Lifting Masks = Back to Getting Down With The Sickness

[Agema]

More in depth.

Of course, America's Frontline Doctors claims it is not anti-vaxxer group. It claims on its website that several of its leaders are innoculated. I find it interesting, however, that they do not state what for: because of course they might be saying that truthfully for being innoculated against tetanus, Hep B, etc. without a single one having had the covid vaccine.

I did have a look through their website last week. It's very carefully presented, especially to target typical right wing memes - freedom from interference, regulation, Big Pharma manipulation, etc. It is a prime exponent of what Phoenixmgs is saying with "let doctors doctor". And it is also the reason why I think "let doctors doctor" requires massive caveats, because if the doctors doctoring are anything like those chuckleheads, it's a licence for medical malpractice.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

Of course, America's Frontline Doctors claims it is not anti-vaxxer group. It claims on its website that several of its leaders are innoculated. I find it interesting, however, that they do not state what for: because of course they might be saying that truthfully for being innoculated against tetanus, Hep B, etc. without a single one having had the covid vaccine.

I did have a look through their website last week. It's very carefully presented, especially to target typical right wing memes - freedom from interference, regulation, Big Pharma manipulation, etc. It is a prime exponent of what Phoenixmgs is saying with "let doctors doctor". And it is also the reason why I think "let doctors doctor" requires massive caveats, because if the doctors doctoring are anything like those chuckleheads, it's a licence for medical malpractice.

There's another similar group called the Front Line COVID Critical Care alliance, and looking at their website is a trip into vitamins and Ivermectin. But I do have to give props to the AFD for posing in front of the Alamo with a double exposure of a bald eagle, really sells them. The FLCCC just tries to look like a legit website instead of an obvious political plant.

 

[Agema]

There's another similar group called the Front Line COVID Critical Care alliance, and looking at their website is a trip into vitamins and Ivermectin. But I do have to give props to the AFD for posing in front of the Alamo with a double exposure of a bald eagle, really sells them. The FLCCC just tries to look like a legit website instead of an obvious political plant.

FLCCC Alliance are a really major step up from America's Frontline Doctors. They are - thankfully - not thoroughly rejecting science, tell you to mask up and get a vaccine ASAP. However, the "I-MASK" protocol they are fannying around with looks like throwing a very dubious load of shit at covid: as if they've just picked pretty much anything with a lick of the lightest evidence and decided to bung that in. Just to be clear where they are here, they don't have fucking scientific evidence, they have anecdotes and testimonials... from people where it's completely unclear that their treatment did a damn bit of difference from conventional standard of care. It's crankery borderline or actual, and their self-aggrandising tactics make them look like top class narcissists (#followthescience, they bewilderingly claim in self-justification). But I don't think their bullshit is dangerous, or that they have any significant political angle.

Members of America's Frontline Doctors probably should have medical boards very carefully consider their licences. They are very clearly promoting anti-vaccination sentiment: there are boilerplate statements to obfuscate and evade obvious liability, but their attempts to scare people off the covid vaccine are plain. Their stupid online pharmacy is a disgusting money-making scam where patients are being charged WAY over cost for their drugs, and obviously the drugs have no proven efficacy. And they are very clearly very right wing.

 

[crimson5pheonix]

FLCCC Alliance are a really major step up from America's Frontline Doctors. They are - thankfully - not thoroughly rejecting science, tell you to mask up and get a vaccine ASAP. However, the "I-MASK" protocol they are fannying around with looks like throwing a very dubious load of shit at covid: as if they've just picked pretty much anything with a lick of the lightest evidence and decided to bung that in. Just to be clear where they are here, they don't have fucking scientific evidence, they have anecdotes and testimonials... from people where it's completely unclear that their treatment did a damn bit of difference from conventional standard of care. It's crankery borderline or actual, and their self-aggrandising tactics make them look like top class narcissists (#followthescience, they bewilderingly claim in self-justification). But I don't think their bullshit is dangerous, or that they have any significant political angle.

Members of America's Frontline Doctors probably should have medical boards very carefully consider their licences. They are very clearly promoting anti-vaccination sentiment: there are boilerplate statements to obfuscate and evade obvious liability, but their attempts to scare people off the covid vaccine are plain. Their stupid online pharmacy is a disgusting money-making scam where patients are being charged WAY over cost for their drugs, and obviously the drugs have no proven efficacy. And they are very clearly very right wing.

Now you say that, but FLCCC has a Twitter where they cut loose.

 

[Gergar12]

What the hell does any of this have with your decision not to wear a mask, and your misplaced belief that this only endangers anti-vaxxers?

I never said it only affects anti-vaxers I said mostly affects them.

 

[Agema]

Now you say that, but FLCCC has a Twitter where they cut loose.

Oh. Oh dear. That is bad.

 

[Buyetyen]

I never said it only affects anti-vaxers I said mostly affects them.

In other words, you're okay with the collateral damage of effecting people who are not anti-vax, so you can get at the ones who are. You're a bad person.

 

[Agema]

Can I interject here as something of a non-sequitur, that I remembered back early-mid June I predicted the USA would probably be over 100,000 new cases and ~500 deaths a day in a month's time (would be into the thousands were it not for vaccination)? The actual figures were ~120,000 and ~650 respectively.

