Why the "big boobs" "absurd female design" still exists?

[nightmare_gorilla]

So, I have a question for everyone rattling their swords about dragon's crown and doa and whatever latest offender of feminine ideals is. Why does this design still persist?

apparently the overwhelming public opinion is that having attractive women just for the sake of having attractive women is crap, lazy, sexist, dumb, and probably gives you cancer. so if everyone hates it so much then why do they continue doing it? businesses aren't stupid MS took a look at the responces to xbox1 and did a 180. not because it was the right thing to do but because they wanted to move more xbox1's. so i'm asking you honestly, if it's so offensive and terrible, why buy the games. if dragon's crown is such a horrendous offender shouldn't it's sales be tanked? I'm not afraid to say I like my games containing absurdly large breasts and I don't mind my games containing small ones either but when given the choice between two totally identical female characters i'll pick the one who's more attractive to me and that means bigger T&A and more revealing clothing. i don't apologize for that and my buying trends reflect it. i'm a big fan of DOA not just for the skimpy clothes but the solid combat systems. Rumble Roses was one of the best pure wrestling systems I've ever laid hands on and yes having a buncha half naked women grabbing each other made the game more FUN, it doesn't add to the social value of the game sure but i play games to be entertained not to make a political statement. i think discussion is an important part of any issue but we've been talking about this since Mai shiranui was invented and subsequently patched into a nude version. since the days of super Nintendo 2d brawlers we've had endless discussions about it. and you know what, everything that can be said has been said. it's time to put up or shut up. if you find a games female design offensive DON'T BUY IT!!!! let the dollars and cents create the games of the future don't bemoan the plight of women in gaming for hours then rush out to buy the latest boob simulator only to post forum rage about it. just don't buy it. once they have your money you have approved of their game as much as they need you to. personally i'm more interested in using this on more offensive practices like online passes and restrictive drm but the principle is the same. we are the consumers we hold all power because we have the money we must make a conscious choice to give it to them.

i just read an article on kotaku about how horribly offensive the "red light district" is in the new Valhalla knights 3, the writer says and I quote "I found it repulsive Still, that didn't keep me from clocking in well over 120 hours of gameplay time." 120 hours into something he found repulsive....

we have to start doing better people, forum rage and flame wars are all fun for a laugh but in the end we are just fighting with each other. so i'm saying if you find the "sexism" in games repulsive but still buy the offensive ones. it's your fault. i'm no apologist I buy what I like and I like full bodied women. I like them more when they come partially unwrapped. saves my mind some time. so I buy things that appeal to me. and don't say there are no good choices in games for women. gameing is such a broad spectrum of styles and genre's there are games that appeal to ALL sensibilities. Last of us had a strong female character, anything with a character customization system usually lets you play a female. buy mass effect, buy things that you think have strong female role models.


who's dollars are worth more? the perverts like me or the straight laced do gooders. OPEN WALLETS AT TEN PACES! FIGHT!

 

[IllumInaTIma]

I have a feeling that people tend to concentrate on wrong side of the argument. I don't find big boobs and ass and revealing clothes offending or tasteless. It's just that I'm tired of it. We have too much big boobs and ass and revealing clothes! And I'm actually with you on that one, I'm loving Dragon's Crown and I find DoA5 to be one of the best fighting games out there, but I just want something else. I want more characters like Chie, Yukiko, or Aigis from Persona series, I want more characters like Ellie and Elizabeth.

 

[RJ 17]

Well as the poll in this thread shows:
http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/9.824474-Poll-Lets-Get-Some-Honesty-Shall-We-Regarding-Big-Breasts-Sexy-Female-Game-Characters
The majority of gamers (at least on this forum) honestly don't care one way or another. They're not begging to have a big set of bouncing jubblies in their face, but they're not put off by it either. It all relates to the "sexy" character being put into the game purely to fill the role of a "sexy character". That is to say, their sexiness IS their character. That's what people get angry about.

So if people don't mind curvaceous females in their games - and a fair number of gamers specifically WANT curvaceous females in their games - then the gaming industry will keep putting curvaceous females in their games if for no other reason than to appeal to the people who want them, seeing as how many others don't really care (that is, aren't specifically offended/upset by it).

 

[nariette]

It's natural to choose for the ones more attractive, that's just human instinct. There's nothing wrong with that. Personally, I think it's just getting a little overused (let me rephrase that, it's pretty overused). There's nothing wrong with it. I just think it would be more fun if game characters had a more realistic approach, like men are less muscular and women have natural body proportions(though there are already loads of games like that, I hope that it will become more normal and not "special" when a game is designed like this). I don't have anything against games who aren't like this though, I play it if it's enjoyable (like everyone). If making characters idealised or realistic can make a difference in this, maybe it would be a good idea for developers to consider this. If it doesn't make a difference, then just let them do what they want.

