The Big Picture: Stars, Worn

TWEWYFan

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This about sums up my concerns about the Star Wars movie better than I could, so thank you Bob!
 

PuckFuppet

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Jan 10, 2009
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I have nothing against the idea of a new story, nor do I have anything against the idea of them using the leads from the original trilogy again. What I do have a problem with, and what will kill this film for me, is JJ Abrams. Everything that man writes boils down to two words, daddy issues. And in a setting that comes pre-packaged will already established parental figure characters you can be damn sure we'll see a lot of it.

Or in a world where magic stills happens and writers other than the crowd that spawned in or around JJ Abrams exist... I really think the old leads coming back would be the ideal. It allows for there to be context, character context, for the whole scope of what the story in the original trilogy achieved in that setting and more importantly, what it didn't.

But yeah, this film is doomed by who is involved. Just pray they never let JJ near a Marvel film... oh god... imagine what that Spiderman would look like.
 
Dec 16, 2009
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Adam Locking said:
Mr Ink 5000 said:
MovieBob said:
Stars, Worn

MovieBob addresses some of the rumors around the new upcoming Stars Wars trilogy.

Watch Video
what was that about Peter Parker at 4:10?
no, noooo, I love superior Spider-man, it pisses all over the potential of killing Parker in the ultimates universe n just replacing him with a black peter parker
Is it bad this was the main thing I took away from this as well?

FFS, while it's obvious they were going to bring him back, couldn't they have waited more than a year? Actually give this arc some meaning and time to develop naturally? Superhero deaths are already dime-a-dozen by this point, keeping Peter dead the extra 12 months or so would hopefully give it a bit of impact, but no, back to life for Peter.

It's not as if Superior isn't selling well either, but I guess they need to status quo back for when the movie comes out...
if the first film is anything to go by, its gonna take more than ruining the comic to make the sequal look good
 

Mr. Q

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What do you mean it's been almost a year since we talked about Star Wars on this show?

*checks the archives* Yup, Continuity Wars back in February 26 of last year. Damn!

OK, back on topic. I seriously want Episode VII to be a passing of the torch to the next generation rather than jerking off the fanboys one more time for a safe buck. I've seen this happen before and it never works out for the best. Best example of that is the same one Bob mentioned in the video - Blues Brothers 2000. I saw that sequel in theaters and, as a fan of the original movie, this did not live up to the first one at all. Blues Brothers was one of those films that did not need a sequel, especially one that just retread the same old shit but with a PG-13 rating and certain magic-based WTF moments. -_- This is also why I'm hesitant on that "always mentioned by Dan Aykroyd but hasn't gotten anywhere near pre-production" Ghostbusters 3 movie. As cool as it sounds to have a next gen take over the duties of the veteran busters, I highly doubt it will pan out. Mostly because Bill Murray isn't in a position to relive the past for a paycheck. Unlike his co-stars, he's doing mighty fine where he's at these days.

I hope to God Disney has some common sense to put the brakes on any half-baked ideas J.J. Abrams and do this sequel properly. They either need a co-director to keep J.J. on a short leash or have him placed in a role where he can do the least amount of damage (like head janitor of Epcot Center). This is not the time to repeat the mistakes of the past, both in terms of the prequels or the botched sequels of popular movies. If they want this to be their latest meal ticket, then they need to stop listening to the whiny bitches of the Internet that have no clue what they want, stop rehashing what has been done with this franchise, and start taking it into a new direction.
 

Lono Shrugged

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TechTim said:
Han dies as a "shock moment", maybe. I feel more likely Luke dies protecting Han, Leah, and sidekicks.
Ford originally championed the idea of killing Han in Return Of The Jedi to raise the stakes. His reasons made perfect sense plot wise and would have added what Joss Wheadon cleverly called "Possible Wild Bunch ending" in Serenity. (As in they could all die) So no, sorry Bob I didn't hear it from you first.

Again without being too negative, the constant smug questioning of motives of everyone involved really struck me as "I will not get hyped about this and be proved right when it does not reach fan expectations" PLENTY of movies have gone through development hell and been fine films so that is not really a valid point. ANY polishing of scripts or bringing in of talented writers can be a plus. If you don't believe me then go to a writers group and see how discussion can elevate a script. In relation to that: Shitting on Irvin Kershner was paticularly cheap. It is very easy to pick someone's worst work and throw it in front of them when you want to make a smug point. (I quite enjoyed Dreamcatcher despite it's massive problems. Great cast, great chemistry) Then, flipping round at the end and saying that "making another trilogy is the best thing they can do with the franchise at this point" just made me groan. What bothered me most wasn't the viewpoint, it was the cheapness of the shots being taken and the assumptions and cynicism involved. I guess it's all part of being a "cinephile" as opposed to a movie lover.

It felt like by taking an incredibly cynical view but still being totally down the middle in terms of expectations feels like Bob covering himself for people calling him out on flipping opinions like with 'Man Of Steel' For god's sake have an opinion and stick to it. Even if it is unpopular. (Like me with Dreamcatcher!)
 

