Looking at the reviews it looks like it's going to be pretty damn divisive. Like Watchmen-type divisive.
The Big Picture: Superman Revisited
- Thread starter MovieBob
- Start date
I agree wholeheartedly here; making Lex a savvy businessman wielding the 'new' kind of power was not only an incredibly smart move, it was one that seems oddly knowing, considering the power that large corporations have in our society and the kinds of crimes we understand they can get away with. Putting that kind of power up against the raw physical power of Superman makes for a more interesting problem.Vilealbaniandwarf said:
Also: to anyone complaining about Superman's 'all powerful' nature I would say a couple things:
1) Good writing generally solves this problem.
2) I have found out that the Hulk can 'adapt' his body so that he can survive in space. That is some lazy bullshit, right there.
You do realise Superman isn't even in the Top 5 of the most powerful Justice League member.Ukomba said:
He's not even in the top 100, or even 1000 most powerful DC character.
people considered golden age superman lighthearted children stories? Are you sure you don?t mean the silver age?
I like lex luthor as a corrupt corporate executive, it solves the why doesn?t he simply sell his inventions plothole.
I like lex luthor as a corrupt corporate executive, it solves the why doesn?t he simply sell his inventions plothole.
I just miss the red trunks he used to have...
The original is still a classic, though. "You've got me!... Who's got you?"
Even if "rewind time" is the most stupid cop-out power ever. Right next to "amnesia kiss".
But, hey, can we all agree that Man of Steel HAS to be better than the nearly three-hour-long borefest that was Superman Returns?
The original is still a classic, though. "You've got me!... Who's got you?"
Even if "rewind time" is the most stupid cop-out power ever. Right next to "amnesia kiss".
But, hey, can we all agree that Man of Steel HAS to be better than the nearly three-hour-long borefest that was Superman Returns?
The difference between Marvel and DC, and which probably a big reason Marvel is doing better, isn't the characters but the universes.
It was mentioned in a Avengers/Justice League crossover at one point, but in the DC Universe, the heroes are loved and adored. There are parades in the street, statues to the heroes... they're loved. Especially in the case of Superman, the villains often come across as jealous and petty, because that's what they are. As a viewer, it's very difficult to sympathise with the enemy in that situation. I'd argue that The Dark Knight pulled it off more because of Two Face than the Joker. Yeah, I'm serious.
In Marvel, the heroes themselves fight adversity. Captain America is manipulated by the government, Stark is an alcoholic, the mutants are discriminated, Hulk is being hunted down by the army when all he wants is to be left alone. Their progression is against adversity, and about doing the right thing even for those that despise you, or would see you fail. That makes a better short story, which is what films ultimately are.
I'm not holding by breath for Man of Steel, but there is so much potential there. I doubt it'll be used sadly.
It was mentioned in a Avengers/Justice League crossover at one point, but in the DC Universe, the heroes are loved and adored. There are parades in the street, statues to the heroes... they're loved. Especially in the case of Superman, the villains often come across as jealous and petty, because that's what they are. As a viewer, it's very difficult to sympathise with the enemy in that situation. I'd argue that The Dark Knight pulled it off more because of Two Face than the Joker. Yeah, I'm serious.
In Marvel, the heroes themselves fight adversity. Captain America is manipulated by the government, Stark is an alcoholic, the mutants are discriminated, Hulk is being hunted down by the army when all he wants is to be left alone. Their progression is against adversity, and about doing the right thing even for those that despise you, or would see you fail. That makes a better short story, which is what films ultimately are.
I'm not holding by breath for Man of Steel, but there is so much potential there. I doubt it'll be used sadly.
If the movie goes well... I hope they reboot batman... not that I didn't like all 3 new bats (i liked the second one, for it's timing, and music)... they are just NOT BATMAN! I want a batman film that is more like the Arkham series, and perhaps start this one with out going to an origin story... and start with "red hood" (the Robbin gone bad) story, to introduce villeins, and deal with each one, then at the end, deal with Batman's own protege... (Refer to Batman:Hush for world art style)... you'll have battles, super villeins, DETECTIVE WORKS (all batman films missing), and EMOTIONS/DRAMA besides love interest (but throwing in cat is cool too... I guess...)..
