The one time Piracy would be ok?

[dogenzakaminion]

Wasn't 100% sure whether this was gaming related or in off topic but here goes.

I was thinking about something after reading another Escapist's post on losing some of his old N64 games (poor soul) and whether he could download a ROM to replace them. Now, I am against piracy in all forms, as I think the creators of a product should get payed for their creation, but what if you already bought the product. You alrady payed and you have legal personal ownership of the product in question, in this case an old game. If this game is no longer avaliable, as in you can't just buy another one to replace it, would downloading the illegal ROM (or torrent, or cracked version or whatever) be ok? You still keep the original game disc but use the rom to play.

Interested on hearing your thoughts on whether this would be ethically ok and still be considered stealing or not. No need for posts on how ok piracy is in general...because it isn't.

 

[Onyx Oblivion]

I believe that pirating something you already own is still theft.

But in this case, the creators ain't making any money from your purchase.

"New" copies of old games go for a ton of money and are now just resold by collectors as new, and "used" copies also ensure no money goes to the people who made it.

It's still illegal and unethical, but you ain't hurting the developers.

 

[GamemasterAnthony]

Actually, if you already own a copy of the game that you paid for, the rules state it's perfectly legal to have a ROM of the game as well. This is especially true in cases of games that are out of print and unavailable...even in this age where stores are now selling retro systems and games.

Actually...it's been argued that having a ROM of a game could also be legal if it's for a game that wasn't available for purchase in the first place. Examples include ROM hacks and fangames, but some people have stated that having a copy of a Japanese only title that was never released to the US should also be alright. This includes games like Terranigma and Namco X Capcom, both of which people have wished were released in the US.

 

[Legion]

It depends on the circumstances. If you have lost/sold on an item and want another copy then it's your fault for losing them or your choice to sell them so if you want it again then you should buy it.

If something is no longer available for purchase (but was when you lost/sold it) then I'd see no harm in downloading a copy for yourself because there is no way the company could possibly be missing out on a sale because of it. It'd still be illegal, but I personally see no harm in it.

Although personally I'd still buy a copy if I could, as long as the price wasn't extortionate. I did so with System Shock 2 last year in fact; I managed to get a used copy from someone on Ebay, but it cost about half the price you'd pay for a brand new game so it wasn't a bad deal (and the game is awesome).

 

[tsb247]

I don't think piracy is ever, "Ok." Then again, it is sad that people sometimes feel so ripped off that they feel the need to, "Stick it to the developers."

And yes, most EULA docs do state that it is perfectly fine to, "backup," the game for personal use; as long as it's not given away or sold. While it's true that not all EULA docs say this, I have actually taken the time to read quite a few that do.

 

[Erja_Perttu]

I think I agree mostly with this.

I believe that pirating something you already own is still theft.

It's still illegal and unethical, but you ain't hurting the developers.

There's been a few games I've owned over the years that are way out of production and impossible to get hold of second hand. If they ever got damaged, I'd probably try and download them to replace, because no one loses out.

 

[delet]

Morally, yes. Legally, no.

 

[Housebroken Lunatic]

Piracy has always and will always be okay. So don't fret.

 

[shadow741]

A game where the company who made it no longer exists, because they won't get the money anyways if you do buy it.

 

[Something Amyss]

Actually, if you already own a copy of the game that you paid for, the rules state it's perfectly legal to have a ROM of the game as well. This is especially true in cases of games that are out of print and unavailable...even in this age where stores are now selling retro systems and games.

The laws state you are allowed to make a backup for personal purposes. Not that you can download one. Especially since that distribution is still illegal.

 

[FMAylward]

I am currently studying Computer Games Programming at university. So chances are this will affect me at some point in the furture.


If you have bought the game and it stops working as long as you keep the old game media I would have no problem with you pirating the game.

If a game is no longer in production or available for legal download no one would have got any money from it anyway, only thing I would have to complain about would be to the publisher for not giving you the option of buying it. Though if the game then becomes available I would want you to buy it.


