What is your Opinion on the Social Justice Movement?

[Dragonbums]

EDIT: By Social Justice I'm not talking about any sort of organization or anything like that. I'm kind of referring to the people who often reblog and make social awareness posts on tumblr, and other places similar to it.

I'm not talking about what they support or anything like that.
What I mean is, how do you view the people that associate with that movement?

I asked this because I just recently came under fire over my ignorance about Johnny Depp and his involvement about Native Americans.
It was some article where he told them that they are still warriors.
Someone on tumblr talked about his life story about living a Native American life and how he doesn't need Depp to tell him that he's a warrior.
That's fine and dandy. And I agreed with said user. However I just didn't like the last bit where he said Johnney Depp was just some rich actor and he doesn't have the right to talk about struggles.

At that point I simply replied and said that Depp did have a lot of hurdles to jump over when he was growing up.
At that point I was told to shut the fuck up, I was labelled as a white person (pro-tip: I'm not white) and I just got called all these white slurs that was really uncalled for.
Saying that I'm backing "white actors" to invalidate his post and that if I walk like a cracker, talk like a "cracker", and act like a "cracker" then it's safe to assume I'm a "cracker". At that point he blocked me.
All this out of a misunderstanding of what I said.

Before that point I was neutral about the whole SJ movement.
And don't get me wrong, they did bring issues to light that I would never of known about otherwise.
However I now understand how Mike from Penny Arcade must've felt (only 1 million times worse) when something he said out of ignorance and instead of people telling him politely that what he said was mean and ignorant they just went on ahead and blasted the guy. Props for him on making an apology.
I now know what some white people must feel when they say something out of ignorance on Tumblr and they are instantly blasted by with the most horrible names. Even though I'm not white, I got really angry at those words.
However this movement will not last long if this is the sort of knee jerk reaction we are going to have towards people with ignorant and/or opposing view points.

Also please try to keep this on topic. Don't derail this too much by completely focusing on the now finished argument.

 

[Uhura]

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I'm a bit confused. What exactly do you mean by the 'social justice movement'? People on tumblr?

 

[DoPo]

snip

I'm a bit confused. What exactly do you mean by the 'social justice movement'? People on tumblr?

Yeah, I'll second that - what movement is that? I am vaguely aware of the term but it seems here it's used to mean "some person on Tumblr I had a disagreement with" I thought it was more of...I dunno - a movement, I suppose.

 

[Lilani]

I'm with the other two posters: what is the "social justice movement?" And my question specifically is, by "Social Justice Movement" do you mean one, big organization/cause like World Wildlife Fund or the Occupy movement, or do you mean just social justice causes in general?

 

[Resetti's_Replicas]

Mike from Penny Arcade has a platform with millions of impressionable viewers. I don't see why it was wrong for someone to call him out on his ignorance; the Twitter conversation someone posted earlier seemed like a perfectly reasonable reaction from someone who had experienced that sort of thing his entire life.

It was Mike's choice to donate $20k to charity, I understand his feeling bad, but I think a simple "sorry" would have suffice (it would have to if it were I that offended someone, I don't have that kind of money kicking around).

But with regards to social justice, isn't it a good thing that someone who was offended was able to go right to the source and get him to reconsider his views?

 

[Dragonbums]

Mike from Penny Arcade has a platform with millions of impressionable viewers. I don't see why it was wrong for someone to call him out on his ignorance; the Twitter conversation someone posted earlier seemed like a perfectly reasonable reaction from someone who had experienced that sort of thing his entire life.

It was Mike's choice to donate $20k to charity, I understand his feeling bad, but I think a simple "sorry" would have suffice (it would have to if it were I that offended someone, I don't have that kind of money kicking around).

But with regards to social justice, isn't it a good thing that someone who was offended was able to go right to the source and get him to reconsider his views?

It wasn't the part where people told him what he said was wrong.
It was how they went about doing it.
Mike was had enough guts to issue an apology and admit that what he said was ignorant and offensive. Few people said that in a rational (albeit upset) way.

However the majority of the people blasted him, sent him hate messages, sent him threats, etc. for basically ignorance more than malice.

 

[Dragonbums]

I'm with the other two posters: what is the "social justice movement?" And my question specifically is, by "Social Justice Movement" do you mean one, big organization/cause like World Wildlife Fund or the Occupy movement, or do you mean just social justice causes in general?

I mean Social Justice causes in general.
They are most well known on tumblr.
Again, not the ideals, just the way they go about educating people who say something in opposition to it's main ideals out of ignorance or different perspective.

