What exactly makes music music?

Tipsy Giant

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DJ_DEnM said:
I've studied music for five years including a degree.

As long as a piece of audio art contains either melody (tones which differ in pitch) or rhythm (tones which have a timing structure) it is music.
Regardless of what anyone else thinks, it is music, whether you personally enjoy it or not is a separate discussion.
What constitutes fine music (as in fine art) is of great debate, however the consensus seems to be that like all art forms it is down to expression, the artists being able to express something which could not be expressed through any other medium, something that resonates with us as a species. This is probably where the argument lies, a lot of people state that unless music meets the fine art criteria it is not music, which is far from true. However it is often this non fine art that is celebrated amongst the uninitiated, same as any art form, what sells the most is deemed the best whereas that is rarely the case. I am not one for bashing something due to it's popularity and will defend every persons right to express themselves, but you don't need to buy into the idea that there is a right and wrong in art, it's whatever you like that is right, that is it.

plus if you wanna hear dub step (which was created in my hometown like 5 years ago) which is a little different there is plenty of variety outside the mainstream

 

DrRockor

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Is it weird that I through that dubstep was an artist up until a week ago?

I have really formed an opinion on it yet because i atleast don't think I've heard a lot of it. I might have heard some and just not known it was dubstep but I don't think it's as bad as people say it is.
 

someonehairy-ish

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Tipsythegza said:
Nowadays: Half naked girls dancing in the background
Fun fact: Many of the studios that produce music videos for various R&B, rap and hiphop 'artists' also make porn.

OT: Music can't really be defined. I'd say that it's any collection of sounds that are designed to produce an emotional response in the listener that also has a rhythmic quality to it.

As for dubstep... I'd say that the reason there is so much 'bad' dubstep is because anyone with the right software can make it and post it online. With forms of music that use instruments you have to find people who are apt enough to play whatever you've written, then get the money together to record it - or get signed. Which means that 'bad' rock bands generally never get to the stage where much of their music is available, whereas 'bad' dubstep artists can easily get to that stage.
That doesn't make dubstep worthless as a genre. There is plenty of great dubstep out there.
 

omega 616

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DJ_DEnM said:
So I've heard many opinions of opinions on dubstep that range from calling it crapstep to Wendy's as a franchise saying it sounds like a broken Frosty machine. It's largely considered music in the US, but people don't think so. So what exactly does it take for something to be considered music?
To me music is something that takes some skill to play, a guitar, a drum set, piano or whatever.

Dubstep and anything created on computer, like dance are not music to me. There was a game called "music" and "music 2001" (I think), on those games you could make stuff equal to dubstep and dance music ... if a below average intelligent child with no musical training can do it, it's not music.

All I hear in that music is super loud bass (so people can be in time with it) and a simple, repetitive melody or tune over the top so it's not just the sound of a hammer falling down stairs.

There is one exception to my rule, his name is beardyman. Beardyman is a beatboxer, beatboxing takes skill, so he makes it music ... I know a lot, if not everyone will disagree with my opinion, butt fuck them! Hehehe.

This is beardyman ...


If you watch all of it you can hear him do 2 Micheal Jackson songs, both the song and the singing at the same time!
 

Hugga_Bear

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dnnydllr said:
Vault101 said:
DJ_DEnM said:
Vault101 said:
So common internet critics?
my point is this thread...isnt (and shouldnt) be about weather dubstep is "good" or "bad"

unless somone out there familiar with music theory will corrent me...Dubstep is music..I've got no interest in defending it as a genre

weather people like it or not is irrelevent
Technically, no, it's not music. Then again, almost nothing that's produced today can actually fall under the "technical" classification of music. I'm as schooled in music theory as a half baked potato, but one of my more (and incredibly) musically inclined friends explained it to me once. I can't remember too much from his explanation, but suffice to say most popular forms of music are missing at least one quality that keeps them from being "technically" music.
Your friend is either an idiot or a liar. It is music, all popular music is music. The 'technical' definition of music isn't complex and is succinctly explained by Tipsy Giant.

What is good music is different and almost entirely subjective but is it music? Yes. To say otherwise is to be elitist twat with no knowledge of the subject.
 

EHKOS

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Feb 28, 2010
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Music is any number of anything that constitutes as a sound in any combination. You can hear music anywhere. The windshield wipers mixed with rain can be music.
 

garfoldsomeoneelse

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Mar 22, 2009
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I'll tell you what makes music: Ableton Live 8.

Seriously though, there's plenty of reasons why dubstep as a genre gets so much flak: elitism, ignorance (both the regular kind and the willful kind), and, most commmonly, a lack of exposure to the good stuff. Even though it's one of my favorite genres, none of this really rustles my jimmies since I'm on the other side of the equation with country music: I've heard one or two really good songs from the genre, but the majority of what I've heard is (imo) garbage so I never really felt compelled to do any digging for the gold, genre-defining songs by gifted artists.

