Youtube Policy is changing the rules for monetize again! Chaos! PANIC! UPDATED AGAIN!!!!

[Mr.Mattress]

This is a terrible idea and I sincerely hope Youtube backs down on it, but let's all be honest here: This isn't going to kill Youtube. All this is going to do is make Bigger Youtuber's rely on Patreon, Crowdfunding and 3rd party support, which I've noticed has been a growing trend for Youtubers in general. Yes, this will kill a lot of smaller channels that have only begun to gain money, and that is absolutely terrible, but the bigger names, and the names with a very loyal niche, will not be affected as badly by these policies. They will survive and thrive, even if they don't have money. All these policies will do is keep those who aren't big down.

Oh, they can absolutely make some money. I'm in no way disputing that. But you're doing everyone a disservice by referring to them as reporters or journalists. Similar to how I would never refer to myself as a carpenter for putting up an IKEA bookshelf.

Sit down.

In the United States, all Citizens have the rights of Freedom of Speech and Freedom of Press. Because of these freedoms, every citizen is technically a Journalist or Reporter even if they have no major experience with reporting. Lovell v. City of Griffin [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lovell_v._City_of_Griffin] is the case that explicitly states that the Freedom of Press applies to all Citizens, not just ones that work for Major News Outlets. For all intents and purposes, these people, regardless of their knowledge on Journalism or Reporting Practices, are Journalists and Reporters.

 

[Kina]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

 

[DudeistBelieve]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

 

[Kina]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

 

[klaynexas3]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

And you're undermining the efforts put in by people to be legitimate reporters without having to have the degree. I'm a first level tech support analyst, I get paid to do that, but I didn't go to school for it, so does that mean despite the actual work I'm doing I'm not actually one? That all that time working on computers doesn't mean anything because I don't have the paper? Being a journalist is a trade that can be learned without a degree saying you know how to do it. Like you carpenter analogy, if you've made enough quality furniture that people are willing to buy, that most definitely makes you a carpenter, despite not having a paper that says so. So I think you should take your own advice and not feel the need to undermine other people's efforts just because they make their money through YouTube.

Sit down.

 

[Armadox]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

And you're undermining the efforts put in by people to be legitimate reporters without having to have the degree. I'm a first level tech support analyst, I get paid to do that, but I didn't go to school for it, so does that mean despite the actual work I'm doing I'm not actually one? That all that time working on computers doesn't mean anything because I don't have the paper? Being a journalist is a trade that can be learned without a degree saying you know how to do it. Like you carpenter analogy, if you've made enough quality furniture that people are willing to buy, that most definitely makes you a carpenter, despite not having a paper that says so. So I think you should take your own advice and not feel the need to undermine other people's efforts just because they make their money through YouTube.

Sit down.

There's qualified and unqualified jobs. You can be a carpenter and build a chair and that is unqualified carpentry. You are not authorized to build a house. Same thing with journalism. If you can gather research and report it in a concise manner, you're a journalist. If you took the time to go to school and get a degree in it, you're an accredited journalist and can preform at a different level. Both deserve to be paid for their skills. Especially (and regardless of title and skill) as their roles as entertainers as determined by the market.

 

[Kina]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

And you're undermining the efforts put in by people to be legitimate reporters without having to have the degree. I'm a first level tech support analyst, I get paid to do that, but I didn't go to school for it, so does that mean despite the actual work I'm doing I'm not actually one? That all that time working on computers doesn't mean anything because I don't have the paper? Being a journalist is a trade that can be learned without a degree saying you know how to do it. Like you carpenter analogy, if you've made enough quality furniture that people are willing to buy, that most definitely makes you a carpenter, despite not having a paper that says so. So I think you should take your own advice and not feel the need to undermine other people's efforts just because they make their money through YouTube.

Sit down.

Experience absolutely plays a major factor and finding yourself with plenty of it in the correct field definitely gives you a foothold in that industry. While producing my imaginary furniture would indeed improve my skills in carpentry, but it wouldn't by default make me a carpenter - which brings us back to my original point.

Downloading a clip and talking around it, be it mockingly or through comedic hard cuts on youtube, does not make you a reporter or a journalist. Sure, you may be reporting something, but the hobby grade biased commentary provided by our oh so beloved Youtube can hardly be held to any standard. Similar to how if I made a game review and put it on youtube. I'm not a games journalist, critic or otherwise. I'm just an asshole on youtube hoping someone hits a red button to give me those sweet 6 dollars of Adsense every month.

If you can find a way to make some money out of your youtube hobby - all the more power to you. That's fantastic and I'm sure it's great fun. But don't insult the people who actually know how to deliver news, make reports and actually create content by grouping them all together.

