Why it is acceptable to criticize smokers, but not fat people?

[Jessta]

It usually takes longer for someone to stop being fat than to stop smoking. Also, smoke stinks. The most a fat person could inconvenience another is by taking up extra space or food.

Or by getting their fat sweaty BO over everything in which case they kinda stink to.

The reason is because smokers get to look cool so they don't get to have the masses behind them as well!
Honestly I would rather have someone call me out and call me evil for smoking and stupid and all sorts of foul words then have them uncomfortably dance around the subject because they pity how overtly pathetic I am >_> Its kind of like how we can't call out retarded people even if they were driven retarded by a bad batch of acid or drinking to much booze, yet its perfectly fine for us to call out high school drop outs and those who just didn't give a damn to study.

Its pretty much the difference between looking down on someone or pitying them.

 

[SFR]

Whoa, you're not suppose to criticize fat people? Well, I've been doing it wrong.

 

[TheNaut131]

Well, I don't think fat people deserve any less criticism than smokers. I guess more people get on smokers because they seem like a more immediate issue to others. But that doesn't mean you can't call out someones fat if is is causing you problems.

I could go on and on, but I kinda want to raise a question here.

Whats the difference between being fat and just being bleh?

So we've got these guys:

Spoiler

You know, blob-like, slightly fluid, masses of living fat. They get treated like they're a legitimate health issue, have to use those mechanical roller carts grandmothers use in grocery stores.

Then you've got what I simply call bleh. Relatively the correct weight for their height and whatnot, can actually fucking walk, look pretty proportional to their bodies, but something is off. Maybe they look a bit thick here and there, have a bit of plump belly, yet still look relatively normal. That if you simply saw them walking down the street and someone asked you, "hey, does that person look fat to you", you'd have to stop and honestly think about. Or hell you might not really notice at first glance or at all? Sure, they may look like a bigger person, but they won't set off any immediate alarms.

Where am I going with this?

Well, being fat my not be as clear cut as suggested. Whereas smoking is obvious. Does either deserve less or more criticism? Honestly, who cares? If one is bothering me, I will react to it in the way I see fit. If it isn't bothering me, meh. I couldn't be bothered to give a fuck and go out of my way to yell or chastise someone who isn't doing anything illegal, immediately dangerous, or truly irritating thing if it isn't actually causing me problems.

 

[ydkwidrmw]

I've read a study that smokers over their life time are actually financially beneficial. While smokers will be a burden on the public health care system earlier in life, statistically they die decades earlier, freeing up other public services and social security for others.

It could be a similar situation for the obese.

Note: I think smoking is disgusting and hate that I have to put up with second hand smoke in public places.

 

[De Bureau]

Also, fast food is cheap. So, if you're working and getting paid a low income, and fast food is the only feasible way to eat in terms of time and money, then it's really not fair to judge them and blame them.

However, I do say Fuck The System for making it this way.

I have to disagree with this actually. Where I am (Ontario) and it may be different in other places, its noticeably cheaper to buy groceries and cook my own food. Compared to other restaurants, yes fast food is cheap, but people on low income (including myself) shouldn't be eating out regularly anyway.

Whenever I see friends wanting to eat fast food it has nothing to do with price and everything to do with their own laziness.

 

[NaramSuen]

The closest I can think of for fat people is if they sit next to you and "flab" over your sit. But then you're shit out of luck cause I will push you out of MY seat. Easy to fix, and doesn't really happen often. I rarely come across people fat enough to take two seats, let alone have them sit next to me.

You have never been stuck next to an obese person on a plane have you? There is no pushing them out of your seat then. Whenever I fly, my greatest fear is that I am going to get stuck next to someone who will "flab" over my seat.

 

[Murray Kitson]

The truth of the matter is that Obesity has now become the leading cause of preventable death in America. This is NOW a fact, two years ago, it was about even with smoking. So it is my belief that it IS appropriate to make fun of fatties.

Let me tell you all a story.
I was out for dinner with family, and after we ate I excused myself for a smoke. One person at the table took it upon them self to try to 'call me on it'. So I stated the above fact. She tried to say that mentioning things like that was taboo, but I went on to say that the same could be said about smoking. She gave her evidence that smoking was expensive, and I countered by saying that she likely spent more on excessive food than I did on tobacco. After a long conversation of me countering every one of her arguments with logic I proposed that for every 10lbs she lost, I would cut back by 1 cigarette a day. This meant if she could reach a healthy weight, I would be without smoking. And as long as she kept it off, I would not smoke. I was ready to follow through, but she refused. So I closed by saying that over eating was more dangerous because people were not willing to give it up in the long run.

