UPDATE: Video of Females on Female Characters Panel
- Thread starter Greg Tito
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You want to start making videogames where the lead females arent walking around in bikini's showing off more flesh than a mall full of butchers?
Take away any and every gaming license owned by the Japanese.
Maybe then we will stop seeing 12yr old looking "19yr old" girls in miniskirts more resembling belts with their panties showing every time you jump on a ledge.
Just to clarify, I like the Japanese, I like "legal" chicks in skimpy clothes.
I was just providing some insight into how to fix the problem ^_^
Take away any and every gaming license owned by the Japanese.
Maybe then we will stop seeing 12yr old looking "19yr old" girls in miniskirts more resembling belts with their panties showing every time you jump on a ledge.
Just to clarify, I like the Japanese, I like "legal" chicks in skimpy clothes.
I was just providing some insight into how to fix the problem ^_^
This was a great discussion, so glad to see so many of my own beliefs being mentioned. I love that they actually defended Lara Croft, since I've personally had someone ask why I don't hate her. I never used to be big on her, but regardless of appearance she's not a bad character. She's the female Indiana Jones, a series I love, and has had some damn fine games. In particular Guardian of Light is a BLAST.
I sorta agree and disagree on the discussion about Yuna though. If you only count FFX, she was a decent character, but FFX-2 screwed that up. But if you want to pull an example from FF, and this one more so shows why Lightning was awful, is Ashe. She wasn't helpless, she wasn't a badass. She had to struggle with what she wanted for herself and what she needed to do for Dalmasca.
As for the discussion about how characters, not just females, need to be characterized better, and someone said they wanted to see a game where it was well done, I can only say this: Half-life 2. Well done females in Alyx and Mossman, and there are OTHER RACES without ever calling attention to it. Yeah, there are no noticeably gay characters, but that's one that's really hard to pull off without being offensive, as if it's done right you have no idea at all. For all we know Barney could be gay, as he seems to have a sort of man crush on Gordon. And if he is, it's never clearly stated, which is one of the best ways to do it.
Oh, and super thumbs up for mentioning Howl's Moving Castle. Easily my favorite Miyazaki film next to Princess Mononoke.
I sorta agree and disagree on the discussion about Yuna though. If you only count FFX, she was a decent character, but FFX-2 screwed that up. But if you want to pull an example from FF, and this one more so shows why Lightning was awful, is Ashe. She wasn't helpless, she wasn't a badass. She had to struggle with what she wanted for herself and what she needed to do for Dalmasca.
As for the discussion about how characters, not just females, need to be characterized better, and someone said they wanted to see a game where it was well done, I can only say this: Half-life 2. Well done females in Alyx and Mossman, and there are OTHER RACES without ever calling attention to it. Yeah, there are no noticeably gay characters, but that's one that's really hard to pull off without being offensive, as if it's done right you have no idea at all. For all we know Barney could be gay, as he seems to have a sort of man crush on Gordon. And if he is, it's never clearly stated, which is one of the best ways to do it.
Oh, and super thumbs up for mentioning Howl's Moving Castle. Easily my favorite Miyazaki film next to Princess Mononoke.
The entire second half of the plot of Final Fantasy X could have been averted if Yuna had told anyone what her actual plan was. (Protip: The internal struggle that the panel mentions her going through wrt: Tidus is not correct. Yuna had decided as early as the Mi'hen Highroad not to summon the Final Aeon, and to fight Yunalesca and Sin, we see that in the sphere she leaves. She wasn't travelling with the knowledge that she'd die summoning the Final Aeon but that she was inevitably going to betray the entire point of her pilgrimmage. Ironically, Tidus would have been the exact person to confide in about this because he's an outsider to the concept.)Jennacide said:
That doesn't make her a bad character, just a complete prat (but then Spira has a one-brain-limit, and Auron's got that).
I thought Howl's Moving Castle was a bit of a disappointment, to be honest. Okay it's mostly brilliant, and the characters are still spot on (whilst the plot is completely different from the book, the characters are pretty much the same), but the ending makes absolutely no sense at all.Jennacide said:
The book is far better.
Wait, WHAT? Soul calibur females are WEAK? Talim is really the only female in the series that can be considered low tier, all other females in the cast are high to top tier. Ivy has always been one of the strongest, provided you know how to use her correctly, and as of soul calibur 4, I believe its possible to cancel much more of her attacks into others making her even more unpredicable. In soulcalibur 4, Xiangua has finally been taken down from the "God" tier, however, looking through a recent tier listing, Hilde is banned along with algol.
EDIT: Males in soulcalibur have been losing clothes as well. Take a look at thier costumes and such evolution as well.
EDIT: Males in soulcalibur have been losing clothes as well. Take a look at thier costumes and such evolution as well.
I'll have to give the book a read. But either way, we should be able to agree on the underlying point: when Miyazaki's weakest films are better than 90% of the crap out of Hollywood. (Yes, even including Pom Poko) I mean, hell, it's a testament to how great he is when Totoro shows up in Toy Story 3, and you know well over half the audience has no idea what Totoro is.GloatingSwine said:
Just a note on enslaved, I think the negative feeling on the enslaved portion has more to do with the fear of having you're will subverted rather than any gender role questions. A good way to explain it to any women with difficulties understanding this emotion is simply to ask; how would you feel if you play a strong female protagonist in a game who had a slave collar attached by the male character. Who could kill her if she did not do exactly what he told her?
How would you feel about the male character?
To be honest though a game like the example would never gt written except possibly as a hanime game, because lets face it the concept regardless of gender roles is asexual fantasy...
Good male/female relationships (or any relationships)_ are about both balance and compromise, make one party to powerful it really its just insulting. (personally I find male role in complete positions of dominance just as distasteful).
How would you feel about the male character?
To be honest though a game like the example would never gt written except possibly as a hanime game, because lets face it the concept regardless of gender roles is asexual fantasy...
Good male/female relationships (or any relationships)_ are about both balance and compromise, make one party to powerful it really its just insulting. (personally I find male role in complete positions of dominance just as distasteful).
Dear God those laughs are more fake then the Big Bang Theory
where did they get the idea that Peach is cable to take care of herself?
where did they get the idea that Peach is cable to take care of herself?
and who the hell was that girl who brought up the Samus point? Because I need to slap her for thinking that Samus was ever well written
she also seems to forget that Samus was always blond and am I the only one who gets the idea behind the zero suit?
she also seems to forget that Samus was always blond and am I the only one who gets the idea behind the zero suit?
sigh I'm so sick of people dumping on 13, it had better written characters than the crap we usually get in the west
I was really happy to see a positive mention towards Yuna though, I still hold her as the benchmark for female characters and probably Garnet and Freya too
regarding the points about sexuality i agree that just because a character is attractive it doesn't make them bad, BUT i take issue with Lara Croft seeing as she is basically designed to appeal to the lowest of the cultural brow
really interesting too, always good to hear another point of view! I wish I was at PAX.... curse the cultural dystopian wasteland that is Ireland!
I was really happy to see a positive mention towards Yuna though, I still hold her as the benchmark for female characters and probably Garnet and Freya too
regarding the points about sexuality i agree that just because a character is attractive it doesn't make them bad, BUT i take issue with Lara Croft seeing as she is basically designed to appeal to the lowest of the cultural brow
really interesting too, always good to hear another point of view! I wish I was at PAX.... curse the cultural dystopian wasteland that is Ireland!