In a perfect world, everyone could play the games they like and nobody bothered them for it, but since it's not a perfect world, others will raise hell when you don't agree to their lifestyle.

 

[EternallyBored]

I have a feeling that people tend to concentrate on wrong side of the argument. I don't find big boobs and ass and revealing clothes offending or tasteless. It's just that I'm tired of it. We have too much big boobs and ass and revealing clothes! And I'm actually with you on that one, I'm loving Dragon's Crown and I find DoA5 to be one of the best fighting games out there, but I just want something else. I want more characters like Chie, Yukiko, or Aigis from Persona series, I want more characters like Ellie and Elizabeth.

Yep, pretty much answered it in the first post. Op is assuming that people who dislike or criticize these types of characters means they never want to see them in any video game ever. This is patently untrue, and misrepresenting the vast majority of the argument. People don't want to see big-breasted beautiful women go away, they just want to see some variety, and to have said big-breasted beauties used in context. It hurts my suspension of disbelief to play in a fantasy medieval setting where the men are all consistently clothed in awesome looking armor, or mysterious robes and hoods, but then the female characters are parading around in exposed midriffs, short skirts, and outfits that look like they would need glue to stay on, it says to me that the developer cared more about sexually exciting me then creating a coherent design and aesthetic. These characters are also inserted just to titillate, and people who aren't into that sort of thing start to feel like it's wasted time, "why are you focusing on Miranda's ass you've just ruined any tension from the scene, god damnit Bioware""Oh look everybody is wearing bikinis now, is there a way I can skip this so I can go back to that whole saving the world thing, that seems like it might be high on my to-do list", etc. etc. etc.

Imagine it like this, if there's something in video games that you think is overdone and played out, that's probably how the other side feels here. It's the equivalent to: "oh look another modern military shooter with attached rank based multiplayer, I wonder when I saw one of those last", or "Hey it's a grizzled white space marine shooting aliens, or cyborgs, or something, how very original". When it's done badly it stands out.

That doesn't mean that sex can't be part of a character though, there's a reason nobody really complained about Bayonetta. It's because she was in a game that justified her sexiness as a part of her character, she was over the top and very sexualized, but it made sense within the context of the game and the setting. I doubt you'll find anyone here that wants to regulate or eliminate titillation from video games, they just want it to be done well, just like shooter fans like their genre but get sick of badly done call of Duty knock offs, and Modern Warfare has only been around for less than a decade, imagine having to put up with it in so many games for 15+ years. Everybody reaches their breaking point eventually.

 

[Lieju]

I'd just want more diversity.

Also, big boobs =/= sexy, not for me anyway. I'm sure there are people who like Sorceress and her nippleless things she keeps on her chest, but not everyone.

For me to find a female character sexy they need to be smart and funny. Reasonable proportions are a plus. Want to know who is the sexiest female character in games for me? GLaDOS. Because science.

Also Merrill from DA2 because mad science magic.

I am not opposed to sexual big-breasted female characters either, though. Even if I don't find them to be my type, I can still enjoy their characterization and story-arcs. Just, you know, would be fun if they had some.

 

[generals3]

Let me just answer the title: Because internet forums filled with social activists are going to give a very biased view of actual opinions in the gaming community (and shouldn't be considered to be representative). Heck even on the escapist, of all places, a vast majority basically said "i don't give a shit" and just as much who said "Blerk" said "boobies!" (i'm totally paraphrasing the poll). So now imagine the actual opinion of the whole gaming community?

So the answer is this: they still make it because people want it. Who would have thought in a free market supply would follow demand. (you seem to know it too)

 

[IndomitableSam]

Why do things with big boobs exist?

Because there are still straight men in the world. And a lot of them are immature. And a lot of them are smart, and they know they can make money by using boobs. Women also know this - it's why we show them off all the time.

Boobs make the world go around.

... Sorry, not in the mood for a sexism discussion today. We'll just go with "yada yada lowest common denominator, boys think boobs are magic hyuk hyuk, penis jokes, old boy's club" and so on.

As a female, I do wish women were portrayed more realistically in all media... then I see Chris Hemsworth and hope the world never changes. Unless it changes into him doing movies with nude scenes.

Everyone's a pig.

... I do put my money where my mouth is though, and only buy games that don't offend me. Best I can do when I've talked myself hoarse.

