The Clone Wars Absolutely Nails the Moment We’ve All Been Waiting For

Nick Calandra

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Not sure if you guys knew, but Marty Sliva has been writing for The Escapist for a few months now. He runs a column called Snapshot which digs into video games big memorable moments, and also has been doing a bunch of coverage for us on The Clone Wars show.

The past few episodes of the final season have been quite incredible, and personally I think it's the best Star Wars stuff we've seen in a very long time.

Have you been watching? What do you think?

Here's his take on this week's episode if you're curious.

 

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I caught up with the season about halfway through(I didn't have DIsney+ until the schools were shut down here) but I was a clone wars fan on Netflix. It's been a great way to finish out the series and I've been far more invested in it then pretty much any SW thing since Rogue One. I even went back to rewatch ROTS for the first time in over a decade in preparation.

But yeah, it's been a great ride and I'm looking forward to watching the final episode(I finished "Shattered" a few hours ago). I appreciate how they managed to sync up the last few episodes with ROTS without it feeling awkward.

Update: Watched "Victory and Death" last night( Apparently the last episode dropped early due to May 4th). Yeah, that was a great sendoff to the series. Particular the last two scenes in the episode. It did an excellent job of dealing with Ahsoka and Maul escaping Order 66 as well as Rex surviving till Rebels(and if you believe the fan theory, Rex shows up in ROTJ as part of the Endor Strike team). The set piece on the falling Star Destroyer reminded me of something from the SW video games(Jedi Knight off the top of my head, though I'm sure there are others). Though it does make the Ashoka's insistence on "non-lethal" measures against the clones feel kind of weird(and Rex does call her out on this).
 
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Chimpzy

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Saw the final two episodes today. And yes, it's a great finale to the show. Tied up some loose story threads. It had good some good emotional moments, like making me feel like Order 66 has some impact, because there are actual characters I like involved in it, not faceless nameless mooks vs equally unknown jedi who didn't so much as had a single line like in the movie.

Also, Maul was a delight as always. Honestly, I'd say Clone Wars biggest credit is making that big fat nothing from Phantom Menace into something fun and engaging.
 

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Was such a good show.

Now what do i do since it's ended?
 

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Saw the final two episodes today. And yes, it's a great finale to the show. Tied up some loose story threads. It had good some good emotional moments, like making me feel like Order 66 has some impact, because there are actual characters I like involved in it, not faceless nameless mooks vs equally unknown jedi who didn't so much as had a single line like in the movie.

Also, Maul was a delight as always. Honestly, I'd say Clone Wars biggest credit is making that big fat nothing from Phantom Menace into something fun and engaging.
This.

Yeah, I was shocked how much Maul was rehabilitated from being that silent bad guy in TPM to being a fascinating and chramistic threat. It was more than enough to let me accept the handwave that "He got better" after getting cut in half and fell into a bottomless pit in the movie.

And knowing who the Jedi, getting to spend time with them, as well as seeing the clones as allies and good soldiers gives Order 66 much more of an impact then "He's dead, she's dead, who are these people again?"

I remember when EP3 came out about certain people bitching about Aayla Secura going down in a manner people were not happy with in ROTS and not being familiar with the books/comics, I'm pretty much "Who?". Oh, there's a Twilek Jedi Lady who shows up very briefly in AOTC and ROTS and doesn't have single line(and apparently there was a huge controversy centered on her and wookieepedia I totally didn't know about until a couple weeks ago) Hard to care about someone who the movies treat as a cameo. Clone wars gave her and some of the other jedi a bit more meaning to them getting gunned down

Was such a good show.

Now what do i do since it's ended?
Have you tried Rebels? If not, it's worth a shot and it's follow on to Clone Wars. A couple characters, such as Capt. Rex and Ahsoka Tano come back as main characters. The first season is more or less set on the same planet and is arguably the weakest.

Not to mention we finally get to see the Maul storyline resolved in kind of an awesome way.
 
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bluegate

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More Clone Wars is always a good thing.

Too bad that the era of Anakin, Ahsoka and Obi-wan swashbuckling their way across the galaxy as good guys fighting "evil" clankers is over.

Way better setting and era than anything post-Episode 3.
 

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More Clone Wars is always a good thing.