However just remember one thing, the people who actually make games are not always the people who decide where and how a game is released or if there is any DRM included. If you don't buy a game you will be affecting those people just as much as the people who do decide that.

 

[Delusibeta]

By the strict letter of the law, ROMs are universally illegal unless you dumped it yourself.

 

[Savagezion]

Wow. I can't believe people are against this. I think this is one of the cases where piracy is justified. (I believe there are 4 times it is justified.) Saying pirating something you have already purchased is theft is like saying that reinstalling a game you once removed from your hard drive is stealing.

Morally, yes. Legally, no.

This pretty much sums up my views on it. In Georgia, it is illegal to carry an ice cream cone in your back pocket if it is Sunday. Sometimes, legal systems can be downright ridiculous. In the case of piracy, it is more of an oversight due to vague generalizations. These problems were born with the internet and the beginning of the Information Age.

 

[Glademaster_v1legacy]

Em actually as far as I remember about ROMs if you own the console and the game you are emulating it is perfectly legal. Although I read Activision's statement in my CoD:BO and it actually says all I have bought is a license to play 1 copy of the game. Not even that I have bought the game just a license to play 1 copy of the game.

In other cases buying a crack or key gen for a game you own as far as I am concerned isn't illegal. You could of lost your CD key which sucks but you shouldn't have to buy a new game for that.

Also if the game or console is no longer in production and you would have to go collectors it is legal. Any old cartridge games which have a save function should also be fair game to download as they have limited batteries in them which are starting to run out. Well aslong as you own it first.

 

[GamemasterAnthony]

Actually, if you already own a copy of the game that you paid for, the rules state it's perfectly legal to have a ROM of the game as well. This is especially true in cases of games that are out of print and unavailable...even in this age where stores are now selling retro systems and games.

The laws state you are allowed to make a backup for personal purposes. Not that you can download one. Especially since that distribution is still illegal.

Yeah, I figured it was something like that in regards to backup purposes. Especially in regards to the previous mention regarding games with save features and limited battery life.

 

[Phoenix09215]

Well I would say no just because I have lost the disc to one of my PS2 games and a new copy of it is 150 big ones >.< I know I could pirate it but instead I'm saving up and buying a copy... Its not the company's fault I lost their game, so its still unfair for me to pirate it.

 

[PunkyMcGee]

i bought my old SNES games on the Wii store (the name escapes me at the moment). and it's what? 4 or 5 dollars(US)? that's not terrible price to pay. and you get to use a controller, and I downloaded illigaly before and the guilt is heavy for me anyway.

 

[Admiral Stukov]

I'd say it's morally justifiable if the developer aren't around any more.
I for one wouldn't hold it against any one if the pirated a game they've already bought, especially if the legally bought version have a horrible DRM system that makes it a pain for legal customers. And no the irony isn't lost on me on that one.

And while I'm on the subject I'd like to praise CD Project for not planning on realising a DRM free version of the Witcher 2, having realised that DRM's cost them a lot of money to no real purpose(the pirates eventually findig a way to crack it anyway).

 

[Something Amyss]

Yeah, I figured it was something like that in regards to backup purposes. Especially in regards to the previous mention regarding games with save features and limited battery life.

A lot of the rules are poorly defined, but it's common for pro-file sharing folks to misinterpret fair use and personal use to be "I can do what I want when I want."

Granted, a lot of our rights have been stripped, since most applications of fair use will get you hit with a DMCA (or appropriate term for signatory countries of WIPO) claim if the work is copy protected.

 

[Hader]

Whether it is right or wrong is what's up for debate.

No matter what though, it is still theft, whatever light it may be in. There is still a gray area concerning digital downloads though, legally speaking at least.

The only gray area I have really considered was when I heard something about Dawn of War II on PC having a limit of like 10 installation or something, and where one guy used up those 10 installations (without knowing this limit) and when he asked support about what he should do, he was told to just buy the game again.

Dunno if it's true, but the whole issue of limited installations sounds ridiculous to me.