I myself would like to thank the moderators for answering the questions and clearing up the issue. On many other sites this thread would have been simply overlooked by the staff or responded with a 'We know better than you do. now shuddup.' - message. Just goes to show why the Escapist is one of the more enjoyable sites out there.
If you read the Privacy Policy of Themis Media, you'll notice that they log which URL you have come from before visiting the Escapist, and which URL you visit next after leaving the Escapist.
That's a reference to the HTTP referrer (or "referer") attribute. A sane browser will set it when navigating links but will blank it out whenever you just follow a bookmark or type a URL in from the address bar.
You can test it here:
http://refspoof.mozdev.org/referrer.php
Try following that link vs. typing the address into your address bar directly.
Probably the rude-to-helpful post ratio. People only remember the posts where I'm snarking at someone, and forget the ten polite, informative posts that I sent that person's way where they confused someone disagreeing with them with someone flaming them, and started getting more and more rude in their responses to me. Darth would literally come into a thread calling people names because he disagreed with them. That's the difference. Also, I don't think I've ever flamed someone off the bat that wasn't doing some kind of "last angry man" impression with their post. And I never did create a new topic to insult other posters. The closest I got was one about not bringing clearly untrustworthy sources into Escapist discussions (coincidentally for this thread, that topic was about Necro).
I'm not disagreeing with you there. I'm more talking about your tendency to piss people off (intentional or not), and a couple of your... wackier posts in an argument. But seriously, I know he got banned for his immaturity and intolerance, and I know he definitely deserved it.
The question was not whether he would get banned, but how long it would take him to. I'm pretty sure his multiple 'this place sucks, I'm leaving' threads every week were a contributor.
I have to say, I'm really impressed with the direction the quality control on this site has taken recently. So to the mods: I think you're doing a great job, *especially* as of late; I see you're getting a lot of feedback from the community over it, and I'd just like to let you know that this Escapist member things you're on the right track, and is inspired by your actions as of late to up the quality of his posts and to try to uplift the level of the thread in general by his postings.
I have to say, I'm really impressed with the direction the quality control on this site has taken recently. So to the mods: I think you're doing a great job, *especially* as of late; I see you're getting a lot of feedback from the community over it, and I'd just like to let you know that this Escapist member things you're on the right track, and is inspired by your actions as of late to up the quality of his posts and to try to uplift the level of the thread in general by his postings.
I don't think there is anybody who is unhappy with the mods, but there is some confusion regarding particular cases.
Having seen how other froums are run I am very grateful for the work of the staff and the Red Guard.
Whats even better is they replyed to what we were asking, not that I didn't expect them to do so.
I like all this support for the mods, and also how open the mods are being about this. It's much more refreshing than being patted on the head and told to stop asking questions. That's why I like the Escapist community so much.
I've had a load of fun with this site, no questions asked. However, today I must ask one majorly uncomfortable one: one that I think carries some weight here in the community.
People have been wondering about the acts recently committed by the BanHammer. While some were admittedly deserved, others have caused confusion, in particular the banning of NecroSwanson. Fire Daemon summed up most of what people are wondering about in his post on the previous page well: we're all sort of confused, scared, wondering what on Earth is going on. Therefore, I have this question to offer:
Can you make some sort of announcement about these bans, explaining the finer details? It would go a long way towards dispelling the bad feelings some of the community have accumulated over them, especially in the case of The Swanson, who was dearly loved here by many.
Another issue that users have voiced is with the apparent inaction that can be seen at times towards certain users: particularly ones that have made comments that have obviously broken the rules. We have reported these users at times to no avail, and we must wonder why this is so. Again, as Daemon said, a lack of moderators/use of the red button is no longer an problem...
Also, by request: some more information is requested about the bannings/moderation of Darth Empyrean, and Darth Mobius.
I, and the following users, thank you for your time.