Too bad that the era of Anakin, Ahsoka and Obi-wan swashbuckling their way across the galaxy as good guys fighting "evil" clankers is over.

Way better setting and era than anything post-Episode 3.
Episode 3 or episode 6? The Galactic Civil War/OT era tends to be the most popular and stormtroopers are at least as much disposable mooks as any of the droids. Hell, at least the droids have the excuse of being programmed to, while stormtroopers(and the rest of the imperial military) rarely come across as anything other than poorly trained fascist dipshits(who apparently are into punching babies).

 
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bluegate

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Episode 3 or episode 6? The Galactic Civil War/OT era tends to be the most popular and stormtroopers are at least as much disposable mooks as any of the droids. Hell, at least the droids have the excuse of being programmed to, while stormtroopers(and the rest of the imperial military) rarely come across as anything other than poorly trained fascist dipshits(who apparently are into punching babies).
Revenge of the Sith - Episode 3.

I'm not a big fan of the depressing and oppressive nature of the Rebels versus Evil Empire era.

The Star Wars galaxy as shown in the Clone Wars and Prequel era is a lot more inviting to me personally. Worlds are individual worlds and deal with their individual problems, there isn't an ever present Evil Empire stomping its feet around. The Jedi are in their prime; they are all over the place and they have a firm grasp on their abilities, meaning we get to see a lot more 'fantasy'-esque stuff being done.
 

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Episode 3 or episode 6? The Galactic Civil War/OT era tends to be the most popular
Really?

I generally got the sense among the fandom that the prequel era was generally more popular than the OT era. I mean, people love the clones (for whatever reason), and there's probably more information on the Clone Wars than any other conflict in the setting. Fans seem to agree that the OT movies are better than the PT ones, but as an in-universe time period, I've found it to be the other way round.
 

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Really?

I generally got the sense among the fandom that the prequel era was generally more popular than the OT era. I mean, people love the clones (for whatever reason), and there's probably more information on the Clone Wars than any other conflict in the setting. Fans seem to agree that the OT movies are better than the PT ones, but as an in-universe time period, I've found it to be the other way round.
I didn't poll the fandom or anything. I guess I just got the impression the GCW was more iconic then the Fall of the Old Republic/Clone War Era based on media around it.

The clones I totally get. Not only did TCW flesh them out to be likable and have different personalities and such, but there's the inherent tragedy there of how they were basically bred as a cannon fodder slave army for a war that was a farce to begin with and as soon as it was over, they'd be forced to murder their generals who they'd fought alongside for years before being discarded themselves (presumably, considering we don't see a lot of clones left by the time Rebels starts).
 

Hawki

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I didn't poll the fandom or anything. I guess I just got the impression the GCW was more iconic then the Fall of the Old Republic/Clone War Era based on media around it.
I'd argue that the GCW is the more iconic war, while the Clone Wars is the more popular war. That may seem like splitting hairs, but I'll put it this way.

If I say "Star Wars" to the average person, they're almost certainly going to think of something from the OT first. By extension, that would include stuff like the Death Stars and Hoth. This material has been burnt into the popular conciousness for decades. Or, in another sense, everyone knows what a stormtrooper is. A clone trooper though? Not so much.

However, within the fanbase, the Clone Wars have struck me as the more popular conflict. I don't have hard numbers, but I've noticed that the clones have kind of achieved a kind of affinity within the fanbase that the rebels/Empire never have (more on the clones later). Also, there's the Clone Wars series itself. I'm not aware of any Star Wars transmedia campaign that's achieved the same level of popularity that the Clone Wars have - remember the Shadows of the Empire transmedia campaign? I didn't even know it was a transmedia campaign until decades after playing the game on the N64 and thinking it was some random game. I know that's not a 1:1 comparison, but what's achieved the level of success as the Clone Wars? Not Rebels. Not Resistance. Sure as hell not Droids or Ewok Adventures. The only thing that comes close is KOTOR, but that's contextually different.

The clones I totally get. Not only did TCW flesh them out to be likable and have different personalities and such, but there's the inherent tragedy there of how they were basically bred as a cannon fodder slave army for a war that was a farce to begin with and as soon as it was over, they'd be forced to murder their generals who they'd fought alongside for years before being discarded themselves (presumably, considering we don't see a lot of clones left by the time Rebels starts).
So, the thing about the clones. On one hand, I get the popularity. On the other, I kind of disagree with it.

