UK Teen Jailed For Cyber-Bullying

HyenaThePirate

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My only problem with this, other than the potential threat to Freedom of Speech and the First Amendment here in the U.S., was this:

The police became involved when Ms Houghton approached the victim Emily Moore while she was out with her boyfriend, ostensibly to apologize, but then became threatening when her apology was rebuffed.
I believe people are basically good and sometimes make poor choices. Sometimes people lack the ability to control themselves, self-restraint. From that though, it sounds like this bully at least made an attempt to reconcile things at some point and probably got mouthed off at in return. See, with Kids i've learned there are always two sides to a story though and we know nothing about the victim in this case. Sure, beating up a school-mate is not how proper people function in society, but how can we be certain that this other girl didn't give as good as she got sometimes?

It's like internet flame wars... often it takes two to tango and people tend to toss the word "troll" at people who often times are simply BETTER at the argument than they are or lack any decent response, facing 'virtual humiliation' at the hands of their 'attacker'.

But ultimately, I feel people in our modern society are waaaaay too sensitive and thin-skinned. They act like "bullies" are some kind of new contrivance, alien to modern civilization. When I was a kid, our school had a bully that in hindsight probably would have made a damn good Viking, being that sort of 6 foot 200 lb blond haired 15 year old that knew his luck in the gene pool gave him a decided advantage. Oh sure I tried everything back then, avoiding him, tattling to the principle and teachers, and that sort of thing. My parents actually even spoke to his parents once. But then I realized looking at his home and surroundings that this guy didnt have it NEARLY as good as me. Eventually it came to a head when he took my favorite AD&D character during a game we were running in the cafeteria during lunch and tore up her character sheet. I lost it. I hit him with my lunch tray and then wailed on him, crying like a baby the whole time, barely able to scream in rage through my snot-filled nose and streaking tears.

We were both suspended, which to me was horrible because I had never been suspended before.

Surprisingly, we both ended up sitting next to each other in ISS (in school suspension) and afterwards we had to ride the "late bus" (for kids who had to stay after school) together. During that week, he and I kinda began to become friends and by time we were seniors in highschool, we were best buddies.

To this day, he's still my best friend, and I visit him at the penitentiary at least once a week.

So that just goes to show... well.. I'm not really certain what my point is anymore.

But I'm certain of one thing. Sending her to JAIL isn't going to change this girl for the better. If anything, her entire life is ruined. No school, never going to get a decent job, and will contribute little to society as an honest citizen with her record. She may even spend those years harboring a deep-seated resentment that festers in her, sustaining her on a diet of hate and pure rage until she gets free, seeks out this other girl, and exacts her vengeance like a Batman villain.

At least, thats probably what I would do.
 

Amnestic

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Aug 22, 2008
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My only problem with this, other than the potential threat to Freedom of Speech and the First Amendment here in the U.S., was this:
Uh. This was set in the UK? Hence: UK Teen jailed for cyber bullying. It's right there in the thread title. Furthermore, the First Amendment doesn't cover fighting words/death threats. The Telegraph source article says:

Article said:
Houghton, 18, boasted on the site that she wanted to kill Miss Moore, also 18, who she had bullied since they were at school together.
Such words wouldn't be counted as protected speech in America, assuming my grasp of constitutional law isn't entirely wrong.
 

HyenaThePirate

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Amnestic said:
My only problem with this, other than the potential threat to Freedom of Speech and the First Amendment here in the U.S., was this:
Uh. This was set in the UK? Hence: UK Teen jailed for cyber bullying. It's right there in the thread title. Furthermore, the First Amendment doesn't cover fighting words/death threats. The Telegraph source article says:

Article said:
Houghton, 18, boasted on the site that she wanted to kill Miss Moore, also 18, who she had bullied since they were at school together.
Such words wouldn't be counted as protected speech in America, assuming my grasp of constitutional law isn't entirely wrong.
Actually that statement was in response to the suggestion by others that such laws could spread to other countries or that they even need to be implemented here in the united states.
Hence the use of the phrase "potential threat".