Baresark

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It's easy to remove the old characters and make the new ones central... they did it in the books. They kill Chewy (just like in the book), sending Han into a depressed state where he stays out of touch with just about everyone (just like in the books), Luke has New Jedi Order business to attend to (just like in the books) and you can make the main Force user's Han and Leia's children and craft stories around them (just like in the books). I also feel that this is right up JJ Abrams alley as he basically ruined Star Trek by taking all the science out of it (something that Star Wars is completely devoid of). He will be awesome as a Star Wars director as the series lends itself to more action based stories. We'll see how it goes though.

Also, this new fresh restart speech that Bob made seems like a trap. He made the exact same argument for Man of Steel, and then came forwarded with how much he hated it, ad nauseum. It would be fine except he hated it because it was so far removed the Richard Donner films, something he himself wanted. But, all well.

I'm sure they will be fine films in their own right... though I have to say, if I see anymore spinny twirly Jedi shit, I'm gonna lose my shit. It just doesn't make sense for them to always be spinning in circles!
 

seditary

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I'm not looking forward to whatever shit JJ Abrams throws into the movie. I'd much rather watch that Mace Windu crack Bob outlined.

And Han dying is a perfect answer to the question of why Harrison Ford would accept to do the movie lol.

Zachary Amaranth said:
People actually laughed at the "reveal" in Into Darkness at the theater a friend of mine went to.

I could totally see it happening again. Abrams pats himself on the back while viewers laugh.
I did too. I even tried to stop myself from laughing because I knew it was coming but I couldn't, it was so dumb I still lost it. I got quite a few looks lol.
 

JimB

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I am all for bringing back the original characters, but every time I try to imagine the original actors reprising their roles in anything other than a cameo, I start to feel uncomfortable and embarrassed. I just have such a hard time imagining that bringing back the original actors would be less sad than going to a high school reunion and seeing a sixty-year-old dressed up like the cheerleader she was four decades ago to try to recapture the glory of a life that has since passed her by.
 

thewatergamer

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Just speaking purely from my opinion please don't freak out any star wars fans, am I the only one that really doesn't care about the new star wars trilogy?

I mean yeah its kind of exciting to see more of it, but I think star wars is just a really tired franchise and I really don't see anyone pumping new life into it very easy, also disney seems alot more interested in making gobtons of money off the name as opposed to actually making a good movie,

I have hope that they will turn out to be good but I think some people are blowing it way out of proportion as "the biggest thing on the internet"
 

Darth_Payn

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shrekfan246 said:
Zhukov said:
Oh, I can just hear it now, "Bu... bu... but that's not... that's not what happened in the extended universe!"
And thus a new decade of cries about "But Han shot first!" was born unto the internet.

OT: Insightful episode. As somebody who likes The Phantom Menace and likes many parts of the other two prequels, I'm not really all that afraid of how a new trilogy is going to "ruin" Star Wars forever again. It's not like much worth paying attention to has come out of the Star Wars brand since 2006, anyway.
That takes a lot of guts to say on the Internet, and I can respect that. I do not HATE the prequel trilogy, just think it could have been better. If anything's a threat to the sequel trilogy's success, it's the Vocal Minority of fans whose whining is the loudest than all others.

As a side note: HOLY SHIT, Peter Parker will be Spider-Man again?! Yay!

captcha: Brand Lift
sounds like what Disney's trying to do to STAR WARS anyway.
 

Darth_Payn

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Mr Ink 5000 said:
Adam Locking said:
Mr Ink 5000 said:
MovieBob said:
Stars, Worn

MovieBob addresses some of the rumors around the new upcoming Stars Wars trilogy.

Watch Video
what was that about Peter Parker at 4:10?
no, noooo, I love superior Spider-man, it pisses all over the potential of killing Parker in the ultimates universe n just replacing him with a black peter parker
Is it bad this was the main thing I took away from this as well?

FFS, while it's obvious they were going to bring him back, couldn't they have waited more than a year? Actually give this arc some meaning and time to develop naturally? Superhero deaths are already dime-a-dozen by this point, keeping Peter dead the extra 12 months or so would hopefully give it a bit of impact, but no, back to life for Peter.

It's not as if Superior isn't selling well either, but I guess they need to status quo back for when the movie comes out...
if the first film is anything to go by, its gonna take more than ruining the comic to make the sequal look good
Wouldn't be the first time; in 2011, right on time for Captain America: The First Avenger, Steve Rogers was given the name Captain America again because up to that point, it was Bucky Barnes, who was "killed" again.
 

shrekfan246

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May 26, 2011
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Darth_Payn said:
shrekfan246 said:
Zhukov said:
Oh, I can just hear it now, "Bu... bu... but that's not... that's not what happened in the extended universe!"
And thus a new decade of cries about "But Han shot first!" was born unto the internet.