 

[Miss G.]

I already do not and have never given a cent to games like this. As a girl, these things annoy and tire me just as much as seeing things with stupid, negative African-American stereotypes because I'm black (not African-American) and I do not tolerate it in my entertainment without damn good reason. All I want is more good variety for my dollar. If a game wants to have big boobs on a character, fine, but at least do it the Final Fantasy way and have various cup sizes represented amongst the females besides DD and wtf-how-does-her-spine-not-snap (along with some personality and/or character depth if there's actually a story since DC doesn't have much of one, if at all) e.g Rikku, Yuna, & Lulu / Yuffie, Aeris, & Tifa / Selphie, Rinoa, & Quistis.

 

[endtherapture]

Boobs are okay but people only pick on the games with boobs. There's plenty of games where female characters have resonable proportions and aren't just in to sell through sex, eg. Skyrim, Deus Ex, The Witcher 2

 

[Scarim Coral]

Sorry but I went TLR (sorry but I am going to bed soon)!

Anyway to simply put it, there are still some people who liked that as this thread is proof of it- http://www.escapistmagazine.com/forums/read/18.824178-Why-Am-I-A-Bad-Person-For-Like-Large-Breasts-And-Sexy-Nuns . Yes we know that the female bodies does come in many shape and form just like male.

 

[sextus the crazy]

I have a feeling that people tend to concentrate on wrong side of the argument. I don't find big boobs and ass and revealing clothes offending or tasteless. It's just that I'm tired of it. We have too much big boobs and ass and revealing clothes! And I'm actually with you on that one, I'm loving Dragon's Crown and I find DoA5 to be one of the best fighting games out there, but I just want something else. I want more characters like Chie, Yukiko, or Aigis from Persona series, I want more characters like Ellie and Elizabeth.

Pretty much this.

Hey, guess what. Sexy people exist! Please stop constantly reminding us, especially when there's nothing interesting about them. I have to deal with enough attractive, but boring people IRL.

 

[LetalisK]

Boobs are okay but people only pick on the games with boobs. There's plenty of games where female characters have resonable proportions and aren't just in to sell through sex, eg. Skyrim, Deus Ex, The Witcher 2

I haven't played it yet, but if it's like the first one(and I think this applies to it as well) I find Witcher 2 being one of the games that doesn't model women in a way so as to sell on sex to be golden irony.

 

[CloudAtlas]

I have a feeling that people tend to concentrate on wrong side of the argument. I don't find big boobs and ass and revealing clothes offending or tasteless. It's just that I'm tired of it. We have too much big boobs and ass and revealing clothes! And I'm actually with you on that one, I'm loving Dragon's Crown and I find DoA5 to be one of the best fighting games out there, but I just want something else. I want more characters like Chie, Yukiko, or Aigis from Persona series, I want more characters like Ellie and Elizabeth.

Yep, pretty much answered it in the first post. Op is assuming that people who dislike or criticize these types of characters means they never want to see them in any video game ever. This is patently untrue, and misrepresenting the vast majority of the argument. People don't want to see big-breasted beautiful women go away, they just want to see some variety, and to have said big-breasted beauties used in context. It hurts my suspension of disbelief to play in a fantasy medieval setting where the men are all consistently clothed in awesome looking armor, or mysterious robes and hoods, but then the female characters are parading around in exposed midriffs, short skirts, and outfits that look like they would need glue to stay on, it says to me that the developer cared more about sexually exciting me then creating a coherent design and aesthetic. These characters are also inserted just to titillate, and people who aren't into that sort of thing start to feel like it's wasted time, "why are you focusing on Miranda's ass you've just ruined any tension from the scene, god damnit Bioware""Oh look everybody is wearing bikinis now, is there a way I can skip this so I can go back to that whole saving the world thing, that seems like it might be high on my to-do list", etc. etc. etc.

That's pretty much it. Most people who dislike nudity in games dislike it the most, I think, in places where it just doesn't belong. Where it doesn't fit to the story, the mood, the themes, the characters. It's killing immersion, and those games are worse for that.

And, yea, I totally agree with the sentiment that we just get tired of it. It's just the feeling of, I don't know, not again. It's always the same stuff. The first time I saw jiggling boobs in a game was in Neverwinter Nights. I was kinda fascinated back then, evidently, as I can still remember it, yea, but... that was 11 years ago. It's just not appealing to me anymore.

 

[Doclector]

Honestly, sexy characters for the sake of being sexy put me off. I hate the feeling that some bastard is expecting me to buy the game just for that, and if I buy the game for other reasons, I hate the thought that someone may think that I'm playing the game just for that.

