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AshuraSpeaks

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Jun 12, 2008
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HUBILUB said:
Not many people admit to backpedaling. Another reason why Yahtzee is awesome
His inspiration is Charlie Brooker - self-described in one episode of Screenwipe as "So bloody post-modern that we're about to cut to a shot of me typing these words into a script" - so he's hung plenty of lampshades on techniques he's using as well.
 

epsilon246

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Sep 18, 2009
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Turbowombat said:
Problem with Samus: she doesn't F***ing talk! Admitadly Team Ninja is fixing this, but I can't credibly commend characterization of mutes. How did she get her advanced armor suit from the Chozo if she wasn't able to ask for it? Why does the Federation send her on missions when she can't respond to their calls? Just the fact that everyone can walk all over her without waiting for her to say yes or no makes her a *****.

Anyway, regarding the review schedule, why did we not see a Dead Space: Extraction review yet? It released earlier in Australia than anywhere else for once. AND it features a well characterized female no less (though that's arguable, she does adopt "damsel in distress" frequently)!
You clearly haven't read the (official) manga where she is shown talking, she also talks in brawl, she doesn't talk in game for the same reason as Master Chief or any other silent protagonist it's not neccesary for story progression. It's only recently we've met creatures that aren't trying to kill her in metroid. And most of the time yes/no suffices.
 

Trotgar

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Sep 13, 2009
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Lord Krunk said:
Trotgar said:
Does Yahtzee post everything at 7 o'clock?
It depends on which time zone you're in. My featured review was released at 7 as well, which gives me the notion that anyone who lives on the Australian east coast has their features released at 7 (ZP and Doomsday Arcade, for example).
Yeah, I forgot to mention that he posts the at 7 o'clock in time zone 2+ (or was it +2)

I didn't even try to guess when Yahtzee himself posts them (in his time time zone) because I don't where in Australia he lives, and wasn't Australia divided in 3 time zones?
 

Lord Krunk

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Mar 3, 2008
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Trotgar said:
I didn't even try to guess when Yahtzee himself posts them (in his time time zone) because I don't where in Australia he lives, and wasn't Australia divided in 3 time zones?
Oh, he doesn't post them, the Escapist does it for him. And he lives in Brisbane, which is in the same time zone as Sydney.
 

DreadfulSorry

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Feb 3, 2009
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Oh my God, THANK YOU, Yahtzee. I'm glad there's someone other than me who's getting tired of female characters in games being in one extreme or the other.
 

lleihsad

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Apr 9, 2009
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Samus doesn't count because her gender doesn't define her? Isn't that WHY she's usually cited as a strong female character? You don't make a strong female character, you make a strong character that happens to be female.

Along similar lines, I'd bring up Maya from the PC game Septerra Core. Her gender is just a facet of her character, rather than her defining aspect.
 

Aulwynd

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Jul 8, 2009
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I don't get why so many people are saying that Alyx is a good "female character". C'mon, she just apear like 20 minutes in the whole HL2(And 5 of them is just to teach you how to use the graivity gun). And in Chapter 1 is even wrost, she dont stop saying generic action hero lines like "Boom, Toasted!" while you're surrounded by Combine soldiers and your allies are dying by your side.
 

HK_01

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I thought that Ashley Williams from Mass Effect was a pretty well done "tough" female character. She was unlikeable at first, but when you found out more about her - she was still unlikeable, but at least you understood her.
 

Something Amyss

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Dec 3, 2008
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RazokKull said:
Agreed. Frankly, I've always been sick of the, "I don't have a penis, and I'm in a video game, this means I have to be extra, extra 'tough' in order to make up for what I lack."

This doesn't net you respect, only ire. Be human, not a raging *****. People will like you more! (And not just for your mammaries!)
To be fair, women being extra tough in an "action hero" role tends to be pretty realistic. Women in any real world position remotely analogous will tend to feel obligated to prove they can be as macho, aggressive, and stupid as the boys. Tongue in cheek, of course.

That doesn't mean being a ***** is a positive personality trait. Or an excuse to have no personality traits. Being tough as nails doesn't translate to being angry or bitchy all the time. It tends to be a byproduct of being part of the "old boy's club."

That being said, I'd kill for some female personas with some actual personality. Character development. Or even just character.
 

Sheo_Dagana

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Aug 12, 2009
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This makes sense... sadly in video games, females fall into about three different types.

The first being the ones with the attitude. Usually they're either depressed about something in their past, have bad attitudes, or both with the former resulting in the latter. The largest racks in the game are reserved for them.

There's the "special girls" up after them. They're usually shy or more softly spoken than others and there is typically something special about them (survivors of ancient races, psychics, ect...).

Lastly there's the bubbly ones. They're hyper active, immature, and you usually want to wring their necks by the end of the game.

Think of any Final Fantasy game you've ever played and it's easy to apply these. I can only think of Sheva from RE5 who was probably one of the best leading ladies I've seen in a game in a while. Obviously inferior, frustrating AI stops people from seeing that she's a fairly believable character.
 

RawShark

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Nov 2, 2009
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Having only just played the God of War 3 E3 demo, I've only just realised there is in fact a kind of double standard going on...

