Update Game of Thrones Ep2 Spoilers - Told Ya Snow

Encaen

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Update Game of Thrones Ep2 Spoilers - Told Ya Snow

Spoiler warning: This article will contain spoilers from the Game of Thrones books, as well as the first five seasons of the show. It may touch on subjects the show hasn

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RedDeadFred

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May 13, 2009
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This episode, like all GoT season premieres, was kind of all over the place. It's like a big recap and showing the glimpses of each character's starting point for the season. There was only one major plot development and while it was VERY satisfying, a lot of it just felt like going through the motions. Still, it's what I anticipated, so it's not like it failed to live up to expectations for me.
I hope nobody was expecting the big reveal since there's no way they'd put that in the first episode. It needs to be given a lot of time so that the scene doesn't feel rushed and cheap. They can't do that when they have to show everyone where all the other characters are and what they're doing.
 

Dragonlayer

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RedDeadFred said:
This episode, like all GoT season premieres, was kind of all over the place. It's like a big recap and showing the glimpses of each character's starting point for the season. There was only one major plot development and while it was VERY satisfying, a lot of it just felt like going through the motions. Still, it's what I anticipated, so it's not like it failed to live up to expectations for me.
I hope nobody was expecting the big reveal since there's no way they'd put that in the first episode. It needs to be given a lot of time so that the scene doesn't feel rushed and cheap. They can't do that when they have to show everyone where all the other characters are and what they're doing.
I was joking to my brother about the big reveal, in that after all the fan theorizing, Jon was just going to get up and say "Phew! Good thing all those knives missed my vital organs!". As for the rest of the episode: Yay, Brienne has finally found Sansa by looking in the right bloody direction for a change! Boo, we're going to have to suffer a whole season's worth of the Sand Snakes! Yay, Davos and Edd are almost certainly going to bring the Wildlings to Castle Black to massacre Thorne and the other murdering, traitor filth! Boo, Daenarys is going to the Dothraki Khal Widows Book Club and subsequently be bloody dull for the rest of her appearances!

I can also see what you mean by being all over the place, but honestly it didn't feel disconnected to me, since we've been following characters across entire continents since the very start.
 

Cowabungaa

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Just for the record and courtesy; because the thread already warns for spoilers in the article we don't have to bother with them in the comments?

I don't know, I'll put this here as a spoiler warning, so everyone reading this; there be season 6 premiere spoilers ahead. Though to be fair, there's not much to spoil.
RedDeadFred said:
I hope nobody was expecting the big reveal since there's no way they'd put that in the first episode.
You mean the completely inevitable resurrection of Jon Snow by Melisandre? I've been predicting that shit for ages now.

As for Melisandre's reveal from this actual episode, right at the end? I wasn't really impressed by it, it doesn't seem to matter much to me. It served to me as more punctuation that she's indeed going to resurrect Jon Snow; she's been horribly wrong about yet another 'Chosen One' and now that we know she's actually old and battered she'll probably go all "I'm done with this shit" and use her remaining life force ala Thoros of Myr to put all her eggs in the last basket she knows of, aka Jon.

But what really annoyed me was the Danny bit. "I'm the queen!" *everyone laughs* "I'm the wife of a dead Khal!" *everyone believes her instantly* Come now... Hell, everything going on in Essos, outside of Arya, reminded me how I lost every fuck I could give about Essos. Seeing that fleet go up in flames sealed the deal for me. It screamed of desperation to me to milk that Mereen cow until it's dead. Talk about meandering side plots good grief.
 

balladbird

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Cowabungaa said:
It screamed of desperation to me to milk that Mereen cow until it's dead. Talk about meandering side plots good grief.
yeah, that was the one part of the premiere that really bugged me. It made no sense. Whether it was the sons of the harpy or the freed men who were opposing Dany, burning her fleet was against their interests since it completely removed the chance of her finally saying "man, screw this" and finally doing what she's nominally wanted to do from the start by leaving their town and never looking back.

Still, season 5 was pretty underwhelming, but I like where this one is starting. I have no idea what's going to happen now, and I don't have a whole lot of faith in the showrunners not to do something stupid to stir controversy whether it makes sense in the narrative or not, but I'm engaged enough to look forward to next week.
 