If only I had done this through a YouTube channel, Phoenixmgs might be hailing me as the infallible voice of truth, like he did Marty Makary, Dr. John Campbell and ZDogg MD.

 

[Gergar12]

In other words, you're okay with the collateral damage of effecting people who are not anti-vax, so you can get at the ones who are. You're a bad person.

Every single time the left-wing has come close to winning in the world we have been crushed. Bernie got crushed twice. The Chilian president Salvador Allende, and 1953 Iranian president Mohammad Mosaddegh got crushed. Arab socialism got crushed. There is currently a fight between neoliberalism and leftism in South America, and while I don’t know what will happen, I suspect they will lose as well.



I have had it with these soft bullshit approaches. We have tried it your way, and Nina Turner lost, and the Justice Democrats don’t act like the Tea Party, and Bernie lost twice. I am going to be opportunistic, ruthless, Machiavellian, and I am going to use a means towards an end approach to dealing with climate change, and capitalism in the long run. No, I am not going to attack the right-wing with violence, or the centrists, but I am going to use this opportunity to counter the people who are ruining this planet, and this country, or at the very least their suffering is of no concern to me.



Also, I don’t care if I am a “bad person”. They called Joe Biden a bad person for leaving Afghanistan. It’s a subjective opinion that has no basis in pragmatic direct action, and indirect action used by the left.

 

[Buyetyen]

Every single time the left-wing has come close to winning in the world we have been crushed. Bernie got crushed twice. The Chilian president Salvador Allende, and 1953 Iranian president Mohammad Mosaddegh got crushed. Arab socialism got crushed. There is currently a fight between neoliberalism and leftism in South America, and while I don’t know what will happen, I suspect they will lose as well.



I have had it with these soft bullshit approaches. We have tried it your way, and Nina Turner lost, and the Justice Democrats don’t act like the Tea Party, and Bernie lost twice. I am going to be opportunistic, ruthless, Machiavellian, and I am going to use a means towards an end approach to dealing with climate change, and capitalism in the long run. No, I am not going to attack the right-wing with violence, or the centrists, but I am going to use this opportunity to counter the people who are ruining this planet, and this country, or at the very least their suffering is of no concern to me.



Also, I don’t care if I am a “bad person”. They called Joe Biden a bad person for leaving Afghanistan. It’s a subjective opinion that has no basis in pragmatic direct action, and indirect action used by the left.

Progress is not guaranteed. And it's that much harder to achieve if you compromise all your values in the name of winning.

 

[Gergar12]

Progress is not guaranteed. And it's that much harder to achieve if you compromise all your values in the name of winning.

Tell that to Trump. He won, and he flip-flopped on everything. He compromises all of his values.

 

[Buyetyen]

Tell that to Trump. He won, and he flip-flopped on everything. He compromises all of his values.

And what kind of victory will you achieve doing the same thing?

 

[Gergar12]

And what kind of victory will you achieve doing the same thing?

A world without billionaires, climate change, and with M4A along with a whole host of progressive, and democratic socialist policies.

Oh the victory... Basically this

 

[crimson5pheonix]

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/state/texas/article253739053.html

It's spread to Texas.

The stupid that is.

 

[Dalisclock]

https://www.star-telegram.com/news/state/texas/article253739053.html

It's spread to Texas.

The stupid that is.

MUST NOT MAKE JOKE.......

 

[Silvanus]

I never said it only affects anti-vaxers I said mostly affects them.

Firstly: you have no idea if this is true either. If an anti-vaxxer catches it, and then passes it onto someone immunocompromised, or takes vital time/resources in A&E, then the anti-vaxxer could easily recover and the immunocompromised could not.

Secondly: if you recognise that you're also endangering people who aren't anti-vaxxers, what does that say about your stance?

 

[Agema]

Tell that to Trump. He won, and he flip-flopped on everything. He compromises all of his values.

Slight correction there:

Donald Trump doesn't have any values - or at least, not in the sense you mean. It would be more accurate to say he flip-flopped on stuff he said he'd do or cared about.

Donald Trump only truly believes in one thing, and that is the greater glory of Donald Trump. Literally nothing else matters but his ego and self-aggrandisement. In his relentless self-interest, self-service and self-gratification he was utterly consistent with that one, sole value.

 

[Buyetyen]

A world without billionaires, climate change, and with M4A along with a whole host of progressive, and democratic socialist policies.

Oh the victory... Basically this

And you think you can achieve a utopia by selling out all of your values and cutting every throat that gets in your way?

 

[Seanchaidh]

And you think you can achieve a utopia by selling out all of your values and cutting every throat that gets in your way?

Such ruthlessness probably has a better case to be made for it than a plan to spread a deadly virus that has already mutated into several variants.

 

[AnxietyProne]

Meanwhile, poor Hydroxychloroquine is sitting on her stoop in the rain, dressed in her best outfit, makeup streaking down her face, looking at her phone fruitlessly waiting for Trump to call, sobbing that "Conservatives will call me back, I know they will! They said I was a MIRACLE! A MIRACLE" before going back to crying...