I think we can all agree that God of War is awesome. Kratos is an amoral little nutter and there's a great catharsis that comes out of that. For those of you who havn't tried it out yet, during the demo innocent greeks will run screaming from enemy hordes, and this time around will even go so far as to hide behind whatever they can in an attempt to escape with their spleens intact. You will, of course, drag them out and slice them up for the green orbs that spill out of them and they should be damn happy for the opportunity.

Thing is, this is also exactly the same thing that Yahtzee is criticizing Rubi, and earlier Lara Croft for. Let's not think about the quality of their respective games for a second (what with neither being anywhere near as good as any GOW), and just think about characterisation. Yahtzee criticized Lara for being unlikable for skewering a Kraken in Trunderworld, but in fact Katos beat her to it by a fair two years in GOW2. And Rubi may not be that likeable a character, but Kratos isn't going to win Come Dine With Me anytime soon. His beef wellington is always overdone for a start.

My point is, boobies aside, games now are filled with unpleasant player characters to the point where they're par for the course. Other than Nathan Drake, I find it hard to think of anyone, especially in the action genre, who I actually found likable.

Well, Gordon Freeman, I guess, but that's just because he knows to keep his mouth shut. He'd be crap at a dinner party though.
 

shadow skill

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Oct 12, 2007
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Magna Carta 2 says hi, as does Persona 3. I also don't see how people can get upset over this kind of thing and use a game where the underlying problem is that the lead is not actually a character at all to make that point. Couple that with a strange willingness to forget that there are really human beings who are very taciturn who keep things very close to the vest. Some of the best characters in fiction fit this quite well like Batman or Wolverine. Some really are amoral too like Jackie Estacado.
 

brunothepig

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May 18, 2009
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Oh god, I remember that scene in Crysis... I also remember thinking, "OK, she's incredibly offended by very common slang, from my obviously cockney (and stupid) partner. We just saved her from the Koreans who were holding her hostage. Hell, if Psycho had asked her out the decent thing to do would be say yes. We just saved her life! What a *****." I did quite like Psycho though lol. He amused me.
On Topic: I can't think of a single game I've played that featured a playable feamle character, with characterisation, not just a created one in an RPG, that wasn't a total *****.
 

RJ Dalton

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Aug 13, 2009
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Pardon me, I'm going to talk about myself again. You might make the accusation that the only reason I talk about myself and my work as a writer is because it's the only thing in the world that I know anything about. Get off my back. It's bad enough that I'm a hopeless nerd with no chance of ever knowing the love of a woman (or, while we're on the subject, any other human being) without all of you constantly reminding me of it. *sob*

What was I saying? Oh, yes.

Go, Yahtzee. This trend for female characters (not just in games, but also in TV and movies) is something that pisses me off to no end. But you know what pisses me off even more, you basically have to make this kind of character now, or people who call themselves feminists, but are really nothing more than psychotic, self-centered bitches (much like the characters they leap to defend) get on your case.

I wrote a story a while back about a character who, Yahtzee will probably hate this, a power-armored space marine who fights demons. Okay, not the most original premise, but I like to take ideas that have been beaten to death with the generic stick and try to make something different out of them. For starters, I made the character a woman. Secondly, because I was basically writing a mother's day story, I decided that I would make the woman actually want to be a mother, rather than a soldier. Her story was basically that military service was mandatory, so she went in planning on getting it over with before settling down and raising a family. Then there was a war of expansion by the empire and she got drafted into further service, followed by the demonic invasion. She kept getting drawn more and more into combat until she became a career soldier. She became a hero when she volunteered for a suicide mission to stop the Demon King and then managed to survive and destroy the Demon King's base. This cost her dearly though, because she was very badly injured, requiring extensive cybernetic prosthetics. Insult to injury, the Demon King, probing her mind for her dearest desire, cursed her so that she could never bear children (demons are real dicks in that story, and for a thematic reason). Since her first dream was stolen, she decided to bury herself in her soldier career so she could protect the world and allow others to live the the dream she could never have.
Now, she was a badass character. You'd have to be to deal with that kind of a life and not go mad or break down. Furthermore, she was a character with complex motivation, a tragic history and a real personality. I thought this was a winning formula. But when I had the chance to do a reading in public (discovering then that it had serious typos which I had to correct on the fly, and boy was that fun (irony)), I got hounded by some self-proclaimed feminists who said that I was insulting and degrading women by creating a character who wanted to be a mother. I suppose if I had made her a surly, psychotic *****, they'd have enjoyed it more, but would it have made a good story? No.
The problem here is not the industry itself, so much as it is the stupid people who refuse to look any deeper than the surface and are constantly seeking something to make into a platform for their shallow political ideologies.

Also, I'm going to say this: I'm actually really put off by titties and have never seen a situation in movies where it didn't really bug me. Some who have read my work (nobody on this site, probably) will find this funny because my work occasionally features nudity, sex and rape. The problem I have is that whenever I see a gigantic pair of breasts, or a woman who gets out her tits for someone in a movie or a game, it always leaves me feeling like I've been insulted. It's like the writers are saying, "We can get away with any kind of shit we want in this story, because you are a male gamer and this woman flaunts her sex appeal all over you. Dance for me, you greasy, sweaty monkey-puppet!"
If there's going to be this sort of thing, make it thematically significant, don't just throw it in willy-nilly to pander to a sex-crazed society. Respect your audience's intelligence more than that. Sure, they haven't give you reason to, but if you push them, they will rise to the occasion.

I'm going to get down of my soapbox now.