White male protagonists in video games

[endtherapture]

So I've recently seen some people playing "Male protagonist" bingo and it strikes me as an utterly pointless exercise. Here's one for our beloved Commander Shepard:

I get the point, it's supposed to highlight how male protagonists are boring and rubbish etc. but I find for me that it is the quality of the writing instead of the characteristics that are held that is more important for me. One of my favourite characters in gaming, Geralt of Rivia, ticks a whole load of these boxes but he's an interesting character. Just because they have these characteristics doesn't make the quality bad or somehow boring, and making one of these characters black or a woman doesn't automatically make them better.

Whilst I agree we could possibly use some more diversity in video games, diversity for diversity's sake is not an instant fix-all, and the quality of the writing is more important than if the protagonist is white or a man.

Also there's this hilarious one in which Samus actually is bingo:

 

[Gladion]

The point of these sorts of spreadsheets (or the Bechdel test for example) is to highlight general tendencies in media landscapes, not to discriminate against singular characters.

On your point of diversity for its own sake: Well... it may sound counter-intuitive at first, but if you think about it, creating more diverse characters with the intent of just having more diverse characters pretty much automatically leads to more interesting characters. That is because when you force yourself to do new stuff (like writing characters), you generall get better at it, tying back to your (correct) point that the quality of writing is extremely important in this matter. Even if you did not set out from the beginning to have a cast of different skin colors or whatnot, that does not mean the final product doesn't benefit from it.

By the way, Geralt is a character from literature. You probably knew that, I just had to point it out for my own sanity's sake.

 

[Dizchu]

I hate how people call Commander Shepard a "straight white male" character.

No. Just. No.

The game begins WITH A GOD DAMN CHARACTER CREATION SCREEN.

Shephard can be a woman, can be black, can be ginger, can have a variety of face shapes and hairstyles. Anyone that claims that Commander Shephard is the white, generic-looking guy on the promotional material has obviously not played the game.

You might as well say that the main character of Skyrim is a brooding, muscly man with a horned helmet and a scowl.

UGH.

 

[Lightspeaker]

I hate how people call Commander Shephard a "straight white male" character.

No. Just. No.

The game begins WITH A GOD DAMN CHARACTER CREATION SCREEN.

I fairly regularly forget that male Commander Shepard even exists. Largely because my Shepard is and always has been female. >_>

So yeah, agree with this. Its kinda stretching the point when people yell that a character is "standard videogame protagonist" when you have a character creation system.

 

[CritialGaming]

I would also like to point out that called Shepard a "Straight white male" is also retarded because you can easily make him a "gay/straight/bi white/black/red male/female" character.

 

[Casual Shinji]

I think it's worth noting that many of these discriptions are simply tied to the action genre rather than the white male protagonist. You take Lara Croft from Tomb Raider '13 and you'll be highlighting a lot of these panels as well;

- Killing spree (humans)... check.
- Blasé about killing... check.
- Loner... check.
- White... check.
- No patience for politics... check.
- Guns, lots of guns... check.
- Brooding... check.
- Psychological problems... check
- Gritty reboot... check.

Not that gaming can't use a good dose of diversity, but this seems like someone trying to be clever without getting the facts straight.

 

[hybridial]

On your point of diversity for its own sake: Well... it may sound counter-intuitive at first, but if you think about it, creating more diverse characters with the intent of just having more diverse characters pretty much automatically leads to more interesting characters. That is because when you force yourself to do new stuff (like writing characters), you generall get better at it, tying back to your (correct) point that the quality of writing is extremely important in this matter. Even if you did not set out from the beginning to have a cast of different skin colors or whatnot, that does not mean the final product doesn't benefit from it.

I think people should work the other way on the problem. Lets just say "I want to have a cast of interesting characters". Then do that. Don't "force" anything, just explore possibilities. The end result will be the same.

I think trying to "force" anything of that nature if where you'll probably fuck up and offend people. At least if you're thinking about diversity over writing an interesting character.

 

[SKBPinkie]

Shepard was quite possibly the dumbest example for this so-called test. He/she an be anyone, any color, differing backgrounds, etc. etc.

And yes, we do need more diversity in gaming, but let's not invent some meaningless tests to make that point.

P.S. I'm an Indian dude. You almost never see Indian people in gaming. Would I appreciate having some here and there? Absolutely. Do I really need it, though? No, I've been able to connect with most well written protagonists despite their race, gender, what have you.

 

[Erttheking]

I hate how people call Commander Shepard a "straight white male" character.

No. Just. No.

The game begins WITH A GOD DAMN CHARACTER CREATION SCREEN.

Shephard can be a woman, can be black, can be ginger, can have a variety of face shapes and hairstyles. Anyone that claims that Commander Shephard is the white, generic-looking guy on the promotional material has obviously not played the game.

You might as well say that the main character of Skyrim is a brooding, muscly man with a horned helmet and a scowl.

UGH.

