U.S. Congress Shelves SOPA

poiuppx

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The Cool Kid said:
This is disgusting. Almost all the criticisms were based on lies. The fact that this is seen as some sort of victory is appauling and shows how few have bothered to read the bill and how mass ignorance has controlled the internet and will simply harm the industries we love so much.
I think you might be oversimplifying the issue a bit. Simply put, even for those of us who despise piracy, SOPA was not a solution. Ignoring the hyperbole, a system designed to- in effect -make modern protective protocols impossible to use and that focuses on solving piracy issues with redirects- a concept that completely ignores not only the flaws in such a solution and the various work-arounds, but also has no actual impact on any form of piracy aside from torrent grabs & direct downloads off specific individual sites -was not a valid solution. Made no better by the fact that such monitoring and maintenance would require a significant degree of manpower and financial resources. The United States simply does not have that kind of cash to sling around at anything pretending to be a solution to, ultimately, a media-industry-specific problem. Ignoring all piracy problems, this was not the solution the industry or the country needed, and it wasn't where the focus should be. Period.

That said, I am curious why you seem to be such a serious devotee of a rather flawed attempt to curtail piracy. It's effectiveness would have been minimal at best; why champion a poor-man's attempt to solve the problem? Why wouldn't you want to see flawed ideas like SOPA tossed out on their ear, and more effective solutions suggested?
 

Jimbo1212

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Oh look, misinformed opinion trumps a good policy again....
A sad day for entertainment


Sizzle Montyjing said:
The Cool Kid said:
So... if we were all lied to, what would SOPA do?
Because, y'know, i'm pretty fine about it not being enacted even if i believed you.
What are you even on about?
When do you get lied to?
Stop with the tin hat rubbish and just admit you like stealing things.
 

ZeroMachine

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Sizzle Montyjing said:
ZeroMachine said:
Listen, Dr. Phil, I honestly believe the guy doesn't understand the issue, so I think we should just leave it alone and enjoy the victory. Just go on fucking that Awesomeface.
You are fucking awesome.
(ps, who's Dr. Phil? I just splice this shit together)

Also, i agree *pops open the bubbly*
The fact that you don't even know who that is makes this all the funnier. Dear god, please search him on Youtube or something.

And relish in the fact that you're on Youtube because if SOPA passed that freedom might not have lasted long :D
 

Erttheking

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Oct 5, 2011
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I seriously cannot believe that people are sad SOPA didn't get passed...ah well, there's always morons in this world.
 

Rhys95

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May 16, 2011
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Because all the criticisms for SOPA are based on lies. Have a read yourself, the actual bill is linked in the link above.[/quote]
The Cool Kid said:
Sizzle Montyjing said:
The Cool Kid said:
So... if we were all lied to, what would SOPA do?
Because, y'know, i'm pretty fine about it not being enacted even if i believed you.
Rhys95 said:
The Cool Kid said:
This is disgusting. Almost all the criticisms were based on lies. The fact that this is seen as some sort of victory is appauling and shows how few have bothered to read the bill and how mass ignorance has controlled the internet and will simply harm the industries we love so much.
You may regret saying that on the internet....where all the Anti-Sopa types are....
So you are happy to pirate? Is that what you are saying?

Anti-Sopa dosen't mean Pro-Pirate. The problem was the loose wording of the bill that meant corporations could take down ANY website that had ANY copyrighted material regardless if the website actually uploaded it itself. This includes sites like YouTube who have little control over thier content. It's like sueing a car manufacturer when someone in one of thier cars runs into your own.

Didn't read the bill but will.... unintentional rhymes are fun
 
Apr 28, 2008
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Hollywood's response to this has been just... ridiculous. Basically, they're response is to say "oh come on, it's not all that bad, just pass it!".

Also, SOPA's still not dead. It could still come back. Don't be surprised if in a couple of months they try again, without heeding any advice from anyone. Plus, there's still PIPA to worry about.

But still, seeing the White House oppose it is nice.
 

Owlslayer

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Nov 26, 2009
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Well, this makes me rather happy. Party time, people~!
And hopefully it will never return, stronger and meaner than ever!!!
Seriously, i hope we`ll never see that thingy again.
 

Darkmantle

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Oct 30, 2011
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The Cool Kid said:
Sandytimeman said:
The Cool Kid said:
Sizzle Montyjing said:
The Cool Kid said:
So... if we were all lied to, what would SOPA do?
Because, y'know, i'm pretty fine about it not being enacted even if i believed you.
Rhys95 said:
The Cool Kid said:
This is disgusting. Almost all the criticisms were based on lies. The fact that this is seen as some sort of victory is appauling and shows how few have bothered to read the bill and how mass ignorance has controlled the internet and will simply harm the industries we love so much.
You may regret saying that on the internet....where all the Anti-Sopa types are....
So you are happy to pirate? Is that what you are saying?