FlapJack452
sky14kemea
megapenguinx
Knight Templar
NoMoreSanity
orannis62
Calobi
Neonbob
Fire Daemon
Gormourn
ae86gamer
Vanguard_Ex
Haliwali
Chicago Ted
runedeadthA
Gxas
Ashbax
Mstrswrd
bluegriffin8
[Gavo]
LimaBravo
nathan-dts
ph3onix
Shapsters
ErGo
Hoxton
xmetatr0nx
SmartIdiot
crazyhaircut94
SakSak
pigeon_of_doom
Machines Are Us
UNKNOWNINCOGNITO
notoriouslynx
Psychosocial
razer17
EcksTeaSea
Bofus Teefus
AkJay
darksusano
Lexodus
tijuanatim
Updates/Reponses from the mods:
A response from Susan. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751#2378817]
Another response from Susan. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751#2379258]
A response from Virgil. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751#2379262]
A response from the Funk. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751#2379350]
Yet another response from Susan. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751?page=4#2380004]
A response from Paul. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751?page=6#2382232]
A response from Wilson. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120751?page=7#2384162]
It seems that the majority of the questions have been answered. Currently, what's going on is a request for the moderators to add a little detail to "ban posts" (the one that a user get the permanent ban on) so that we can avoid future questions about why someone was banned.
EDIT: If you wish to be added to the list, please ask via PM. I won't respond, but I will add you to the list.
DOUBLE EDIT: Please, stay on-topic, and don't flame the mods. They're watching, after all.
I didn't know Necroswanson personally but I have seen many of his posts and he's not a bad person and was loved by members of the community. Mobius posted a racist post and got banned as a result, you could kind of see a moderator coming at you if you did something like that, but those two were very nice people.
I would just like to explain to the mods that this isn't saying "I hate you, you suck!" you are doing a brilliant job with the forums, and I accept that part of it is just down to us not reporting posts, yet decent posters who have been here for a very long time are being banned whilst trolls who are new to The Escapist are only getting suspended for a week. One guy got suspended for just a week for making this thread. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120147#2349369]
I think I would much rather tough mods then soft mods. Personally, I think they are doing a great job in keeping the quality of this place up and considering how popular it is (with Zero Punctuation and Unforgotten Realms) it could be really easy to let the floodgates open so to speak.
Haha, I really don't mean to sound like a suck up, I am just grateful that the mods are here and are doing so well. I've been a moderator myself (on the official Australian PS2 magazine forums) and its not an easy job, and compared to this place, that forum was pretty damn small!
So once again guys and girls - Thanks!
As for the deeper discussion in this thread, Purple Rain and Rade sum up how I feel pretty well.
Let me step in at this point and simply say one thing -- when deciding what disciplinary action to take, we look at a user's complete ban history, as well as their general demeanor. So, if an individual infraction doesn't look like it justified a permaban, you're usually pretty safe in assuming it's a "straw that broke the camel's back" kind of situation. If you've been banned seven times for virtually the same offense -- say, making personal insults towards other community members -- it seems pretty obvious that you're not going to change your ways. Why would we want to keep that person as a member of our community?
Ok, that's fair, I can't really argue with that reasoning, but admittedly Mobius' posts were just a joke gone way too far.
About the users not changing? Is there anyway someone could make an appeal and maybe get him a trial 'un-banning'? Because I know a lot of people liked him, especially in the RP forums.
I'm not referring to anyone in particular. This complaint -- that people get permabanned "for nothing" -- is one that pops up frequently, so I was hoping to better explain that that simply isn't the case.
As for appealing, while I understand where you're coming from, and am personally all for second chances, don't you think the previous 7 bans should be enough of a heads up for the person? One would think that a reasonable person would figure out long before then that such behavior isn't appreciated. How many chances do we give a person before we finally tell them no? Ten? Twenty?
I've had to permaban people that I genuinely like. It's not something I get a giggle out of. But I'm also very much in favor of people taking responsibility for their behavior.
I have noticed that sometimes people get banned, and the mods/admins/whatever don't really give them a reason, just a "You are banned, have a nice day", so how can they change the error of their ways if they do not know what they did?