Here's the thing, from my perspective, as someone who's never been that into the Star Wars EU. Taking the films by themselves, there's very little to suggest that the clones have distinct personalities, and what does exist indicates that they're little better than droids. In Ep. 2, there's not a single clone character. In Ep. 3, we know there's a bit of friendship between Obi-Wan and Cody, but as soon as Order 66 is given, there's nothing to suggest that any of the clones have any compunction against turning on the Jedi. Yes, Cody does have a throwaway line in the RotS novelization about firing on Obi-Wan, but that's it. The way I saw it was that we aren't meant to sympathize with the clones. We're meant to see them as amoral soldiers that, putting two and two together, go on to be the stormtroopers - the visual elements in RotS is enough to establish this. Now, that's not to say you couldn't hypothetically tell stories about clones that gained free will, and those stories were told, but to me, those stories would be the exception rather than the rule.

Of course, the Clone Wars TV series, and a plenthora of other media (e.g. the Karen Traviss Clone trooper novels) make an effort to 'rehabilitate' the clones, in that a lot of them gain personalities. The ethics of their creation are questioned, Ashoka becomes friends with Rex (or according to fanfic, something more), and I've seen the Order 66 Clone Wars clips, which are like night and day compared to how RotS portrays them. Now, you could argue that this makes the clones more interesting. That it adds moral ambiguity to the actual conflict, that the Republic is breeding sapient beings to fight a war against a force that is fighting for independence. If you said that, maybe you're right. I can't deny that it arguably adds depth to the clones. However, I would maintain that how the clone troopers came to be portrayed in media, is VASTLY different from how the films portrayed them.

Also, there's another thing that I find a bit puzzling about this. EU media has humanized the clones, and the fanbase seems to have liked it, given the popularity of various characters. However, that humanization hasn't been extended to stormtroopers or even droids. Oh sure, some stories have dealt with stormtroopers going rogue, but never to the same extent, and I can't think of a stormtrooper character that's ever achieved the popularity of clone trooper characters. Heck, say what you will about the sequel trilogy, but it at least gave us Finn, and Jannah, and humanized stormtroopers to an extent. But again, it seems that we're willing to humanize one group of faceless soldiers (clone troopers), while laugh at another (stormtroopers). And droids? Solo treated L3's liberation attempts as a joke, and even then, some fans accused the film of being "SJWed" because a female droid was trying to get other droids to seize their independence.

So, yeah. On one hand, I get the clone troopers' popularity. On the other, I also don't.
 

Chimpzy

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Of course, the Clone Wars TV series, and a plenthora of other media (e.g. the Karen Traviss Clone trooper novels) make an effort to 'rehabilitate' the clones, in that a lot of them gain personalities. The ethics of their creation are questioned, Ashoka becomes friends with Rex (or according to fanfic, something more), and I've seen the Order 66 Clone Wars clips, which are like night and day compared to how RotS portrays them. Now, you could argue that this makes the clones more interesting. That it adds moral ambiguity to the actual conflict, that the Republic is breeding sapient beings to fight a war against a force that is fighting for independence. If you said that, maybe you're right. I can't deny that it arguably adds depth to the clones. However, I would maintain that how the clone troopers came to be portrayed in media, is VASTLY different from how the films portrayed them.

Also, there's another thing that I find a bit puzzling about this. EU media has humanized the clones, and the fanbase seems to have liked it, given the popularity of various characters. However, that humanization hasn't been extended to stormtroopers or even droids. Oh sure, some stories have dealt with stormtroopers going rogue, but never to the same extent, and I can't think of a stormtrooper character that's ever achieved the popularity of clone trooper characters. Heck, say what you will about the sequel trilogy, but it at least gave us Finn, and Jannah, and humanized stormtroopers to an extent. But again, it seems that we're willing to humanize one group of faceless soldiers (clone troopers), while laugh at another (stormtroopers). And droids? Solo treated L3's liberation attempts as a joke, and even then, some fans accused the film of being "SJWed" because a female droid was trying to get other droids to seize their independence.