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.338364-U-S-Congress-Shelves-SOPA#13689437

Because all the criticisms for SOPA are based on lies. Have a read yourself, the actual bill is linked in the link above.
You still don't seem to understand. See this bill would have serious reprecutions on the technical infastructure of the internet. Don't fuck with the damn DNS. Also I'm well aware of what the bill does.

http://www.theverge.com/2011/12/22/2648219/stop-online-piracy-act-sopa-what-is-it
Another source of distorting the truth:

"SOPA section 103 and PIPA section 4 require payment processors and ad networks to shut down accounts if they receive the right kind of letter from a copyright owner"

What it then says is that such an act was criticised previously and ignores the following part of the bill (Section 103 4 III) which states that you need solid evidence in the letter, and section 103.6 states that if you are wrongfully accused, you can be awarded damages.

What's the problem?

poiuppx said:
I think you might be oversimplifying the issue a bit. Simply put, even for those of us who despise piracy, SOPA was not a solution. Ignoring the hyperbole, a system designed to- in effect -make modern protective protocols impossible to use and that focuses on solving piracy issues with redirects- a concept that completely ignores not only the flaws in such a solution and the various work-arounds, but also has no actual impact on any form of piracy aside from torrent grabs & direct downloads off specific individual sites -was not a valid solution. Made no better by the fact that such monitoring and maintenance would require a significant degree of manpower and financial resources. The United States simply does not have that kind of cash to sling around at anything pretending to be a solution to, ultimately, a media-industry-specific problem. Ignoring all piracy problems, this was not the solution the industry or the country needed, and it wasn't where the focus should be. Period.

That said, I am curious why you seem to be such a serious devotee of a rather flawed attempt to curtail piracy. It's effectiveness would have been minimal at best; why champion a poor-man's attempt to solve the problem? Why wouldn't you want to see flawed ideas like SOPA tossed out on their ear, and more effective solutions suggested?
SOPA may not have been a solution, but it certainly would have helped cut down piracy as joe-average isn't going to know how to work around DNS redirects. It hardly seems a criticism to say google, an extremely wealthy company, would of had to spend money to enforce SOPA. If they couldn't afford it, they would be exempt from the bill as laid out in the first section of it.
Piracy costs the industries we love billions and to see SOPA scrapped though mainly ignorance is just a sad sight showing how blind the masses can be.
Now where did the pirates touch you?

That's the only reason I see for all this irrational strawman hate you're giving.


awaiting the ban hammer


EDIT: solid evidence only requires one or two links. That's pretty solid, technically.

lol, solid evidence on a digital medium.
 

AhumbleKnight

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Apr 17, 2009
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The Cool Kid said:
Sandytimeman said:
The Cool Kid said:
Sizzle Montyjing said:
The Cool Kid said:
So... if we were all lied to, what would SOPA do?
Because, y'know, i'm pretty fine about it not being enacted even if i believed you.
Rhys95 said:
The Cool Kid said:
This is disgusting. Almost all the criticisms were based on lies. The fact that this is seen as some sort of victory is appauling and shows how few have bothered to read the bill and how mass ignorance has controlled the internet and will simply harm the industries we love so much.
You may regret saying that on the internet....where all the Anti-Sopa types are....
So you are happy to pirate? Is that what you are saying?

http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/7.338364-U-S-Congress-Shelves-SOPA#13689437

Because all the criticisms for SOPA are based on lies. Have a read yourself, the actual bill is linked in the link above.
You still don't seem to understand. See this bill would have serious reprecutions on the technical infastructure of the internet. Don't fuck with the damn DNS. Also I'm well aware of what the bill does.

http://www.theverge.com/2011/12/22/2648219/stop-online-piracy-act-sopa-what-is-it
Another source of distorting the truth:

"SOPA section 103 and PIPA section 4 require payment processors and ad networks to shut down accounts if they receive the right kind of letter from a copyright owner"

What it then says is that such an act was criticised previously and ignores the following part of the bill (Section 103 4 III) which states that you need solid evidence in the letter, and section 103.6 states that if you are wrongfully accused, you can be awarded damages.

What's the problem?
Some of the problems include a lot of people not being happy with Copywrite Infringment becoming a felonly, and the transfer of a large amount of the cost of owning IP onto the government (and by extension tax payers). If you own an IP, then it is yours to profit off and as such yours to protect. The most important problem, as has already been stated, is that all this questionable shit will have no effect on piracy. NONE.

