Zero Punctuation: Grand Theft Auto IV
- Thread starter Yahtzee Croshaw
- Start date
Excellent review, as always.
However there is one thing I haven't seen mentioned yet.
Immersion, noisy consoles and shitty FPS.
Honestly, I have a really hard time enjoying a conversation in game when my 360 is doing it's normal LOUD-AS-FUCK thing. I fondly remember when consoles didn't sound like badly built PC's by some cheap retard . Or when the games themselves didn't have constant slowdowns (yes yes I know, games back then had slowdowns as well but not to the extent that 360 games does)
Now, I'm an incredibly spoiled PC-gamer tard, so I'm used to high fps, OR (and this is something that I guess console games will never offer) I could lower the settings in any given game, to trade in more fps at the expense of details etc.
Having said that I wish they actually spent a little more time making the game fluid, then... whatever else they were doing. But it's not really isolated to GTA4, it seems like fluid FPS/steady FPS is a criteria extremely low on any developers list of things to optimize for.
Am I the only one on the planet that prefers fluid game play over 1080p content that grinds to a fucking halt every time you hit a trashbin in a park (GTA4 example) or when the game spawns to many enemies (Halo 3, Mass Effect) or just generally gets overwhelmed. A prime example where the game actually looks decent and fps doesn't take a constant hit is DMC4, while not a incredibly good game, it still looked nice and kept a decent frame rate. (And yes, I realize that DMC4 is not even close to as expansive as the GTA4 city is, but still, it shows it can be done)
But meh, seems most console gamers of today are content with 15-20 fps.
However there is one thing I haven't seen mentioned yet.
Immersion, noisy consoles and shitty FPS.
Honestly, I have a really hard time enjoying a conversation in game when my 360 is doing it's normal LOUD-AS-FUCK thing. I fondly remember when consoles didn't sound like badly built PC's by some cheap retard . Or when the games themselves didn't have constant slowdowns (yes yes I know, games back then had slowdowns as well but not to the extent that 360 games does)
Now, I'm an incredibly spoiled PC-gamer tard, so I'm used to high fps, OR (and this is something that I guess console games will never offer) I could lower the settings in any given game, to trade in more fps at the expense of details etc.
Having said that I wish they actually spent a little more time making the game fluid, then... whatever else they were doing. But it's not really isolated to GTA4, it seems like fluid FPS/steady FPS is a criteria extremely low on any developers list of things to optimize for.
Am I the only one on the planet that prefers fluid game play over 1080p content that grinds to a fucking halt every time you hit a trashbin in a park (GTA4 example) or when the game spawns to many enemies (Halo 3, Mass Effect) or just generally gets overwhelmed. A prime example where the game actually looks decent and fps doesn't take a constant hit is DMC4, while not a incredibly good game, it still looked nice and kept a decent frame rate. (And yes, I realize that DMC4 is not even close to as expansive as the GTA4 city is, but still, it shows it can be done)
But meh, seems most console gamers of today are content with 15-20 fps.
I really wasn't expecting Yahtzee to provide the most, um, stable review of GTA IV to date, but I'm glad someone finally reviewed the game without foaming at the mouth like Cujo on ecstasy. Still, a tad mellow for what we've come to expect from our beloved machine gun mouth. Low on caffeine, Y?
Look, I can understand both sides of the arguements for a game like GTA IV, I mean, there is gonna be a limit to just how large you can make the sandbox and a limit to all these little sidequests you put in and hidden features (I for one am still trying to find all the oysters on GTA:SA -without!- cheating and using a map or FAQ).
Now I for one enjoy finding out all the little side tidbits for you to do (usually looking at the player stats page will suffice, remember -Seagulls sniped- on Vice City?) but if Rock* aint careful soon they are gonna make a game that is so huge it just aint worth the effort to move off the first street... I mean, at least this time round they had the goddamn decency to give the option to cab it around the city.
Overall I agree with a lot of what Yahtzee said (in between laughing my ass off at it)...
This is a great game... just going to be a little tedious to reach the 100% complete...
Now I for one enjoy finding out all the little side tidbits for you to do (usually looking at the player stats page will suffice, remember -Seagulls sniped- on Vice City?) but if Rock* aint careful soon they are gonna make a game that is so huge it just aint worth the effort to move off the first street... I mean, at least this time round they had the goddamn decency to give the option to cab it around the city.
Overall I agree with a lot of what Yahtzee said (in between laughing my ass off at it)...
This is a great game... just going to be a little tedious to reach the 100% complete...