So, yeah. On one hand, I get the clone troopers' popularity. On the other, I also don't.
I suppose that could down to the fact that the clones have the benefit of being rank and file for the good guys' side for the vast majority of their screentime. Stormtroopers don't. They're villainous mooks. And while this is pure conjecture on my part, the nature of that villain might play a role in why Stormtroopers are mostly only humanized when they've done a heelface turn (Finn, Jannah): the Empire are Nazis. Not literally of course, but the inspiration in the Empire's look is obvious, down to the uniforms, iconography and naming conventions. And why not, it's an easy and effective way of coding your villains as irredeemably evil: make them look like Nazis. But it also makes humanizing them a bit of an iffy proposition.
 
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I suppose that could down to the fact that the clones have the benefit of being rank and file for the good guys' side for the vast majority of their screentime.
Screentime by what standards though?

Screentime if we factor in the EU? Well, yeah, though you could debate whether the Republic are the 'good guys' in context. Screentime if we look at the films? Again, debateable. The 'rehabilitation' of the clones came afterwards. Even if we factor in stuff released between Ep. 2/3, the clones still pave the way for the Empire, and have no compunction against gunning down Jedi at the drop of a hat. In contrast, stormtroopers are actual recruits.

Stormtroopers don't. They're villainous mooks. And while this is pure conjecture on my part, the nature of that villain might play a role in why Stormtroopers are mostly only humanized when they've done a heelface turn (Finn, Jannah): the Empire are Nazis. Not literally of course, but the inspiration in the Empire's look is obvious, down to the uniforms, iconography and naming conventions. And why not, it's an easy and effective way of coding your villains as irredeemably evil: make them look like Nazis. But it also makes humanizing them a bit of an iffy proposition.
So, on that note.

Is the Empire/First Order based on the Nazis? Yes. From an in-universe perspective, is the Galactic Empire worse than the Republic? Yes. However, that doesn't really preclude humanizing storm troopers. If we look at WWII fiction, there's plenty of material that humanizes German soldiers. There's material that humanizes Japanese soldiers. There's material that humanizes Confederate soldiers. You can look at any war and find a way to humanize the people serving the 'wrong side,' and it would be easier to do in Star Wars, because it escapes the real-world baggage that comes with it. And, to its credit, Star Wars technically did with Finn, but there's never been the same level of 'stormtrooper rehabilitation' that the clone troopers got. There's plenty of Imperial defectors you could name in the canon, including stormtroopers, but none have reached the level of the clone troopers. I'd argue that within the fanbase, Finn is still secondary to major clone trooper characters.

And look, I get it. Stormtroopers are mooks that we get to enjoy being shot while missing all of their own shots. But I'd still maintain that one clone troopers came to be regarded as within the fanbase, is very different from how the films originally portrayed them as.
 

Chimpzy

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The clones still pave the way for the Empire, and have no compunction against gunning down Jedi at the drop of a hat. In contrast, stormtroopers are actual recruits.
Bit nitpicky perhaps, but whether the clones had compunctions against killing jedi or not wasn't up to them. They're programmed to follow order 66 and have a chip implant that further enforces it. Rex' chip was faulty so he could sort of resist it, and completely ignore his programming once the chip was gone. The Rebels show has other freed clones who similarly had their hardwiring removed and promptly switched back to the jedi side. So my guess is other clone troopers would also stay loyal to whatever jedi they have a good bond with, if given the choice.

And yes, Stormtroopers are recruits. Who chose to fight for the genocidal cartoonishly evil ersatz-nazis. Tho both A New Hope and Solo seems to imply a fair number Empire troops could just be people from backwaters hoping for a better life and/or seeking adventure, a common real life motivation for joining the military. And I suppose there's also a lot of not so voluntary conscription followed by a healthy dose of brainwashing going on. The sequels pretty much spell out the First Order gets all its fodder that way (tho not their ships, it ass-pulls those). So not much choice going on in that case either.
Is the Empire/First Order based on the Nazis? Yes. From an in-universe perspective, is the Galactic Empire worse than the Republic? Yes. However, that doesn't really preclude humanizing storm troopers. If we look at WWII fiction, there's plenty of material that humanizes German soldiers. There's material that humanizes Japanese soldiers. There's material that humanizes Confederate soldiers. You can look at any war and find a way to humanize the people serving the 'wrong side,' and it would be easier to do in Star Wars, because it escapes the real-world baggage that comes with it. And, to its credit, Star Wars technically did with Finn, but there's never been the same level of 'stormtrooper rehabilitation' that the clone troopers got. There's plenty of Imperial defectors you could name in the canon, including stormtroopers, but none have reached the level of the clone troopers. I'd argue that within the fanbase, Finn is still secondary to major clone trooper characters.

