You aren't. I have no idea how it won both best game and best moment! The Throat Of The World isn't even that impressive. Not that Skyrim is a bad game, but i can think of plenty better that came out this year.Evil Smurf said:
World of Tanks Named Best MMO at Golden Joystick Awards
- Thread starter MikeWehner
- Start date
Golden Joystick is user voted. WG have been actively asking people to vote for WoT for ages.Tiger Sora said:
Also, ToRtanic? The MMO that made the fastest transition from subscription to F2P in history because everyone found out how terrible it was? You think that was going to get any votes?
On the subject of "persistent worlds", World of Tanks actually does have one, Clan Wars. The graphical representation of that persistent world is just a Risk style map, but it's actually far more player driven as a persistent world than any of the Morepigs that have followed WoW. (MMOs used to be highly player driven, the only one left that way is basically Eve).
I really did enjoy Skyrim, and visiting the Throat of the World was pretty interesting to me. Top gaming moment of the year, though? Not really. There are other moments in Skyrim I'd put up against that one, not to mention more gripping games.
I can't ever seem to get World of Tanks to run acceptably on any system I try it on, and it always seemed fairly junky to me. Given the comments regarding the grind and the balance issues, it doesn't seem like I've missed out on much.
I can't ever seem to get World of Tanks to run acceptably on any system I try it on, and it always seemed fairly junky to me. Given the comments regarding the grind and the balance issues, it doesn't seem like I've missed out on much.
GloatingSwine said:
For the record SWToR was not terrible, and was quite well received by the users. The problem was of course the usual one of game developers not realizing that to maintain subscriptions you need to put a ton of time consuming content at the end of the game (like large raids) so people will be able to keep improving their characters and have something to work towards.
MMOs fail because the developers still fail to realize that no matter how great the leveling process is, in the end everyone wants up at the end of the game, and even if you do it a few times with differant characters, eventually the big question becomes "what now" and if there is no answer the players are going to leave rather than mindlessly paying a sub every month in hopes that you add new content.
Approachability is also an issue to an extent, making everything easy, approachale, and casual is fine, but the thing is that if the best gear tends to come from relatively small and easy to run instances, that means people are going to max out the content rapidly, get the best gear, and be done. WoW survived because at first it didn't have any real compeititon for endgames, and then because it had 40 man raids which were VERY time consuming just to organize and pull off. People might have complained about them, but they kept coming back for them, and also re-upping their subscription.
ToR wound up like it did because in the final equasion everyone wound up at max level with their favorite 'toon, and then had nothing to do but hang out in the fleet statons and run instances of grind the PVP maps. Once you have all the best gear, and have run 200+ huttball matches, there really isn't much left in the game for you to do.
ToR launched relying entirely on it's leveling process, which was great, but it had no endgame. If they could have put the effort into the endgame content and keeping people occupied there this would never have happened. In the end ToR wasn't anything special as far as it's failure goes, it just collapsed like every other MMO with extremely limited endgame content.
Subscription models are not really bad, and games like ToR can succeed, it's just that the guys developing the games need to think in the long term and what will keep people playing while they develop more content (however long that takes).
Honestly I suspect we'll be seeing a "FTP" crash soon, followed by an abandonment of MMOs for a while, and then a subscription based resurgence. The reason is simply that the FTP model was a way of making money without the game being beholden to subscription fees. The idea being it could make money to support it's development and generate profit without relying on people to pay a fee every single month. The problem being that the guys running these games simply got too greedy, it rapidly turns into a situation where instead of using the revenues from those buying things to create general content for the game, they simply pocket ALL the money, and largely just produce more things for people to buy as opposed to real game content. The selling point of a gamer "paying to support the game" and getting whatever they pick up from the cash shop as a sort of gift for their donation sounds great on paper, but in practice when you see people going for months of investment and then not seeing any substantial game content added, it becomes an issue. Right now a lot of FTP games have people sitting at the end, pumping money into th egame, and waiting for it to be properly expanded, but as time goes on and this increasingly doesn't happen I think the bubble will burst.
At any rate, comparing WoT to SWToR is like comparing apples and oranges as I said in a previous post. One is an arena based game, the other is a presistant world game, both are MMOs in a strict sense, but entirely differant kinds. As far as sheer quality of presentation and content goes, no game really approaching SWToR, it's absolutly awesome, especially the first time you play through it, pretty much "Knights Of The Old Republic III", the problem though is as I explained, once you've seen it all, and played the "flashpoints" and PVP mini-games a bunch of times there isn't much to it, and it doesn't take that much time in the big picture to see an do everything to the point of mental exhaustion. Very, very, few games will ever be as good as SWToR was as far as it went, it's problem was a failure of planning on how to sustain the intended business model.
