With Spoilers, Discuss the Avengers

[F'Angus]

Hell that movie was Awesome. I didn't know how it would turn out but whoa, brilliant.

Scarlett Johansson's arse. Dear god! The scene where she was talking to Loki in the glass cage thingy, all I could look at was her butt. Woah.

And this!

 

[RatRace123]

OHMYGODTHATMOVIEWASSOSUPERAWESOMEI'VEALREADYGONETOSEEITTWICEANDIT'SJUSTASAMAZINGTHESECONDTIME!

The movie is just plain, friggin' awesomeness! Everybody gets their chance to be a badass, it's the most fun I've ever had at the movies and both times I've seen it has ended with applause.

Also, the Hulk is the best character in the movie, his scenes are pure gold! If I had one criticism it would probably be the fact that the movie seems to have too much to focus on in its 2 hours 15 minute runtime.

I'm eagerly awaiting the director's cut.

 

[doomspore98]

Loved the movie and every single scene, just one question.

How can Hulk control his anger now. He goes from RAAAR HULK SMASH to an old guy giving him clothes to RAAAR HULK SMASH BUT NOT AT THOSE CERTAIN GUYS!

 

[DrTobiasWho]

Right... there's a difference between Banner losing control and banner taking control.

The time on the airship he lost control.

The fight on the ground he took control.

It really isn't that hard to figure out numbnuts.

 

[CAPTCHA]

The Hulk:
And as cool as the Hulk was, I think they managed his story line pretty poorly. They made this big deal about him being this unstoppable, uncontrolable animal, yet at the end of the movie he was taking orders and working within the team. That simply didnt fit the story they had provided. He just rocked up on a motorbike and was a different character who just happened to look the same.
They could have made it more believeable if during the scene in the airship, when he was chasing the Black Widow and had just knocked her down, if he was about to smash her or something, they could have shown something along the lines of Banner attempting to take control. They could have then shown that he did exert some form of control over the Hulk, and laid the ground work for him being in control during the final battle. Because the Hulk in the final battle was a different Hulk that we were shown during the earlier movie. They were two different characters. They just looked the same. See what i'm getting at?

Yeah I noticed that too. They should have set up some sort of arc for Banner and the air ship scene was the time to do it. I understand that they needed the team split up at the end for the classic stumbling start to the third act, but that's no reson why they couldn't have had Hulk overcome his rage and do something heroic, even if it was something as small as showing mercy.

The Thor - Ironman fight, and the poor depiction of Tony Stark:
This was stupid and could have been done so much better.
Thor is a god and a great warrior, but he is not stupid.
Ironman is a GENIUS. Tony Stark would not have been able to rise to being a captain of industry without knowing how to talk to people and to convince them to see his point of view. Could you honestly see a person who acted like that, ever convince a board of directors to do things his way?
The whole concept that Ironmans first action to stop Thor would be violence is just plain stupid. Who would voluntarily pick a fight with a god? He would have talked to him first and convinced him that they needed Loki.
But then there wouldnt have been a fight scene.
Also, if Thor had killed Loki then and there, the Allspark wouldnt have been used to open the portal. And the rest of the movie wouldnt have happened.

Also how stupid was it that they both left Loki stood on a hill while they fought. Even Cap didn't go to secure Loki. Good thing he wanted to be caught yeah?

Loki:
Loki is supposed to be a master sorcerer. He did barely any magic. A couple of illusion spells and they guess that covers it? Not good enough.
Plus, there's the side note of the arrogance shown by the film makers in having him speaking English to a street full of Germans. But that wasnt his fault. That was the writers.

I think this was a problem of the script being weak. When Loki brainwashed a bunch of people he did it just by touching them with his staff. He's the god of tricks. That should have been done through deception and had the audience screaming at the screen for the heros to see the error of their ways. That would have taken some actual writing though, which wasn't the objective of the film. Instead we got the whole "a wizard did it" thing. They tried to explore this properly in the jail scene with Scarlett Johansson, but why with her? Why not with the Hulk since that was supposed to be Loki's plan. It would have made no difference to the plot if they changed them around except make it better because they wouldn't have had to rely on the stupid deus ex staff. But no, the writers wanted to show the heros all arguing to emphisise that the team was fractured, even though they were back together the very next scene.

It's also worth noting how much of a none entity the villans of the film were. I mean we have a wizard who's no match for any of the heros physically and never displays anything but a meger adeptness for magic or stratergy, and then pair him with a race of faceless mooks from an alien race who we are never told anything about. Jeeze, wonder who's going to win?

The piss poor writing and Joss Whedon:
The whole film felt like a second draft. The feeling that I got was that they were forcing situations of conflict and not letting them occur naturally. They were just setting up fight scenes rather than them being inevitable.

