Where were the Avengers/SHIELD in Iron Man 3?

chozo_hybrid

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Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
I spent that whole last part of the film looking for something like that. Would have been awesome.
 

theshadavid

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THOR - Asgard
Hulk - Hiding, working.
Captain America - Probably in Iran or something doing military stuff.
SHIELD - I can honestly say that I can imagine Samuel Jackson saying "Tony's got this covered."
 

irmasterlol

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The stakes never reached a level that would require S.H.I.E.L.D. or the other Avengers to get involved. This was Stark's personal battle. Besides, a major point in The Avengers was that they could only be assembled in times of desperation.
 

Falseprophet

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Frankly, when they thought the Mandarin was just another terrorist blowing things up here and there, he was too small fry for SHIELD to get involved. SHIELD deals with super-powered threats like Asgardians and the Hulk and the Tesseract, not demagogues with a couple of zealots and video cameras. They were clearly monitoring the Mandarin just in case, so there was intel for Tony to hack. But there was no indication Mandarin was anything more than just another terrorist, making it the job of mundane intelligence, law enforcement, and military agencies to get him, not SHIELD's. By the time Air Force One was attacked, it was already too late for SHIELD to get involved.

Also, while SHIELD came across as an American agency when they were first introduced in Iron Man 1, the Avengers suggested they were an international organization. If the latter's the case, maybe they don't have an automatic mandate to intervene in partner nations' internal affairs when no superpowers or extraterrestrials are evident.
 

Snotnarok

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chozo_hybrid said:
Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
I spent that whole last part of the film looking for something like that. Would have been awesome.
They were probably trying to avoid diverting attention to a series that fell flat on it's face on the third installment and trying to kick that reboot out as fast as possible
 

Winnosh

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Shocksplicer said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Same reason as War Machine wasn't in The Avengers, or the Eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom - it would make a shorter movie. Any other explanation is more of an excuse than an explanation. Plausible, perhaps, but we all know why they REALLY weren't in the movie.
No, there's a REASON the eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom.
The Avengers aren't in Iron Man 3 because it's Iron Man's movie, and they're all reasonably high profile actors at this point.
Lets not get into that whole Eagles thing. It would be a terrible Idea if the Eagles had gotten involved and tried to carry Frodo. We'd most likely have ended up with an Eagle Dark lord.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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Shocksplicer said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Same reason as War Machine wasn't in The Avengers, or the Eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom - it would make a shorter movie. Any other explanation is more of an excuse than an explanation. Plausible, perhaps, but we all know why they REALLY weren't in the movie.
No, there's a REASON the eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom.
And what would that REASON be, my liege?
 

Orks da best

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Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
chozo_hybrid said:
Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
I spent that whole last part of the film looking for something like that. Would have been awesome.
The Truth is much simpler... Marvel doesn't have the movie copyrights to spider-man, they couldn't use him so much as a cameo unless they get the movie copyrights from paramount.

Sad but true.
 

F-I-D-O

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Snotnarok said:
chozo_hybrid said:
Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
I spent that whole last part of the film looking for something like that. Would have been awesome.
They were probably trying to avoid diverting attention to a series that fell flat on it's face on the third installment and trying to kick that reboot out as fast as possible
Marvel Studios also doesn't have the rights to put Spiderman on the screen (I believe 20th Century Fox does). If something as blatant as a guy being webbed up had appeared, then they could have faced a lawsuit.
I imagine Marvel studios doesn't care how the Spiderman movies went, and is hoping they just stop making them so the rights return to Marvel.

OT:
SHIELD is international, and a couple explosions targeting America can't really warrant investigation by the recovering agency. Remember, the helicarrier was HEAVILY damaged, and they lost a lot of agents.
Thor is in Asgard. This much is explained in Avengers. It takes a lot of energy to send him to Earth (due to no Bifrost bridge), and Odi probably wouldn't care about an Earth terrorist.
Captain America - no offense to him, but he's not going to be much help in here. He's not a detective, and he couldn't have gone toe-to-toe with the bad-guys henchman. I imagine he's probably somewhere in Iraq. Iron Patriot was kind of being more effective in hunting down the villains than Cap could have been.
Hulk is shown at the end, and I doubt he wants to expose himself again. He was rather proud of his hulk-less streak in Avengers.
 