But Skyrim was awful. Even held by the metric of other games Bethesda's made it's a bad game. RPG mechanics simply don't mate that well with an first-person aesthetic.MikeWehner said:World of Tanks Named Best MMO at Golden Joystick Awards
Skyrim wins big as the awards set a new record for voter participation.
As the longest-running annual gaming awards series - and the oldest gaming honors voted on by the general public - the Golden Joystick Awards have a long and storied history. This year marks the event's 30th anniversary, and the winners include... well... pretty much the games you'd expect to win. With more than 4 million votes tallied, which doubles last year's record, it's hard to argue with these results.
Some of the more interesting honorees include Minecraft for Game Most Similar to Cocaine Addiction and Slender for Game Most Likely to Make You Change Your Pants. Ok, I made those up. Check out the full list of the real winners below.
Ultimate Game of the Year: Skyrim
Best Action Game: Batman: Arkham City
Best Strategy Game: Civilization V: Gods and Kings
Best Tablet Game: Angry Birds Space
Best Downloadable Game: Minecraft XBLA
Best Fighting Game: Mortal Kombat
Best Shooter: Battlefield 3
Best MMO: World of Tanks
Best Handheld Game: Uncharted: Golden Abyss
Best DLC: Portal 2
Best Sports Game: FIFA 12
Best Racing Game: Forza 4
Best Browser Game: Slender
The One to Watch: Grand Theft Auto V
Top Gaming Moment: Visiting Skyrim's Throat of the World
For a bit of perspective on just how far we've come in the past 30 years, take a look at the image above. On the bottom is the very first Golden Joystick Game of the Year winner, Jetpac for the ZX Spectrum and VIC-20 home computers, and on the top is Skyrim, this year's overall top dog.
Source: CVG [http://www.computerandvideogames.com/375036/golden-joystick-awards-2012-all-the-winners/]
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Really the only games that can feel like they earned their awards were sport games, Civ 5 (because there was no real competition) and Arkham.
The problem with World of Tanks? It's not an MMO. It has more in common with Battle Tanks (yeah, that old N64 game made by 3D0) and Quake than World of Warcraft and Firefall.
Time to throw my opinion into the ring!
Ultimate Game of the Year: Skyrim
Haven't played it so I can't say but it makes sense due to how much everyone praises it.
Best Action Game: Batman: Arkham City
same as Skyrim.
Best Strategy Game: Civilization V: Gods and Kings
Haven't played it, but I can't think of any other strategy games right now.
Best Tablet Game: Angry Birds Space
Of course this was going to win..
Best Downloadable Game: Minecraft XBLA
I was hoping Journey would have won this.
Best Fighting Game: Mortal Kombat
I like this choice, really as long as Marvel Vs Capcom 3 didn't win I would have been happy.
Best Shooter: Battlefield 3
Wait... Call of Duty didn't win? What world is this?
Best MMO: World of Tanks
Suprising. Thought Pandas or Diablo would have won.
Best Handheld Game: Uncharted: Golden Abyss
Kinda surprised.
Best DLC: Portal 2
Apparently a test creator. Okay then.
Best Sports Game: FIFA 12
I couldn't care less about sports games so I guess good for it?
Best Racing Game: Forza 4
Now I wish a new Burnout Game would come out.
Best Browser Game: Slender
Okay then
The One to Watch: Grand Theft Auto V
After IV was the most boring thing ever, I am actually kinda interested in seeing if they will remedy that with V so I guess I am cool with this.
Top Gaming Moment: Visiting Skyrim's Throat of the World
No clue what that even is.
Well there goes my worthless opinion on all this stuff.
Ultimate Game of the Year: Skyrim
Haven't played it so I can't say but it makes sense due to how much everyone praises it.
Best Action Game: Batman: Arkham City
same as Skyrim.
Best Strategy Game: Civilization V: Gods and Kings
Haven't played it, but I can't think of any other strategy games right now.
Best Tablet Game: Angry Birds Space
Of course this was going to win..
Best Downloadable Game: Minecraft XBLA
I was hoping Journey would have won this.
Best Fighting Game: Mortal Kombat
I like this choice, really as long as Marvel Vs Capcom 3 didn't win I would have been happy.
Best Shooter: Battlefield 3
Wait... Call of Duty didn't win? What world is this?
Best MMO: World of Tanks
Suprising. Thought Pandas or Diablo would have won.
Best Handheld Game: Uncharted: Golden Abyss
Kinda surprised.
Best DLC: Portal 2
Apparently a test creator. Okay then.
Best Sports Game: FIFA 12
I couldn't care less about sports games so I guess good for it?
Best Racing Game: Forza 4
Now I wish a new Burnout Game would come out.