Sit down.

 

[SupahEwok]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

And you're undermining the efforts put in by people to be legitimate reporters without having to have the degree. I'm a first level tech support analyst, I get paid to do that, but I didn't go to school for it, so does that mean despite the actual work I'm doing I'm not actually one? That all that time working on computers doesn't mean anything because I don't have the paper? Being a journalist is a trade that can be learned without a degree saying you know how to do it. Like you carpenter analogy, if you've made enough quality furniture that people are willing to buy, that most definitely makes you a carpenter, despite not having a paper that says so. So I think you should take your own advice and not feel the need to undermine other people's efforts just because they make their money through YouTube.

Sit down.

And roll over and play dead too, while he's at it.

I think to be an honest to god carpenter you probably need a license, but that's really just a difference between the hobbyist and professional. Me personally, I kinda regret my time spent in college. To do what I'm aiming to do, I could've just gotten a certification or some accreditations, and been able to get a professional job.

OT: so apparently those changes are happening. Hrm. A lot of the big Youtubers have Patreon income so they can survive on that and stay on Youtube, but that's the thing, isn't it: a great deal of their income is independent of Youtube. The small timers will be shut down by this change and the big timers can afford to take a principled stand and move to another service. After all, if their audience will follow them, which Patreon allows, why would they stay at Youtube making no ad money when they can go someplace else where they can get that money?

Somebody at Youtube has done fucked up.

 

[Kina]

I think to be an honest to god carpenter you probably need a license

Nah son, if this thread has taught me anything, it's that you can be anything you want if you wish really, really hard.

 

[klaynexas3]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

And you're undermining the efforts put in by people to be legitimate reporters without having to have the degree. I'm a first level tech support analyst, I get paid to do that, but I didn't go to school for it, so does that mean despite the actual work I'm doing I'm not actually one? That all that time working on computers doesn't mean anything because I don't have the paper? Being a journalist is a trade that can be learned without a degree saying you know how to do it. Like you carpenter analogy, if you've made enough quality furniture that people are willing to buy, that most definitely makes you a carpenter, despite not having a paper that says so. So I think you should take your own advice and not feel the need to undermine other people's efforts just because they make their money through YouTube.

Sit down.

There's qualified and unqualified jobs. You can be a carpenter and build a chair and that is unqualified carpentry. You are not authorized to build a house. Same thing with journalism. If you can gather research and report it in a concise manner, you're a journalist. If you took the time to go to school and get a degree in it, you're an accredited journalist and can preform at a different level. Both deserve to be paid for their skills. Especially and regardless as their roles as entertainers as determined by the market.

Oh I do understand that aspect of it, that's why the carpentry analogy works while the doctor one would not work, because that you legally need to go through the right channels. My whole point being is that a YouTube journalist is still a journalist, while maybe not as qualified and there are plenty that are bad at being a journalist, but they are journalists none the less. Much like how it's demeaning towards the creators that do actually put in the effort to be a good journalist on YouTube and are actually better at that job than say a reporter at Fox or CNN.

 

[klaynexas3]

Freedom of press. I also have the freedom to practice carpentry, but that doesn't make me one by default whenever I pick up a hammer.

Sit down.

If you want to be something, it's as simple as just being it.

THe quality of your ability and legality to be a carpenter can be debated, but so long as you call yourself a carpenter you are one.

Do you not feel that undermines and misleads people by claiming a title or asking others to refer to you as such? I could tell someone to take some aspirin and boom guess what, I'm a doctor. Sure, I may not have spent 8 years in med school, but I'm a doctor.

Sit. Down.

And you're undermining the efforts put in by people to be legitimate reporters without having to have the degree. I'm a first level tech support analyst, I get paid to do that, but I didn't go to school for it, so does that mean despite the actual work I'm doing I'm not actually one? That all that time working on computers doesn't mean anything because I don't have the paper? Being a journalist is a trade that can be learned without a degree saying you know how to do it. Like you carpenter analogy, if you've made enough quality furniture that people are willing to buy, that most definitely makes you a carpenter, despite not having a paper that says so. So I think you should take your own advice and not feel the need to undermine other people's efforts just because they make their money through YouTube.

Sit down.

Experience absolutely plays a major factor and finding yourself with plenty of it in the correct field definitely gives you a foothold in that industry. While producing my imaginary furniture would indeed improve my skills in carpentry, but it wouldn't by default make me a carpenter - which brings us back to my original point.