F-I-D-O

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Johnny Novgorod said:
Shocksplicer said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Same reason as War Machine wasn't in The Avengers, or the Eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom - it would make a shorter movie. Any other explanation is more of an excuse than an explanation. Plausible, perhaps, but we all know why they REALLY weren't in the movie.
No, there's a REASON the eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom.
And what would that REASON be, my liege?
Eagles - very proud, very egotistical creatures (they exemplify there traits more than any other race in the world).
You want to put the ring that corrupted Boromir so fast next to them?
Also, they're not a taxi system. The Eagles are creatures with free will. They help because they want to, not because they have to.
And I would imagine there's a couple archers in Mordor. And eagles aren't exactly subtle. A well aimed trebuchet, ballista, or simply a hail of arrows could take down an Eagle carrying a few hobbits. Oh, and Nazgul.
Oh, and it wouldn't be the most accurate thing to drop a ring from over Mount Doom. That's something where you want to make damn sure it lands in the lava.
 

sammysoso

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I think that's what Stark's early conversation with Rhodes was for. Rhodes indicated that the US government was hesitant to ask for Iron Man's help because that could interfere with potential SHIELD (global) work.

So there is a distinction between domestic events and global events (which would require Avengers attention). That's kind of weak, but that's just something that we're probably going to have to let go, unless they REALLY screw up.
 

KeyMaster45

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Tomaius said:
Anyone else think it was odd that it was a Christmas movie?
I know right? Every time we were reminded that it was Christmas I got yanked out of the movie (mentally) to ponder why they didn't just make it a December release. The only other explanation I could figure was that the director wanted to remind us of Die Hard. Which in a way the plot of the movie kinda harkened back to it.
Disguise the real plot with phony terrorism so nobody realizes it's all about making/stealing tons of money. Still, the big reveal was priceless.

Outside of that farfetched hypothesis I got nothing. It seems to have been Christmas simply because at some point somebody wanted the movie to take place during it.
 

Johnny Novgorod

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F-I-D-O said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Shocksplicer said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Same reason as War Machine wasn't in The Avengers, or the Eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom - it would make a shorter movie. Any other explanation is more of an excuse than an explanation. Plausible, perhaps, but we all know why they REALLY weren't in the movie.
No, there's a REASON the eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom.
And what would that REASON be, my liege?
Eagles - very proud, very egotistical creatures (they exemplify there traits more than any other race in the world).
You want to put the ring that corrupted Boromir so fast next to them?
Also, they're not a taxi system. The Eagles are creatures with free will. They help because they want to, not because they have to.
And I would imagine there's a couple archers in Mordor. And eagles aren't exactly subtle. A well aimed trebuchet, ballista, or simply a hail of arrows could take down an Eagle carrying a few hobbits. Oh, and Nazgul.
Oh, and it wouldn't be the most accurate thing to drop a ring from over Mount Doom. That's something where you want to make damn sure it lands in the lava.
I dunno, they were more or less a taxi system in The Hobbit two or three times. And they do tend to show up in the nick of time at the end of both stories.
 

Shocksplicer

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Johnny Novgorod said:
F-I-D-O said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Shocksplicer said:
Johnny Novgorod said:
Same reason as War Machine wasn't in The Avengers, or the Eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom - it would make a shorter movie. Any other explanation is more of an excuse than an explanation. Plausible, perhaps, but we all know why they REALLY weren't in the movie.
No, there's a REASON the eagles didn't fly the fellowship to Mount Doom.
And what would that REASON be, my liege?
Eagles - very proud, very egotistical creatures (they exemplify there traits more than any other race in the world).
You want to put the ring that corrupted Boromir so fast next to them?
Also, they're not a taxi system. The Eagles are creatures with free will. They help because they want to, not because they have to.
And I would imagine there's a couple archers in Mordor. And eagles aren't exactly subtle. A well aimed trebuchet, ballista, or simply a hail of arrows could take down an Eagle carrying a few hobbits. Oh, and Nazgul.
Oh, and it wouldn't be the most accurate thing to drop a ring from over Mount Doom. That's something where you want to make damn sure it lands in the lava.
I dunno, they were more or less a taxi system in The Hobbit two or three times. And they do tend to show up in the nick of time at the end of both stories.
Either way, there's your reasons. Cheers F-I-D-O.
 

an annoyed writer

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I think this is going to kinda be explained in Captain America: The Winter Soldier, which takes place in roughly the same time period. They're also going to be introducing a few new characters to the melting pot, so SHIELD might be dealing with them.
 