Such words wouldn't be counted as protected speech in America, assuming my grasp of constitutional law isn't entirely wrong.
Actually, it is. Making a direct threat is not, such as "I AM GOING TO KILL YOU".
but simply saying you WANT to kill someone, is not illegal. Hence all the stupid idiots out there who make statements on their White Extremist Hate sites like "I want to kill Obama"

Sadly I also disagree with you on protected speech however. Making a direct threat to a person is the only time such language should be penalized. But while making such comments as "i want to kill so and so" is definitely perhaps in bad taste, what I post on MY facebook/myspace/textbook cover is my opinion and I'm entitled to it no matter HOW despicable it might be.
You see, people have the right to express their opinions and feelings. Surely it didnt stop the people wishing all manner of death on Osama Bin Laden, or Mr. George W. Bush from doing so openly. Should all of those people who ever posted such statements about their desires for violence against a specific individual be rounded up and thrown in jail?

You see, my problem with things such as this as they have a terrible habit of snowballing out of control. It starts as this, then it ends up with everything we say being monitored or you find yourself being banned by institutions, websites, and fired from jobs simply for having a politically incorrect opinion. Things often go to extremes when you make efforts to 'police morality and manners'.

Soon, simply saying that you "hate" Bill Gates will be enough to net you a fine or restricted from web-sites, who might simply do so out of fear of being SUED because your statement 'offended' someone else.

"Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety deserve neither Liberty nor Safety"

- Benjamin Franklin
 

Overlord2702

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Good on that judge.

In my home town in Australia we had 5/6 people comitt suicde over cyber bullying THIS year.
Bitches like that dont know what there effect is on people.
 

Knight Templar

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A random person said:
LCP said:
bulling =/= Death threat
Jerious1154 said:
Although bullying is a terrible thing, I think it's pretty clear that the girl wasn't actually sent to jail for being a bully. She was sent to jail because she threatened to kill somebody and had a history of physically assaulting them.
Pretty much those. I wouldn't support this if it was just regular cyber-bullying or trolling, those don't call for actual imprisonment.
The latter?
No.
The former?
Yes.

Speaking as a person who has been bullied I can say it only gets worse as time goes on. What starts as "joking around" turns into attacks, all at the expense of the victim whose life is often ruined for years.
 

Zenode

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LoopyDood said:
Hehehe, jailed for trolling.

That judge is obviously awesome.
You sir have made my day

But it is obviously trail

as someone off 4chan would say

Fail Troll is fail
 

wordsmith

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May 1, 2008
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Quadtrix said:
If it were up to me, every crime would be punishable by death, by this is nice regardless.
Man, I'd love to meet you... If you killed everyone who commited a crime, no-one would be left alive. Everyone has committed a crime at some point in their lives, no matter how small. I speed daily. Never been caught, but I'm still committing a crime. So once you've killed the 70% of drivers who speed, you can start on those who litter. Then on the people who cross the street without finding a pedestrian crossing (jaywalking). Then on everyone who's ever taken a leak against a tree (public indecency).

In short, it's great that you have morals and all, but "Kill 'em All" isn't a particularly brilliant philosophy.
 

bodyklok

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Well I have to disagree with the whole bullying stays with you for live, I've been bulled but after a while you just forget it, unless you keep on thinking about it all the time.

Anyway, it's good that she's getting punished for what she's done, maybe a few people will stop acting like retards and tough guys now.
 

Deity1986

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HyenaThePirate said:
The police became involved when Ms Houghton approached the victim Emily Moore while she was out with her boyfriend, ostensibly to apologize, but then became threatening when her apology was rebuffed.
I believe people are basically good and sometimes make poor choices. Sometimes people lack the ability to control themselves, self-restraint. From that though, it sounds like this bully at least made an attempt to reconcile things at some point and probably got mouthed off at in return.
An apology after 4 years of bullying? Probably not the first of them either; I'm not surprised it got rebuffed. There are many ways of apologising other than actually being sorry:
"Yeah, I'm sorry I did that, but you must understand that you're the one that started it yeah? You know not to mess with me, yeah? Maybe you should show some ****in' respect."