Downloading a clip and talking around it, be it mockingly or through comedic hard cuts on youtube, does not make you a reporter or a journalist. Sure, you may be reporting something, but the hobby grade biased commentary provided by our oh so beloved Youtube can hardly be held to any standard. Similar to how if I made a game review and put it on youtube. I'm not a games journalist, critic or otherwise. I'm just an asshole on youtube hoping someone hits a red button to give me those sweet 6 dollars of Adsense every month.

If you can find a way to make some money out of your youtube hobby - all the more power to you. That's fantastic and I'm sure it's great fun. But don't insult the people who actually know how to deliver news, make reports and actually create content by grouping them all together.

Sit down.

Except now you're lumping in the YouTube content creators that actually do spend the time and effort that what you would call a "real reporter" would also spend, but just because they make their money through a different means they are not a real reporter. So I am calling you on that point and pointing out that that is equally, if not more demeaning, because you are gating off what they are not by their quality of work, but by how many more years they spent in school. There are shitty reporters on YouTube, some that calling them reporters could be seen as an insult to the people at a news station that have spent their lives trying to learn this craft, but there are also plenty on YouTube that saying they aren't reporters because they don't have the exact same degrees as the guy at the news station is insulting to any person that made it anywhere in the world purely through the work force. It's unsulting to any writer that didn't waste their time on an English degree, any artist that didn't want to go through the hoops to get an Art degree, any animator that didn't go to school for it. You don't have to like it, you can say they are shite at what they do, but don't say that me saying these guys are journalists is insulting when you're doing nothing but insulting any person without a degree.

Sit down.

 

[sageoftruth]

If all this is true, then that will probably be a miracle for any other companies who had hopes of opening up their own youtube, because demand for a new service will probably skyrocket among those who thrived on those kinds of discussions.

 

[Armadox]

If all this is true, then that will probably be a miracle for any other companies who had hopes of opening up their own youtube, because demand for a new service will probably skyrocket among those who thrived on those kinds of discussions.

Yes. But the cash needed to have the infrastructure for this is so massive, that any company big enough to foot the bill I wouldn't want running the show.

 

[Armadox]

I think to be an honest to god carpenter you probably need a license

Nah son, if this thread has taught me anything, it's that you can be anything you want if you wish really, really hard.

I'm now curious, what is it you do, Kina? You have a seriously strong opinion on the nature of what makes a job and who deserves the ability to profit from said job. I'm genuinely interested in seeing from what standpoint you are coming from yourself.

 

[Sexual Harassment Panda]

Didn't we always know this was going to happen? Live by advertising, die by advertising.

Advertisers are well within their rights to not want to be associated with certain things. The sad truth is that the castle was built on sand to start with. Content creators that are interesting enough to have this be a problem for them can do it as a passion project or else find alternative revenue streams... Expect more begging and pushing of patreons in the very near future.

This is shit. But this isn't censorship.

I know people are claiming that youtube are targeting videos based on ideology. If that's true, I'll join in the outrage. As it stands... We just knew this was going to happen, right? I'm utterly unsurprised.

 

[Ten Foot Bunny]

Boogie posted a new video that's quite disturbing...


Apparently his videos talking about mental health are being de-monetized, as well as videos from channels that talk exclusively about mental health. This whole "family friendly" thing is really going too far. I guess that, according to YouTube, mental illness needs more stigma piled onto it. Nice way of telling us that our experiences are too harmful for public consumption, and that sharing those experiences is (quite literally) without value.

SO pissed off right now.

 

[bartholen_v1legacy]

I know people are claiming that youtube are targeting videos based on ideology. If that's true, I'll join in the outrage. As it stands... We just knew this was going to happen, right? I'm utterly unsurprised.

Well, considering Youtube has built its reputation as a free platform for anyone anywhere to talk about anything and post anything short of porn, snuff videos, doxxing and such, I don't think this kind of move was entirely to be expected. Fuck, Youtube's most subscribed channel is a guy who's made jokes about rape, often swears copiously and has played some of the goriest games in existence. To think they now would suddenly go "oh, we want to be family friendly" is just fucking retarded. It'd be like a news station suddenly deciding their whole programming is going to consist only of the lighthearted end segments.

One of the most fucked up things to come out of this is that youtuber who went to North Korea and made a vlog series about it focusing only on the positive will not be affected in any way. Those videos will stay monetized, whereas videos discussing politics, mental health, sexual assault, feminism, racism, anything the like, will get hit. So what is basically North Korean propaganda is okay, but criticizing feminism, that's a no-no. Fuck fucking fuckety fuck fuck fuck.