Hades

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I never got why people are so interested in John Snow and why they are so eager to speculate on his (probably inevitable) survival.

He always struck me as the most boring man in Westeros.
 

hermes

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Hades said:
I never got why people are so interested in John Snow and why they are so eager to speculate on his (probably inevitable) survival.

He always struck me as the most boring man in Westeros.
He is one of the very few "good guys" left in Westeros (the rest of them are all over the world), and one of the only remaining attractive ones (which, given the soft porn nature of the show, it is important to give someone for the female public to swoon about). Not that it is a warranty in this show but, if he dies, who is going to fight against the not-zombies horde? Littlefinger? Sansa?
 

MCerberus

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hermes200 said:
Hades said:
I never got why people are so interested in John Snow and why they are so eager to speculate on his (probably inevitable) survival.

He always struck me as the most boring man in Westeros.
He is one of the very few "good guys" left in Westeros (the rest of them are all over the world), and one of the only remaining attractive ones (which, given the soft porn nature of the show, it is important to give someone for the female public to swoon about). Not that it is a warranty in this show but, if he dies, who is going to fight against the not-zombies horde? Littlefinger? Sansa?
Sansa getting tired of all this shit and going Valkyrie we can all agree would be the optimal plot twist
 

hermes

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MCerberus said:
hermes200 said:
Hades said:
I never got why people are so interested in John Snow and why they are so eager to speculate on his (probably inevitable) survival.

He always struck me as the most boring man in Westeros.
He is one of the very few "good guys" left in Westeros (the rest of them are all over the world), and one of the only remaining attractive ones (which, given the soft porn nature of the show, it is important to give someone for the female public to swoon about). Not that it is a warranty in this show but, if he dies, who is going to fight against the not-zombies horde? Littlefinger? Sansa?
Sansa getting tired of all this shit and going Valkyrie we can all agree would be the optimal plot twist
It would definitely help make her more interesting.

I just think it would make little sense for her to turn into a warrior woman after spending all her life being a clueless and sheltered brat, being pushed around by other people actions. Right now, it would be more understandable if Cersei or Margarey went valkyrie than Sansa...
 

Remus

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Melisandre is a hagraven! HISSSSSSS. But come on, lay hands on Jon already. If Thoros can do it Mel can do it with her pinky finger. And why haven't we seen Lady Stoneheart yet? I'm awaiting that scene where Drogon flies over the horde looking for Meysa, just to see a khal shit himself. So much stuff to look forward to this season.
 

Malty Milk Whistle

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As long as they keep the Greyjoy MinInvasion of Essos I'm going to be a happy trooper.

Also I didn't think it was too bad, it did all an opening episode was meant to without too many cock-ups.
Sand Snakes are still the worst group of characters in the show though.
 

RedDeadFred

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Cowabungaa said:
RedDeadFred said:
I hope nobody was expecting the big reveal since there's no way they'd put that in the first episode.
You mean the completely inevitable resurrection of Jon Snow by Melisandre? I've been predicting that shit for ages now.
That's my point. Everyone is expecting it, so people might have thought it would happen right away.

The Mel thing was just whatever. An old crone disguising herself as a beautiful woman is nothing new in fantasy.

The Danny thing bothered me too. Are we really supposed to believe that they're just going to take her word for it when none of them had originally believed her? I get that they're pushing her as having a really commanding aura now, but I don't think the actress pulled it off well enough for it to be very convincing. I'll always have gripes with the Danny story though. IMO, it was the weakest part of the books, so it makes sense for it to be one of the weakest parts of the show (not that they haven't made other weak parts better and other better parts weaker).
Edit:
Hades said:
I never got why people are so interested in John Snow and why they are so eager to speculate on his (probably inevitable) survival.

He always struck me as the most boring man in Westeros.
I found that he was a much more interesting character in the books. You really get to see his struggle with his vows and morality in general. You see him grow a lot more in confidence while still struggling with his old issues. Not only that, the show skips his best line in the entire series! In the book, he was originally going to hang Janos, but as the man begged and threatened, Jon stops and says that what they're doing is wrong. For a second, you think he's going to let him live. Then he says "Edd, fetch me a block."
 