I'm not sure what you mean by this?

Joss Whedon: I wonder how much actual writing he did for this movie? From what i've heard, he has been, a consultant if you will, for various movie scrips in the past. When the script isnt funny, they call him in to add one liners and make it funnier. I personally think that's what they did for this movie. If you compare the scripts for Buffy, Angel, Firefly and Serenity to this script, you can see that the Avengers is no where near the class of his previous stuff. The interpersonal dialog in this movie was hopeless. Yes Ironman was funny and there were some really good one liners, but the rest of the conversations were forced and irrelevant.
If on the other hand it was all Joss Whedon, then it's not one of his best.

I take the opposite stance on this. I think the writing for the most part was decent enough. A bit teppid, but functional. It's the humor I felt was forced. It was all so slap-sticky and unreal. Like when Thor and the Hulk are fighting together and when they are finished Hulk punches Thor. The way it was done was just so unnatural. The same could be said for most other jokes too; like the charactors telling them were aware of it. They courted the 4th wall a little to closely is I guess what I'm trying to say.

3. They treated Thor and Ironman like really dumb 15 year olds.

To be fair, that's kind of their MO.

 

[Marik2]

Did ANY theater not explode in uproarious laughter and applause when Loki's big verbal lashing of the INCREDIBLE FREAKING HULK ended quite badly for him? I thought so. That kind of scene isn't exactly uncommon, but it was just amazingly well done. I didn't hear what Hulk said to Loki afterward I was laughing so hard!

That, plus Hulk's casual punching of Thor right after they just took a leviathan down makes me declare Hulk to be the funniest character in the whole movie. Followed closely by Tony.

Also this:

Thor: Be careful how you speak of Loki! He is of Asgard and he is my brother!!
Black Widow: He killed 80 people in 2 days.
Thor: ... He's adopted.

I've never seen a single Joss Whedon work before this movie, so I always wondered why people go nuts over him. Now I know. Is ALL of his stuff like this? I may have to check them out if they are!

Hell yeah I loved those one liners, everyone just laughed insanely.

Pretty much the same reaction as I did, about Phil, but my wife pointed out an interesting possibility on the way home.

He might not be dead.

Nick Fury is a manipulative twat, he pretended those cards were in his pocket and outright lied to the Avengers, I think he'd be more than capable of faking Phil's death to ensure their cooperation.

Yeah I was thinking the exact same thing. They can't just kill off a guy who the majority of the audience loved since the beginning.

 

[Iammatt]

Right... there's a difference between Banner losing control and banner taking control.

The time on the airship he lost control.

The fight on the ground he took control.

It really isn't that hard to figure out numbnuts.

this this this. I don't think bruce being able to control his transformation had anything to do with talking to the old man, I think it was simply that he could choose when he wanted to become the hulk in some situations and if he chooses to, he has more control. That's why he told captain america he is always angry, because he can make himself angry and become the hulk, or he can be made angry by something else and not have control over it. That's what I assumed anyways

 

[tippy2k2]

Yeah I was thinking the exact same thing. They can't just kill off a guy who the majority of the audience loved since the beginning.

Killing a well loved and established character in a very quick and dirty way is basically Joss Whedon's calling card. If you are a main character of Whedon's, watch your back because when he gets bored, he kills...

EDIT: http://fandomania.com/joss-whedons-16-most-painful-character-deaths/

Spoiler warnings aplenty for Whedon stories. Click on the link at your own risk...

 

[bigfatcarp93]

Yeah, I'm definately seeing this one again. I also have to day that I was really liked that Thor showed genuine shock and sorrow over Coulson's death. He couldn't save the son of Coul...

EDIT: And come on, we ALL got a huge applause in our theaters at the scene where Hulk ragdolled Loki.

I mean, man... most heroes would let Loki finish his monolouge, deliver a one-liner, and THEN kick his ass. Not Hulk, though. Hulk just doesn't give a shit.

 

[bojackx]

Captain America took one alien blast-o-ray beam to the chest and he was all wounded. Hulk takes a barrage of them to the everywhere on his body and he's absolutely fine.

It seems the one person they didn't invite into the Avengers was the one's who's BLOODY INVINCIBLE.

 

[Robert Ewing]

I was gutted when Coulson died.

And the avengers reminded me about how much I thought Spiderman was missing from the team... Poor spidey. Where was he when Loki's army was invading!?

 

[Offworlder_v1legacy]

Great movie but I'm still pissed off Ant-Man wasn't involved. Oh well one can dream.

Edgar Wright posted a picture on his twitter account...

What could it be?

If it is what I think it is, then awesomeness inbound.

 

[jamjar]

"(i forgot): There a bunch of freaking monkeys.
Captain America: Hey, I know what monkeys are!
...
I got that reference..."

