US 2024 Presidential Election
- Thread starter gorfias
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This is obviously false. His support is highly conditional.
Everyone angry at traffic who isn't barricading roads.
Yes, those people were nuts. Upset about taxes, they picked a fight with armed soldiers, then lost the fight badly. Most of the soldiers were entirely acquitted, 2 with minimal punishment, their actions justified by the circumstance. The Boston Massacre is more significant in the history of propaganda than the conflict itself, with artists and writers mythologizing the event in real time. The idiots who got themselves shot are meaningless, the people that managed to transform the event into a rallying cry for a movement that became a new nation conceived in liberty are the real story worth telling.
No, those people are all nuts. That's always my point. That's not a carefully formed act of insurrection, attempting to overthrow the government at the behest of Donald Trump, that's a crowd of people who have lost their mind turning into a riot. I remember the day that happened, a co-worker was watching the coverage at work. This co-worker is so Republican, they named their first born after Ronald Reagan, and their exact words on the event were "these people are nuts".
So whataboutism, then.
I'm not criticising you for "not condemning them enough"; I'm criticising you for excusing it by offering so much benefit-of-the-doubt it breaks credibility, while you routinely assume the worst of those on the receiving end of state violence.
So yes, i object more to that than i do to some other forum members being a bit mean about a man who unnecessarily gunned a woman down. Its a functional sense of perspective.
Of course he has. It is amazing how quickly Trump supporters will shift gears. Reasoning exists to back-justify the most recent declarations of Dear Leader.
Trump's said any number of things that had a Democrat President or presidential candidate said would have led to calls for their arrest or worse, and they just nod along because what is said is not remotely as important as who is saying it.
For example:
orDonald Trump said:
Donald Trump said:
But you are objecting to calm suggestion that everyone can be understoodand giving great latitude to people that want to accelerate conflict and make the nation collapse, which is highly dysfunctional.
No, I'm not, because that's not what you offered. I agree everyone can be understood. But the understanding you're insisting we accept is based on foolish assumptions and crafted to excuse heinous actions. I have a different understanding.
Hysteria. I'm merely commenting on the forum posts I find more objectionable, which are yours.
Whereas you're giving great latitude to people who unnecessarily kill other people, so long as they're wearing uniforms; whilst you refuse to give the slightest latitude to those targeted by the government, assuming guilt where none has been established.
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I guess "wearing a silly costume" is an arrestable offense by...checks notes border patrol agents. Not actual police.
I guess he's lucky they didn't shoot him in the face for trying to run them over with his loudspeaker or something.
(Oh, I forgot to mention that Fox News is referring to Minnesota protestors as "agitators". Because you would only protest against unaccountable Federal agents murdering your neighbors if you were paid to.)
I guess he's lucky they didn't shoot him in the face for trying to run them over with his loudspeaker or something.
(Oh, I forgot to mention that Fox News is referring to Minnesota protestors as "agitators". Because you would only protest against unaccountable Federal agents murdering your neighbors if you were paid to.)
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No, you can trust yourself as well, unless you think people don't think barricading traffic is nuts, and then you may also be nuts.
Your understanding is blind hatred that will only inspire further acts of violence.
by ICE
against people who object to their neighbors being abducted by masked gunmen.
- Feb 7, 2011
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42% of the country is in favor of abolishing ICE. They aren't just against what ICE is currently doing, 42% of the country thinks that the entire organization is too corrupt and dysfunctional to continue existing at all. 67% of people think that ICE isn't properly doing their jobs and that their tactics are too forceful.
Trump is underwater on immigration, which used to be his best issue.
So no, an overwhelming majority of America doesn't think these people are psychos. An overwhelming majority of Americans are appalled by the actions of ICE. The response of non-violent protests is completely reasonable and warranted.
Edit: BTW, 4 people died in ICE custody within the first 6 days of the year. More people died in ICE custody in the previous year than in the previous 4 put together, and it's the highest number in 2 decades. And that's only counting the people who have died directly in ICE custody so far, it's not counting the people who ICE have lost (we have no idea where they are and how many, if any of them have died), the people who ICE have killed outside of custody, or the people who died after being deported. The frequency at which people are dying in ICE custody is also increasing, with 22% of the deaths occurring just in December.
2025 was ICE’s deadliest year in two decades. Here are the 32 people who died in custody
The deaths came as the Trump administration ramped up immigration enforcement, detaining a record number of people
www.theguardian.com
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So are you saying that if I agree with your assessment of the situation I have that as a proof and if I disagree I may simply be nuts?
I'm sorry, this conversation started with you claiming Hades, a European, had too little insight into American attitudes to gauge public perception, yet now you are claiming I, another European, will be able to infer the attitudes by thinking. I don't have any more insight than Hades as far as I'm aware, so it remains on the level of "trust me, bro",
It is your explanation here that seeks to excuse the acts of violence that occured, and ensure the perpetrator faces no real repercussions. That's what would open the door to further abuse and further acts.
If there were research posted on the internet, it wouldn't be something you know just by talking to regular people who live here.
And most of even those people think people blocking ICE with their cars are nuts. You can think Democrats cheated in 2020 and still know the Jan 6ers were all crazy. You can hate Charlie Kirk and still know the guy who shot him is a lunatic.
I told you I would likely put him in jail for manslaughter.
More people were deported by ICE last year than in the previous 4 years put together. 59,000 (2021) + 72,000 (2022) + 143,000 (2023) + 271,000 (2024) = 545,000 deportations. 2025 had 605,000. Those 4 years combined from your source had 28 deaths, a rate of 5.14 per 100,000 deportations. 2025 had 32 deaths, a rate of 5.29 per 100,000, a <3% increase from the previous administration. The total being this high now is a rather large jump in absolute terms, but the rates of things are parallel, and notably the pattern of deportations doubling each year is a continuation from the previous administration, and almost certainly related to the use of the CBP One app, which granted people entry with minimal oversight and had ICE as the only mechanism available to remove people whose asylum claims are denied after they're already living in the US, other than them receiving that notice and leaving on their own.
The average detention period with ICE is ballpark 50 days, so if we imagined that population detained for a whole year at a time, it would predict a death rate of 38.6 per 100,000. The CDC's listed death rate for people between the ages of 15 and 24 varies by year but is about 80 per 100,000 and for people 25-34 was over 150 per 100,000. If we presume that under this administration, the average detention stay has been cut in half, you are still statistically less likely to die in ICE custody than not, which for any rational person is a perfectly predictable result.
All numbers pulled uncritically from whatever google told me, I didn't spend too much time on this.