I'm not saying it is like that, but it's a possibility. A lot of people like that will apologise just to try and get themselves out of trouble (ie: maybe the police had already been informed at this point and she was trying to get the girl to call them off).
And, yeah, the other girl probably isn't the nicest person either, but being bullied for years on end can sometimes have that affect on people.
 

Amnestic

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Aug 22, 2008
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Then on the people who cross the street without finding a pedestrian crossing (jaywalking).
Not a crime in England unless you count Motorways. Same with Sweden.
 

ugeine

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wordsmith said:
"Hey, there's that girl who's viciously bullied me for the last 4 years... *clicks add*"

Stupid girl...

Aaah, so its the victims fault after all!

squid5580 said:
What are you smoking? You can't expect people to take measures to protect themselves on the internet. It is so much easier to be stupid then get to waste the court's time and money. You know since they have nothing better to do than worry about what someone puts on your facebook.
This girl has already been found guilty of assaulting the victim in 2005 as she walked home from school, and two years later she was convicted of causing criminal damage after kicking Emily's front door.

I tend to think preventing harrassment and assult is a half decent use of the courts time.

Maybe we should have solved this the American way; just given the victim an assult rifle and let her loose at school?
 

jodko

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Cyber bullying seriously get out of here you don?t have to read other peoples face books or whatever I mean get over it. Also 3 months in jail for posting a threat that?s a bit much although she should have been arrested for the previous assaults.
 

ugeine

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Just a few points on this from reading the article:

1) There's been some high profile suicide cases in England latley about teenagers commiting suicide because of cyber bullying.

2) A lot of people seem to think this is the introduction of some kind of special law where you're accountable for any of the stupid things you say on the internet; if I threatened to kill somebody in real life, I'd probably get done for it.

3) Somebody somewhere seems to have taken the incident where the bully approached the victim in the restaurant as some kind of peace offering where the victim instead went to the authorities; this is bollocks. This girl has beenj bullying the victim for yonks, so even if the bully's apology was sincere (which i highly fucking doubt) then you can't blame the victim for not accepting it. I'd also like to point out that in England a stranger or enemy coming up to you and putting their arm round you can be taken as highly intimidating, and I'm sure this was the intention here. (I'm sure it's different in America, where you're all well friendly). Also, saying 'I'll give you something to ring the police about' is hardly a nice way of saying sorry.
 

tsb247

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That judge really has a way with words.

Let's also think of the humiliation this girl is suffering right this very second. For the rest of her life, she will have to carry with her the knowledg eof being the first person out of the population of an entire country that has been charged and convicted of such a crime (Not to mention that the likes of us here on this forum are discussing it right now). She definately got what she deserved, and I will be quietly laughing at her for the next week or so. Maybe this little incident will straighten her out? I should surely hope so.
 

sneak_copter

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Random argument man said:
Well, she deserves her punishment.

However, I'm not sure about that photo...She looks a bit like Lund from Doomsday Arcade...Or is it me?
It is soooooo you.

OT: She's only got herself to blame.
 

tsb247

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HyenaThePirate said:
My only problem with this, other than the potential threat to Freedom of Speech and the First Amendment here in the U.S.
Nobody's First Amendment rights were violated (if this would have taken place in the U.S. that is). There is actually a crime in most states in the U.S. called, "Criminal threat," that is usually charged as a felony offense.

Here is an overview of the charge of criminal threat as viewed in California:

http://www.justia.com/criminal/docs/calcrim/1300/1300.html

Most states follow the same standards for bringing the charge of criminal threat against someone. Ms. Houghton followed the pattern almost to the letter, and it could be argued that she filled in numbers 4 and 5 when the approached the victim - even with the intent to apologize. Number 6 could be proven with evidence of a history of bullying that particular person, and I believe it was mentioned that she had. Even if Ms. Houghton did not meet all 6 criteria, she still could easily have been charged with a felony criminal threat, and I it would have been very likely that the charge would have stuck.