Zero Punctuation: Halo Wars

xopher

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Mar 16, 2009
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What is the deal with being the "first" to write a comment? Really who gives a ****?

Anyway,about Yahtzee's latest review, I seem to agree with him on most points. RTS games DO NOT translate well to consoles. I tried the demo and wasn't too impressed; seemed more like a dumbed down Starcraft to me.

LOL he was VERY pissed at the end, and I can't say I wouldn't be pissed too. I really hate time limit missions then end up having to start the whole damn thing over when you fail.

That said however, I'm anxiously waiting for Starcraft 2.
 

SandroTheMaster

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Apr 2, 2009
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xopher said:
What is the deal with being the "first" to write a comment? Really who gives a ****?

Anyway,about Yahtzee's latest review, I seem to agree with him on most points. RTS games DO NOT translate well to consoles. I tried the demo and wasn't too impressed; seemed more like a dumbed down Starcraft to me.

LOL he was VERY pissed at the end, and I can't say I wouldn't be pissed too. I really hate time limit missions then end up having to start the whole damn thing over when you fail.

That said however, I'm anxiously waiting for Starcraft 2.
Is everyone going to speak up Starcraft here? Here's a reason why Yahtzee will hate Starcraft with all his being if he reviews it: It is the Halo of RTSs. It was innovative, yes. More than TEN YEARS AGO. Now Starcraft II is going to be about EXACTLY the same, with some units changed and a graphical upgrade. It will sell well? Of course. Halo sells well, it doesn't mean it is a good game in comparison to other action games. Neither is Starcraft nowdays. He complained about the pace of Halo Wars, which is too fast for an RTS. So even a game in the pace of Starcraft will be too slow. Like Yahtzee himself said, he doesn't have the patience to play a RTS (and probably would get urges to kill himself if he tried the more sophisticated, but also much more slow-paced RTSs out there). Look, Diablo did to RPGs what Starcraft does to RTSs, it completely ruined an outsider idea of the genre, and in part made a completely new approach to these genres that can be done by cookie-cutter by anyone. Now, tell me: Why do no Diablo clone or Starcraft clone (other than C&C, which had it's own fanbase already) is ever successful? Because the playstyle is boring and repetitive. Diablo and Starcraft only keep the success because the fans are real fanatics. They keep themselves restrained to the experience they had some dozen of years ago when it was new and never, ever let go.

No. I'm not a Blizzard hater. I love what they did to give credit to the gaming industry and thanks to WoW now it is actually acknowledged by the society. Also, I loved their games, in their golden days, when they were an interesting new idea in the plate. But I'll always bash a company that completely avoids evolving for reliance on a completely faithful fanbase that'll never allow them to change. Many may bash EA, but they use the economic stability given by their franchise series to let some devs take a chance every now and then. Blizzard seems to only be making the same game again and again for the last decade, without even at least reasonably evolving the concepts every now and then because the fanbase wouldn't allow it.

Lastly, if I can think of an RTS Yahtzee might enjoy, here's one: Sacrifice. It has a delightful new premise, it has a different gameplay, it has completely original art design and it is completely insane. Much like Psychonauts in the Action/adventure genre.
 

NewGeekPhilosopher

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Feb 25, 2009
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Yahtzee should review Noby Noby Boy next, it should give him some amusing material to work with.

Either that or GTA: Chinatown Wars.
 

xopher

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Mar 16, 2009
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SandroTheMaster said:
xopher said:
What is the deal with being the "first" to write a comment? Really who gives a ****?

Anyway,about Yahtzee's latest review, I seem to agree with him on most points. RTS games DO NOT translate well to consoles. I tried the demo and wasn't too impressed; seemed more like a dumbed down Starcraft to me.

LOL he was VERY pissed at the end, and I can't say I wouldn't be pissed too. I really hate time limit missions then end up having to start the whole damn thing over when you fail.