Baron von Blitztank

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My guessing is that;

A) SHIELD trusted Tony and was confident that he was able to get the job done on his own. Plus he had the help of Rhodes which probably made it less of a priority.

B) The other Avengers were busy doing their own things which were happening at the same time as Iron Man 3, which will probably prove true with Thor: The Dark World and Captain America: The Winter Soldier.

C) SHIELD was busy trying to get new members/friends, which sounds likely given that The Guardians of The Galaxy are going to make an appearance and with the rumors of an Ant-Man and Doctor Strange movie.
 

Calibanbutcher

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j-e-f-f-e-r-s said:
Gizmo1990 said:
I went to see The Hobbit last night (Loved it!) and seeing the eagles made me think of the Lord of the Rings plot hole (Why they did not just catch a ride on them to Mordor) but it got me and my friends thinking on what was the biggest/ worst plot hole.
TheKasp said:
Then why the heck were the eagles capable of entering the territory without problems in the end?
Don't forget that the followship has a wizard and master bowmen, those fancy flying mounts are surely vulnerable to arrows in the eyes as well as some protective magic from Gandalf (also a ringbearer). Heck, why not even ask Radagast for help as well. Screaching? Have fun screaching with arrows in your throat. Oh, and we also can't hear you over Gandalfs awesome magic.
Right, I'm going to end this 'Eagles' nonsense right here and now. The Eagles are not a plot hole in Lord Of The Rings, for the following reason. The following is a picture of Sauron as represented in the LOTR films:


While the books imply that Sauron is more of a metaphorical eye than a literal fiery one, both the film and the book share the same thing in common: to be caught directly in Sauron's gaze is to suffer the biggest case of mind-rape this side of Cthulhu. Having the Dark Lord stare at you is akin to having your soul stripped from its bones. Lest we forget, in the film adaption of Fellowship, Frodo twice is caught in Sauron's gaze, and each time it reduces him to the state of a rabbit caught in the headlights. The second time, he damn near throws himself off the top of a watchtower to escape Sauron's glare.



Remember this scene?

Additionally, in the books (and partly in ROTK) we get even more insight into the effect Sauron's presence has on mortals. Pippin looks into the Palantir, gets directly caught in Sauron's presence, and has a mental breakdown as a result. When they find him, he's a complete wreck. Only Gandalf's semi-telepathic abilities are able to bring him back to any kind of normalcy, though even recollecting the experience is incredibly painful for him thereafter. Similarly, Lord Denethor was also ensnared by Sauron using a palantir, and went completely mad and devoid of hope as a result. Aragorn looks into the Palantir to challenge Sauron, and in his own words the Dark Lord nearly breaks him. The others feel that the encounter prematurely ages him somewhat. Saruman looked into the palantir, and was so driven to despair by Sauron that he felt the only viable option was to end up siding with the big bad.

That is the effect that being looked at by Sauron has. The strongest willed characters in the story are driven to the point of madness, and lesser characters are completely crushed by his presence. If there is one golden rule in Lord Of The Rings, it is do not directly attract Sauron's attention, as he will rape your mind and utterly destroy you.

So with that in mind, which do you think is a better option? Laying low, and trying to sneak to Mt Doom without catching his attention? Or hopping on the back of the largest winged creatures in Middle Earth, and flying in a straight line directly towards the one character who will turn your mind into sushi just by looking at you'? Bearing in mind that the object that you're supposed to be destroying is actively trying to be found, and will attract Sauron's attention by itself first chance it gets, though it isn't exactly going to be hard for him to miss a posse of giant frickin' eagles headed straight towards him.

