Utah creates 5 person commission to regulate one trans girl playing sports

Buyetyen

Elite Member
May 11, 2020
3,129
2,362
118
Country
USA
Ok Strawman...
If you don't want to get accused of saying stupid shit, maybe don't make the "separate but equal" argument.

The best thing to do is to ignore the issue as much as possible, the more attention is given to it, the more both side will try to keep it alive to the detriment of the people affected by it.
And the trans people effected by things like this? Do they not get a say?
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
8,922
784
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
If you don't want to get accused of saying stupid shit, maybe don't make the "separate but equal" argument.



And the trans people effected by things like this? Do they not get a say?
I didn't make a separate but equal argument.

Anyone can say whatever they want, doesn't mean things will go the way you want. Show me a place where trans women are getting kicked out of women's are getting kicked out of because of actual hate, and I'll be on your side 100%.
 

Buyetyen

Elite Member
May 11, 2020
3,129
2,362
118
Country
USA
I didn't make a separate but equal argument.

Anyone can say whatever they want, doesn't mean things will go the way you want. Show me a place where trans women are getting kicked out of women's are getting kicked out of because of actual hate, and I'll be on your side 100%.
See, you've already played your hand. I could show you videos of a trans woman getting beaten while the attacker calls her slurs, and you would still find some way to insist it's not actual hate.

Sorry dude, but if you wanted to have an intelligent conversation on this, you shouldn't have made your own intellectual dishonesty so well-known on this forum.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Thaluikhain

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,300
6,798
118
Country
United States
People keep pushing this sports thing as hate against transgender people. It's not hate because if a trans woman was playing women's chess or a trans woman was in a women's video game clan in a women's tournament, literally no one would care.
How long was your coma? Like, the trans woman who was good at Jeopardy was thrown plenty of hate. As was the trans woman who was good at eating hot peppers. Trans women good at competative videogames get shit thrown at them constantly

Both side of this issue need it to be kept alive and "hot" because they use it for political gains.

The GOP will rail against this minor issue with only one person affected and despite the fact that, honestly, minor sports competition really don't matter that much.

The dem will rail against it despite the fact that the entire idea is that there's a biological sex and mental gender that can be different and sports category are obviously based on biological sex making this a non issue and, again, minor sports competition really don't matter that much.

The best thing to do is to ignore the issue as much as possible, the more attention is given to it, the more both side will try to keep it alive to the detriment of the people affected by it.
Ignoring the issue would've just let the GOP ban people being transgender.
 

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,300
6,798
118
Country
United States
I didn't make a separate but equal argument.

Anyone can say whatever they want, doesn't mean things will go the way you want. Show me a place where trans women are getting kicked out of women's are getting kicked out of because of actual hate, and I'll be on your side 100%.
So, long as somebody has a flimsy excuse, it's all good?

Like, again: the Mormon, conservative governor of Utah sees this as a hateful attack on an extremely small minority of people. What's sold *you* on it?
 
  • Like
Reactions: Thaluikhain

tstorm823

Elite Member
Legacy
Aug 4, 2011
6,468
923
118
Country
USA
Like, a Mormon conservative politician who endorsed the likes of Rubio, Cruz, and Trump can see this for what it is, who do *you* think you're fooling?
I'm not fooling anyone. I'm stating the truth. That politician may very well also be stating the truth, I've not said anything to dispute him, I've disputed the ridiculous caricature being made of the bill. See below:
Well, at least that wouldn't involve genital inspection. It would still be horrible, it would still be senseless, it would still be abuse, but at least it would be just a bit less severe.
This bill does not involve genital inspection. Why would it even? It's a commission to determine if a trans girl is eligible for girls sports, using whatever evidence they'd like to make their case with. If the youth has a vagina, they're not going to be in this position in the first place. If they have a penis, it doesn't help their case. Not only is this commission not tasked with genital inspections, there is no situation where it would inspire one. You're just being silly.
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
8,684
2,879
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
This bill does not involve genital inspection. Why would it even? It's a commission to determine if a trans girl is eligible for girls sports, using whatever evidence they'd like to make their case with. If the youth has a vagina, they're not going to be in this position in the first place. If they have a penis, it doesn't help their case. Not only is this commission not tasked with genital inspections, there is no situation where it would inspire one. You're just being silly.
To answer you're question: why would it? Because that's what the Olympics used to do
 

Trunkage

Nascent Orca
Legacy
Jun 21, 2012
8,684
2,879
118
Brisbane
Gender
Cyborg
Ok Strawman...


Really?!?! What does changing a word on your birth certificate matter? Sex is the field on a birth certificate, not gender. The only reason I would ever want to change my birth certificate is if something on there was wrong to where it was messing up me getting a driver's license or passport or something. Even if my sex was wrong on it, I wouldn't give 2 shits about it.