Cowabungaa

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RedDeadFred said:
The Mel thing was just whatever. An old crone disguising herself as a beautiful woman is nothing new in fantasy.
I spent some time thinking about it, and looking back I actually really like it. It's really indicative of how GoT plays with tropes. It just as easily eschews them as suddenly uses them. The Atlantic put it in words nicely:

After the show has spent so long jamming spears through handsome young prince heads in order to prove that it?s not reliant on fairy-tale tropes, it can occasionally shock simply by serving up some of the oldest magic tricks in the storybooks.
It also serves as a nice example of "show, don't tell". Because here we have this priestess from a far-flung corner of the world who has been on a spiritual journey to save the world. A journey not only many characters in the story but also we as viewers have not always really taken seriously.

But through the simple act of disrobing, both physically and magically, we now learn that she has been on this journey for probably decades upon decades. Maybe even centuries. It's a neat little visual cue to show how desperate and weary she must feel to lose what really must seem like the world's last hope if only because she as self-proclaimed mentor of said hope might not live long enough to see another. We and the characters might laugh about her silly prophesies behind her back and call her a con artist, but for her they truly mean everything.

So if this moment is an indication of character development to come she might be one of the most interesting and well-fleshed out characters of the season. Which would also make her inevitable sacrifice to resurrect Jon Snow all the more poignant. Might be, because GoT doesn't always treat its (female) characters with much respect.

Speaking of interesting characters, Lena Heady stole the entire episode during that beautifully acted scene of Jaime's arrival. In a way creating a very interesting contrast with Melisandre. Where Melisandre takes the entire weight of a world-defining prophesy on her back and internalizes it, Cersei is driven to the brink of madness by an extremely personal little prophesy and sets out to project it out on the world around her. Two completely different interpretations of the prophesy trope side by side. Neat-o.

It's when noticing moments like this I like GoT best. When I see it play around with tropes and prophesies, not only leaving the viewer somewhat uncertain, if only in the little moments (I feared for Podrick there for a second) but weaving a degree of uncertainty and thus humanity in the characters as well.
Malty Milk Whistle said:
As long as they keep the Greyjoy MinInvasion of Essos I'm going to be a happy trooper.
Shit I nearly forgot about that. And even though the burning of Mereen's fleet still makes little sense in the moment, it now might actually be a useful happenstance in the long run. Danny tromps around with those Dothraki for a while, eventually escapes and comes back to a Mereen occupied by a Greyjoy who had set out to bed a Targaryen. And would ya look at that there's not only a new fleet available but it's also headed by a man of a greater Westerosi house. Jackpot.
canadamus_prime said:
If they start bringing characters back from the dead I'm done!
That's old hat in GoT land. If anything it's somewhat of a returning thing. There's the wights 'returning' from the dead, Dondarion being resurrected multiple times, Lady Stark came back (and might still in the show, apparently it was hinted to last season) and we all know The Mountain is that 'new' Kings Guard member.
 

Mahorfeus

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The Sand Snakes bothered me more than anything. I shared the sentiment that the Dorne thing was a drag in the last season, and now that situation seems like it's only going to get worst in this season. I hope Jaime and Bronn get a chance to stick it to them. Or hell, for the sake of irony they could have the Zombie Mountain wreck their shit. Oberyn was a cool character, but damn if his death didn't cause a lot of shit to fly.

With the way this show is, they'll either have them live for as long as possible since they're so detestable, or the fact that their treachery was all frontloaded in the first episode will ensure that retribution is swift and messy.
 

Nurb

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Dec 9, 2008
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People aren't all that surprised by the show killing folks off for shock value anymore.

The problem is they keep shit going too long, there needs to be some resolution happening here and plot needs to actually PROGRESS. Last season was a whole bunch of dicking around with no payoff... Oh no people died, whoop-dee-shit, how about tying up some plot threads?
 

Orga777

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So, we are two episodes into Season 6, and... it is overall okay. The stuff at The Wall, with Bran, and with Sansa is pretty dang good, but other than that, most of the stuff is kinda meh or down right terrible. First the terrible...

