The French Create Realistic Trench Warfare Sim

[DJjaffacake]

I'll say what I say every time someone suggests a WWI shooter, pathetic though I may be to keep screaming when no one can hear me:

There was a lot more going on in WWI than sitting in trenches and suicide charges over no-man's-land. There were proper battles, tank battles, air battles, infantry battles, street battles, river crossings, beach landings, cavalry raids, and so on and so forth. And you are forgetting that Western Europe was only one theater of operations. There is more great material than you could possibly shove into a single WWI video game however epic in scope.

The real problem that actually exists with making a WWI game is the weapons. Personally I could do without assault rifles and be very sparing with the semi-autos. It wouldn't bother me that those weapons did not exist or were practically experimental. But I can't imagine Activision is about to make a AAA title where the player has to wait a quarter of a second between shots to work the bolt.

This trench sim looks very exciting. I will definitely keep an eye out for it.

The Germans did develop submachine guns [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MP18] towards the end of the war, so it wouldn't be unfeasible to have those in a WWI game. Although not this one, since it's set before they were completed.

 

[Li Mu]

STOP THE PRESS!
A game in which the main characters are not American? Is this allowed? I'm pretty sure there is a law against such a thing happening.

I'm guessing there will be DLC which fixes that. Because as we all know (according to the big devs) Americans wont play games unless it's about an American fighting for FREEDOM!

(I know this isn't true, but it's what devs seem to think, otherwise why would 90% of FPS games be about Americans, despite them making up only a small percentage of the worlds population and also the worlds gamers.)

 

[orangeban]

Hmm, could be interesting. Too bad (for me) they set it at Verdun rather than the Somme, I know much (but still relatively little) more about the Somme.

Anyway, could be interesting. From the little I do know about Verdun, I know the French were on the defensive and eventually won in the end, so they may be the easier side to play on.

I wonder if we could have other in-depth WW1 sims, "U-Boat: 1916" (Commit war crimes against civilians, or, maintain the British blockade and do the exact same thing!), or "Tunnels: 1916" (If the Germans don't get you, the gas will!) or "Tanks: 1916!" (It's like a horse, but metal, horrifying and deadly! Plus, if it's not French, it'll probably sink!).

Edit: Oooh, ooh, I got more

"Generals: 1916" (Throw your men to their deaths, become an Earl!)

"Home Front: 1916" (Realistic starvation action! Unless your German, in which case, MORE STARVATION!)

"Cavalry: Earlier than 1916 because we eventually figured out what the Hell we were doing" (Don't worry, horses are bullet-proof, your commanders wouldn't send you to pointless deaths because they don't know how machine-guns work!)

"Recruiting Sergeant: 1914" (For the British, lie to get in physically inadequate men and boys! For the Germans, conscription!)

"Flamethrower Operator: 1916" (Y'know how everyone says in WW2 games that shooting flamethrower tanks so they blow up is unrealistic? Well, that's totally realistic in WW1!"

"Shell Shock Victim: 1916" (Experience the retro cure for PTSD, execution! Do not pass Go, do not collect a war memorial inscription!)

 

[ElPatron]

The speed he is acting on the bolt is just... slow.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_minute

This war saw a lot of machine gun use. Suppression by individual soldiers was as important as by machine gun crews (and today it still is, which justifies the full auto/burst modes of fire found in many battle rifles and assault rifles).

I understand they are trying to prevent the "360 quickscope" style of playing, but... even the Trench Gun had no disconnector, which allowed it to slam fire.


Now you know why the Germans complained about scatter-guns being inhumane.

There was a lot more going on in WWI than sitting in trenches and suicide charges over no-man's-land. There were proper battles, tank battles, air battles, infantry battles, street battles, river crossings, beach landings, cavalry raids, and so on and so forth.

This.

 

[orangeban]

The speed he is acting on the bolt is just... slow

Yeah, but the speed in those videos wouldn't really have been achieved in WW1 either. Veterans reached about 10 shots a minute, recruits could manage about 5.

 

[IndianaJonny]

I hope they continue to press this as a sim rather than a 'pew-pew' shooty FPS. I mean think about it - if they do this historic focus right, surely they'll turn people off playing it for 'fun-shooty-times' and the only way we'll be able to stomach 'playing' this is as a faithful recreation of the horrific circumstances the soldiers faced.

by centering the game on the battles of course. Also, WWI was not solely a trench based war. You would have gameplay in forests, towns, & so on. But lets explore trench combat.-Fight starts in the trenches, the smart ones keep their heads down, the retards charge over the top and get gunned down. One side would be on defense the other offense, offensive team charges across the field to reach the best points they can survive from. They work through the trenches of the defenders until they reach the objective. All the while it is going to be a brutal fight. Little to no cover in the charge & sharp corners ripe for ambushes once in the trenches. Major body count but still massive potential for a fun game....