There are several DC heroes and villains that are stronger and faster than Superman (usually one or the other) or are at least on par with him but have an advantage and/or disadvantage that can give one the edge. Billy Batson/Captain Marvel/SHAZAM (f*ck you, reboot) is arguably completely on par with Superman AND he's magic, which hurts Supes a lot. All the Flashes are faster than him, especially Wally West. Plus he's not immune to hypnotism and he's fallen to that a few times now, even by Poison Ivy.Ukomba said:
Superman's best stories are often more about whether or not he should use his powers and finding a balance, a way to give people hope without having them come to rely on him. That or they're about him having to show that while he is an exemplary man and a paragon of what superheroes should strive to be, he can't be everywhere at once and people may suffer due to his inability to help. Goeff Johns' Superman: Secret Origin and New Krypton arc tackled that perfectly (though some of the character changes like Parasite were a little on the weird side).
What? Is this sarcasm? Never been good at detecting sarcasm that is blatantly wrong or misleading....Sheen Lantern said:
I've seen it several dozen times, it underpowers both Superman and Goku.Ukomba said:
This is where Superman ranks on the JLA/JL scale:
1. Spectre
2. Phantom Stranger
3. Doctor Fate
4. Wally West's Flash
5. Barry Allen's Flash
6. Captain Atom
7. Kyle Rayner's Green Lantern
8. Alan Scott's Green Lantern
9. Jay Garrick's Flash
10. Martian Manhunter
11. Captain Marvel / Superman
(This is off the top of my head, I'm sure I've forgotten some people)
And on the DC Universe as a whole, jesus, I could sit here all day and still wouldn't have enough time to list everyone stronger than Supes.
Every 5th Dimensional Imp, every New God, every Martian, Swamp Thing, The Presence, Michael and Lucifer, every Spectre, The Great Evil Beast, every incarnation of the Anti-Monitor, the regular Monitor, Mandrakk, the Source, anyone connected to the Speed Force.
Ion, Parallax and every other avatar of emotion.
Imperiex, Doomsday, Trigon, the Guardians of the Universe, Zoom and Professor Zoom, Time Trapper, Starbreaker, Amazo, The Entity, Saint of Killers, every Endless, Ares, Zeus, Cythonna and... You get the point.
I'm still laughing that you linked that video as if it makes Superman out to be some sort of god, I mean, how weak did you think he was before you saw that video? lol
Was that what Infinite Crisis was about? I have some research to do.Hutzpah Chicken said:
Wolverine's angry loner schtick doesn't work anymore since he appears in a lot of X-Men books and he's still an Avenger, though I think his role is downplayed since Jonathan Hickman took over writing.80sboy said:I agree.
We're living in an age where ever hero has to be an anti-hero. No one understand characters that just want to do good anymore because they think they're just one-dimensional boy scouts, while angry brooding murderous characters like Wolverine supposedly have depth...lol
(not saying I don't like Wolverine...honestly, I love him...but he is just a one-dimensional angry fuck...lol)
Up till now, the only other movie except for the original Superman movies with Chris Reeves that got it right was Captain American. Unfortunately for that movie though, after the genuinely good 1st act, the 2nd and 3rd went to shit as it became a bland mind numbing bore, as if the director just decided to finish it off and pass the character onto the Avengers. Also, HOW THE FUCK do you make Red Skull into a mind numbing bore of a character? Damn, that movie went to shit!
Oh, and as for Sam Raimi's Spiderman? Nope! He was just a one-dimensional forgettable goodie-two-shoes.
As for your Captain America argument, it's all over the place. Did we watch the same movie? You claim it got Cap right, then call it and the Red Skull boring? Hugo Weaving just ate up the scenery as the Skull!
Why does Bob hate on TDKR? I thought he thought it was OK, and I liked how they did Bane! I was thoroughly entertained, and that's the least I asked for from that movie.OlasDAlmighty said:
I do have high hopes for Man of Steel, and so far, I'm not disappointed.