And look, I get it. Stormtroopers are mooks that we get to enjoy being shot while missing all of their own shots. But I'd still maintain that one clone troopers came to be regarded as within the fanbase, is very different from how the films originally portrayed them as.
True, the Star Wars fanbase tends to latch onto background characters or even just an object, and then the expanded material massively, er, expands on that. Which then becomes this vicious circle of mutual fanwank.I mean, Boba Fett? Supposedly the most massive superbadass even tho he's never portrayed as such in the OT. Sure, he's got enough of a reputation to get hired by Vader, he's clever enough to track the Falcon to Bespin and takes a few shots at Luke in Empire and Return. But that's all the quote unquote badassery we actually see of him before he unceremoniously gets offed by accident by a half-blind Han. Same for the other bounty hunters from that <1 minute scene in Empire, except they get less of a showing. Especially the droid, IG-88. Enough that they basically made an expy of it in the Mandalorian.

Aaaaaanyway, I guess the clones sparked the fanbase's imagination and adoration more than the Stormtroopers did. Except oddly not when it comes to dressing up. I've never seen cosplay of the clones. Plenty of the main heroes, Vader, Boba/Jango, generic Jedi, Stormtroopers and sexy twilek dancers (in certain more specific circles), and out of those the Stormtrooper is arguably the most popular. But not clone troopers.
 
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I suppose that could down to the fact that the clones have the benefit of being rank and file for the good guys' side for the vast majority of their screentime. Stormtroopers don't. They're villainous mooks. And while this is pure conjecture on my part, the nature of that villain might play a role in why Stormtroopers are mostly only humanized when they've done a heelface turn (Finn, Jannah): the Empire are Nazis. Not literally of course, but the inspiration in the Empire's look is obvious, down to the uniforms, iconography and naming conventions. And why not, it's an easy and effective way of coding your villains as irredeemably evil: make them look like Nazis. But it also makes humanizing them a bit of an iffy proposition.
Pretty much this. The clones are shown as being effective, working alongside the jedi(especially when you factor Clone Wars into the mix) and basically having no choice in the matter. They were born and bred to be a grand army of the republic and Clone Wars almost outright states being a soldier is pretty much all they have in life(one of the clones who is found raising a family on a backwater planet is treated as a deserter, impling clone troops can't just quit the army). Order 66 was a double whammy of the inhibtor chips and the additional clause of those who refuse to execute Order 66 will be charged with treason and face execution themselves.

Stormtroopers, on the other hand, are generally seen as being ineffective fascist jerkasses who chose to join up(unless there's a lot of offscreen conscription we're not seeing) and there are a few defectors from the imperial ranks in various media, so it's implied the people who didn't like the Imperial Military didn't last very long(Sabine and Callus in Rebels, Kyle Katarn in Dark Forces games, Han Solo in Solo, what's her face(though hers was a bit more of a stretched considering her elite trooper status) from Battlefront 2) and promptly switched sides.

I admit it would be nice to see a couple of non-jerkass stormtroopers, buit again, it seems that good people tend to not like being in the imperial military very much due to self selecting for facist jerkasses who enjoy harassing civilians and punching babies.
 
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Bit nitpicky perhaps, but whether the clones had compunctions against killing jedi or not wasn't up to them. They're programmed to follow order 66 and have a chip implant that further enforces it. Rex' chip was faulty so he could sort of resist it, and completely ignore his programming once the chip was gone. The Rebels show has other freed clones who similarly had their hardwiring removed and promptly switched back to the jedi side. So my guess is other clone troopers would also stay loyal to whatever jedi they have a good bond with, if given the choice.
That whole chip thing in the clones was wholesale invented in the Clone Wars show, years after the movies. I actually prefer the old EU's take on it, which was: that Order 66 was a line in the the clones' emergency orders handbook, available for anybody to see. From Wookiepedia:

Order 66 could be found in the document entitled Contingency Orders for the Grand Army of the Republic: Order Initiation, Orders 1 through 150, GAR Document CO(CL) 56-95, a document containing a series of special contingency orders that covered any and all emergency situations, which the clones that comprised the Grand Army of the Republic (GAR) were prepared to execute, immediately and without question, and only in specific cases of extreme necessity. It was originally designed as a fail-safe by Jedi Master Sifo-Dyas against rogue Jedi.[1] Some of these orders concerned contingencies any armed force could conceivably face. Many dealt with contingencies specifically involving the GAR Supreme Commander—in this case, Supreme Chancellor Palpatine—and the effect on the chain of command were he ever to become incapacitated or declared unfit to issue orders. In particular, Order 65 dealt with the detention and possible execution of the Supreme Chancellor by the Republic if he became unfit for office, further hiding the true intention of Order 66. Sufficiently buried among the other one hundred forty-nine orders so as to almost escape notice, Contingency Order 66 specifically dealt with the effect on the chain of command were issues to arise involving the Jedi. The text of the order ran:

Order 66: In the event of Jedi officers acting against the interests of the Republic, and after receiving specific orders verified as coming directly from the Supreme Commander (Chancellor), GAR commanders will remove those officers by lethal force, and command of the GAR will revert to the Supreme Commander (Chancellor) until a new command structure is established.
I find this a lot more compelling than a mind-control chip that takes away free will. It's a criticism on military doctrine, and of the Jedi being so far above common life that they miss the thing in plain sight that destroys them. At any point in time, any Jedi could have read this manual or asked a question of any clone trooper about orders to eliminate Jedi, and not one ever did. And it still left loopholes for clone troopers to choose to disobey the order, which in the old EU a few did.

There's no nuance in just leaving it up to "mind control chips", but ultimately the cartoon is a kids' show.

I mean, Boba Fett? Supposedly the most massive superbadass even tho he's never portrayed as such in the OT. Sure, he's got enough of a reputation to get hired by Vader, he's clever enough to track the Falcon to Bespin and takes a few shots at Luke in Empire and Return. But that's all the quote unquote badassery we actually see of him before he unceremoniously gets offed by accident by a half-blind Han.
Fun fact: when George was making Episode 5, he was still operating on a 12 movie saga vague outline. In that outline, Boba Fett was supposed to be the main villain of Episode 6.

Naturally, the reality is that that was cut down, and Lucas had to get rid of Boba Fett quickly to move on to the main plot with the Emperor. This is why the first act of Episode 6 is divorced from the rest of the movie, it was meant to be its own movie.

Boba's enduring popularity was largely down to his character design; Lucas has said that if he knew how much fans would take to the design, he'd have tried to do something more with the character in the movie.

Aaaaaanyway, I guess the clones sparked the fanbase's imagination and adoration more than the Stormtroopers did. Except oddly not when it comes to dressing up. I've never seen cosplay of the clones. Plenty of the main heroes, Vader, Boba/Jango, generic Jedi, Stormtroopers and sexy twilek dancers (in certain more specific circles), and out of those the Stormtrooper is arguably the most popular. But not clone troopers.
Eh. I think clone troopers were a little more popular in the old EU, mainly because Karen Traviss wrote a bunch of Republic Commando books that were the Star Wars branch of military sci-fi fiction for a while, and naturally fans of that sort of thing gravitated to it. She kind of fetishized them and tied them in to Mandalorians a lot more. Mandalorians as a whole are a force for Star Wars fandom, being probably the most popular faction after the Jedi. But those clone troopers were, like, a sub-branch of Mandalorians as a whole. Then the show divorced clone troopers from Mandalorians, so after that I think clone troopers as a whole lost a lot of traction even as a few clone trooper characters like Rex were a big hit with fans.
 

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Those last scenes were so great. And all done with a character whose face we can't see, its all in the context
 

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Have Windu and Dooku finally engaged in battle because that's what I was waiting for.
 

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In the final two episodes the clones fire an ABSURD amount of """lethal""" shots at our heroes and even if they hit, 'tis but a scratch and it doesn't even slow them down. If that's not insulting enough, stun shots are 1-hit KOs. Why won't the clones use those instead when chasing a couple of people? It would clearly be much more effective. Ugh, I guess children like pewpewpew.