Easiest thing in the world to do is just ask. If you're put on probation, and don't understand why, just ask. You can PM a mod, you can use the feedback link to send us an email -- we read each and every one of those, and answer them when appropriate. If you're suspended a half dozen times and never ask why, then either you know exactly what's going on, or you simply don't care.
Let me clarify something about "free speech" and "in jokes," if I may. What usually happens is someone gets banned for saying something offensive, then pleads to the mods, saying "it's a joke between me and my friend." Which I'm quite sure it is -- and if you and your friend were the only ones reading it, that'd be fine. But you're not. To you and your pal, saying " ou mother murdering fuckstain" may qualify as an endearment, but to anyone who doesn't know you, it looks like a personal attack. If we let it stand, then people will think that they can use similar language, and suddenly the forum is chock full of insults being thrown back and forth.
Weren't you banned during this years March Mayhem? I found that particularly interesting, were you consulted by the other mods, were you given any warnings? I was actually pretty impressed that the site disregarded your yellow name when it came to a ban.
I actually read this whole thread and for that I feel I deserve a reward... possibly a snack.
I have never been probationed on any website I've ever posted on because I remember these X things
1) Talk to people on the internets like I'd talk to them in person; If I wouldn't shout at someone and call them an idiot and suggest that they have intercourse with themselves or an immedite family member (ie mom) than I won't do it on the internet.
2) every forum has pretty much the same rules. Nearly every rule on the escapist is on most well moderated sites. The only thing is some sites prefer necro'ing an old thread and some prefer you make a new thread on a topic. This site falls in the former.
3) It's just the internet; If I'm getting to pissed off at someone I can go log off and do something else with my time
4) I discuss things with people I don't argue with them; arguing with someone is trying to prove you're better or to change their mind. If someone is willing to argue to the death about something chances are you aren't going to change their mind. Discussing is exchanging opinions and leadning what the other person thinks. Not trying to change that.
and the big secret to not getting banned
5) Read your post before you post it. This could also be called "THINK first"
I've got nothing really groundbreaking to offer this thread, but I will throw my hat down in the ring supporting little notes from mods, regarding why someone has been banned. I don't see how it would make the forums any worse, and indeed offers several benefits such as cutting out any confrontations that may arise.
I'd like to join Emu and others in offering support to the mods. I think that they do a tidy job on the forums, and even though there are some slip-ups from time to time (I think the March Mayhem scenario was a particular debacle) but on the whole, this bunch of part-time mods are far better than full-time mods on certain forums (try offering constructive criticism on, say, the CAD forums if you dare) and we as a community should be grateful for what we have, not bitching about decisions we probably don't understand.
I would just like to explain to the mods that this isn't saying "I hate you, you suck!" you are doing a brilliant job with the forums, and I accept that part of it is just down to us not reporting posts, yet decent posters who have been here for a very long time are being banned whilst trolls who are new to The Escapist are only getting suspended for a week. One guy got suspended for just a week for making this thread. [http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.120147#2349369]
See that one is tricky. It's a ban-worthy offense to put out anyone else' personal information on the forums. Yet his post was not about that and was instead an interesting statistic that had some discussion value in it. I'm guessing he got suspended because of the misleading title, not the post itself. Because we've been here a long time, we should know better than to do this. That's why the newbies are getting leniency somewhat. Also as Susan said, a user's past mod history is taken into account when a punishment is being decided.
the mods have definatly improved in terms of turn around when it comes to request's, since Alex P and Kuliani took on their respective roles especially, I can only assume that Alex P and Kuliani are GODs in text form.
Its the only valid explanation, that or the site reached saturation point in terms of dirtbags and the previous gang couldn't do their jobs as well as babysit us 24/7.
To everyone asking mods to put explanations in closed threads, etc. -- I definitely get where you're coming from, but here's the problem: We say "so and so was banned for reason X" and suddenly we have a whole lot of posts about how Reason X isn't good enough, and what about so and so who also did Reason X but didn't get banned, and so forth.
The last thing we need is backseat moderation and arguments over every ruling. If you can think of a way around that problem, I'd love to hear it.
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