Why it is acceptable to criticize smokers, but not fat people?

CODE-D

New member
Feb 6, 2011
1,966
0
0
Jinjiro said:
CODE-D said:
Secondhand Fat doesnt cause others cancer.
This point, and other posts stating that 'there's no second-hand obesity', are LAUGHABLY naive. Eating habits and food choice are almost always passed onto you by other people, usually starting with your family. Obese parents pass on their bad choices to their kids, and someone already posted that having fat friends make you feel normal. Learning how to eat is something you are taught, not something you learn on your own, and it is entirely our responsibility to stop eating like idiots. Otherwise, each generation is going to be fatter and unhealthier than the last one.

I won't start ranting about smoking - the TL;DR version is 'pointless, smelly, deadly pacifiers for adults'. We should have outgrown that ridiculous habit decades ago, especially with the knowledge that you're basically paying to die sooner. Oh well.

Honestly though, neither obesity nor smoking pisses me off nearly as much as the amount of food that we waste. See this infographic [http://media.treehugger.com/assets/images/2011/10/world-food-crisis.gif.492x0_q85_crop-smart.jpg] - it's just shocking, especially when you realise that the nations that waste the most are also the fattest nations. Ridiculous.
Yeah thats why I stopped eating like a fatty when I grew up, didnt affect my friends bad habits and they didnt affect my eating healthy when we ate together so what you say holds no merit to me.
However smoking is way more addictive and hazardous and a parent who smokes in front of their kids(especially in a closed environment) is way more hazardous.
Being a little overweight due to eating habits is way better than being an everyday smoker.

BUT!!! I doubt the initial thought of this thread was families, it had to do more with public strangers. So again, being near a fat guy whos eating like a slob may actually deter you from eating more whereas theres nothin you can do about a smoker if theyre breathing their obnoxious smelly cancer fumes your way.

Also you brought up obese, thats the extreme. Whats the extreme of smoking, highly progressed cancer and irreversible damage to cardiovascular system, loss of taste and numb other sense and overall bad feeling until you get your next fix.
so whats your choice
 

Mallefunction

New member
Feb 17, 2011
906
0
0
Brawndo said:
FoolKiller said:
But here is a better question for you. What do you do for someone who is fat because they had a poor upbringing? Do they not require and deserve help losing/dealing with the weight?
I am all for helping people lose weight. I don't propose a campaign of making fun of fat people. But in order to be helped, you have to admit that you have a problem and be willing to change. This means some overweight and obese people need to stop acting like they are a protected class of citizens like racial minorities, and parents of fat children need to stop getting upset when the school nurse tells their children they need to stop drinking soda and start exercising.
Pretty much this. Although we definitely need to regulate fast food and unhealthy food more than we are right now. The fact that lobbyists were able to CONVINCE congress that pizza is a vegetable just because it has some tomato sauce (which is a goddamn fruit by the way, not a vegetable) is insane. Push these fuckers out of Washington and I can promise that we will start seeing real change in peoples' diets.
 

AwesomeFerret

New member
Apr 28, 2010
320
0
0
I mean to cause no offence here, but until the day that smokers can contain their smoke in their own damn mouths and stop blowing it out into everybody elses air, I'll continue to hold my, human rights act given opinion that they're essentially self harmers who feel the need to stab the people around about themselves aswell. Make of that what you will, but atleast obese people don't force feed me cancer by standing next to them. I apologise to any offended parties, but I believe that in a civilised debate, should, as with everybody else, have the right to express my opinion.
 

orangeban

New member
Nov 27, 2009
1,442
0
0
The Cheshire said:
I'm a slim smoker, I look so sexy freezing in the cold trying to light my fag outside the bar...

Anyway, no, I don't think it's fair. But not for fat people either! Just leave them the hell alone, for fucks sake, if I want to smoke and eat fat it's my fucking choice. But yes, as far as hypocrisy goes, if there is a tax for tobacco there should be a tax for fatty food, this is a point I have always done whenever one of the non-smoking whiney little annoying maggots comes to me whining about how I am forcing a tumour of lung cancer onto him. I am not, but hey, if I could, I would! One self-righteous moralist asshole less.

orangeban said:
Recently David Cameron chose not to tax fatty foods. Why? Because he understands that the main market for fatty foods are poor people, since fatty foods are cheaper. He didn't want to introduce a tax that mainly affected poor people. That is why fatty foods aren't taxed.
Now, we all know the British diet is fatty, but really, fatty products are only consumed by poor people? What, poor people can't afford to eat salad? Cause I'm poor and I don't spend much on food, but I still manage to keep a decent diet. Red meat and muffins and cakes are not exactly my idea of a budget meal!
I didn't say that poor people only eat fatty foods, or that fatty foods are only eaten by the poor. But the fact is, fatty foods (think microwave meals, ready meals, canned foods) are cheap. Also remember that poorer people spend a higher proportion of their money of food.

