that hurts people are the enemy, and Pride is about overcoming those people

That's the idea of being liberal. Everyone is tasked with finding a way to do as they please and pursue what they find meaningful in life. You are to not hinder other people for you do not want them to hinder you back, but you are also not obligated to worsen your happiness out of some nebulous moral duty to them, either.


The cool thing is that if everyone did this for themselves they wouldn't need someone else to help them since they'd have already managed to achieve their desires by themselves, so everyone ends up happy this way.


The only way this fails is when people are unwilling or unable to achieve what others are achieving, which leads to things like jealousy and enmity, but you don't fix that by hating on the people who didn't fail at what you failed at, you fix this by realigning your goals and finding a new target to pursue, one that you may be more capable of achieving.
Like worse housing, lower paying jobs, and bad education. Just lower your standards and you solve *checks notes* racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, and most importantly, you don't inconvenience normal people.
 

Dreiko

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Anyway, Arkansas has a bill in front of the governor restricting doctors from giving care to trans people, up to and including not allowing doctors to refer patients of other doctors about said healthcare.

"Random straight people" were never the enemy. Straight people who feel so strongly about being straight that they support legislation that hurts people are the enemy, and Pride is about overcoming those people


Like worse housing, lower paying jobs, and bad education. Just lower your standards and you solve *checks notes* racism, sexism, homophobia, transphobia, and most importantly, you don't inconvenience normal people.
The thing that makes people feel strongly about these things is religion or people in power that demagogue about it. If people were more about not inconveniencing anyone in general and finding their way through life by themselves with what they can achieve in earnest then these ills would be less pronounced than they now are as well. There'd be no need for someone else to tell you through religions or propaganda what is the meaning of a good life, you'd have to actually ponder that yourself.


The thing is that there has to be a constant, a standard that is there which everyone upholds, which will cause people to behave in this way. If you start giving people free punch passes because their ancestors failed by a sufficient enough amount that they now are second class citizens then you start shaking the confidence people have in this approach and they will just try to game the system in their favor as opposed to working within it.


And yes lowering your standards fixes a ton of things, especially with today's overinflated standards as caused by people projecting an air brushed version of their lives on social media that cause people to be jealous and covetous of things that aren't even realistic to begin with. I don't think nobody ever was happy back before the modern era, despite how much suffering was commonplace back then due to lower technological advancement and ignorance of science and medicine. So if the people of those times found some way to be content, it is eminently possible for practically everyone alive in our modern paradise.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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You need either more or less drugs.
The thing is that there has to be a constant, a standard that is there which everyone upholds, which will cause people to behave in this way. If you start giving people free punch passes because their ancestors failed by a sufficient enough amount that they now are second class citizens then you start shaking the confidence people have in this approach and they will just try to game the system in their favor as opposed to working within it.
That is quite possibly the dumbest way to blame somebody for being oppressed that I have ever heard. That "standard", whatever it is, has not and does not exist. The fact that there are second class citizens to begin with proves that. Working within the system has not, does not, and will not work. You'd have to be ignorant of the entire history of the United States to believe otherwise, let alone be confident. Slavery took bombings, assassinations, and war. Labor rights happened through challenging the system with massive disruptions and pitched battles. Racial and gender rights involved shut downs, fighting with police, and fucking up the system. The first Pride was a fucking riot.
Fuck's sake, this entire fucking country was founded in violent opposition to "the system".
 
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Agema

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That's the idea of being liberal.
No, the point of being a liberal is to support the idea of the individual as an agent capable of taking control of their own life, and giving them the freedom to do so.

Seeing as you swan around discussions denying some people's self-determination and showing little interest in or objections to their suppression, whether by the state or oppressive majorities, the natural conclusion is that you are not liberal. Just a mound of smug self-interest spouting some platitudes that you've noticed that your peers respond well to.
 

TheMysteriousGX

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The thing that makes people feel strongly about these things is religion or people in power that demagogue about it.
Fuck it, I'm not done.

For a significant amount of people, they feel strongly about "these things" because some assholes who have *actual power* have spent the last 6/80/200 years propping up hundreds/thousands of actual bullshit laws trying to fuck up the lives of themselves and their friends and loved ones. It's not demagoguery or religion that makes people like me feel strongly about this, it's people who're using the government as a cudgel against me, my family, and my friends.

Meanwhile, sanctimonious assholes stand off to the side asking me why I care so much about my friends and family being under actual threat while they whine about their fucking high school porn games not getting enough fucking respect.
 

Dreiko

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No, the point of being a liberal is to support the idea of the individual as an agent capable of taking control of their own life, and giving them the freedom to do so.

Seeing as you swan around discussions denying some people's self-determination and showing little interest in or objections to their suppression, whether by the state or oppressive majorities, the natural conclusion is that you are not liberal. Just a mound of smug self-interest spouting some platitudes that you've noticed that your peers respond well to.
Your self-determination has to not come at the expense of mine. That's the fundamental part. If through my self-determination you end up somehow in a bad way without me trying to cause such an effect, that's just the luck of the draw basically. There's no faulty principles here. Just try to make the best of what life gave you. If you try to upend the system then the people who are better off will try to maintain it and they have more resources than you so if anything you'll end up worse than where you started while they consolidate even more power.

Fuck it, I'm not done.

For a significant amount of people, they feel strongly about "these things" because some assholes who have *actual power* have spent the last 6/80/200 years propping up hundreds/thousands of actual bullshit laws trying to fuck up the lives of themselves and their friends and loved ones. It's not demagoguery or religion that makes people like me feel strongly about this, it's people who're using the government as a cudgel against me, my family, and my friends.

Meanwhile, sanctimonious assholes stand off to the side asking me why I care so much about my friends and family being under actual threat while they whine about their fucking high school porn games not getting enough fucking respect.
Yeah that's what I was talking about with regards to religion and demagogues. A lot of these dumb laws trace back to religious thought or demagogy. That's your opponent, not people who want to enjoy politically incorrect entertainment unmolested.