Ehhhhhhhhhh

Frankly I remember back around Mass Effect three that we had to pull fucking teeth with Bioware in order to get them to release a trailer that actually had a female Shepard in it. Commander Shepard CAN be anything. But white male mid 30s brown haired heterosexual Shepard (A few of the trailers for ME3 had him kissing Ash) is the face of the franchise. No real getting around that.

 

[spartan231490]

Congratulations, you have correctly deduced that making everything about race misses the point(and is racist besides). Have a "not a racist" badge, and go enjoy your video games about interesting people, regardless of their skin color/gender/species, or whatever else the extremists are whining about today.

 

[Dizchu]

Frankly I remember back around Mass Effect three that we had to pull fucking teeth with Bioware in order to get them to release a trailer that actually had a female Shepard in it. Commander Shepard CAN be anything. But white male mid 30s brown haired heterosexual Shepard (A few of the trailers for ME3 had him kissing Ash) is the face of the franchise. No real getting around that.

But does that mean the problem is with the marketing rather than the game itself? If I recall correctly, the percentage of people that play FemShep is quite small, but Bioware has continuously put the extra effort in to include her. When "culture critics" and "social justice advocates" dismiss efforts like these for some cheap outrage, it just comes across as a slap in the face to their own causes.

As people always say, "you can't judge a book by its cover". Same goes for Bioshock Infinite, actually. We all know how ridiculous the marketing was for that, yet the game itself is hardly reflective of that.

 

[Zhukov]

One of my favourite characters in gaming, Geralt of Rivia, ticks a whole load of these boxes but he's an interesting character.

Ugh.

Gonne be "that guy" here.

If fricken Geralt is you counter-example then consider me aggressively unconvinced.

He's hardly the worst-of-the-worst, but he's nigh on emotionaless and utterly free of charisma or charm or... much of anything. I can't really think of any solid character traits he possesses other than generic action game bravery and being (potentially) a bit of a womanizer. You could replace him with basically any dude with a functioning penis and a good sword arm.

That aside, I take your point.

Thing is, the idea of these "bingo games" is to point out the trends, not condemn every example of those trends. However, you can't point out a trend without pointing at examples of said trend.

If I have to choose between a poorly written character who's utterly indistinguishable from every other gormless leading man and a poorly written character who at least looks or acts a bit different, I'll take the latter any day. (For example, I've always wanted to play a game with an unapologetic coward for a protagonist.)

If there's nothing but porridge on the menu, even a bowl of rice will seem novel.

 

[Vigormortis]

So, um....what does it mean if I keep getting bingo when I apply many of the female protagonists seen in gaming to the test?

Is there a point to this thing or is this yet another case of Jonathan McIntosh being a useless shit?

 

[endtherapture]

One of my favourite characters in gaming, Geralt of Rivia, ticks a whole load of these boxes but he's an interesting character.

Ugh.

Gonne be "that guy" here.

If fricken Geralt is you counter-example then consider me aggressively unconvinced.

He's hardly the worst-of-the-worst, but he's nigh on emotionaless and utterly free of charisma or charm or... much of anything. I can't really think of any solid character traits he possesses other than generic action game bravery and being (potentially) a bit of a womanizer. You could replace him with basically any dude with a functioning penis and a good sword arm.

That aside, I take your point.

Thing is, the idea of these "bingo games" is to point out the trends, not condemn every example of those trends. However, you can't point out a trend without pointing at examples of said trend.

If I have to choose between a poorly written character who's utterly indistinguishable from every other gormless leading man and a poorly written character who at least looks or acts a bit different, I'll take the latter any day.

If there's nothing but porridge on the menu, even a bowl of rice will seem novel.

Is it you that hates The Witcher games with a huge passion on this forum? It might well be.

Geralt is a pretty deep character with some great morals when you really start analysing him and looking into the experiences and story which made him. On the outside he might be the typical white protagonist, but he's got some great characterisation and a variety of relationships shown off in the books and the games and is an example of one of these characters being written well.

I think he's pretty funny anyway, he's got a great dry sense of humour and good sarcasm (which I appreciate as a British person), but if you're who I think you are and aggressively hate these games, I'm gonna have to consider your opinion worthless sorry (more due to your general opinion of the games than because of anything you are saying)

Quality of writing > standard character archetypes. Geralt is good writing and ticks a load of these boxes, which illustrates my point well.

 

[Erttheking]

Frankly I remember back around Mass Effect three that we had to pull fucking teeth with Bioware in order to get them to release a trailer that actually had a female Shepard in it. Commander Shepard CAN be anything. But white male mid 30s brown haired heterosexual Shepard (A few of the trailers for ME3 had him kissing Ash) is the face of the franchise. No real getting around that.

But does that mean the problem is with the marketing rather than the game itself? If I recall correctly, the percentage of people that play FemShep is quite small, but Bioware has continuously put the extra effort in to include her. When "culture critics" and "social justice advocates" dismiss efforts like these for some cheap outrage, it just comes across as a slap in the face to their own causes.