I couldn't stop laughing. I think Whedon was making a joke at his own expense there (due to his abundance of modern pop culture references), and it was great. Also the guy that instantly started playing galaga after everyone left.

You quoted that wrong
Fury: I want to know how he managed to turn two of my best men into his own personal flying monkeys
Thor:Flying monkeys, i don't...
Cap: I got it....I got that reference

 

[Lucane]

Did anyone else Think Black Widow was a little overly freaked out by the Hulk/Bruce Banner? the 1st time in the house when he pretended to start to loose his temper she didn't put her gun down for a little while and then later when she was running away from him on the Helicarrier after Thor comes and smacks him into the Hanger section she's sorta paralyzed with fear or something. Now not saying a wouldn't fair any better but it seemed a little off putting seeing how she was faking it in her sting operation and with Loki while in confinement and having no trouble fighting Hawkeye or the alien armada.

 

[bigfatcarp93]

*facepalm* I JUST realised that the shit that Tony made in Iron Man 2 (The new element) was the same stuff the Tesseract was made of. Howard must have figured it out after he found the Tesseract, and disigned the Ark Reactor specifically to run off of that element... but, limited by the science of his time, he couldn't manufacture more, so the "unfinished" Ark used Palladium instead. But, Howard was still clever enough to leave a blueprint of an atom of... uh... "Tesseractum" in the Expo map, so that Tony, with the tech of his time, could manufacture more and "finish" the Ark Reactor. Meaning that, in theory, Tony Stark could make another Tesseract.

EDIT: I may start a new topic just to discuss this...

 

[Slayer_2]

For a superhero movie, it wasn't bad. I really enjoyed Tony Stark, the sarcastic ultra-nerd billionaire. I was almost hoping him and Captain America were gonna 'take it outside'.

 

[Cry Wolf]

Did ANY theater not explode in uproarious laughter and applause when Loki's big verbal lashing of the INCREDIBLE FREAKING HULK ended quite badly for him? I thought so. That kind of scene isn't exactly uncommon, but it was just amazingly well done. I didn't hear what Hulk said to Loki afterward I was laughing so hard!

That, plus Hulk's casual punching of Thor right after they just took a leviathan down makes me declare Hulk to be the funniest character in the whole movie. Followed closely by Tony.

Also this:

Thor: Be careful how you speak of Loki! He is of Asgard and he is my brother!!
Black Widow: He killed 80 people in 2 days.
Thor: ... He's adopted.

I've never seen a single Joss Whedon work before this movie, so I always wondered why people go nuts over him. Now I know. Is ALL of his stuff like this? I may have to check them out if they are!

he has strong writing when it comes to team based things, (to the extent i will go out of my way to read any team-oriented book he has written) but his tv stuff is equally as good.

Woah, be careful. Dollhouse was fucking awfull. *Most* of his stuff is great though.

 

[deth2munkies]

When Agent Coulson died he said "Give them something to..." AND EVERYONE IN THE WHOLE FUCKING THEATER SAID "AVENGE" AT THE SAME TIME.

It was magical.

Not so magical was that everyone was laughing so hard at Hulk beating down Loki that I didn't get to hear what his witty retort was

 

[CODE-D]

When Agent Coulson died he said "Give them something to..." AND EVERYONE IN THE WHOLE FUCKING THEATER SAID "AVENGE" AT THE SAME TIME.

It was magical.

Not so magical was that everyone was laughing so hard at Hulk beating down Loki that I didn't get to hear what his witty retort was

I dont think hes dead or rather it was so open ended that they could bring him back believably.

 

[WolfThomas]

*facepalm* I JUST realised that the shit that Tony made in Iron Man 2 (The new element) was the same stuff the Tesseract was made of. Howard must have figured it out after he found the Tesseract, and disigned the Ark Reactor specifically to run off of that element... but, limited by the science of his time, he couldn't manufacture more, so the "unfinished" Ark used Palladium instead. But, Howard was still clever enough to leave a blueprint of an atom of... uh... "Tesseractum" in the Expo map, so that Tony, with the tech of his time, could manufacture more and "finish" the Ark Reactor. Meaning that, in theory, Tony Stark could make another Tesseract.

Or it's Vibranium the stuff Cap's shield is made of. Indestructible and capable of absorbing limitless energy, sounds like a good property for an arc reactor heat sink thing. Though yeah the movies are packed full of this stuff, like in Captain America Howard Stark describing the tesseract energy cells as emitting radiation but not alpha or beta (so gamma the stuff that Banner was hit by) which is confirmed in the Avengers. And Reinstein written on the canisters of supersoldier serum in the Incredible Hulk (which was Erksine's original/ret-conned to false name in comics).