That said however, I'm anxiously waiting for Starcraft 2.
Is everyone going to speak up Starcraft here? Here's a reason why Yahtzee will hate Starcraft with all his being if he reviews it: It is the Halo of RTSs. It was innovative, yes. More than TEN YEARS AGO. Now Starcraft II is going to be about EXACTLY the same, with some units changed and a graphical upgrade. It will sell well? Of course. Halo sells well, it doesn't mean it is a good game in comparison to other action games. Neither is Starcraft nowdays. He complained about the pace of Halo Wars, which is too fast for an RTS. So even a game in the pace of Starcraft will be too slow. Like Yahtzee himself said, he doesn't have the patience to play a RTS (and probably would get urges to kill himself if he tried the more sophisticated, but also much more slow-paced RTSs out there). Look, Diablo did to RPGs what Starcraft does to RTSs, it completely ruined an outsider idea of the genre, and in part made a completely new approach to these genres that can be done by cookie-cutter by anyone. Now, tell me: Why do no Diablo clone or Starcraft clone (other than C&C, which had it's own fanbase already) is ever successful? Because the playstyle is boring and repetitive. Diablo and Starcraft only keep the success because the fans are real fanatics. They keep themselves restrained to the experience they had some dozen of years ago when it was new and never, ever let go.

No. I'm not a Blizzard hater. I love what they did to give credit to the gaming industry and thanks to WoW now it is actually acknowledged by the society. Also, I loved their games, in their golden days, when they were an interesting new idea in the plate. But I'll always bash a company that completely avoids evolving for reliance on a completely faithful fanbase that'll never allow them to change. Many may bash EA, but they use the economic stability given by their franchise series to let some devs take a chance every now and then. Blizzard seems to only be making the same game again and again for the last decade, without even at least reasonably evolving the concepts every now and then because the fanbase wouldn't allow it.

Lastly, if I can think of an RTS Yahtzee might enjoy, here's one: Sacrifice. It has a delightful new premise, it has a different gameplay, it has completely original art design and it is completely insane. Much like Psychonauts in the Action/adventure genre.
Believe it or not, people STILL like RTS's. I (and MANY people) have been waiting for Starcraft 2 since beating the first one 10 years ago. Fans have been begging Blizzard for a sequel for ages and after a while it seemed they wouldn't make it; even though we get 2 Warcraft sequels. I'm not sure how Starcraft will be and neither do you. I'm hoping Blizzard DOES bring new things to the table this time around. If the game is good, great, if not then I will say as such. Don't bash fans because of what game they like. Personally, I hate EA games like Madden, NBA Live, etc because I think it's the same crap year after year with just new gimmicks, but some people do like them, and I don't criticize them for doing so. And no, I seriously doubt Yahtzee will hate a game JUST because many other people like it. I have seen ALL his reviews and it's obvious he can think for himself and could care less about what other people think about a game.

Speaking of which of RTS's, they are the only Blizzard games I like, I don't think I could get into WoW and never really got into Diablo. To me RTS's are a break from the typical shoot em up games these days. Speaking of shoot em ups, I now despise Halo, sure it was fun when I played it, but I can't even play it anymore, and I doubt I will be getting anymore Halo games. Additionally, The COD series got VERY old prior to Modern Warfare and I wasn't going to buy anymore COD games if they were only going to be WWII based. COD4 was a godsend and I have no idea why they decided to go BACK to WWII with COD:WAW needless to say I won't get WAW, WWII games are played out and over produced. Blizzard never had a sequel for Starcraft so at least give them a chance to see what they come up with. Like I said if it sucks, I will say as such, but in either case I'm anxious to see the game.

I will however have to check out that Sacrifice game that you mentioned. I'm reading the synopsis now, and seems like an interesting concept.
 

