I don't like it. I'm pretty sure they don't actually want American help because that would (correctly) delegitimize them. But since you want to open that can of worms, Ukraine bans its communist parties and communist symbols. Russia's communist party is the main opposition party currently. So there's a contrast for you. I'll say it again, Ukraine bans its communist parties and communist symbols. This is democracy to you?
Ukraine
- Thread starter Silvanus
- Start date
With the same law which bans Nazi Symbols.
A law which was criticized by the Vienna convention btw.
And to get some context the banning of the communist party came after 2014 (what is it with that year I wonder?) when the communist party was accused of collaborating with the Eastern Ukrainian separatists. After being unable to ban the "party" based on the crimes of its members they decided to use the decommunization law.
Interesting survey. I admit, i expected less people seeing harm in the breakup of. Though, to be fair, four countries, including all the Baltics were not even asked and those are most vocal about their independence, of the 11 aked, 4 still gave an answer of more good than harm and the surve is roughly a decade old, which means it was done at a time, when most of those countries had experienced the economic problems of the breakup but not yet much of the recovery.
Former Soviet Countries See More Harm From Breakup
As the 22<sup>nd</sup> anniversary of the Soviet Union's collapse approaches next week, residents in seven out of 11 former Soviet republics are more likely to say the breakup harmed their countries than benefited them.news.gallup.com
That's the year when neo-Nazis helped propel a popular protest into a western-backed regime change.
And that's the year a neo Fascist called Putin decided to invade Crimea and stage a military Fascist backed coup in Eastern Ukraine.
And it's that which helped Azov become integral part of Ukraine's national guard and fueled the ban against the communist party. "Funny" how Putin's decisions have a nasty tendency of helping fascists and harming communists.
Bandera had to face the reality that the Soviet Union would not voluntarily release Ukraine. Therefore, he would need an ally to force the USSR to release it, and that necessitates keeping that ally happy. As the only nation able and willing to separate Ukraine from the USSR was Nazi Germany, so he needed to make himself palatable to the Nazis. This is extraordinarily ugly by any measure, but it was also means to a nationalistic end pragmatism rather than ideological.
And let's be clear here: you are pragmatically waving away the mass killing and devastation of Ukraine by a brutal authoritarian regime because it suits your wider objective of opposing Western capitalism, so I think you might have a lot more in common with Bandera than you suppose.
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And Putin himself has played absolutely no role in this. Any evidence to the contrary is Western propaganda.
Remember, Putin is simultaneously the only one capable of stopping Western Imperialism and powerless to control even his own actions as head of state. Russia is a powerful rival of the United States and a poor oppressed colony in the American empire. We have always been at war with Ukraine.
Hey, you're the one who seems to think European countries are "white countries."
We can all use unfortunate phrasing to pretend that everyone we disagree with is expressing overtly racist views, rather than the implicit racial biases which everyone is susceptible to because we all live in a racist society. It's not particularly helpful or accurate, though.
It's particularly unhelpful when we're talking about a war between two countries which are both irredeemably infested with overt institutional and societal racism, including within the political sphere, but acknowledging that is a bit complicated isn't it.
I don't mean to be elitist, but read a book. Learn some actual ideology criticism.
None of the points you are making are as deep or insightful (or unrepresented in the media you criticize) as you think they are.
I don't.
But considering that every argument you've used against Western intervention in Ukraine could just as easily be applied to some hypothetical action in support of Palestine, I have to ask, do you faint with moral outrage at the mere suggestion? We wouldn't want to antagonize poor Issac Herzog by interfering in Israel's sphere of influence would we?
Or is it different because Russia is apparently a "white country"?
It's amusing, because I was going to make the point that arguing with you is exactly like arguing with Zionists (what with the doublethink and all). But thanks for drawing attention to it for me.
Your premises seem no less malleable and self-serving, and I fear the men behind them.
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And generally, the more you materially assist Nazis, the worse.
I seem clear-headed enough to recognise that assisting the Third Reich with an invasion and annexation constitutes collaboration with Nazis, and that gifting somebody an influential job on the basis of their familial relationship to such a POS sends a very bad message.