You can present it honestly but limits need to be remembered. Particularly with how far you go. Trench combat is one thing but life in the trenches is another. Think of it as honesty, & brutal honest realism. In one you play the game like a shooter with the limitations of its era. The other? You force the players to play the game like they live in the trenches for a week before they see any action other than the guy next to them dying from a sniper shot.

I might be okay with the 2nd but i know i would like the 1st.

I'm not sure if you re-read over your bit here, chum, but you appear to give a very 'clean and tidy' impression of what trench-fighting involves - nice, neat bullet wounds and all that.

As Karloff mentions in the article, 130,000 unidentified bodies in one burial site alone (God only know how much was left of them to 'identify'). Lengthy barrages churning the ground into mud, leaving German concrete fortifications largely unscathed, men drowning in the mud, wounded men screaming and sobbing through the night out in no-man's land, men shooting comrades by accident..sometimes not by accident, the 'souvenir hunting' that went on. Heck, the video on The Trenches own site [//www.thetrench1916.com/] doesn't pull its punches.

I'm not coming down on you RT, I'm just questioning whether this is best described as "massive potentional for a fun game".

 

[ElPatron]

The speed he is acting on the bolt is just... slow

Yeah, but the speed in those videos wouldn't really have been achieved in WW1 either. Veterans reached about 10 shots a minute, recruits could manage about 5.

At what distance? There is a difference between "open sights, bench rest, 700m, static targets on open field" and "open sights, off-hand, 200m, fast moving targets using concealment"

Besides, the speed at which you are shooting is not the speed you work the bolt. I like beating the shit out of rifle bolt handles unless I am trying not to damage brass for reloads. In the gameplay the character pulls the bolt ever slower than me trying to save casings.

Again, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_minute

Those speeds were achieved in WWI. They knew the benefits of lubricant on their guns back then. They knew the benefits of firing fast for suppressive fire.

 

[Andronicus]

Despite being barely a blip in the radar for most of the big players in the Great War, WWI was such a defining moment for Australia, it's a shame you can only play as German and French. I mean, it's a French game, so fair enough that the focus would be on the French soldiers, but still, a bit sad I guess.

Also, I agree with others like RT above that the trenches weren't the only aspect of WWI, but it certainly seems to be the part the game is pushing (the hint is in the title), and it's very difficult to make trench warfare fun for a game, especially one focusing on simulating the actual feel of trench warfare, rather than jazzing it up for the CoD crowd. That doesn't necessarily mean I don't think it couldn't be (or shouldn't be) made, I just think it would be extremely hard to find it's audience.

 

[natster43]

Seems interesting. I will have to keep an eye on this.

 

[orangeban]

The speed he is acting on the bolt is just... slow

Yeah, but the speed in those videos wouldn't really have been achieved in WW1 either. Veterans reached about 10 shots a minute, recruits could manage about 5.

At what distance? There is a difference between "open sights, bench rest, 700m, static targets on open field" and "open sights, off-hand, 200m, fast moving targets using concealment"

Besides, the speed at which you are shooting is not the speed you work the bolt. I like beating the shit out of rifle bolt handles unless I am trying not to damage brass for reloads. In the gameplay the character pulls the bolt ever slower than me trying to save casings.

Again, http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_minute

Those speeds were achieved in WWI. They knew the benefits of lubricant on their guns back then. They knew the benefits of firing fast for suppressive fire.

Professional soldiers, maybe, but fresh recruits, and by 1916 the British army was nothing but recruits, the veterans having pretty much all died, wouldn't have been able to reach such speeds.

 

[ElPatron]

Professional soldiers, maybe, but fresh recruits, and by 1916 the British army was nothing but recruits, the veterans having pretty much all died, wouldn't have been able to reach such speeds.

Yes, I understand that. With such high recoiling cartridges and low capacity internal magazines, the "average" shooting in the conflict this game is set on would involve so many soldiers there would be no point in firing that fast. The speed shown in the video would be probably suitable for most combat in the game (estimated 15 seconds for 6 shots + 10 seconds for reload is more or less equal to 18 shots/minute).