Hah. Good points on a great but flawed game.
I'm a little surprised that he didn't lay into the ultra-annoying fail a mission and being sent all the way back to where the briefing ends instead of where the mission actually begins. This necessitates an often long and tedious drive during which you're quite liable to knock a police car and have to take an annoying detour, just to get to the point where you can start the whole cycle over again. Not to mention the complete lack of checkpoints even on the longest multi-stage missions.
I know it's still an improvement on retrying missions from the previous games, but it's as if Rockstar thought 'Well, considering how challenging it is just to persuade a car to do a simple thing like turn a corner at anything above walking speed without toppling a lampost or anything else that has the misfortune to be within a 20 metre radius of where you actually -wanted- to go, it would almost seem like -cheating- to let people skip that bit and get to the point where the mission actually begins.' I don't actually mind the driving, and I appreciate that when I'm with someone in a car, the pre-mission banter changes if I have to repeat it - that's mighty cool. But if I succeeded in driving to the mission area once, I don't see why I should have to go through all that down time again just to get back to the point where I stupidly fell off my motorbike and failed the chase.
The problem is, the game IS really fun, and everyone seems to agree on that, which means that what are actually pretty big flaws end up treated as minor niggles. They're not. They're things which need fixing. They're actually things that make me and other people switch the game off for the night, or get into a really bad mood with it.
I'm a little surprised that he didn't lay into the ultra-annoying fail a mission and being sent all the way back to where the briefing ends instead of where the mission actually begins. This necessitates an often long and tedious drive during which you're quite liable to knock a police car and have to take an annoying detour, just to get to the point where you can start the whole cycle over again. Not to mention the complete lack of checkpoints even on the longest multi-stage missions.
I know it's still an improvement on retrying missions from the previous games, but it's as if Rockstar thought 'Well, considering how challenging it is just to persuade a car to do a simple thing like turn a corner at anything above walking speed without toppling a lampost or anything else that has the misfortune to be within a 20 metre radius of where you actually -wanted- to go, it would almost seem like -cheating- to let people skip that bit and get to the point where the mission actually begins.' I don't actually mind the driving, and I appreciate that when I'm with someone in a car, the pre-mission banter changes if I have to repeat it - that's mighty cool. But if I succeeded in driving to the mission area once, I don't see why I should have to go through all that down time again just to get back to the point where I stupidly fell off my motorbike and failed the chase.
The problem is, the game IS really fun, and everyone seems to agree on that, which means that what are actually pretty big flaws end up treated as minor niggles. They're not. They're things which need fixing. They're actually things that make me and other people switch the game off for the night, or get into a really bad mood with it.
Nice review but I think the comment about the police being too easy was not right. If you only have 1 star wanted level you can lose them easy but you get 3,4 or 5 it becomes much harder.
After playing the game, my only thought was 'meh'. Basically the same game as the past 4 but with new flaws thrown in. Bear in mind that Rockstar is offering free downloads of the 3 original Scottish games (GTA, London & 2).
Yahtzee's right though. What's with the grey and brown these days? Why can't we have red in games. Remember that, Red?
Yahtzee's right though. What's with the grey and brown these days? Why can't we have red in games. Remember that, Red?
Yahtzee certainly nailed most of the negative features about the game. Darkness looks ok on a computer monitor, but it doesn't look all that great on my 720x480 television. The driving is a bit frustrating because of the sloppy breaking (and spinning out), so I end up taking a cab if I am able to see one. The way cops are easily avoided is to make up for how they're incredibly powerful in this game. You could have 4 stars in Vice City and it would still take a while for them to gun you down. In this, 2 stars means they're shooting shotguns at you, and you go down fast. Still a great game though.
"Yeah, it's much more fun to punch people to death and run around wearing the same track suit you start with."
Replace punch with stab, and that's what I do in this game. I've made more money from stabbing people than I've made from the actual missions, and I'm about 20% done the game!
"Yeah, it's much more fun to punch people to death and run around wearing the same track suit you start with."
Replace punch with stab, and that's what I do in this game. I've made more money from stabbing people than I've made from the actual missions, and I'm about 20% done the game!
Well sorry about that. Yeah, I meant the Niko/HL2 comparison--and I did say Gordon Frohman, as opposed to, say, Gordon *Freeman*. Mr. Bubbles mentioned Concerned, and if you didn't quite get the joke, I suppose this is a good a time as any to link to the webcomic it referred to.Indigo_Dingo said:
http://www.hlcomic.com/ Putting Garry's Mod to good use.