 

[RandallJohn]

Tumblr-wise, I really dislike it. It raises awareness of issues, but it does it in quite the wrong way. And I wouldn't mind it so much if it was just a case of "Oh, it's idiots on the internet, just ignore them." My issue is that they piggyback on real issues like feminism, racism, and things like that. They make it more about shouting down those who disagree and humiliating or harassing people (sometimes with death threats,)and honestly, it pushes things to the point where you can't think about the issue without thinking of them, and for some people, it can make you turn a blind eye to the issue altogether. And heaven help you if you disagree or ask for clarification on a subject. Hell, I've even seen tumblr SJ's jump on a person and berate him for being a "white cis male" even though he was AGREEING with her.

Tumblr can be a fun site, but the groupthink there is also a perfect incubator for idiots. Luckily, this kind of arguing doesn't usually work in meatspace, where logic can win arguments.

(Note: There are people on there who are actually pushing for these causes, raising awareness, and making a positive difference in the world. Sadly, their voices are far less common because their posts don't include a sassy insult to a male and twenty-five "oh snap" reaction gifs.)

 

[Tanakh]

They are the laziest, most useless form of social activism with an inflated ego. Still, they seem to be more good than harm.

Offtopic: There is something about you that rubs me the wrong way OP. Not sure what it is, anyway, GL HF with your internet crawls.

 

[Dragonbums]

They are the laziest, most useless form of social activism with an inflated ego. Still, they seem to be more good than harm.

Offtopic: There is something about you that rubs me the wrong way OP. Not sure what it is, anyway, GL HF with your internet crawls.

GL HF? I don't understand what that means.

 

[Sonic Doctor]

The social justice movement for the vast most part is a bunch of people that want to do something that makes themselves feel like they are making a grand difference in the world, like they are part of something that is as monumental and world changing as the events of the 1960's. These are people that are really just in it for themselves than the cause and they are people that don't care who they hurt in their wake.
What's troubling is that such people have turned the concept into a one strike you're out type of thing. If someone says something inappropriate or ignorant, it becomes and all out assault to try and ruin that persons life. Instead of just nicely discussing with such people on how what they said or did was wrong, the social justice "bringers" practically become rabid animals with no sense and just attack such people.

Example of a list of actions of what I feel it seems social justice "bringers" like to do:

1.) Berate the people with as many bad names as it takes to make them feel bad. Make them feel like the worst people alive and that they are a waste of space.

2.) If they have a job, lets get them fired.

3.) Do whatever else it takes to destroy their lives.

Because of these social justice nuts, employers have adopted one strike policies. Rather than standby a good employee that just said something wrong and would be best helped with a very minor reprimand(if even needed) and a conversation about what they said or did was wrong.

As it has pointed out in this thread, because people end up doing these mob-like attacks, they tend to end up loosing support and make the cause seem like it is childish and should just stop. I mean really, the first thought when people say or do something stupid, shouldn't be "let's get them and ruin their lives".

 

[Dragonbums]

The social justice movement for the vast most part is a bunch of people that want to do something that makes themselves feel like they are making a grand difference in the world, like they are part of something that is as monumental and world changing as the events of the 1960's. These are people that are really just in it for themselves than the cause and they are people that don't care who they hurt in their wake.
What's troubling is that such people have turned the concept into a one strike you're out type of thing. If someone says something inappropriate or ignorant, it becomes and all out assault to try and ruin that persons life. Instead of just nicely discussing with such people on how what they said or did was wrong, the social justice "bringers" practically become rabid animals with no sense and just attack such people.

Example of a list of actions of what I feel it seems social justice "bringers" like to do:

1.) Berate the people with as many bad names as it takes to make them feel bad. Make them feel like the worst people alive and that they are a waste of space.

2.) If they have a job, lets get them fired.

3.) Do whatever else it takes to destroy their lives.

Because of these social justice nuts, employers have adopted one strike policies. Rather than standby a good employee that just said something wrong and would be best helped with a very minor reprimand(if even needed) and a conversation about what they said or did was wrong.

As it has pointed out in this thread, because people end up doing these mob-like attacks, they tend to end up loosing support and make the cause seem like it is childish and should just stop. I mean really, the first thought when people say or do something stupid, shouldn't be "let's get them and ruin their lives".

I had no idea it went to serious real life consequences. The most I've seen is simply 3,000 + notes all telling said person that they are a little shit.

 

[RandallJohn]

They are the laziest, most useless form of social activism with an inflated ego. Still, they seem to be more good than harm.

Offtopic: There is something about you that rubs me the wrong way OP. Not sure what it is, anyway, GL HF with your internet crawls.

GL HF? I don't understand what that means.