But when everything goes into a "oh shit" situation everyone is able to work the bolt fast even if they aren't being proficient. The Mad Minute was a compromise between speed and precision, but during certain times a line of soldiers firing really fast will make advancing troops keep their heads down.

And what about when enemies enter tranches? The speed suitable for "normal" situations might be a little too slow for when seconds matter.

 

[orangeban]

Professional soldiers, maybe, but fresh recruits, and by 1916 the British army was nothing but recruits, the veterans having pretty much all died, wouldn't have been able to reach such speeds.

Yes, I understand that. With such high recoiling cartridges and low capacity internal magazines, the "average" shooting in the conflict this game is set on would involve so many soldiers there would be no point in firing that fast. The speed shown in the video would be probably suitable for most combat in the game (estimated 15 seconds for 6 shots + 10 seconds for reload is more or less equal to 18 shots/minute).

But when everything goes into a "oh shit" situation everyone is able to work the bolt fast even if they aren't being proficient. The Mad Minute was a compromise between speed and precision, but during certain times a line of soldiers firing really fast will make advancing troops keep their heads down.

And what about when enemies enter tranches? The speed suitable for "normal" situations might be a little too slow for when seconds matter.

It's not a matter of soldiers not having to shoot fast, it's that they didn't shoot fast because they were rookies. Many of whom hadn't actually thought they'd reach the front line, they thought the war would be over before they'd finished training.

Suppressive fire was handled by the machine guns, that was the entire point of having the weapon.

As for in-trench fighting, well, most of that was actually hand-to-hand. Trenches were built in a zig-zag, precisely so that rifles were useless inside.

 

[Hero in a half shell]

Ohh, I will have to keep an eye on this game, hopefully they have enough funds to make English translated versions. Props to them for tackling an FPS set in World War 1, especially since this seems to be their first game.

And what about when enemies enter tranches? The speed suitable for "normal" situations might be a little too slow for when seconds matter.

That's what the bayonet is for *Evil grin*

But seriously I would say it would even itself out if your enemies also have slow firing rifles, you will all spend a longer time being exposed reloading, and in that situation different tactics are needed than the 'twitch shooting' CoD style.
Positioning yourself is key, finding useful cover, waiting for the right moment to make your shots, making every shot count, and of course when it all goes belly up there's always that delicious tactic of circle strafing your opponent, trying to keep out of his crosshairs while keeping him in your crosshairs, as you bash his face in with your rifle butt. CoD's insta-knife-kill be damned, those frantic close quarter balls ups were some of the funnest moments of any multiplayer FPS.

 

[Dangit2019]

STOP THE PRESS!
A game in which the main characters are not American? Is this allowed? I'm pretty sure there is a law against such a thing happening.

I'm guessing there will be DLC which fixes that. Because as we all know (according to the big devs) Americans wont play games unless it's about an American fighting for FREEDOM!

(I know this isn't true, but it's what devs seem to think, otherwise why would 90% of FPS games be about Americans, despite them making up only a small percentage of the worlds population and also the worlds gamers.)

I'm sure there's an inexplicable scene where American volunteers show up to save the day at the end to make up for this French blasphemy.

 

[cwmdulais]

ahh, helmets on sticks, my old nemesis, we meet again!

 

[soren7550]

Hopefully with this, my older brother and boyfriend will stop complaining to me about the lack of WWI games.

Wait, the boyfriend will ***** nonstop on how PC gaming sucks. *sighs*

 

[Mekado]

STOP THE PRESS!
A game in which the main characters are not American? Is this allowed? I'm pretty sure there is a law against such a thing happening.

I'm guessing there will be DLC which fixes that. Because as we all know (according to the big devs) Americans wont play games unless it's about an American fighting for FREEDOM!

(I know this isn't true, but it's what devs seem to think, otherwise why would 90% of FPS games be about Americans, despite them making up only a small percentage of the worlds population and also the worlds gamers.)

I'm sure there's an inexplicable scene where American volunteers show up to save the day at the end to make up for this French blasphemy.

Oh, but the USA did join WW1, in 1917 after being attacked themselves.

See a pattern there ?

Most trench warfare looked like this, and if you refused to charge you were simply executed by your own commanding officer or forced into the no man's land by yourself to die.

 

[xplosive59]

The atmosphere and tension in this game could be absolutely amazing if done well. Although it doesn't look like it will be the most exciting game.