As people always say, "you can't judge a book by its cover". Same goes for Bioshock Infinite, actually. We all know how ridiculous the marketing was for that, yet the game itself is hardly reflective of that.

I find that it reflects the mindset of the industry. I have little doubt that they thought that the white male would sell the game better. There's probably a reason why even when they put out the flippable cover, they had the female on the back. Don't get me wrong, Bioware itself did a lot, the problem is that I fell like EA got its claws in and did some questionable things. Question. Why does the thousand year old warrior monk who can't have sex ever have her tits out and is walking around in high heels? I feel like that's because Mass Effect 2 was trying to be more "mainstream" hence the Gears of War like combat system. I liked that combat system, but it really shows what people in positions of power do in order to make more money. Also, I get where you're coming from, I really do, hard work should be met with praise, and to an extent I agree, but sometimes people try hard and mess up, and when that happens you gotta give the cold hard honest truth. Naoto in Persona 4 had a sub-plot about gender identity, which was very ambitious but...well...despite an impressive build up the ending left a bad taste in my mouth. The devs tried hard, of that I have little doubt, but they still messed up.

Yes, but the cover can still tell us some things. After all the point of the cover is to draw in, so it should say something when the cover is made to not really be reflective of its content.

 

[Zhukov]

Geralt is a pretty deep character with some great morals when you really start analysing him and looking into the experiences and story which made him. On the outside he might be the typical white protagonist, but he's got some great characterisation and a variety of relationships shown off in the books and the games and is an example of one of these characters being written well.

That made me laugh out loud.

Look mate, if you think Geralt is an example of brilliant writing then our perspectives are too far apart to have any sort of meaningful discussion on this topic.

To me, being told that Geralt is a good character is like being told that boiled horse shit makes good soup. Obviously taste is subjective, but that taste is beyond my ability to understand.

 

[endtherapture]

Geralt is a pretty deep character with some great morals when you really start analysing him and looking into the experiences and story which made him. On the outside he might be the typical white protagonist, but he's got some great characterisation and a variety of relationships shown off in the books and the games and is an example of one of these characters being written well.

That made me laugh out loud.

Look mate, if you think Geralt is an example of brilliant writing then our perspectives are too far apart to have any sort of meaningful discussion on this topic.

To me, being told that Geralt is a good character is like being told that boiled horse shit makes good soup. Obviously taste is subjective, but that taste is beyond my ability to understand.

Leave the thread then if you've got nothing constructive to add other than "!!!!Haha the Witcher is dog Shit!!! People are idiots!!!! "

 

[Zhukov]

Geralt is a pretty deep character with some great morals when you really start analysing him and looking into the experiences and story which made him. On the outside he might be the typical white protagonist, but he's got some great characterisation and a variety of relationships shown off in the books and the games and is an example of one of these characters being written well.

That made me laugh out loud.

Look mate, if you think Geralt is an example of brilliant writing then our perspectives are too far apart to have any sort of meaningful discussion on this topic.

To me, being told that Geralt is a good character is like being told that boiled horse shit makes good soup. Obviously taste is subjective, but that taste is beyond my ability to understand.

Leave the thread then if you've got nothing constructive to add other than "!!!!Haha the Witcher is dog Shit!!! People are idiots!!!! "

I did contribute more than that.

Second half of my first post. Talking about the subject at hand without any mention of The Witcher.

Also, please quote where I said "people are idiots" or anything to that effect.

 

[Phasmal]

(For example, I've always wanted to play a game with an unapologetic coward for a protagonist.)

If there's nothing but porridge on the menu, even a bowl of rice will seem novel.

That sounds like a great idea. For some reason I'm picturing a stealth game in which the most you can do if you get seen is throw things and run away making terrified sobbing noises.

I did actually try and think of any games with cowardly protagonists and I came up with nothing. Admittedly I haven't played every game in existence so there could be some, though.

EDIT: Oh I forgot to address the main topic.

OT: This card exists to point out trends, and if you're gonna try and convince me that Blando McWhite-dude isn't a trend in video games, excuse me while I throw my head back and laugh like a Musketeer.

 

[balladbird]

Nevermind all the social justice stuff, I'm just offended that they forgot to circle the "Supernatural Powers" square on that grid, considering Shepard can be a biotic.

Right? and if you play full-on renegade you commit more than one war crime while you're at it! I know SPECTRES are above all that but that's still technically criminal in my book.

as to the topic at hand, as has been stated, it's more about trends and pointing out the by-the-numbers boiler plate that gaming protagonists tend to be pressed from. One can argue it's useless, aside from being entertaining from a purely intellectual standpoint... and one would be more or less right. the bingo cards aren't even a new thing. been seeing them for months, and I'm not sure what all the hullabaloo against them is.

but then, the entire thing gamers have against dem evul SJWs is lost on me.