LumiHawke

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Dec 5, 2008
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It is official that Halo Wars has to be one of the worst RTS games that has come out in the past decade. It is no joke either. Compared to more resent RTS games from the past 3 years Halo Wars seems like something from the 90s, and I wasn't a good fan of 90s RTS games all but a few which focused on field tactics over army/resource managment. I bought Empire Total War, it is apsolutely amazing, and I didn't like really the earlier Total War games, just the napoleonic age of warfare is something that few RTS games really focus on and yet do sucha nice job at it, naval battles are *hearts* ground battles are just as nice.

I thought Starcraft and the C&C series was crap, and Halo Wars looks like a primitive version of StarCraft... so you can see how I view the game. lol
 

EscChaos

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Feb 14, 2008
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In a normal case I would be alarmed at a cross-over; them often being little more than a desperate way for two shows to find unity in their own decline and attempt to leach onto eachothers fan-bases as a pair of starving -- well... leaches.

Therefore I am almost ashamed to admit that it worked. Though not previously having payed any heed to the passable advertisement for some kind of "unskippable" series I today found myself sitting through the entire season and will probably, at least in the short term, continue to follow it. Damn you Yahtzee, you mastermind!
 

SandroTheMaster

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Apr 2, 2009
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xopher said:
Believe it or not, people STILL like RTS's. I (and MANY people) have been waiting for Starcraft 2 since beating the first one 10 years ago. Fans have been begging Blizzard for a sequel for ages and after a while it seemed they wouldn't make it; even though we get 2 Warcraft sequels. I'm not sure how Starcraft will be and neither do you. I'm hoping Blizzard DOES bring new things to the table this time around. If the game is good, great, if not then I will say as such. Don't bash fans because of what game they like. Personally, I hate EA games like Madden, NBA Live, etc because I think it's the same crap year after year with just new gimmicks, but some people do like them, and I don't criticize them for doing so. And no, I seriously doubt Yahtzee will hate a game JUST because many other people like it. I have seen ALL his reviews and it's obvious he can think for himself and could care less about what other people think about a game.

Speaking of which of RTS's, they are the only Blizzard games I like, I don't think I could get into WoW and never really got into Diablo. To me RTS's are a break from the typical shoot em up games these days. Speaking of shoot em ups, I now despise Halo, sure it was fun when I played it, but I can't even play it anymore, and I doubt I will be getting anymore Halo games. Additionally, The COD series got VERY old prior to Modern Warfare and I wasn't going to buy anymore COD games if they were only going to be WWII based. COD4 was a godsend and I have no idea why they decided to go BACK to WWII with COD:WAW needless to say I won't get WAW, WWII games are played out and over produced. Blizzard never had a sequel for Starcraft so at least give them a chance to see what they come up with. Like I said if it sucks, I will say as such, but in either case I'm anxious to see the game.

I will however have to check out that Sacrifice game that you mentioned. I'm reading the synopsis now, and seems like an interesting concept.
I never said people don't like RTS. I love RTS, it is one of my favorite genres. I'm just saying that I'm so far unimpressed with SCII (and I've seem more than a few alpha playtests). Look for my posts in the last page, I explain why.

Now, about EA, they at least deserve some credit. Sure they sell the same cookie-cutter every year, but if it sells so well, who can blame them? What is commendable is how they don't keep only with their cookie-cutter (like, well, Blizzard). They're paying for the upcoming Dragon Age and Dante's Inferno, two games with new interesting concepts. While they also launched Dead Space and Mirror Edge (which are new different takes on FPSs, regardless what Yahtzee said). So it is not so bad, really. Tell, me: Does it seems like Blizzard is making any real change's with SCII? Or better yet, in Diablo III? Is it anything new? Hells, the greatest change's I've seem in Diablo III were being mercilessly bashed by fans (Witch Doctors and new Art concept), so they even backed out for one of these (Art Concept).
 

kallenator

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Jan 16, 2008
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RowdyRukia said:
awesome reference to Battle Royale! best japanese movie of all time!!
No no no no...

Final Fantasy Advent Children, Best Japanese movie ever period
 

TheZaius

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May 7, 2008
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Best Japanese movie is clearly Godzilla. You know... the one from 1998.