OT: Insightful episode. As somebody who likes The Phantom Menace and likes many parts of the other two prequels, I'm not really all that afraid of how a new trilogy is going to "ruin" Star Wars forever again. It's not like much worth paying attention to has come out of the Star Wars brand since 2006, anyway.
That takes a lot of guts to say on the Internet, and I can respect that. I do not HATE the prequel trilogy, just think it could have been better. If anything's a threat to the sequel trilogy's success, it's the Vocal Minority of fans whose whining is the loudest than all others.
I certainly acknowledge that the prequels could be far better. Attack of the Clones and Revenge of the Sith have embarrassing scripts which the performances of Samuel L. Jackson and Ewan McGregor couldn't even save, Hayden Christensen was a poor casting choice but I'm not sure any more talented actor would've even been able to do a better job, and Lucas' direction was fairly poor across the board.

Even the biggest saving grace of the films, the action sequences, tend to drag on a bit longer than they ideally should for the sake of showing how flashy they could make everything. And while I love the action sequences for what they are, the reason I think The Phantom Menace is still a good film even in comparison is because it still retained a bit of the 'heart' found in the original trilogy rather than being flashy and overblown for the sake of it. Sure, it was simpler, less subtle, and more overtly 'kid-friendly' than the original trilogy, but at the end of the day I actually enjoy it more than Return of the Jedi and about as much as A New Hope or Empire Strikes Back.

I've got no taste in films, though. I like Star Trek: First Contact/Generations/Nemesis and The Motion Picture, and quite enjoyed Into Darkness as well. XD
 

bluegate

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I had always hoped that they would set it in either a 'distant' future or a distant past, it's a pretty big universe, no need to stick to the same cast of characters. Create something new and exciting, pretty please? Ah well, it's not going to happen...

I am interested how this is going to turn out though.
 

Combustion Kevin

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here's my thought: why would they HAVE to involve the original characters that heavily?
featuring them in a support role or as a mentor figure in one way or another is cool, it gives old viewers a connection, but to make the new trilogy SPECIFICALLY ABOUT THESE CHARACTER'S KIDS just feels like bad fanfic territory to an almost stereotypical level.

By all means, feature the old guard, but bring in something new in the protagonist's origins, an interesting environment and background, not something you'll commonly find in disney's direct-to-video sequels they brought out before.
 

Canadamus Prime

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Jun 17, 2009
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I said from the first moment I heard about this new trilogy that it's be a mistake to bring back the original cast, unless the films were set 40 or so years after the original trilogy and even then...
 

Something Amyss

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seditary said:
I did too. I even tried to stop myself from laughing because I knew it was coming but I couldn't, it was so dumb I still lost it. I got quite a few looks lol.
It's a legit reaction. I had it spoiled well before I saw it so my response was fairly inorganic, but sweet Jesus was that a dumb reveal.
 

Kyrian007

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I'll preface this by saying that I LOVE Star Wars. Loved the original movies, love most of the EU, and am a big fan of most of the videogames (Rogue Squadron rail shooters can suck it, X-Wing and Tie All the Way.) Heck, the vector graphics star wars game (sit down booming base cabinet with a steering yolk) is what probably MADE me a gamer in the first place. I didn't love the prequels, but I wasn't supposed to. They were made to bring kids young enough to be MY OWN kids into the franchise. And even though it wasn't what I wanted, I can't fault them for that. I TOO wish more kids knew, loved, and GOT Star Wars.

Having said that, I look over at my bookcase dedicated to dozens of EU novels, Dark Horse comics, tabletop roleplaying books going all the way back to the West End Games D6 version, and even some of the classic Marvel Comics Star Wars and all I can think is... I don't want ANY of this in Episode VII. Not even my beloved Dirty Dozen bad-boy Wraith Squadron.

Don't get me wrong, I still like MOST of that stuff. I even LOVE a lot of it. But that's not what I want to see in episode VII. I'd love to see some of that stuff on the big or small screen. But I think that the established EU and the movie canon... need to go their separate ways. The problem lies with the EU. There's just too much for it to be enticing to newcomers, and for someone like me who has followed the whole thing... there would not be anything NEW to an episode VII adhering to the EU. Hell, there wouldn't be anything new in episode XXVIII. As much as I would love to see Booster Terrick's Gambit steal a star destroyer just before the battle of Thyferra, Kyp Durron and the Sun Crusher, Kyle Katarn vs the Dark Troopers, Keeyan Farlander and the Redemption Scenario, or even the only mission of Dinner Squadron (the only NR squadron with a 100% success rate and no losses) there's just too much EU out there to do it any real justice keeping the movies "canon" with the EU. Better to start fresh. But they just have to remember, George Lucas rebooted another property once... Willow. And I thought that could not have turned out ANY worse. I'm kind of iffy on the choice of JJ, but as long as he does better than Shadow Moon was to Willow...

Ok, it could be half as bad as that and still suck. But I don't think he could do much worse.