Tampa's got a pretty big (and constantly growing) rave culture, though, so most everyone around here has acquired a taste for it simply by proximity to the party. Metal shows have bit the dust in favor of big-name EDM artists, which is fine with me despite my love of metal because the new acts are actually a lot more entertaining.


EDIT: And to anyone that says producing electronic music requires no skill, download any DAW you wish and drop a professional track of your own. I'll give you three months to learn the program, learn to write music in a unique language, layer a ton of complex sounds and rhythms, synthesize your own unique sounds, mix, and master an original composition that doesn't sound like utter shit. If it's really as easy as you assert, I should be eating humble pie in a week.
 

Shivarage

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Hehehe, you have to laugh at you guys who use your degree as some sort of proof of confirmation that your opinion is worth more than others =P

your wall owns that piece of paper and your opinion is no better than anyone elses :3
 

Tipsy Giant

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Shivarage said:
Hehehe, you have to laugh at you guys who use your degree as some sort of proof of confirmation that your opinion is worth more than others =P

your wall owns that piece of paper and your opinion is no better than anyone elses :3
you're right, proof of looking further into a subject is no proof of a better opinion, however I never stated that. I was just giving my background in the subject and giving my opinion.


Trust me, noone knows how worthless that piece of paper is more than me.

although I do respect a Doctors opinion more because of his PHD on medical matters
 

MiracleOfSound

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Dubstep is music. Saying it's not is just stupid hyperbole. People say the same about any genre they don't like.

Anything that is an organized and mathematically constant audio rhythm is music - and sometimes even stuff that isn't organised and constant can be music too.
 
Jun 11, 2008
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I think this should help. [http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Music+Definition] On a more serious note yes it music whether it is good music that depends on your opinion which is subjective. Unfortunately, with Dubstep we come to an interesting point about some electronic music in general which is that it can be very easy to make. This means that some of what is Dubstep is crap because it may not make musical sense, is pure noise and not well structured however, there is obviously good and bad Dubstep.

Listen to this and then realise it is a good example of functioning music then tell me what you think of Dubstep.
 

Shivarage

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Tipsy Giant said:
you're right, proof of looking further into a subject is no proof of a better opinion, however I never stated that. I was just giving my background in the subject and giving my opinion.


Trust me, noone knows how worthless that piece of paper is more than me.

although I do respect a Doctors opinion more because of his PHD on medical matters
A degree in medicine is much different because medicine is a science, even then science can never prove anything - it can only disprove so nothing is ever certain

Art is mere opinion, if you can know an art so much better than anyone else because of a degree then go right ahead, make art and be a success :)
 

Torrasque

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I'll tackle this in two ways:

1. Music is any combination of sounds that someone finds appealing to the ears. Tap the wall while whistling something and shuffling your feet on the ground. That is music. It is very simple and rudimentary music, but it is still music to someone.

2. Good music is what most people talk about whenever they talk about music. Good music is entirely individual, and while large groups of people can agree on a sound that sounds good, no person will like all of the same music as another person; it is just not possible. I define good music as being something I can listen to twice and enjoy more the second time, something that makes my head bob or my mind invent a quick little story to go with it. Great music is music I can listen to again and again without getting tired of it. Bad music is off key, off rhythm, and just sounds bad... A lot of Death Metal is like that, most rap is like that, and all country is like that.

I can't recall what comedian said it, but in his set he said "I've always found it ridiculous for someone to tell me what bad music is. I mean... How do you tell someone 'No! That doesn't sound good! YOU don't like that!'" (paraphrased).
 

Torrasque

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Daystar Clarion said:
I'm not an expert on music, not by a long shot.

My opinion of dubstep is like this.

The vast majority of it, is shite, but when a good dubstep track comes along, I really like it.

Like this, for instance.



It pushes all the right buttons in my brain and I can't help but like it.

So, to answer your question, music for me is a mixture of two things.

The track above gets my rythm going, but there's very little emotional involvement.

While this...


Makes my heart soar. The former I will have forgotten in six months, while the latter will be with me for a very long time.
Ooooo thank you! This gits song is absolutely amazing :D

I entirely agree with your point on dubstep. I have listened to a bunch of Skrillex, and with the exception of a few songs, it isn't all that good. It just gets stale really quickly imo. But I have seen some fantastic Zelda dubstep and other amazing dubstep. I think most people who dislike dubstep get hung up about how dubstep is made by abusing technical aspects of the mixing and how it isn't "proper" music; kind of like how DJs that just remixed songs but did not really make anything, were scorned when they first appeared.

Captcha: history repeats itself
How fitting.
 
Jun 11, 2008
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Torrasque said:
I can't recall what comedian said it, but in his set he said "I've always found it ridiculous for someone to tell me what bad music is. I mean... How do you tell someone 'No! That doesn't sound good! YOU don't like that!'" (paraphrased).
Probably Dara o'Briain as he brought that up as part of a stand up but I'm sure he's not the only person to point that out.