All of this is regardless of the fact that he has Fell Beasts and other creatures/weapons to launch at the Eagles in response (the Witch King by himself would be able to flay the minds of any posse of eagles stupid enough to head in his direction, whether or not they bring Gandalf with him), and that as soon as he realises they're heading towards Mordor, rather than say Minas Tirith, he can just send a battalion of Orcs to the top of Mt Doom (remember that he specifically keeps a path clear to the top of the mountain at all times) and have them wait there for the eagles to arrive. Flying directly towards Mordor is stupid in and of itself, simply because Frodo and co would have to spend at least several hours flying directly into Sauron's line of sight, and try to not let their minds turn to complete porridge as a result.

If the Fellowship didn't want to get corrupted, driven to despair or utterly mentally broken as a result of entering a staring contest with Sauron, then trying to avoid line of sight and going the sneaky walking route was the only option. Anything else, including trying to hitch a lift with the Eagles, would have utterly failed due to Sauron's ability to break minds from afar.

Also, the only reason the Ring even got destroyed was because Gollum stole it at the last minute and ended up falling in himself. The whole point was that, when it came to it, Frodo couldn't willingly give it up, and it took an act of god for the thing to be destroyed. If they hypothetically did get to Mt Doom via Eagle transit, and Frodo decided to keep it for himself... how would the Ring get destroyed then? Bearing in mind that a posse of Eagles can't exactly hang about in Mordor under Sauron's gaze while working out what to do next.

If you want a real plot hole from the films, consider this one instead: In The Two Towers, when Frodo and Sam get sidetracked in Osgiliath (ugh!), Frodo gets ambushed by a Nazgul, and in a moment of weird behaviour, actually offers the Ring to the Nazgul hovering before him. The damn thing literally gets within two inches of snapping the Ring back for Sauron.

In Return of The King, Pippin looks into the Palantir, and ends up being tormented by Sauron. According to Gandalf and Merry, Sauron now believes that Pippin has the Ring, and is going to lash out at Minas Tirith pre-emptively as a result.

...except, why would Sauron think that Pippin has the ring in Rohan/Isengard, when he knows for a fact that the Ringbearer was in Osgiliath, the other side of Minas Tirith? His own Nazgul have discovered that Frodo has cleared the distance from Rohan, has ended up on the other side of Minas Tirith and is actually heading his way to Mordor via Osgiliath? Why would Sauron want to attack Minas Tirith when his own emissaries have discovered that Frodo's already cleared past it, and is on his way eastwards?

In the book, Frodo never gets discovered anywhere near Osgiliath, and Sauron's move to attack Gondor comes as result of misdirection from Aragorn fooling him into thinking he has the Ring, and is going to go on the offensive with it. Sauron thinks Isildur's Heir is now the biggest threat, and moves to wipe out Gondor before Aragorn can unite its people under his banner, and use the Ring to assault Mordor. In the film? None of that happens, so none of Sauron's offensive makes any sense. If the Nazgul had seen Frodo in Osgiliath, then surely he would have spent all his resources in capturing Osgiliath, and then from there ascertaining exactly where Frodo went with the Ring, rather than simply assuming Frodo went back to Minas Tirith after already (seemingly) come from there. The whole thing is a mish-mash of illogical tactics and reasoning which don't bear up to scrutiny.

That's a plot hole worth looking at.


One of my favourite quotes on the escapist.
If this doesn't clear things up, nothing will.
 

StormShaun

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Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
That would of been cool.
Though if I had to imagine it, they would use the NEW Spider-Man who has only had one movies and really hasn't gained speed yet.

Hopefully they will think about it in the future. :D
 

Ed130 The Vanguard

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Snotnarok said:
Better question, where was Spiderman in the Avengers? I mean it was New York right? Couldn't even show one badguy webbed up as like a lil' easteregg thing?
Because the Spiderman movie rights is Sony's not Marvel studios at this point.

Remember Marvel sold those (and X-men's) rights off looong before Iron Man and the whole interconnected continuity idea came along and as long as the current right holders produce movies that use the licences and not sit on them Marvel can't use those characters.
 

Dryk

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Well from everyone else's perspective the Mandarin is just your average terrorist, if a little more successful. Tony would have had to have told someone that he had superpowered henchmen before other heroes would've gotten involved and asking for help like that's not really his style.