Dorne is just continuing its severe lack of purpose and awfulness from last season. What a joke THAT dumpster fire of a plot is, and it is hands down the WORST writing in the entire show. Not one thing is redeemable about that whole disgrace and is only there so D&D can wank off on their shock deaths some more. Every character is a giant joke and a cardboard cutout used as a plot device. Awful awful awful. Ellaria and the Sand Snakes need to go. That goes for Winterfell and stupid ass Ramsay Snow as well. He wishes he was half the character Joffrey was. His entire purpose is a complete waste of time with how they are using him. They made him "important" when he has no real personality outside of being a complete monster to have any substance. His existence has been overstated and he needs to go. He doesn't even really drive the plot forth. Speaking of which, I am tired of these dumb betrayals that don't make any sense and are only used for shock value. Between Dorne and Winterfell in just two episodes, are you telling me that the guards to Doran and Roose who are only loyal to them are just okay with all this? There will be no dissension in the ranks? They all just want to stand around and nobody cares? REALLY? This is a complete joke, right? Ya see, it worked with the Red Wedding because Robb slighted Walder Frey and the Lannister's took advantage of that to stage an elaborate plan to kill off the King of the North to kill him when he least expected it on enemy grounds. NOT IN THEIR OWN DAMN THRONE ROOMS! What the hell is this? Shit, Ramsay is a bastard and even LESS of the North could give a damn about him than they already did Roose Bolton, and now they are out of favor with the crown because of Littlefinger's plans with Sansa. What can Ramsay realistically do here? He should of been drawn and quartered immediately. What a joke that all is. I can't wait for Jon to just march on Winterfell with the Wildlings and just end this little joke of a character for good. It is too good for him. Man... I wish Joffery was still around. At least his monstrous streak served a purpose.

Anyway, with the awful plot lines covered, we have the meh plotlines. Mereen... I guess we need more time, but Mereen just seems to be plodding along to really nothing right now. Danny is off with the Dothraki and pretty much out of action for now till the "Wonder Duo" finds her and finally gets things moving again... yawn... padding, padding, padding. That is Mereen right now. What makes Mereen great is Tyrion and Varys. Also, I didn't mind Tyrion's interactions with the dragons. yeah, it was faux suspense, but it did some good for Tyrion's character and was a sobering experience for him. I think that will bode well for the future. So that is all good. Speaking of padding, Arya is super padding the last two episodes. What a waste that all was. They could of just did what they did in one episode and just brought her back of the House of Black and White instead of drawing it all out for no real reason at all. Hopefully she actually accomplishes something now. :/

Then we have King's Landing. The scene with Jaime and the High Sparrow was damn good, but I am not sure how I feel about everything else right now. We shall see later, but it seems to be middling around right now with limited time to grow. Also, Jaime should of slapped Cersei for giving the Faith Militant power again like a moron. There is potential here,, but we will see. The books did a better job with the Jaime and Cersei storyline since they are drifting further and further apart, while in the show it seems to be opposite of that. Which is really unfortunate, cause Jaime starts to realize how toxic their relationship always was. It is surprising that the show is going the other way with that plot thread. It really doesn't help Jaime's character that much. Just like Stannis, I think D&D just don't know what the hell to do with them and end up butchering their characters instead of making them more compelling. That is just me, though.

And that leaves the Greyjoy's... I am actually a bit excited for this plot thread to get started. It will be interesting to see more of how they operate considering that they were criminally underused up to this point. Should be nice seeing Euron and hopefully Victarion, too. Of course my excitement is tempered because of how awful Dorne was. They can ruin this just as easily. Oh well. We shall see I guess.

All in all, it is better than last season so far, but that isn't saying a whole lot, and it can still get more obnoxious the longer it goes. Especially when Dorne gets involved. Bleh... So... yeah. Okay is the best I can give it after two episodes so far, and the season will be a lot better if they just end the Dorne and Bolton plot threads as soon as possible. The show will be able to breath better by ending those two really dumb plot lines.
 

SmugFrog

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Sep 4, 2008
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You know, I still haven't finished Season 5, but I REALLY need to get caught up. Everyone posting Snow's picture everywhere with the "OMG spoilers inside" isn't really helping anything.