It's a drastically flawed democracy, as opposed to... no democracy at all. Ukrainian elections are not rigged in favour of a single party. Russian elections are. That "main opposition party" has zero possibility of ever attaining governing power, and its followers are routinely brutalised by state forces.
Russian allowance of oppositional forces is a complete farce.
Yeah, Fascist tend to hate Fascist from other countries. It's not really combatable with any country
Even if Ukraine was complete controlled by fascists, that doesnt mean Russia isnt controlled by fascists
Roughly a decade old, ergo the recovery period after the 2008 financial crisis, many people would have been looking at the past with rose tinted glasses during that era.
No, what keeps happening is you post that one news story about Azov, then you stare meaningfully at it or make some claim about how this all comes down to the west. Then people explain, again, that Azov is what it is because Ukraine was desperate to defend itself after being invaded by your hero, and then you say "west west Nazi's west bad" or you go totally silent.
Nobody is minimizing anything, hell, mostly people are just talking about current events in the war. You just bring this up and others aren't allowing you to try to justify your hero or demonize your government at the cost of Ukrainian agency.
Eventually we may see just how much Russia takes care of their own people as every day new companies are boycotting selling there. What they don’t realize is this really isn’t bothering Putin nearly as much as they’d like to think. The millions of innocent “underlings” though would be a different story.
I mean kinda. Russia has spend the vast majority of its history either subjugating Ukraine and the rest of eastern Europe, or trying to get it back after the subjugation ended.
Cute attempt, but no. I'm promoting an understanding of the origins of this conflict that isn't as shallow as a hallmark card. How many more times do I have to point out that very pro-American experts who are favorable to western capitalism not only opposed the expansion of NATO but predicted exactly this outcome? I'm not presenting you some fringe theory; it's just something that has been excised from media discourse because for whatever reason they want to make the Iraq war run-up look like a shining example of honesty, deliberation, and journalistic integrity by comparison.
I assume you're capable of reading what I've written, but you've given me plenty of reason to doubt that.
Russia is a country that justifiably feels threatened by the most powerful military alliance in human history that has unremittingly moved itself and its weapons closer and closer even after they achieved regime change. It also has thousands of nuclear missiles ready to launch at a moment's notice. Israel is a settler colonial state that exists on stolen land largely at the pleasure of my (and to a lesser extent your) government; it shouldn't really have even existed in the first place, though that ship has sailed by now. The difference between how each is treated by our governments illustrates that sanctions against Russia have nothing to do with any humanitarian concern-- except that they will cause much additional suffering among innocent people.
You're welcome for drawing your attention to an asinine point that you'd have done better not to mention at all. I'll do that for you any time you like.
That I decline to hold Russia to a higher standard than the United States has ever held itself or its dubious allies is not a great point. Why should I expect Putin to act better than the United States? Why would I signal my support of a campaign by the United States to punish Putin for acting like the United States (or the UK)? Why would you?
Putin invaded a country on flimsy pretenses! Oh wow, the United States has never done that.
Putin's country is dominated by a wealthy elite! Not like here, then!
Putin's military is causing civilian casualties! Unheard of.
Putin is making questionable accusations about WMD in Ukraine! Unprecedented.
Putin attacked a hospital! Never before have we seen such things.
The major difference between the United States and Russia is that Russia is doing this in its own neighborhood ostensibly to try to secure itself against a very credible threat of attack. You've jumped on board a train that is very transparently about weakening a target of the most powerful country in human history at the expense of innocents in both Ukraine and Russia. Rationalize it however you like-- and you'll have no shortage of help in doing so-- but that is what you are doing.
This just tells me that you either refuse to see the point of what I've written or that you're comfortable with American imperialism, shallow posturing to the contrary notwithstanding.
This has not convinced me of your clear-headedness. The guy did some diplomacy on behalf of the Soviet Union and made an agreement to secure temporary peace with a monster after capitalist countries rejected Stalin's suggestion of forming an antifascist alliance. This is somehow comparable to-- greater than, even!-- engaging in gleeful pogroms in Nazi occupied territory in your view.
Macca’s masterstroke could end the Russia-Ukraine war | news.com.au — Australia’s leading news site
Golden Arches Theory of Conflict Prevention
That's, um...that's a thing. 0_0
Golden Arches Theory of Conflict Prevention
That's, um...that's a thing. 0_0