Shit though, I have embarrsed my self by saying that David Cameron didn't do. Totally slipped up, Cameron supports it, don't know why I thought otherwise. Here's a good quote against it though.

'Martin Paterson, the deputy director-general of the Food and Drink Federation, said: "A so-called 'fat tax' levied on specific food types would hit lower income families, be patronising to consumers, and would be a tax on choice. Many food products already attract VAT. A 'fat tax' would operate like a poll tax on food, penalising lower income families who spend a higher proportion of their income on food and drink."' [from the Telegraph]
 

Spolin

New member
Nov 22, 2010
12
0
0
PaulH said:
Spolin said:
Jegsimmons said:
and if anyone says "second hand smoke" i say, get the fuck over it. That shit is still being debated, and you have enough common sense to get the hell out of the room.
If by "still being debated" you mean there is scientific consensus that it is bad for your health, then yes.

Besides, not everyone can just "get the hell out of the room" when someone decides to light up next to them, not everyone has either the mobility to move or mental capacity to know they should move.
Scientific consensus eh?

That's funny, because what I read is that there is no significant connection between environmental tobacco smoke and mortality rates. That even if you work in a tobacco smoke heavy environment that you still only have 1/100000 of dying from tobacco smoke related causes. But what do I know? I've only read journals and studies about it.

Maybe there is some secret consensus that states, inequivocably, that tobacco smoke is out to get all of you lovely people on those oh so high horses ^_^
If what you've been reading are the "journals" and "studies" funded by the Tobacco companies to make themselves look better, then yes you may have found such claims.

However, those studies that had nothing to do with Tobacco companies have usually found some sort of significant negative connection. Heck, the very fact that inhaling passive smoke causes me to cough is pretty simple evidence that what I'm breathing in isn't terribly good for me.
 

The Cheshire

New member
May 10, 2011
110
0
0
orangeban said:
'Martin Paterson, the deputy director-general of the Food and Drink Federation, said: "A so-called 'fat tax' levied on specific food types would hit lower income families, be patronising to consumers, and would be a tax on choice. Many food products already attract VAT. A 'fat tax' would operate like a poll tax on food, penalising lower income families who spend a higher proportion of their income on food and drink."' [from the Telegraph]
OK, well, I am not an expert on how poor English families spend their money, so I can't really argue too much against that. My point is, fatty foods are still a choice you make consciously, like buying smokes, and unless healthy food is really expensive over there (not here) I can see no reason why poor families would be forced to take fatty food.

Then again, if the issue is that healthy diets cannot be afforded by poor people, then the problem is even larger. I basically live on pasta, frozen fish, salads, cereals and integral bread, none of these things are expensive here. Now, if these things are expensive in English and poor people can't afford them, then maybe that is a problem to tackle before even considering any taxes. It would probably save money on health, then again, I don't know how hospitals work in England, with Thatcher privatizing everything in the 80s I am unsure if Brits have social security or work American style. Either way, it's not fair.
 

Moonlight Butterfly

Be the Leaf
Mar 16, 2011
6,157
0
0
I'm personally just wondering in which universe the OP lives in?

Fat people have been ostracised and made fun of as far back as the plays of Aristophanes. Not entirely sure why he think smokers (which relatively have only recently been shunned) are worse off?

Bizarre.
 

WOPR

New member
Aug 18, 2010
1,912
0
0
Brawndo said:
because last I checked fat people don't commit negligent homicide every 32(?) seconds

You think that a medical professional would notice how deadly smoking is while being fat just means that your job (that you get PAID FOR) will be a little bit tougher because you live in a country where being thin (like me) means that it's virtually IMPOSSIBLE to find pants in your size (28x34) because the rest of the country is so dang fat

I personally kinda get ticked off at both, because COME ON PEOPLE
but the only time I out and out insult a fat person is when they're stuffing their face like an animal. Or in a more exact case, when two really obese women were yelling at a little 5 year old kid to "FINISH HER LUNCH!" when she was crying and saying that she was full (mind you that "dinner" was a Big Mac McDonald's meal)

Captcha - He byDisco

Hmm... let's get funky..?
 

Macrobstar

New member
Apr 28, 2010
896
0
0
JoesshittyOs said:
Food's necessary for survival. Some people just like to indulge a bit more.

There's really no reason to start smoking in the first place except for peer pressure/thinking it makes you look cool.

That's the way I look at it, and I'll even occasionally indulge in a cigar every once in a while.
Or that they enjoy it?
 