 

[ConstantErasing]

Well I think part of it is that there is a bit more in the way of genetics and other factors outside ones control that could cause obesity while the same doesn't quite hold true for smoking. Also I think possibly the fact that rampant obesity is a bit newer of a problem than smoking and we haven't quite caught up. Personally I don't think they should be above criticism but I think I would be more likely to be polite and sensitive about it because unlike with smokers I am not breathing in an unhealthy and irritating side effects on behalf of an insensitive offender.

 

[Supah]

Actually if your wife had asthma I'd move. I'm an asshole but I'm not that kind of asshole. I'd gladly finish the smoke in my car. What pissed me off about this idiot parent was the fact that she had to walk directly away from her intended path to confront me. I know smoking is bad for myself and others, that's why I try to stay out of the way while I'm doing it. You would know that if you had actually finished reading my post, where I state that I would drive to the mountains to smoke a carton away from everyone else.

The real problem is you represent about 5% of smokers, the rest will gladly puff a cloud right in your face

 

[Murray Kitson]

The truth of the matter is that Obesity has now become the leading cause of preventable death in America. This is NOW a fact, two years ago, it was about even with smoking. So it is my belief that it IS appropriate to make fun of fatties.

So in other words you're saying: Fat people are more likely to die, so I should mock them.
That's not at all about a self-serving desire to be a dick. Because everyone knows mocking people is the best way to make the have better habits. Or not really. If you want to mock people do just say you want to be a dick instead of pretending it's for their own good.

Let me tell you all a story.
I was out for dinner with family, and after we ate I excused myself for a smoke. One person at the table took it upon them self to try to 'call me on it'. So I stated the above fact. She tried to say that mentioning things like that was taboo, but I went on to say that the same could be said about smoking. She gave her evidence that smoking was expensive, and I countered by saying that she likely spent more on excessive food than I did on tobacco. After a long conversation of me countering every one of her arguments with logic I proposed that for every 10lbs she lost, I would cut back by 1 cigarette a day. This meant if she could reach a healthy weight, I would be without smoking. And as long as she kept it off, I would not smoke. I was ready to follow through, but she refused. So I closed by saying that over eating was more dangerous because people were not willing to give it up in the long run.

I think the real conclusion to take from this is that you're easily swayed by a single example of anecdotal evidence. Which just says that you use bad logic.

Not what I am saying at all. But if they want to force a confrontation and start it, maybe fatties should look in the mirror first. Doesn't help that I am still in great shape regardless of my habits. I may not be able to run a marathon, but I can jog a mile easy enough. From time to time I even bike 150km in a day. I smoke because I enjoy it. If someone wants to eat because they enjoy it, I think they should. A little secret... I don't plan to live forever. But don't start a fight with me.

 

[NaramSuen]

The problem is that with the convenience of modern food, we don't have these dry months when we find less food. You would have to make the fast a yearly event. Like Muslims do. Otherwise you're promoting weight gain.

If you want to keep a steady weight then the best option is to stick to a schedule and an intake average.

I am not disagreeing with your opinion about a healthy eating schedule, but I thought I should point out that Muslims actually consume more calories during Ramadan. From what I have read, these so-called fasts are actually feasts with huge meals served every night after sunset and every morning before sunrise.

 

[Mooboo Magoo]

I haven't read the whole thread, so this is my response to the OP.

I do agree that there is an inconsistency, but weight issues are far more complicated than just people being lazy. The food that we eat is so heavily processed that, unless you have a lot of time on your hands and can cook everything you eat from raw, locally produced foods, you don't really have a choice in how healthy you eat. The biggest problem with diet is sodium content because it is being used to a huge extent in almost all processed foods.

I do respect your opinion of the inconsistencies in political correctness, because they do look odd to the casual observer, but I don't think you understand the impact of this on women. You talk about facebook pages like 'big women are beautiful' and cast them as simply championing their weight.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/-IdNkLW9rbes/TaAvnHc2tPI/AAAAAAAAACw/D3q4-q9ttvM/s320/photos-of-thin-and-fat-girls.jpg

Notice the name of that picture is 'photos of thin and fat girls'. That means the one of the right must be the fat girl. Women have a much larger range of body types than men and in this culture anyone who is not rail thin is seen as being fat or obese and, as far as I can tell, they tend to hold onto weight for biological reasons that do not exist in men (such as constantly fluctuating hormones caused by menstruation). The woman in that photo is not fat, but she will be called a fat girl because she does not fall into an extremely narrow view of what is healthy for a woman. If a man had the exact same body size as that woman he would be considered normal.

There are some people that revel in their weight, like anyone who shops at this site for any reason other than being a skinny hipster: http://www.fatguyshirts.com/

My point is that weight issues are far more complicated than smoking issues, and anytime you talk about weight you are necessarily talking about gender inequality because of perception differences in what constitutes as fat or thin. You are also necessarily talking about class issues because of higher obesity rates in poorer people (because of the aforementioned processed foods) and, by extension, a racial issue because of the higher percentage of minorities being impoverished.