People keep pushing this sports thing as hate against transgender people. It's not hate because if a trans woman was playing women's chess or a trans woman was in a women's video game clan in a women's tournament, literally no one would care. The issue is whether it's fair or not, which I very much doubt has been concluded.
There are two SEPARATE bills in the article. One is banning any change on a birth certificate. Another banning anyone who is transgender from playing.

It's in the same paragraph

Edit: It actually says law, not bill. I don't know if its separate bills, but they are seperate laws
 

TheMysteriousGX

Elite Member
Legacy
Sep 16, 2014
8,300
6,798
118
Country
United States
I find the "I wouldn't care about the gender on my birth certificate being wrong unless it fucked up the bureaucracy the flows from it" argument to be hilarious because the main reason people want to change their birth certificates is because it fucks up the bureaucracy that flows from it. Like, that's reason #1.

Just no thought being put in at all.
 

Buyetyen

Elite Member
May 11, 2020
3,129
2,362
118
Country
USA
Conservatives will couch their beliefs in "biology" until biology doesn't align with what they learned in church or primary school, then they immediately fall back on magic.
Science is a lot like Hollywood to conservatives. It possesses an immense cultural cache that conservatives desperately crave for themselves, but it keeps telling them things they don't want to hear.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Hades

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
8,922
784
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
See, you've already played your hand. I could show you videos of a trans woman getting beaten while the attacker calls her slurs, and you would still find some way to insist it's not actual hate.

Sorry dude, but if you wanted to have an intelligent conversation on this, you shouldn't have made your own intellectual dishonesty so well-known on this forum.
What actual government policy is hating on trans people? You can't stop people from hating other people. Nobody that is for fair competition in women's sports is hating on trans women.

How long was your coma? Like, the trans woman who was good at Jeopardy was thrown plenty of hate. As was the trans woman who was good at eating hot peppers. Trans women good at competative videogames get shit thrown at them constantly


Ignoring the issue would've just let the GOP ban people being transgender.
OMG, I didn't think I'd need to put an exception of "random people hating on other people because that what's people have always done" in there. There's always some people hating on others that are different, you're not going to stop that outside of the culture changing over time. Do we need to fight for fat rights because people call other people fat? There hasn't been any government policy that is singling out trans people because of hate. Is there some government bill pending about no trans allowed on Jeopardy or hot pepper eating contests?

So, long as somebody has a flimsy excuse, it's all good?

Like, again: the Mormon, conservative governor of Utah sees this as a hateful attack on an extremely small minority of people. What's sold *you* on it?
Sports is separated by sex, not gender. Simple as that.

There are two SEPARATE bills in the article. One is banning any change on a birth certificate. Another banning anyone who is transgender from playing.

It's in the same paragraph

Edit: It actually says law, not bill. I don't know if its separate bills, but they are seperate laws
So what that you can't change SEX on your birth certificate? What the fuck does that matter? The law isn't banning trans people from playing sports, stop saying stuff that isn't true. Sports is separated by SEX, not gender. Trans people have not been banned from playing sports anywhere in the US.
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
8,922
784
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
Science is a lot like Hollywood to conservatives. It possesses an immense cultural cache that conservatives desperately crave for themselves, but it keeps telling them things they don't want to hear.
Conservatives followed science more than democrats during covid. The 2 top FDA officials quit because Biden was not following the science.
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
8,922
784
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA
Laughing doesn't make it any less true.

Florida out-performed Michigan, one of the most restrictive states for covid. Illinois had ridiculous covid policies (I live in Cook County and did everything in Indiana because it was open the whole time) and all Illinois policies did was allow it to get tied with Florida.
 

Silvanus

Elite Member
Legacy
Jan 15, 2013
11,027
5,796
118
Country
United Kingdom
Florida out-performed Michigan, one of the most restrictive states for covid. Illinois had ridiculous covid policies (I live in Cook County and did everything in Indiana because it was open the whole time) and all Illinois policies did was allow it to get tied with Florida.
Way to pick one or two data-points that help serve an argument, rather than the overall trend.

As a trend, more Republican-run states are performing worse than more Democrat-run states.
 

Phoenixmgs

The Muse of Fate
Legacy
Apr 3, 2020
8,922
784
118
w/ M'Kraan Crystal
Gender
Male
Way to pick one or two data-points that help serve an argument, rather than the overall trend.

As a trend, more Republican-run states are performing worse than more Democrat-run states.
But if said policies work, then they would work. Surely, some blue state with tons of restrictions should out-perform Florida with its eyes closed if said policies work, right? I mean, the left wing media calls the Florida governor Death-Santis, yet he did better than half of them.

As a trend more republican states are less healthy, notice any similarities between the worst performing covid states and the following list?
1648591995589.png