Daw

New member
Apr 6, 2009
19
0
0
A lot of overweight people aren't in control.
You make it sound like the choice is like taking off a piece of clothing, No its a complete life style change, Let alone the people who have medical reasons they are overweight.

What that money hopefully is doing is finding a way to really find out what is wrong with a persons body and why it is storing all the extra food as fat.
Then it can be addressed better than. "Lose weight fatty." Which is what your post sounds like.

Congrats for not being overweight, Maybe you have it lucky and can eat anything and you body will burn it off, Some people suffer from the other side of that, No matter what they eat it turns into fat.

Did you know children who don't get a lot of food when they are younger easily put on weight because the body is set in starvation mode, So the sickly kids who barely eat over in Africa would put on weight like crazy if they had a decent food intake, Would you attack them by saying.. "But it costs me!"


As for smoking, Drinking is very similar on those lines and i bet you drink often, As many people do.

I do not however i hate the taste of any kind of alcohol and i wouldn't want to drink often, I got over doing it when i was younger. (haven't drunk since i was 22, and am now 28.)

Should i say how people who drink cost us all money? they crash cars beat people more often cause abuse, Let alone destroy they're insides.

If you want to go on a "pick on somebody" hate rage perhaps look at hypocrites who believe they are perfect.



So here's my plan

We'll shoot everyone who does illegal drugs, Drinks or Smokes, Anyone who doesn't have a medical reason for being overweight, And the 5% of the population will have a much happier time.
 

orangeban

New member
Nov 27, 2009
1,442
0
0
The Cheshire said:
orangeban said:
'Martin Paterson, the deputy director-general of the Food and Drink Federation, said: "A so-called 'fat tax' levied on specific food types would hit lower income families, be patronising to consumers, and would be a tax on choice. Many food products already attract VAT. A 'fat tax' would operate like a poll tax on food, penalising lower income families who spend a higher proportion of their income on food and drink."' [from the Telegraph]
OK, well, I am not an expert on how poor English families spend their money, so I can't really argue too much against that. My point is, fatty foods are still a choice you make consciously, like buying smokes, and unless healthy food is really expensive over there (not here) I can see no reason why poor families would be forced to take fatty food.

Then again, if the issue is that healthy diets cannot be afforded by poor people, then the problem is even larger. I basically live on pasta, frozen fish, salads, cereals and integral bread, none of these things are expensive here. Now, if these things are expensive in English and poor people can't afford them, then maybe that is a problem to tackle before even considering any taxes. It would probably save money on health, then again, I don't know how hospitals work in England, with Thatcher privatizing everything in the 80s I am unsure if Brits have social security or work American style. Either way, it's not fair.
It's not that bad. The point is really that a fatty food tax would negatively affect poor people. Not make them starve or go bankrupt or anything, just cost them more money.

The way health care works in Britain is you have the NHS which provides health care for free and is funded by taxes, and there are various private hospitals you can go to as well.
 

PeterDawson

New member
Feb 10, 2009
299
0
0
Best answer I can think of is regulation. A big problem for some people is their life just doesn't allow for the level of exercise to help with any weight issues they may have, though of course diet is also an issue. Hell I still manage to hit the gym in spite of working over forty hours a week sitting on my rear end while eating very little junk food (pretty much only at parties) and I'm still overweight. Smoking, while incredibly addicting, is easier to deal with and can be harmful to others thus there's a stigma of slowly killing yourself and others. Being overweight, there's a lot more factors and not all could be within one's own control, as there's also medical issues. Hell if I remember right a US house bill to help give people an incentive to work-out more was killed by groups like the cancer and diabetic associations.
 

The Cheshire

New member
May 10, 2011
110
0
0
orangeban said:
It's not that bad. The point is really that a fatty food tax would negatively affect poor people. Not make them starve or go bankrupt or anything, just cost them more money.

The way health care works in Britain is you have the NHS which provides health care for free and is funded by taxes, and there are various private hospitals you can go to as well.
But see, that can be turned around too: if fatty food is more expensive, then poor people would have to eat healthy, thus saving both in health and money on the long run. Also, life is better when your ass is not twice the weight it's supposed to be. I have a very fat friend, for her it's very difficult to lift her ass of the chair, any kind of physical activity demands more effort.
 

Latinidiot

New member
Feb 19, 2009
2,216
0
0
FoolKiller said:
Personally I agree with you. The question is where and how would you draw the line. Smoking is an easy one.

But here is a better question for you. What do you do for someone who is fat because they had a poor upbringing? Do they not require and deserve help losing/dealing with the weight?
And people with parents who smoke? They are looked down upon as any other smoker. they had almost no choice, not more than people with bad upbringing in the food department. the main point is that the situation as it is now is not fair to the smokers.