Anyway, this review was great.
 

xopher

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Mar 16, 2009
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SandroTheMaster said:
xopher said:
Believe it or not, people STILL like RTS's. I (and MANY people) have been waiting for Starcraft 2 since beating the first one 10 years ago. Fans have been begging Blizzard for a sequel for ages and after a while it seemed they wouldn't make it; even though we get 2 Warcraft sequels. I'm not sure how Starcraft will be and neither do you. I'm hoping Blizzard DOES bring new things to the table this time around. If the game is good, great, if not then I will say as such. Don't bash fans because of what game they like. Personally, I hate EA games like Madden, NBA Live, etc because I think it's the same crap year after year with just new gimmicks, but some people do like them, and I don't criticize them for doing so. And no, I seriously doubt Yahtzee will hate a game JUST because many other people like it. I have seen ALL his reviews and it's obvious he can think for himself and could care less about what other people think about a game.

Speaking of which of RTS's, they are the only Blizzard games I like, I don't think I could get into WoW and never really got into Diablo. To me RTS's are a break from the typical shoot em up games these days. Speaking of shoot em ups, I now despise Halo, sure it was fun when I played it, but I can't even play it anymore, and I doubt I will be getting anymore Halo games. Additionally, The COD series got VERY old prior to Modern Warfare and I wasn't going to buy anymore COD games if they were only going to be WWII based. COD4 was a godsend and I have no idea why they decided to go BACK to WWII with COD:WAW needless to say I won't get WAW, WWII games are played out and over produced. Blizzard never had a sequel for Starcraft so at least give them a chance to see what they come up with. Like I said if it sucks, I will say as such, but in either case I'm anxious to see the game.

I will however have to check out that Sacrifice game that you mentioned. I'm reading the synopsis now, and seems like an interesting concept.
I never said people don't like RTS. I love RTS, it is one of my favorite genres. I'm just saying that I'm so far unimpressed with SCII (and I've seem more than a few alpha playtests). Look for my posts in the last page, I explain why.

Now, about EA, they at least deserve some credit. Sure they sell the same cookie-cutter every year, but if it sells so well, who can blame them? What is commendable is how they don't keep only with their cookie-cutter (like, well, Blizzard). They're paying for the upcoming Dragon Age and Dante's Inferno, two games with new interesting concepts. While they also launched Dead Space and Mirror Edge (which are new different takes on FPSs, regardless what Yahtzee said). So it is not so bad, really. Tell, me: Does it seems like Blizzard is making any real change's with SCII? Or better yet, in Diablo III? Is it anything new? Hells, the greatest change's I've seem in Diablo III were being mercilessly bashed by fans (Witch Doctors and new Art concept), so they even backed out for one of these (Art Concept).
Ok I get your point now.

To answer your questions about Blizz, I've never played Diablo so I wouldn't know what is new with Diablo 3. But as far as SCII, based on the videos I've seen, nope, nothing really new, but I will have to see the final product before I make a final determination. Blizzard did however bring something new to the table with Warcraft 3, with the introduction of "Heros". Many fans didn't like it, but I did. To me I think WC3 was a big improvement over WC2, and I guess I am kind of expecting the same with SC2. I haven't seen the SC2 vids in a while, so I can't remember if there were "heroes" in it, but I would welcome them.

When the game is FINALLY released, you may be right and it may end up being the same game as the original. but as of right now I'm just welcoming a sequel as I have been waiting so long for one; I just hope its worth the wait. The last few sequels I have bought have been a bit underwhelming (GOW2, Ninja Gaiden 2, GTAIV,)
 

nightazday

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Apr 5, 2009
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the point of RTS's is Massacre

pretend that the opposing side is a village of people you hate and it will all make sense
 

Kogarian

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Feb 24, 2008
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Wow, Yahtzee must really suck at RTS. And for constantly complaining about RPG's, shooters, and now RTS's, I'm wondering if he's even a fan of gaming.