Best Browser Game: Slender
Okay then
The One to Watch: Grand Theft Auto V
After IV was the most boring thing ever, I am actually kinda interested in seeing if they will remedy that with V so I guess I am cool with this.
Top Gaming Moment: Visiting Skyrim's Throat of the World
No clue what that even is.
Well there goes my worthless opinion on all this stuff.
The same here. And yes, Wargaming "encouraged" (some may call it bribed ?) players to vote for them. Without knowing i assume other contenders possibly did that too though.nikki191 said:
And i can understand why some folks may question the whole MMO thing. The problem is that the lines are getting more and more blurred when it comes to categories and game genres (sadly).
Aren't these awards for games from last year?Andy Shandy said:
Because if Spec Ops: The Line doesn't rack up some serious accolades, the medium is dead to me.
Personally, I would've given GOTY to Dark Souls, Best Shooter to Spec Ops, and best handheld game to Gravity Rush. Each to their own, though.
Nope, they included games from this year. Spec Ops was actually what I voted for in the Best Shooter, Game Of The Year, and Best Moment categories. Also, Mass Effect 3 was in a few categories and The Walking Dead was in Best Downloadable, etc.Secret world leader (shhh) said:
...Andy Shandy said:
For the past four years up until a few months ago, I had my heart and mind set on becoming a game designer.
I guess i'll just be a music video director or an artist of some kind then.
I'm disappointed every time I see Mortal Kombat get a "Best Fighting Game" award or something of the same sort.
...Jesus, if only awards were given by people who actually knew something about the genre.
...Jesus, if only awards were given by people who actually knew something about the genre.
Skyrim winning anything is telling. That game is so broken it's funny. There are quests, for example on all three platforms that are incomplete. It's like awarding film of the year to a movies that's full of "scene missing" images throughout it's parts, or best novel of the year to a book that's got spllgn eorrs adn blnake paegs.
Great thing about this industry, I guess, is that you can not only get away with things like that, you even get accolades for it.
Great thing about this industry, I guess, is that you can not only get away with things like that, you even get accolades for it.
You just spent ages telling us all about the ways it was terrible. Saves me the trouble.Therumancer said:
It might have been alright as KotOR 3 (which, let's face it, is what people actually wanted), albeit a version of KotOR 3 where you occasionally see people called things like XxArsebiscuit419xX running around on your planets doing the same quests as you, but at anything related to being multiplayer, let alone massive (I remember the immense brouhaha about how utterly broken the main PvP was, allowing one side to freely farm the other all day forever) it was utter shite.
I think, though, that they were misguided in their very conception of the game. The structure and mechanics of WoW, action bars and click-and-wait autoattacks, are a relic of the internet infrastructure as it existed when WoW was new and people were still playing it on dialup, and all the synchronisation issues that entails. You can't make a game that works mechanically like WoW and expect to pull a new audience.
And the WoW feedback loop of quest->level->raid is pretty much sewn up by WoW. People who find that compelling are pretty much all playing WoW already, and since they're all playing WoW it's where their guildmates are and where they've got an existing social network to keep them engaged (which is one of the reasons WoW has the inertia it does). So even if a small section of the market jump ship to the latest WoW clone (Warhammer Online, Age of Conan, ST Online, LOTRO, D&D Online, SWtoR whatevs) they'll all go back to where they've got their high level raiding character and guild that keeps them far more engaged than the actual content ever will. So you can't expect to make a game that works like WoW's metagame and expect to pull and retain WoW's audience.
The hilarity of it all is that whilst the major publishers were all desperately trying to clone WoW and charge $14.99 a month for an inferior copy of the same mechanics and metagame, envious of it's 15 million subscribers, a couple of other companies have come along and exploded those figures. Riot's League of Legends has 35 million registered accounts, at least 12 million of them are active at least once a week, 4 million once a day. Their recent championship event had eight million viewers on youtube. World of Tanks has 40 million registered accounts, peak server population daily is about 750,000-800,000 (mostly in Russia, where peak population is half a million, that's half a million people on at once every day at peak times. The EU server hits 110,000-130,000 at peak, and that's every day. And that's not the number of unique accounts that play every day, it's the number of people that are logged on all at once at peak time.
In terms of active users these new online multiplayer games are shitting all over WoW, and since they have such high populations they don't have to monetise each player quite so much in order to make bank on them. The few drips and drops of riot points or gold people buy on impulse are more than enough to replace and even exceed what the same game could get with a subscription. WoW (and Eve, but that's even more insular and specialist) is the last of the dinosaurs when it comes to the current mechanics, metagame feedback loop, and business model of MMOs. Trying to bring out a new dinosaur, but this time with lightsabres clutched in its tiny ineffectual little arms, was always destined to be terrible.