But will I refuse to play a game because of that? No. No I won't. The whole "vote with your wallet" thing's all well and good, but if I like a game enough, I will buy it, unless it is absolutely overflowing with obvious, pointless attempts at sex appeal. I won't deprive myself of an entire game that I'll probably enjoy because of one or two possible incidents of sexism.

Hell, would it really help? Would todays publishers connect the dots? No, they'd probably just fire the dev team.

Bottom line, yes, we need to stop sexism in the industry, yes, we need to stop the practice of female characters in videogames being nothing but sex appeal, but no, trying to get people to reject certain games for containing those elements is not the way to do it.

Why does it still exist? Simple, dumb publishers, sometimes dumb dev teams. Industry's moving slower than the general consensus is. Hopefully they'll wise up sometime soon.

 

[nightmare_gorilla]

and again, all these are arguments for or against or whatever. i'm saying companies have no real flag to wave. they don't put in big boobs because they like it or leave it out because "that's the right thing to do" a game with a hot big titted chick in it sells better than the same game with the same character with "realistic" proportions. otherwise why bother. i'm not trying to start another discussion of do you like it or not. i'm telling you. either buy or don't buy and just shut up about it already. I get it women are mad about being underrepresented by game character choice. but yelling about it doesn't change anything, what changes things is money.

yeah you can disagree with part of a game and still enjoy it but at the end of the day when a game is sold the publisher sees that you liked it enough to buy it which is a version of agreeing with everything the game contains if only 60$ worth of agreement. but 60$ is all the agreement they need to make another game that is more or less identical. so you have to decide. are you ok with the "repulsive" part of a game enough to see it persist. or do you make a real statement about not accepting repulsive instead of buying it and going on the internet telling everyone how repulsive you find it?

I don't care what your argument is, overused and hate it, don't care about it, whatever, i'm saying vote with your money and let the chips fall where they may.

i'm saying the outrage people claim to have isn't enough to affect the buying trends. it isn't enough to actually stop this behavior because even the people who yell about it all day long don't care as much as they say they just want to look good. the author of that kotaku post spend paragraph after paragraph lambasting the game for being sexist and offensive but not only did he buy the game he bought the dlc and sunk 120 hours into it. that is a lot of real marketable measurable approval of something he is claiming to hate. I think it's convenient for people to blast games for using this tactic because they feel guilty for buying and enjoying said games. i'm saying the time for debate has ended, i'm saying the "pros and cons" are no longer worth being listed and weighed. it's time to do something real. I only saw one of you saying you already refuse to buy these types of games, good for you. there's already many forum threads about this i'm not looking to start a flame war or anything but come on. isn't it time we either accept the marketing WE created through buying trends or actually take action.

 

[CloudAtlas]

But will I refuse to play a game because of that? No. No I won't. The whole "vote with your wallet" thing's all well and good, but if I like a game enough, I will buy it, unless it is absolutely overflowing with obvious, pointless attempts at sex appeal. I won't deprive myself of an entire game that I'll probably enjoy because of one or two possible incidents of sexism.

I find the argument "if you don't like it, don't buy it" to be very weak too. Oftentimes, there isn't exactly a great variety of recent, good games of a particular type to choose from. What if you're into fantasy MMOs? Good luck finding one that is as gratuitous as Skyrim. Or even a second one, if you got tired from the first. What if you're into Space Operas? Well, then there's hardly a way around Miranda Lawson's butt these years. And what if you have, God forbid, a penchant for Japanese games?

People who don't like this stuff just can't rely on only buying only those games that do not feature such content, because that would often mean buying fewer games than we would like. So, yea, like everybody else, we have to lobby for our preferences to be reflected in future games too.

And I don't think it's not working. There are much more debates today every time a game with questionable content is published. Games are changing. Just look at 2013's Lara Croft.

 

[Yuuki]

It's because sex sells. Even if the person drawing the big breasted knight knows it's stupid, it will get their game some media attention. Look how much we are all talking about Dragon's Crown. That's the point. Even negative attention is still attention.



Just by posting a pic of a hot looking girl, will now get people to read what I wrote. they may not respond to it, it gets their attention. Whether it is negative or not, who cares.

Goddammit dude, at least have the courtesy to that in a NSFW spoiler tag or something, really don't need my others spotting that on my screen.

She's not sexy to me since I find facial/tongue piercings and slutty expressions disgusting (except in extremely rare cases), plus this isn't a site I fap to.

Please? Thanks. I'm trying to read what people are saying and it's rather distracting