Why advocate ineffective, expencive, questionable legislation that will not stop the thing that it claims it will stop?
 

poiuppx

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The Cool Kid said:
poiuppx said:
SOPA may not have been a solution, but it certainly would have helped cut down piracy as joe-average isn't going to know how to work around DNS redirects. It hardly seems a criticism to say google, an extremely wealthy company, would of had to spend money to enforce SOPA. If they couldn't afford it, they would be exempt from the bill as laid out in the first section of it.
Piracy costs the industries we love billions and to see SOPA scrapped though mainly ignorance is just a sad sight showing how blind the masses can be.
I can more than sympathize with wanting to defend our industry. More than. I try to curtail it when I'm on here, partly because I can be a bit... extreme in my sentiments there-in, but I am decidedly in the anti-piracy camp. My issue is right there in your first paragraph reply; it was not a solution. Not a long-term one at the least, and not one that would have had enough of an impact. People found TPB. They learned how to work a torrent. Banking on their stupidity when it involves their pursuit of their greed can be a bad gamble.

Look, you and I are closer to being on the same side than you perhaps realize. But the thing is, if you ever want to see a legitimate way to combat large-scale piracy, you don't want to start with something equal parts flawed and derrided like SOPA. When you need a new car, you don't pick up the used Edsel from the first lot you get to... you keep searching. SOPA was not the champion worth pegging your colors onto. Even setting the hyperbole aside, it was poorly written, suggested solutions that were anachronistic at best, and ultimately, as you yourself admit, its main weapons were easily circumvented from day 1 with the right know-how. The fact the blacklist raised a bit of the old Red Scare shadow likely didn't help sell it to the public either.

You're angry, and you have a right to be. But ask yourself if SOPA was really the solution you wanted it to be, or if the anger came more from how it was blown out of proportion to The Sky Is Falling levels. Take five steps back and ask yourself if, on a site that adores slamming pirates, it would really have received this much negative attention if it was the solution you wanted it to be. If the answers you come to is no, then take a breath, refocus, and start looking for the better solutions to champion.
 

Sizzle Montyjing

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Apr 5, 2011
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Jimbo1212 said:
What are you even on about?
When do you get lied to?
Stop with the tin hat rubbish and just admit you like stealing things.
My friend... i have never pirated in my life.
Not even once.
Not even for something i really wanted that wasn't available at all in my country (UK).
But yeah, guess i like stealing things herp de fucking derp.
The Cool Kid said:
You do realise that the bill gives far too much power to corporations right?
They would abuse the shit out of it, and do you know why?
Corporations are not our friends, hell, if VEVO can block content randomly based on what country i am from, if music companies can take down stuff that they don't OWN because THEY. DON'T. LIKE. IT. Then what do you think they are going to do with this bill?

To be honest, i think i'll take the opinions of the majority and INTERNET AND LAW EXPERTS.
 

Sizzle Montyjing

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Apr 5, 2011
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The Cool Kid said:
Well... how about you give me a link to the bill, because i can't find it.
ANYWHERE.

Now, let me ask you a question: Are you an expert in law?
Do you understand the FULL implications (not just cherry-picking) the implications of the bill.

Massive uproars like this happen for a reason, and i'm pretty sure that all of those people aren't misinformed.

Also, you can't abuse the bill? BULLSHIT.
Almost anything can be abused.
 

Torrasque

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While this is a relief, I won't jump up and dance with joy unti "shelved" becomes "will never be proposed again". And I fear that will not happen for an incredibly long time...
This:
The_root_of_all_evil said:
"That is not dead which can eternal lie,
And with strange aeons even death may die."


SOPA only rests. It will return.
 

Aeonknight

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Apr 8, 2011
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The Cool Kid said:
You have people who will willingly mod games like Skyrim to allow you to kill children, out of principle of maintaining the illusion of freedom of choice in that game.

Do you really think they wouldn't figure it out? And do you think the information on "how to bypass DNS" wouldn't be widespread within a few months? On the internet of all things?

This bill doesn't work. It never had a chance of working. I applaud the effort and the sentiment behind it, but when it threatens to do more harm than good (and these are software engineers that are saying this, not just TotalBiscuit), it's not worth passing.

Why is that hard for you to understand? The bill may have been turned down on false pretenses, but it still had very real problems that you yourself acknowledge. Fucking with the DNS infrastructure is not acceptable collateral damage just so 12 yr old Jimmy has to work just a little bit harder to pirate the new Linkin Park album. If you choose to think so, then may as well agree to disagree.
 

Sizzle Montyjing

Pronouns - Slam/Slammed/Slammin'
Apr 5, 2011
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The Cool Kid said:
Answer the question- Are you an expert in law?
I'm not doing jack shit until you tell me what makes you so correct.
I can read the bill too, but i don't understand it.
 

Sandytimeman

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Jan 14, 2011
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The Cool Kid said:
What's the problem?
The problem is that the bill isn't perfect and messes with DNS infrastructure. We cannot pass a half ass law into effect. New versions will come back, and they will be refined to a more perfect state. That's in everyone's best interest, no?