Relative to weight, smoking is a simple issue. I haven't done the research on this but in my experience most people start smoking due to peer pressure in their early teen years and I imagine that in some cases this is entirely unavoidable for the individual to have any sort of a functional life (in those cases where gang mentality is prevalent, for example). The biggest difference between weight and smoking, though, is that despite smoking being a chemical dependency it is easier to quit because it doesn't really require any changes in lifestyle. I don't mean to belittle anyone's accomplishments in quitting, but I have met many more people who have quit smoking than people who overhauled their entire lifestyle to lose weight.

 

[NightHawk21]

I'm a poor college student with too much homework and a slow metabolism.

Healthy food is more than twice as expensive as trashy food. I can't afford to go to a gym, nor do I have four hours a week to go. I'm gaining weight because all my exercise comes from running between classes.

What do, OP? What do?

I doubt that bro. I'm a little overweight, but I know damn well that if I took some of the time I use to play videogames or screw around on the internet I could get into relatively fit state, and I'm in one of the most work-intensive programs in my university. Also buying your own food and making it by hand is less expensive than eating fast food (especially if your buying stuff at campus restaurants), its just more time consuming. Also any decent sized post secondary school has a gym open to its students for a very low fee.

Basically, what I'm getting at is I'm not going to preach to you to lose weight (shit its not like what I say is actually going to change your mind anyway), but don't make up excuses for your weight gain; you're just lieing to and hurting yourself.

Buying nutritious food cost more than buying crap, and I'm not talking fast food. I'm talking fruit, veggies and wholesome food versus frozen meals, snacks and instant meals. Not everyone is the same as you. During my university days I went to school then to work. There was no time for most things but to shuffle from one to the other. It's like you're prejudging how people operate without really knowing what they really do with their time. And I'm sorry not all schools have a gym. Mine didn't get one until last year.

I'm sure you find that buying produce is not generally more expensive than buying fast food. Sure over the course of 1 meal maybe, but I can make a sandwich, hamburger, wrap, or some sort of stir fry for a couple dollars and I'll have enough to last me 2-3 days. So ya maybe the cost to get say a big mac meal once is slightly less than it takes to buy groceries/ meal(I doubt it), but you'll get way more food out of your groceries then 1 big mac meal. Why do you assume I don't have a job, and as for the gym you'll notice that I said any decent sized post secondary school has a gym. Shit my high school had a gym for the students to use for like $20 dollars for all year admission (granted it wasn't big at all, but it was there).

Also no I don't think I'm prejudging. I've yet to meet a single person that regularly wakes up at 6 am, is out the door in an hour and either in class or at work (or in between) and gets home at 11 or 12 and goes to sleep. Sure I had to pull a schedule like that every once in a while, but its never consistent over any extended period of time 1-2 weeks at the max. So no I don't think I'm prejudging when I say that almost everyone can find some way to get some rudimentary exercise in their schedule.

 

[NightHawk21]

I'm a poor college student with too much homework and a slow metabolism.

Healthy food is more than twice as expensive as trashy food. I can't afford to go to a gym, nor do I have four hours a week to go. I'm gaining weight because all my exercise comes from running between classes.

What do, OP? What do?

I doubt that bro. I'm a little overweight, but I know damn well that if I took some of the time I use to play videogames or screw around on the internet I could get into relatively fit state, and I'm in one of the most work-intensive programs in my university. Also buying your own food and making it by hand is less expensive than eating fast food (especially if your buying stuff at campus restaurants), its just more time consuming. Also any decent sized post secondary school has a gym open to its students for a very low fee.

Basically, what I'm getting at is I'm not going to preach to you to lose weight (shit its not like what I say is actually going to change your mind anyway), but don't make up excuses for your weight gain; you're just lieing to and hurting yourself.

>implying I play games any more
>implying I don't try to make my own food
>implying there's ever room in the University gym (believe me, I've tried)
>implying that I'm a normal person who can actually finish homework in a reasonable time

I don't have to make up excuses, they're right there.

Never said you played games more then I did, that was a personal example since that's what I like to do in my free time. For all I know you read books, or sculpt ice statues, or build model trains.

You said, healthy food was more than twice as expensive. I'm simply pointing out that your wrong. I don't know if you try to make your own food, you never mentioned it. Again for all I know you're buying some burger at a health fitness place, resulting in twice the price.

Not sure what university you go, so I don't know how big your gym is so I can't really say. That wasn't the issue, you brought up price. Besides I can list of the top of my head at least 5 exercises for a decently well rounded workout that you can do without any equipment other than a bottle of water (to keep you hydrated) and some room.

Don't think I mentioned anything about homework. I was talking about pure school hours that I log in a week. Also I never mentioned anything about your homework. Also time management is very important so if you can't manage your time well enough to even do the necessities, then your right you won't have time to do anything after all the time you wasted.