As always, a gloriously objective review.
The only reviewer i've seen so far who can actually see past the good things in a game, no matter how good they may be, to point out the bad bits.
And i regret watching this at uni, beause laughing out loud in a huge quiet room makes you feel somewhat conspicuous xD
Marvelous.
The only reviewer i've seen so far who can actually see past the good things in a game, no matter how good they may be, to point out the bad bits.
And i regret watching this at uni, beause laughing out loud in a huge quiet room makes you feel somewhat conspicuous xD
Marvelous.
While your review was excellent, probably my favorite part of the video was your choice of end song.
Not a bad review but a bit lacking, a few points Ben misses.
1. The idea of taking your friends out is to keep them happy and this benefits you, for instance Bruice will pick you up in a helicopter once he likes you, Packie will blow things up, roman will get you a cab, little Jacob will sell you weapons on the cheap etc all which will help out later on in the game.
2. Early on in the game there are plenty of side missions, each friend can give you various jobs.
3. Ben adjust your graphics settings, with the default setup on some large screens the contrast and brightness need a bit of massaging (xbox360).
Still I have got to say with such a big game Ben?s review seems a bit light , I personally think GTA 4 is the best in the series so far I do though have my own few gripes like the save game format which is still a la ps2 and gets old pretty fast, and the radio stations have to much GTA 4 made music and not enough real world tracks and to much of world gets turned off during certain missions, like during packies bank heist helicopters and boats seem to be absent from the game while the mission is running?all in all I would give the game a 9 out 10.
P/S one small tip the game is designed in 720p native so going 1080i/p will just give you blurry textures.
1. The idea of taking your friends out is to keep them happy and this benefits you, for instance Bruice will pick you up in a helicopter once he likes you, Packie will blow things up, roman will get you a cab, little Jacob will sell you weapons on the cheap etc all which will help out later on in the game.
2. Early on in the game there are plenty of side missions, each friend can give you various jobs.
3. Ben adjust your graphics settings, with the default setup on some large screens the contrast and brightness need a bit of massaging (xbox360).
Still I have got to say with such a big game Ben?s review seems a bit light , I personally think GTA 4 is the best in the series so far I do though have my own few gripes like the save game format which is still a la ps2 and gets old pretty fast, and the radio stations have to much GTA 4 made music and not enough real world tracks and to much of world gets turned off during certain missions, like during packies bank heist helicopters and boats seem to be absent from the game while the mission is running?all in all I would give the game a 9 out 10.
P/S one small tip the game is designed in 720p native so going 1080i/p will just give you blurry textures.
GTA 4 fun factor = Very high
GTA 4 realism factor = Epic Fail
I'm sorry, but by trying to make the game more realistic, they made it even less so than the first GTA. Not to say that I don't like the game, but I'd rather play multiplayer in GTA 3, and drive the cars in Crackdown... Now that was some crazy driving!
GTA 4 realism factor = Epic Fail
I'm sorry, but by trying to make the game more realistic, they made it even less so than the first GTA. Not to say that I don't like the game, but I'd rather play multiplayer in GTA 3, and drive the cars in Crackdown... Now that was some crazy driving!
It's sad though. I mean, you can't touch a cops' car but you can totally destroy anything and anyone around them. When the early tutorial stated that cops were on the lookout for crime, it made me happy, only to realize that "crime" meant touching their car or whatever is scripted in missions. The sand box mode leave a lot to be desired on that side. Add the super unrealistic car driving, and you have a game that feels more like Crazy Taxi with guns than GTA.Uszi said:
It just doesn't feel like being a criminal trying to climb the crime ladder, but rather as just another anonymous guy in a city where cops don't give a shit about anything beside the paint job on their cars. Maybe Rockstar wanted to depict a city with corrupted officials, but if it was the case, the story wouldn't make sense anymore.
If I have a wish for a patch, it would be to fix the crazy ass handbrake sliding and give eyes to the freaking cops. Passing a red lights, provoking accidents or gun fights, it should all be considered crimes IMHO. You can stop players from camping near the ATMs and stabbing everyone for cash, but you can make the cops act like cops, and seeing at how they are the *only* treat to Bellic in the game, it would make sense too.
EDIT : Oh and that patch should fix the annoying traffic in multiplayers races. It doesn't make sense. I understand that they had to do something to give the impression of a city with a lot of cars, but those "traffic cloud" sticking only to players in cars is stupid. And cut down on the car lights when flying at night. It doesn't take a genius to see that they are fake. Plus, they disappear when they are near the bottom of the screen.