"Good luck, have fun"

 

[Zhukov]

Some of us don't have anything to do with tumblr.

So, just what the flying fuck is a "social justice movement" and what does it have to do with Johnny Depp, crackers and Penny Arcade?

 

[Dragonbums]

They are the laziest, most useless form of social activism with an inflated ego. Still, they seem to be more good than harm.

Offtopic: There is something about you that rubs me the wrong way OP. Not sure what it is, anyway, GL HF with your internet crawls.

GL HF? I don't understand what that means.

"Good luck, have fun"

Ah, thanks for that.
I'm really bad at acronyms that are more than 3 letters.

 

[MeChaNiZ3D]

Bunch of childish hyprocrites who seem to think harrassing people over unintentionally or trivially politically incorrect things is a way of encouraging tolerance. Naturally I don't mean everyone in the 'social justice movement', but practically everyone who considers it a movement and them a part of it as opposed to a general mindset of common sense and decency, which is what I consider most people's sense of social justice.

A side note though, I didn't even know there were white racial slurs. I mean, cracker, sure, oh that hurts, reminds me of the old days when people long dead and who weren't related to me owned other people as slaves, what an aspersion you've cast. But are there any actual insults? There's white trash, but that's more classist than racist.

GL HF? I don't understand what that means.

Good Luck Have Fun.

 

[Sonic Doctor]

They are the laziest, most useless form of social activism with an inflated ego. Still, they seem to be more good than harm.

When people that say small, ignorant, but rather inconsequential things that get their lives ruined by such "social justicers", in that the people losing their jobs and such(especially hard on people in such an economy), that is doing more harm than good. Because then people are created that start to view the cause as in a bad light. It will raise more malice towards a cause than create positive awareness.

I for one would never support a cause that maliciously attacks people for hurting another person's feelings because insensitive things were said, where polite discourse would have be sufficient where it always will be sufficient in the minor cases I'm thinking of.

Cases where, "oh boo-hoo, what those people said offended me. It was (insert racist, misogynistic, etc, etc), so let's get them fired. They deserve to feel all the 'pain' I feel because of it and more. It is a great thing if they get fired and their lives get ruined."

 

[Dragonbums]

Some of us don't have anything to do with tumblr.

So, just what the flying fuck is a "social justice movement" and what does it have to do with Johnny Depp, crackers and Penny Arcade?

Social Justice is kind of a tumblr movement (however not limited to tumblr) where bloggers would raise social awareness about issues minorities, age groups, genders,sexual orientation, sexual identification and countries face that most people are unaware of that.
In theory and in practice it's not an inherently bad thing. Especially when it brings these things to light.
However recently it's starting to become a vicious mob mentality where when one user or a couple speaks out of ignorance or have an opposing view point, they attack dog the person.

It has to do with Mike in a sense because he recently made a rather ignorant comment about transgender people on Twitter. Although he later apologized for it and admitted that he didn't really know what he was talking about, between the original tweet and the comment he was called all sorts of derogatory names, blasted all over the place, and being generally malicious instead of rationally explaining it to him.

It has to do with Johnny Depp indirectly because he is apparently going to be cast as a Native American in some Disney(?) movie and during an interview he said that Native Americans are still warriors.
An actual Native American who took issue to this gave his life story about living as a true Native American in this day and age and that Depp has no standing on talking about being a warrior because he doesn't truly understand what it is to be a Native American because he is just some rich white celebrity that doesn't understand struggle. Which is fair enough. One should not talk about a native people if he doesn't really understand them.
However the notes under the post were basically malicious towards Depp.
I'm not defending the guy or anything, but you can't really say it's Johnny Depp is being a shit because Disney hired him for a role.

Yeah. I guess that's the gist of it.

 

[Sonic Doctor]

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I had no idea it went to serious real life consequences. The most I've seen is simply 3,000 + notes all telling said person that they are a little shit.

Well, I'm more talking about the real world events that end up in internet spotlight, where people fighting for social justice, for equality, take to the internet pulpit and end up getting people fired because of all the bad light that people that slip up get shined upon them.

Considering your join date, you missed the whole Donglegate incident that screwed up two guys lives in the tech world, and one got fired.

I'll leave this video to explain, because I don't have time to write out several paragraphs more than I already have in this thread.


I know there are people that don't particularly like this youtuber, but I for one agree with points he makes in the video.

Suffice it to say, I think such over reactions by feminists do more harm than good. Same goes for overreactions when it comes to situations where race is involved. If it ruins people's lives for no good reason, then the movement has a great deal of work to do to recover and be seen in a flattering light.