 

[Kina]

I'm now curious, what is it you do, Kina? You have a seriously strong opinion on the nature of what makes a job and who deserves the ability to profit from said job. I'm genuinely interested in seeing from what standpoint you are coming from yourself.

Sales operator internationally for Disney Live, Disney on Ice and Monster Jam.

Except now you're lumping in the YouTube content creators that actually do spend the time and effort that what you would call a "real reporter" would also spend, but just because they make their money through a different means they are not a real reporter. So I am calling you on that point and pointing out that that is equally, if not more demeaning, because you are gating off what they are not by their quality of work, but by how many more years they spent in school. There are shitty reporters on YouTube, some that calling them reporters could be seen as an insult to the people at a news station that have spent their lives trying to learn this craft, but there are also plenty on YouTube that saying they aren't reporters because they don't have the exact same degrees as the guy at the news station is insulting to any person that made it anywhere in the world purely through the work force. It's unsulting to any writer that didn't waste their time on an English degree, any artist that didn't want to go through the hoops to get an Art degree, any animator that didn't go to school for it. You don't have to like it, you can say they are shite at what they do, but don't say that me saying these guys are journalists is insulting when you're doing nothing but insulting any person without a degree.

Sit down.

You hit the nail on the head with your first sentence there. They are indeed, Youtube content creators - and that's perfectly fine. If someone managed to transition from their psuedo news outlet on Youtube to an actual outlet, that's fantastic. That's a great first step. I'm sure there are lessons to be learned there and they can at the same time receive feedback from the Youtube comments section regarding their hard hitting Journalism, and we all know what that looks like.

The distinction I'm trying to forward here is this:
They may be reporting news, but that does not make them news reporters per what an average person would define a news reporter.

You can most certainly learn without a proper degree when it comes to journalism in this case, but that doesn't change the fact that you are still just some guy/girl, on your Youtube channel with your commissioned Deviantart intro putting out your two cents about the latest dumb thing Trump did. Could someone look at that video and loosely refer to it as some form of journalism? Absolutely, be my guest. Would most people consider them to be actual journalists though? No. They are content creators on Youtube. That's why they're not held to the same standard as other, actual outlets and that is why every opinion piece on there has to be taken with a grain of salt.

Imagine a job application where the recruiter asks:
"Oh, it says here you've been a news reporter for a little over 1 year. Do you mind if I ask where you used to work?"
"youtube.com/sitdownnews"

Good luck, and please sit down.

 

[Silentpony_v1legacy]

The truth is that basing your entire income off YouTube ads is a poor business model and was doomed from the start. It was a bubble, and the fact YouTube even paid content creators was more of a favor than an actual commission project. And it was based entirely on marketability, not personality or content. I think some creators got too involved with themselves and forgot they aren't getting paid for how awesome and smart and clever and kewl they are, they're getting paid for how marketable they are.

And as the people who buy the ads, companies are fully within their rights to pick and choose what channels they're associated with. Basically if you think it was okay for Speedo to drop that swimmer guy because of the stories about him, then you have no right to complain about YouTube demonetizing videos they don't like.

Also its not censorship. Not in any way. No one is stopping anyone from producing videos and saying what they want. YouTube is just going to stop paying them to do so, which is their right to do.

 

[Saelune]

The truth is that basing your entire income off YouTube ads is a poor business model and was doomed from the start. It was a bubble, and the fact YouTube even paid content creators was more of a favor than an actual commission project. And it was based entirely on marketability, not personality or content. I think some creators got too involved with themselves and forgot they aren't getting paid for how awesome and smart and clever and kewl they are, they're getting paid for how marketable they are.

And as the people who buy the ads, companies are fully within their rights to pick and choose what channels they're associated with. Basically if you think it was okay for Speedo to drop that swimmer guy because of the stories about him, then you have no right to complain about YouTube demonetizing videos they don't like.

Also its not censorship. Not in any way. No one is stopping anyone from producing videos and saying what they want. YouTube is just going to stop paying them to do so, which is their right to do.

Well, its a lot of indirectness. A lot of people like a channel, it becomes appealing to advertisers to reach a large audience, so they do. Now the advertisers are being picky about what audiences they are catering to in stupid ways. They are choosing to not pick many marketable channels now.

And sure, they can still make their content, but earning a living off it is eventually the main reason they keep doing it. Might have started as a hobby, and many may continue to do it out of enjoyment, but a lot of channels will just stop if they cannot make a living off of it. They aren't saying they cannot make their content, but they are indirectly shutting down a lot of channels due to how practically a monopoly YouTube is.

And just because its legal, doesn't mean its ok. I utterly hate that argument.